Summer 2022 Transfer Thread

[Barrington Womble]

11 hours ago, Scott_M said:

I don’t necessarily disagree with most of that. 
 

I get where you’re coming from. As I’ve said earlier in the thread, midfield should have been priority this summer, even over Nunez.  
 

If we could overpay for the right player, I agree we should do it. I don’t think we should overpay for a player who’ll do. 
 

I’m excited to see how Elliott and Carvalho develop with more minutes. Hopefully Jones becomes more consistent. I know you might not have faith in some of those players like I do, Klopp does seem to want to give them a chance though. 
 

However, we shouldn’t have to play, for example, Spurs away with the Spanish / Serbian lad doing a Tyler Morton. 
 

IMO, sending Keita back to RBL and taking Laimer would make most sense but I’ve no idea if Laimer good enough? 

So I think klopp has had the choice in the summer, a midfielder or an attacker and it was why he was so vociferous in Thailand about 8 being enough. We knew before the season was over mane was going and touchameni <sp> was too rich for our blood, so we made a choice with Nunez and the 8 or 9 midielders and hope for the best and ostrich the worst. 

 

You mention we shouldn't be blooding Bajcetic away at spurs (which I assume is a reference to last season). But this weekend he's coming off the bench to save some legs. That's great, exactly when you want to use someone like him as the game was won and the opposition was poor. But the choice to bringing him on was bringing nobody on and over the next week we play Newcastle, Everton and Napoli - do you want to see him when we're in one of those fights? Perhaps after all the penny pinching we've done for years, klopp almost achieving the impossible last year, it might have been helpful to offer him enough money to bring in a midfielder and a forward and not just 1 or the other, especially in light of how close milner, Chamberlain and keita are to the end of their contracts? You say you think we should have prioritised midfield, but then we'd have gone into this season with just Salah, Diaz, Bobby, Jota and praying carvalho can cut it at this level. That would have also been a different desperate situation imo, especially in light of how little Bobby has been offering over the last couple of years. 

 

As for you last paragraph. Honestly I don't know who's good enough. I don't watch enough foreign football to make that judgement. Luckily that's not my job, I don't have the scouting reports, I don't have the data. I assume though our recruitment team do have this info and if they think he's not enough, there would be plenty of other players who are. We know everybody. Nobody was thinking about Jota when we brought him in - in fact he'd even started not being a regular at wolves the back end of his time there. The data is there should we want to use it. 

 

I just think klopp and the recruitment team have had enough wins in the transfer market to be trusted. And if that means to solve this problem we might have to pay 50m for a player we value at 40m, well get on with it. If we weren't tight to begin with, perhaps we wouldn't be in this entirely predictable mess. 

[HBenn]

32 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

I just don't think they care. They know we can make top 4 with or without a new midfielder. 

I am glad they know because I don't think it's absolutely nailed on. Especially if we get an injury to Fabinho.

[an tha]

8 minutes ago, Moo said:

 

Or there was no money available sooner, now there is money available (big if) it's too late for sensible negotiations.

Klopp is nothing if not pragmatic and if he didn't want a midfielder earlier in the window it's because he didn't think he would be provided with the funds to get someone he fancied.

I struggle to imagine that anyone truly believes that Klopp thought he would get anything of note from Keita and Oxlade-Chamberlain this season. 

He wouldn't even pick Oxlade in his squads in 2nd half of last season - and he was available.

 

No doubt in my mind that had he not got crocked again in pre season that we'd have sold him this summer and then bought someone else in  - the timing of the injury was lousy as we are now stuck with him eating up a big wage for fuck all.

[Colonel Bumcunt]

5 minutes ago, Moo said:

 

Or there was no money available sooner, now there is money available (big if) it's too late for sensible negotiations.

Klopp is nothing if not pragmatic and if he didn't want a midfielder earlier in the window it's because he didn't think he would be provided with the funds to get someone he fancied.

I struggle to imagine that anyone truly believes that Klopp thought he would get anything of note from Keita and Oxlade-Chamberlain this season. 

Yeah but I get the impression that Klopp wanted to bid for Tchou.....fuckit...   And FSG we're happy to back him, and then he wanted to go to Madrid, and Klopp decided he was ok to wait for another banger like him to come along.  

And then the injuries happened. 

And now we're in a position not of FSGs making, but Klopp's.  He took a chance on Keita returning and it has blown up in his face and now FSG are probably, rightly, questioning just how invested Klopp is in, say, Neves, when the fee is likely north of £50m.

