Paris shootings

[stringvest]

@sasas --- TT was/is about an occupation of land ( read real stuff)- as is Palestine (oh shit went there)

 

As stated in this thread previously (either Anubis or AWS) if you can't communicate your aim/claim/goal - in the west it is called the elevator pitch - in 30 seconds to make your case -  then your message becomes blurred.

 

 

Howie, the TT war was not about an occupation of land. They want a state of their own in Sri Lanka.  The TT ethnically cleansed all non-Hindus from the north and east of Sri Lanka, with the exception of a small number of Tamil Catholics.  They massacred and kicked out Muslims as well as the majority Buddhist Sinhalese.  There is no resemblance to what is going on in Palestine.  

[Mook]

Why don't we just get some Buddhists across here to boot the Muslim's arses?

 

Problem solved.

[stringvest]

There are Buddhist nationalists in Sri Lanka causing all sorts of mischief as well.  

 

Religion is a plague.  

[TheHowieLama]

Howie, the TT war was not about an occupation of land. They want a state of their own in Sri Lanka.  The TT ethnically cleansed all non-Hindus from the north and east of Sri Lanka, with the exception of a small number of Tamil Catholics.  They massacred and kicked out Muslims as well as the majority Buddhist Sinhalese.  There is no resemblance to what is going on in Palestine.  

 

Might be my mistake but I thought that they were one of  the catalysts for civil war and in fact took/controlled an area that was ultimately taken away. Is that incorrect? Israel played a major part in this.

[George Costanza]

 

 

Religion is a plague.  

 

Its the root of most evil/deaths in world history. 

 

religion should be banned imo. if you believe in a god then fuck off to mars

[stringvest]

They did take an area that they believed should form a state called Tamil Eelam.  As I say, they did that by executing minorities and forcing those that they did not kill out of the area.  Meanwhile Hindu Tamils lived, and continue to live and work all over the rest of the island.  There have never been any no-go areas for Tamils.  

 

For over 20 years, Sinhalese were not allowed into the northern, north western and north eastern parts of their own country.  In fact, the north and east have been reopened to everyone, but there is a heavy psychological defeat on the Tamils in that those areas are now also populated by Sri Lankan army military and government institutions, the signage now has Sinhalese as well as Tamil and English,  where previously that wasn't the case, and most of the TT civil infrastructure has been dismantled and replaced.

[Guest Pistonbroke]

Its the root of most evil/deaths in world history. 

 

religion should be banned imo. if you believe in a god then fuck off to mars

 

Behave yourself mate. I'm an atheist myself but can realise that most people who hold a religious faith are law abiding citizens. They can shove their faith and beliefs up their arse as far as I'm concerned, but at the end of the day the majority are not responsible for the cuntish things mankind bestows on us. 

[VladimirIlyich]

 

 

Bar western forces re invading the middle east of bombing it into oblivion and killing millions of innocent people in the process, the only group of people that can really stop the isis & islamic terrorist threat is other muslims. The western forces cannot win as if they go all guns blazing in retaliation they will undoubtedly just create greater resentment. Half hearted measures of the past have come back to haunt. It should have been all or nothing in regards to the middle east & not some half arsed measure.

 

The major problem is that the big power in the region (Saudi Arabia) has absolutely no intention of going against Isis & in some areas they actually support it. Fuck their oil its time so real pressure was put on that country & the ruling families.

 

As far as i'm concerned any muslim who isn't against Isis & other terrorist organisations should be considered as a supporter & dealt with by any means necessary. Half measures get you nowhere. If you want rid you have to commit fully to it. If that mean arresting british muslims by association then so be it. Like any other criminal organisation they have a chance to do the right thing & turn over dangerous individuals

Your comments about sympathisers being dealt with accordingly makes me very uncomfortable as this takes in lots of ordinary people who would never take up arms but see the West simply as invaders and killers of their friends and families(in some cases at least.) This is like our current government wanting to spy on us and treating those of us who refuse to swallow their lies and bullshit as 'enemies of the state' and should be dealt with accordingly.

Its a fine line between getting a balanced view and being an enemy. God knows,half of us would be jailed for our views on this thread alone.

[TheHowieLama]

Cheers SV - I can tell you that the media here portrayed similarities between the two - this had to be more than 20 years ago? At least seems it - tbh it seemed an guerrilla v military conflict.

 

Edit -- maybe cuz of this    It took away not only the right to oppose but even the right to evaluate, as a community, the course they were taking. This gives a semblance of illusion that the whole society is behind the LTTE

[stringvest]

Cheers SV - I can tell you that the media here portrayed similarities between the two - this had to be more than 20 years ago? At least seems it.

 

More like 6 years than 20 mate.  Another mess caused by the British, I'm afraid.  

[FanchesterCity]

Then it comes back to the same question I posed to Fanny - would you do that?

