Should the UK remain a member of the EU

[AngryOfTuebrook]

A "golden hello" payment is the keg of beer.

A sustainable economy is the dental plan.

 

I'm with Lisa and the union on this one.

[Bruce Spanner]

It’s a silly fucking plan anyway as you have limited numbers who are just going to move round for the benefits causing further supply chain problems, it’s not addressing a problem it’s simply moving it around.

 

Fast track and make free HGV licences for people interested, simple.

 

Then pay a fair rate of pay in light of the finding that they’re essential workers.

[Gnasher]

5 hours ago, Skidfingers McGonical said:

It’s not evidence at all.

 

It’s practically begging people with money to come

to work for one particular sector that has been treated with contempt throughout the pandemic. A sector that is vital for our society to support itself, Health & Social care. 
 

A £10k handshake isn’t going to convince anyone that working for shit money and be treated like shit, is the future. 
 

 

Er OK here's another non pay rise from a different firm different sector, 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58047483.amp

[AngryOfTuebrook]

13 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Er OK here's another non pay rise from a different firm different sector, 

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58047483.amp

Another temporary fix (to a problem caused mostly by Covid) in a sector we already know about.

 

There is no generalised Brexit bonanza for working class people.

[Gnasher]

32 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Another temporary fix (to a problem caused mostly by Covid) in a sector we already know about.

 

There is no generalised Brexit bonanza for working class people.

Your first word tells the correct story..the rest is speculation.

[Gnasher]

6 hours ago, Bruce Spanner said:

It’s a silly fucking plan anyway as you have limited numbers who are just going to move round for the benefits causing further supply chain problems, it’s not addressing a problem it’s simply moving it around.

 

Fast track and make free HGV licences for people interested, simple.

 

Then pay a fair rate of pay in light of the finding that they’re essential workers.

All good and well but isn't it strange that like your last sentence says they're only now viewing these workers as "essential" and offering a "fair rate of pay", so  what's changed? Maybe these bosses have all been kicked by a horse.

[Gnasher]

1 hour ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Another temporary fix (to a problem caused mostly by Covid) in a sector we already know about.

 

There is no generalised Brexit bonanza for working class people.

Yeah I suggest all these construction/haulage/care home and agricultural workers give their bonus payments and pay rises back to the bosses because they won't last and they might put a notch on inflation.

[Gnasher]

6 hours ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

A "golden hello" payment is the keg of beer.

A sustainable economy is the dental plan.

 

I'm with Lisa and the union on this one.

In the real world it was the 'non golden goodbyes' that workers used to fear.

[Gnasher]

6 hours ago, Skidfingers McGonical said:

It’s not evidence at all.

 

It’s practically begging people with money to come

to work for one particular sector that has been treated with contempt throughout the pandemic. A sector that is vital for our society to support itself, Health & Social care. 
 

A £10k handshake isn’t going to convince anyone that working for shit money and be treated like shit, is the future. 
 

 

"begging people to work" you might phrase it as a bad thing but I quite like the sound of that tbh.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

9 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Yeah I suggest all these construction/haulage/care home and agricultural workers give their bonus payments and pay rises back to the bosses because they won't last and they might put a notch on inflation.

I've said a few things about these pay rises, mainly 

1. They're deserved and overdue.

2. They're temporary, so the people receiving them shouldn't act as if Johnson, Gove, Rees-Mogg and the rest of the gang who "got Brexit done" have led the working classes to the Sunlit Uplands.

3. They don't/won't cause inflation.

 

With that in mind... what the fuck are you on about?

 

 

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

11 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

In the real world it was the 'non golden goodbyes' that workers used to fear.

Do you imagine that world is in the past?

[Gnasher]

13 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Do you imagine that world is in the past?

No but I don't think it's a bad thing that it's not in the present.

 

Have another "non" example of workers in a sector that employs three million people feeling little bit more wanted than before.   

 

https://www.ft.com/content/296d84a2-b73a-4bd0-b65b-6ef9883e6afc

 

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

1 hour ago, Gnasher said:

No but I don't think it's a bad thing that it's not in the present.

"It's not in the present"????

 

May I respectfully suggest that you're not the expert on the real world that you sometimes claim to be.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

1 hour ago, Gnasher said:

 

Have another "non" example of workers in a sector that employs three million people feeling little bit more wanted than before.   

 

https://www.ft.com/content/296d84a2-b73a-4bd0-b65b-6ef9883e6afc

 

Subscription only.

 

Does it say anything I don't already know?

[Gnasher]

2 hours ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

I've said a few things about these pay rises, mainly 

1. They're deserved and overdue.

2. They're temporary, so the people receiving them shouldn't act as if Johnson, Gove, Rees-Mogg and the rest of the gang who "got Brexit done" have led the working classes to the Sunlit Uplands.