 

I must admit, I'm reluctant to think of Neves as a Liverpool player in 3 years time, and Klopp probably is as well.  And that's fine if he costs £25m but he won't.  

[Barrington Womble]

27 minutes ago, Colonel Bumcunt said:

Because at this point we could be paying 2x the true market value of a player, that's not paying 'a bit more', that's getting ripped off, and it'll have an effect in Jan. 

The question is can we wait until Jan. 

 

Well, we have 5 points from 12. Haaland is scoring hat tricks and not getting sent off for head-high challenges.  I think the PL league is gone to be honest, so my onus would be on the CL.  We can muddle through our group as we are, and spend big in Jan on a world class target, be that Bellingham or Laimer or whoever.  But we'd have kept our powder dry to see what the World Cup throws up, and have money to act. 

You don't know that's what we'd have to pay though. And if we did, so what? We never spend anything. We're one of the world's richest clubs and we act like we're fucking Bournemouth. If we weren't tight to begin with and we'd have just sorted this out at the start of the summer, we wouldn't be in a position to be ripped off. That's the financial cost of the risk we took then. We tried to be tight, it failed. So pay the price and put it right. They won't be discounting any of our ticket money for penny pinching in June. 

[Barrington Womble]

16 minutes ago, HBenn said:

I am glad they know because I don't think it's absolutely nailed on. Especially if we get an injury to Fabinho.

Every side could say things like that though. We won't have this many injuries all season. He's there now and if he gets injured later then maybe Jones and thiago are back. We no doubt will though have another spell like this, because our midfielders are in the main frail, young or too old. But I've absolutely no doubt unless this crisis lasts half a season or more, we will absolutely make top 4. 

[Moo]

2 minutes ago, Colonel Bumcunt said:

Yeah but I get the impression that Klopp wanted to bid for Tchou.....fuckit...   And FSG we're happy to back him, and then he wanted to go to Madrid, and Klopp decided he was ok to wait for another banger like him to come along.  

And then the injuries happened. 

And now we're in a position not of FSGs making, but Klopp's.  He took a chance on Keita returning and it has blown up in his face and now FSG are probably, rightly, questioning just how invested Klopp is in, say, Neves, when the fee is likely north of £50m.

 

I must admit, I'm reluctant to think of Neves as a Liverpool player in 3 years time, and Klopp probably is as well.  And that's fine if he costs £25m but he won't.  

I can believe he absolutely wanted Tchouameni, seems like everyone was in agreement on him.  We didn't get him and moved for Nunez.  I don't think it's a coincidence we didn't move for second choice mf after Tchouameni, after all he's done now, he will never be back on our radar. I don't think there was ever enough funds for two big money signings.

[an tha]

8 minutes ago, Moo said:

I can believe he absolutely wanted Tchouameni, seems like everyone was in agreement on him.  We didn't get him and moved for Nunez.  I don't think it's a coincidence we didn't move for second choice mf after Tchouameni, after all he's done now, he will never be back on our radar. I don't think there was ever enough funds for two big money signings.

And that is the problem

 

There absolutely should be  - we are one of the biggest, highest revenue generating clubs in world football - at or near the peak of our attractiveness to players.

[Lee909]

Imo Tchouameni was a target cause everyone thought Mbappe was Real bound and it left us a clear run at him. As soon as that deal collapsed then Real moved to Tchouaméni themselves and that ended out interest

[HBenn]

10 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

Every side could say things like that though. We won't have this many injuries all season. He's there now and if he gets injuredaune Jones and thiago are back. We no doubt will though have another spell like this, because our midfielders are in the main frail, young or too old. But I've absolutely no doubt unless this crisis lasts half a season or more, we will absolutely make top 4. 

I think the difference with other teams though - like City - is that they are probably 2 or 3 players away from that. I don't imagine Thiago or Naby or probably even Curtis will come back from their current injuries and then be present for the vast majority of the season. Take Fab out for a good period of time and you are looking at probably Hendo, Milly and Harvey.

Tbh - even if Naby were fit now I don't think he would make a huge difference.

Either way, I think we will find out from Jürgen tomorrow the likelihood of anything happening now. I would be pleasantly surprised if anything at all happened. I think they are already laying the groundwork to say it's all too difficult 

[Barrington Womble]

1 minute ago, an tha said:

And that is the problem

 

There absolutely should be  - we are one of the biggest, highest revenue generating clubs in world football - at or near the peak of our attractiveness to players.