 

If not - either there are thousands more who would with little or no training, or their recruiting message and delivery of it is head and shoulders above the US Army as an example.

 

I don't think it's a proposition that ISIS need to sell. Most westerners put a high value on human life and we're conditioned to see it as precious in the extreme. Not everybody in the world thinks this way.

Then there is the issue of disenfranchised muslim youth who can be persuaded to be part of something, made to feel valuable / important, and before they know it, they are heroes with a 'purpose'. That purpose eventually becomes terrorism (in our eyes), but clearly in their eyes, they've finally discovered some meaning, and purpose.

 

So.... i don't believe ISIS are selling themselves any better than western armed forces, I just believe they are better able to capitalise on the disenfranchised, and can offer 'results' (a feeling of importance) very rapidly. i would wager that a potential suicide bomber is made to feel far more important than any western world soldier ever is.

 

To me, it's not brilliance on ISIS's part, it's plain old social manipulation that sees other disenfranchised youths lured into prostitution, or drug addiction etc. It doesn't mean the people suckered in are thick, but they are susceptible to persuasion if you press the right buttons, and for some, those 'right' buttons are being a heroic martyr, if not at the start of their recruitment, certainly at the end of it.

[FanchesterCity]

Your comments about sympathisers being dealt with accordingly makes me very uncomfortable as this takes in lots of ordinary people who would never take up arms but see the West simply as invaders and killers of their friends and families(in some cases at least.) This is like our current government wanting to spy on us and treating those of us who refuse to swallow their lies and bullshit as 'enemies of the state' and should be dealt with accordingly.

Its a fine line between getting a balanced view and being an enemy. God knows,half of us would be jailed for our views on this thread alone.

 

Yes, it's a dangerous road to go down that.

I had sympathy with the IRA's view on Ireland, but none for some of its methods. In all conflicts there are at least two differing views, and it's too simplistic to say one is 'right' and the other 'wrong'. In fact, I'd go as far as to say that if you can only see one side, you're a part of the problem.

Forcing people to choose one side (when they can clearly see both sides) is a recipe for disaster. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

A lot of my mates on Facebook have got their profile pics coloured red, white and blue in solidarity.  It just seems a little incongruous (to the point of tastelessness) because a lot of those pics are cartoon characters, kids in fancy dress, pissed-up selfies, etc.

[Red Phoenix]

Oh. So now Buddhism is bad as well now because of some fascist fucking idiots? Even though the vast majority are probably more peaceful than members of almost anything else classed as a religion. Do I have to apologize for them because I meditate and think that Buddhism has a lot right about our completely backwards reality? I condemn them, they don't represent me, etc.

 

And it should be banned, is a plague. So one person says something about Buddhism, then religion is a plague. Then someone else quotes the plague bit and says if you believe in God fuck off to Mars.

 

Well it's good that Buddhists don't believe in God, isn't it then?

 

Fucking clueless. No wonder we're in such a mess. Maybe we should ban everything that has a backwards minority, and see where we get with that. Will anything remain?

 

Let me have a guess at what will actually happen, and it's not exactly rocket science : no religion will be banned, and people will just have to fucking learn to live with each other peacefully as much as they can. There'll be a lot more bombs, attacks, killings, and all types of shit from the idiot minorities of these religions/philosophies, and so on. But the thought police will not win. People will be free to believe what they want, as long as they aren't harming anyone, and the vast majority will be fine. Those that would prefer that wasn't the case will just have to accept that.

 

And maybe one day in the future, we'll get to look back at all of these bombings, attacks, and so on, and know what groups of elites have been instigating so much of it, behind the scenes (for an example, we already know about a lot of wahhabi financing coming from Saudi arabia. But there has to be many other links in other countries for many other types of problems, terrorism, and so on.) That will definitely be interesting.

 

History is going to shit on a lot of so called "leaders" and their minions, that's for sure.

[Hades]

As far as i'm concerned any muslim who isn't against Isis & other terrorist organisations  should be considered as a supporter & dealt with by any means necessary.  Half measures get you nowhere. If you want rid you have to commit fully to it. If that mean arresting british muslims by association then so be it.  Like any other criminal organisation they have a chance to do the right thing & turn over dangerous individuals

 

While we're at it, let's arrest every Western citizen who doesn't actively condemn the 108,000 Iraqi civilian deaths, the 21,000 Afghani civilian deaths and the 50,000 odd Pakistani civilian deaths since 2001. 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Turns out now a second attacker was also registered as a refugee on Leros.

 

Someone owes Tyler Durden an apology. Or two, if you count the one for misrepresenting him in the first place.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34823938

 

According to the BBC, two people under investigation had registered in Greece as refugees.  That's not quite as clear-cut as the story (originating from a Murdoch paper) that Naz linked to.  (As a good liberal, I'm sure you'll agree that it's premature to call them two attackers.)