3. They don't/won't cause inflation.

 

With that in mind... what the fuck are you on about?

 

 

 

Sorry but regarding number 2 how do you know they're temporary?

[Gnasher]

Three articles in various mainstream media just today showing low paid workers offered pay rises/kick backs for their labour because of worker shortages caused by Brexit and or Covid.

 

Getting like the monty python sketch now, 'bar for giving pay rises to the construction/haulage/agricultural/care home industry what did Brexit do for us?

[AngryOfTuebrook]

19 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Sorry but regarding number 2 how do you know they're temporary?

Because the companies introducing them can't afford them. They have been introduced as an emergency measure for a temporary situation caused mostly by Covid. Going from the links you've posted, no employers or economists believe that they are sustainable. There is literally nothing to suggest that they will last.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

8 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Three articles in various mainstream media just today showing low paid workers offered pay rises/kick backs for their labour because of worker shortages caused by Brexit and or Covid.

 

Getting like the monty python sketch now, 'bar for giving pay rises to the construction/haulage/agricultural/care home industry what did Brexit do for us?

It really isn't. If the question is"what has Brexit done for us?" the answer is "exacerbated the shortages caused by Covid." That's all.

[Bruce Spanner]

Some Panglossian shite going on round these parts. 

[Gnasher]

1 hour ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Because the companies introducing them can't afford them. They have been introduced as an emergency measure for a temporary situation caused mostly by Covid. Going from the links you've posted, no employers or economists believe that they are sustainable. There is literally nothing to suggest that they will last.

Really? A lot of low paid workers haven't had a pay rise since the crash, are you suggesting the level of pay they were on is the best they can hope for?

[Gnasher]

2 hours ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

It really isn't. If the question is"what has Brexit done for us?" the answer is "exacerbated the shortages caused by Covid." That's all.

I think most would agree its a bit of both, what percentage is guess work but it's undeniable the shortages in labour have strengthened the bargaining position and increased the job security of a lot of low paid workers across most spectrums.

[Gnasher]

2 hours ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Because the companies introducing them can't afford them

One of the links was Aldi..

 

https://www.cityam.com/aldi-to-create-4000-jobs-in-1-3bn-uk-investment-as-profits-soar/

2 hours ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

. They have been introduced as an emergency measure for a temporary situation caused mostly by Covid. Going from the links you've posted, no employers or economists believe that they are sustainable. There is literally nothing to suggest that they will last.

 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

2 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

One of the links was Aldi..

 

https://www.cityam.com/aldi-to-create-4000-jobs-in-1-3bn-uk-investment-as-profits-soar/

 

Independent haulage firms, construction companies, pubs, hotels, etc. can't afford these rates of pay - as I've already pointed out, the big multinationals (like Aldi) will be best placed to survive this Covid/Brexit storm.  This will leave them with an even more powerful market position.  Of course, they could choose to use that position to reward workers instead of shareholders and executives, but somehow I don't see it.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

14 minutes ago, Gnasher said:

Really? A lot of low paid workers haven't had a pay rise since the crash, are you suggesting the level of pay they were on is the best they can hope for?

After decades of various shades of Tory eroding workers' rights and increasing inequality, leading to a Government of the right-wing gang who led the Brexit campaign specifically to allow them to further cut workers' rights (even if those plans are currently on hold) I don't have a great deal of hope that workers in the sectors currently seeing pay rises will fare any better than all the other workers who haven't had pay rises for years.

 

I don't understand what it is that gives you such confidence.  It's like a non-league club playing one of the big six in the FA Cup; if you get an early goal, by all means enjoy it, but don't delude yourself that you're going to win, because you know from experience that the odds are too heavily stacked against you.

[Gnasher]

28 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Independent haulage firms, construction companies, pubs, hotels, etc. can't afford these rates of pay - as I've already pointed out, the big multinationals (like Aldi) will be best placed to survive this Covid/Brexit storm.  This will leave them with an even more powerful market position.  Of course, they could choose to use that position to reward workers instead of shareholders and executives, but somehow I don't see it.

Construction companies?  Really?

 

https://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/construction-building-material-ihs-markit-pmi-june-uk-housebuilders-inflation-091738481.html?guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly91ay1maW5hbmNlLXlhaG9vLWNvbS5jZG4uYW1wcHJvamVjdC5vcmcv&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAANMyrzRDA0yuzi_CML_Sf2zgeia6qaD_UVgtErz5pWUI6KIAMw2g4pnNLDUW0HA7UyJF_WCB2xql9tBc92Yn13u3tSvZwDNDCrmGIdgGxdqlnalIaURnkSTQNtdY6j29XodVs0T8CNXXcCHFBUgTaNFBi-NtA46HYC25XIBPB2Oz