And you have to put that in the context of mane moving, his wages moving, it's not like Nunez was an out and out investment. 

 

The club probably will earn 300m more than the salary last season. It makes you wonder why we can afford to put some of that into the squad. 

[m0e]

Anyone who plays Championship Manager, or has any budgeting experience, knows that transfer fees, signing on fees and wages come out the same pot.

 

Milner is on fuck all unless he plays, and Salah and Nunez have taken the Mane and Origi salaries between them.

 

We've added Carvalho and Ramsey, with a new feal for Elliott, probably all covered by the Milner savings and Minamino being sold.

 

That's without even bringing in the unexpected cost of Diaz for 6 months.

 

There's Oxlade and Keita costing us £270k a week, and unless they leave, we aren't buying shit. Klopp knows this 100%.

 

We had the same discussion last season about Wijnaldum, and it was obvious what would happen the minute Klopp decided Elliott was a midfielder.

 

I reckon he was trying to both shut the fans up with this right player nonsense and his sarky "you were right" bollocks, and also put pressure on the team to start performing.

[Moo]

2 minutes ago, an tha said:

And that is the problem

 

There absolutely should be  - we are one of the biggest, highest revenue generating clubs in world football - at or near the peak of our attractiveness to players.

Of course there should be but if it is not made available for transfers then we end up in this situation, short in a key area.  We were last year and got away with it, kind of.  And the year before too when of course we didn't get away with it, unless you consider CL qualification the main barometer of success.

[HBenn]

4 minutes ago, an tha said:

And that is the problem

 

There absolutely should be  - we are one of the biggest, highest revenue generating clubs in world football - at or near the peak of our attractiveness to players.

Agree. If it has been down to money then it's scandalous considering the spend over the last few years.

 

The one caveat I would give is that if money for Bellingham has been put aside for his arrival in Jan. Then I could see their position more.

[Barrington Womble]

15 minutes ago, HBenn said:

I think the difference with other teams though - like City - is that they are probably 2 or 3 players away from that. I don't imagine Thiago or Naby or probably even Curtis will come back from their current injuries and then be present for the vast majority of the season. Take Fab out for a good period of time and you are looking at probably Hendo, Milly and Harvey.

Tbh - even if Naby were fit now I don't think he would make a huge difference.

Either way, I think we will find out from Jürgen tomorrow the likelihood of anything happening now. I would be pleasantly surprised if anything at all happened. I think they are already laying the groundwork to say it's all too difficult 

City supposedly have one centre back fit for their game this week. They have 2 right backs, but no cover, because one of them plays left back. And what happens to them if haaland gets an injury, which he has a record of? We're on our arse now, in the same way as we were around that spurs away game last season. But it was about the only time last season we were so desperately short of players. That's not to say it won't happen again - in fact I think it will unless we buy, but players will come back and it won't always be this dark. I just don't see the crisis being so bad we won't get 4th. 

[an tha]

4 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

And you have to put that in the context of mane moving, his wages moving, it's not like Nunez was an out and out investment. 

 

The club probably will earn 300m more than the salary last season. It makes you wonder why we can afford to put some of that into the squad. 

Our attitude to spending does at times seem baffling.

 

I am not advocating throwing around the sort of money the oil clubs do, or even the mancs and arsenal have - but surely we could invest more than we do, especially when we are faced with a real need like we have with our midfield issues.

[HBenn]

2 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

City supposedly have one centre back fit for their game this week. They have 2 right backs, but no cover, because one of them plays left back. And what happens to them if hall and gets an injury, which he has a record of? We're on our arse now, in the same way as we were around that spurs away game last season. But it was about the only time last season we were so desperately short of players. That's not to say it won't happen again - in fact I think it will unless we buy, but players will come back and it won't always be this dark. I just don't see the crisis being so bad we won't get 4th. 

I.hope your right. I just think it's all so unnecessary to be taking such stupid risks again. 

[Barrington Womble]

6 minutes ago, m0e said:

Anyone who plays Championship Manager, or has any budgeting experience, knows that transfer fees, signing on fees and wages come out the same pot.

 

Milner is on fuck all unless he plays, and Salah and Nunez have taken the Mane and Origi salaries between them.