 

I don't know about anybody else, but I know I owe Tyler nothing.  I gave my opinion on what he posted, he got narked, so I gave a full explanation of my opinion. Nothing more to add.

[Guest Pistonbroke]

While we're at it, let's arrest every Western citizen who doesn't actively condemn the 108,000 Iraqi civilian deaths, the 21,000 Afghani civilian deaths and the 50,000 odd Pakistani civilian deaths since 2001. 

 

I think George is just a young lad caught up in the hysteria, if not he needs to have a good look at himself in the mirror. 

[Jairzinho]

I've had to read the cunt act to several people today. 

[Guest Pistonbroke]

I've had to read the cunt act to several people today. 

 

I've only left the house four times today to go out with the dogs, it's been pissing it down all day over here so I've been spared interaction with fuck wits. 

[Oh Buoy]

There's too much point scoring this evening - and there's no winner.

 

Ultimately, every opinion/suggestion I've seen is reactive rather than proactive or its a long-winded explanation of what's happened and why.

 

There's been one person (as far as I'm aware) that's mentioned realigning our understanding of communication. There's been a few that have referenced oil and tougher western intervention.

 

The bottom line is we're a country that has little power over our own government. They've caused a lot of mess and so have a lot of other countries that have tried to modernise and change a place that's rotten with corruption, control, crime and manipulation.

 

That's our perspective and it's fed to us in the "good vs evil" media and political shop window.

 

When we take from a country and twist the cultural and civil war rubik cube a few times. The backlash comes closer to home and naturally we gather together and condemn them for doing so.

 

Pissing on someone's chips because you believe it's better for them will never head towards a solution. Understanding, communicating and growing together as a humanity will.

 

But greed, selfishness and money has and will always be the root of evil here. Humanity is incomprehensible and it always will be.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

No prizes for predicting what tomorrow's headline in The Paper That Supported Hitler was always going to be.

 

[Red Phoenix]

Comment from an Independent reader :

Islamophobe? I don't blame him. Can somebody just remind me how many acts of terrorism this past decade have NOT been down to Muslims? In fact, these past twenty years?

Response :

Mass murder in Iraq twice.
Mass murder in Yemen.
Mass murder in Afghanistan.
Mass murder in the borderlands of Pakistan.
Mass murder and theft in Palestine.
Mass murder in Libya.
The instigation of 'rebels' in Syria (terrorists trained in UK run terror camps in Jordan to attack the Syrian Government).
Is that enough for you.

What ISIS have done is abhorrent but stop blaming Islam, we don't blame all Christians or westerners or Jews for the carnage your elected governments have caused in Muslim nations.

 

From this page : http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/paris-attacks-jason-manford-removed-from-facebook-after-expletive-filled-post-condemning-murdering-a6734431.html

[razor]

Oh. So now Buddhism is bad as well now because of some fascist fucking idiots? Even though the vast majority are probably more peaceful than members of almost anything else classed as a religion. Do I have to apologize for them because I meditate and think that Buddhism has a lot right about our completely backwards reality?

 

Yes, what I said was

 

Not that I'm putting forward the argument that these murdering Buddhist extremists or their anti-Buddhist ideology are representative of the majority of Buddhists. 

 

Now there's a thought...

[Red Phoenix]

Yes, what I said was

 

Not that I'm putting forward the argument that these murdering Buddhist extremists or their anti-Buddhist ideology are representative of the majority of Buddhists. 

 

Now there's a thought...

 

Yeah it wasn't you I was meaning in my response, it was just how the conversation went on a bit after you posted.

 

Anyway, giving this a rest now. At the end of the day there's over 100 dead from the attacks and I feel like I've been arguing about Islam and other related stuff instead of really sparing any time to think about those victims, and that's obviously not right. So I'm done.

[Tyler Durden]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-34823938

 

According to the BBC, two people under investigation had registered in Greece as refugees. That's not quite as clear-cut as the story (originating from a Murdoch paper) that Naz linked to. (As a good liberal, I'm sure you'll agree that it's premature to call them two attackers.)

 

I don't know about anybody else, but I know I owe Tyler nothing. I gave my opinion on what he posted, he got narked, so I gave a full explanation of my opinion. Nothing more to add.

No mate you never gave your opinion about fuck all I posted, you jumped to a load of conclusions without a clue suggesting I'd said 'close the borders' and all that bollocks when alls I'd really said was that it was a very real possibility that they would use the mass movement of people to conceal terrorists because I think they'd be daft if they didn't.

 

At no point would I suggest closing borders or any measures to stop movement because you can't stop it, it's difficult to protect yourself from which is why I think they would use it.

 

The reason I got a cob on is because you tried to make out I'm some racist cunt for holding a very valid opinion irrespective of whether the Paris attackers were refugees or not (and by the way when I said it I'd heard nothing to suggest they were refugees)