 

We've added Carvalho and Ramsey, with a new feal for Elliott, probably all covered by the Milner savings and Minamino being sold.

 

That's without even bringing in the unexpected cost of Diaz for 6 months.

 

There's Oxlade and Keita costing us £270k a week, and unless they leave, we aren't buying shit. Klopp knows this 100%.

 

We had the same discussion last season about Wijnaldum, and it was obvious what would happen the minute Klopp decided Elliott was a midfielder.

 

I reckon he was trying to both shut the fans up with this right player nonsense and his sarky "you were right" bollocks, and also put pressure on the team to start performing.

So I think your assessment is we are spending pretty much about where we were and the budget is relatively static? The moves and new contracts all cancel each other out? If that's the case, would it not be reasonable to think as revenues increase (which they are doing), we could expect to see that filter into the team? Isn't that the whole ideal of increasing revenues? So when Salah gets a new contract, perhaps it's funded with some Nike, standard chartered or any of the other sponsorship income streams rather than having to reallocated another players wages? Or perhaps some extre TV money? And if we're short on money for fees, would that not be supported by the massive unexpected incomes we must have got last year for taking part in 63 matches? 

 

I really don't think it should be too difficult to find the money. We just don't want while we have 8 midfielders on the books. 

 

[Bjornebye]

If Code sorts his NFC pass out we will be able to afford whoever we wan't. 

[Barrington Womble]

29 minutes ago, an tha said:

Our attitude to spending does at times seem baffling.

 

I am not advocating throwing around the sort of money the oil clubs do, or even the mancs and arsenal have - but surely we could invest more than we do, especially when we are faced with a real need like we have with our midfield issues.

I don't think it's baffling at all if you assume all of the decisions are based on increasing the capital value of the club. If the assessment is top 4 is highly likely with or without a midfielder, then what is the ROI on a getting in a new one?

[an tha]

12 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

I don't think it's baffling at all if you assume all of the decisions are based on increasing the capital value of the club. If the assessment is top is highly likely with or without a midfielder, then what is the ROI on a getting in a new one?

Yeah.

 

I suppose i am just thinking solely from a footballing perspective.

[LFC 6 Times]

What will our excuse be this time when we inevitably do fuck all bar move van der berg and Phillips out on loan.

[m0e]

27 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

So I think your assessment is we are spending pretty much about where we were and the budget is relatively static? The moves and new contracts all cancel each other out? If that's the case, would it not be reasonable to think as revenues increase (which they are doing), we could expect to see that filter into the team? Isn't that the whole ideal of increasing revenues? So when Salah gets a new contract, perhaps it's funded with some Nike, standard chartered or any of the other sponsorship income streams rather than having to reallocated another players wages? Or perhaps some extre TV money? And if we're short on money for fees, would that not be supported by the massive unexpected incomes we must have got last year for taking part in 63 matches? 

 

I really don't think it should be too difficult to find the money. We just don't want while we have 8 midfielders on the books. 

 

It's not just finding money. It's committing to 150k a week for 5 years, plus the transfer fee, plus whatever else is involved with a signing.

 

Increased revenues usually creates bonus payments, better salaries across the entire operation, and more marketing spend.

 

I'm sure the accounts show an increase in wages evey single season since Klopp got here.

 

I also believe we have one of the highest wage bills in football. Klopp has a massive backroom, with specialists for all sorts of things, including penalty neuroscience and throw ins

 

He knows the fucking budget, is my point.

[Jose Jones]

11 hours ago, HBenn said:

I would potentially argue it the other way.

 

9-0 up and still not able to rest all our first choice midfielders. In addition, of the 2 players that came on in midfield one is 36 and the other 17. We also had to take one of our players off as a precaution. 

 

Think someone on here a good few weeks ago said "if Bajcetic sees any league time something has seriously gone wrong". He has and it has. That has been while we have been playing 1 game a week. 

 

That would be the message for J W.

Slightly disappointed you didn't remember that was me.

I probably should have caveated it with "unless we're 9-0 up at home" but I agree with the point, and obviously Klopp does too.

Something has gone seriously wrong with the midfield injuries!  Bajcetic probably would be 10th in line?  Not great he's getting in the first team squad 3 league games into the season.

[Megadrive Man]

We should have cut our losses on Ox and Keita this summer and accepted the best offer we could get for them, cleared them both of the wage bill and signed one player to cover them both.

 

I'd happily take a Ward-Prowse or similar level of player over them two.