New 5.5bn redevelopment plan approved for Docks

[VladimirIlyich]

I'm all for developments that give the city a long term revenue and jobs boost like a Cruise Terminal is sure to do.

 

As for the rest of the stuff,well more apartments arent really a good thing at the moment so the related buildings need to be a bit different from the norm,maybe somethings that is related to the city's seafaring heritage or whatever.

 

More Costa Coffee branches doesnt really help anybody other than that particular company in the longer term and longer term thinking is needed.

Just build the Cruise Terminal first and think about what will compliment it.

[Dougie Do'ins]

I'm all for developments that give the city a long term revenue and jobs boost like a Cruise Terminal is sure to do.

 

As for the rest of the stuff,well more apartments arent really a good thing at the moment so the related buildings need to be a bit different from the norm,maybe somethings that is related to the city's seafaring heritage or whatever.

 

More Costa Coffee branches doesnt really help anybody other than that particular company in the longer term and longer term thinking is needed.

Just build the Cruise Terminal first and think about what will compliment it.

It's not as if it's going to happen over night. It's going to be a gradual plan over many years. It was only a matter of time before the dock road to the north of the Pier Head was invested in. The demand may not be there right now but it will come. There has to be a catalyst and the new cruise liner terminal may just be it.

[VladimirIlyich]

It's not as if it's going to happen over night. It's going to be a gradual plan over many years. It was only a matter of time before the dock road to the north of the Pier Head was invested in. The demand may not be there right now but it will come. There has to be a catalyst and the new cruise liner terminal may just be it.

 

But with 9000 apartments unsold I wouldnt think more is a good idea for quite a while yet.

Time to get creative.

[Magic Sponge]

9000 apartments? How accurate is that?

[VladimirIlyich]

Looking at various reports there doesnt seem to be any figures for empty apartments in Liverpool being bandied around.

 

In 2008 there was an article saying 35% were unoccupied but that was 3/4 years ago so I wouldnt expect that now as a few new ones have popped up plus its been a decent market for property speculators to buy them up so we will probably never know for sure.

Even in 2010 an article was going on about quite a few empty apartments but figures seem to be difficult to track down.

 

9000 is probably a bit of an exaggeration I reckon.

[Magic Sponge]

Looking at various reports there doesnt seem to be any figures for empty apartments in Liverpool being bandied around.

 

In 2008 there was an article saying 35% were unoccupied but that was 3/4 years ago so I wouldnt expect that now as a few new ones have popped up plus its been a decent market for property speculators to buy them up so we will probably never know for sure.

Even in 2010 an article was going on about quite a few empty apartments but figures seem to be difficult to track down.

 

9000 is probably a bit of an exaggeration I reckon.

 

I was going to say mate, that sounds fucking ridiculous.

[VladimirIlyich]

I was going to say mate, that sounds fucking ridiculous.

 

Yeah,I should have researched a bit more.

 

9000 could be equivalent to the 35% figure in 2008 or it could mean the city as a whole but its highly unlikely in just the city centre alone.

[Get Carter]

Yeah,I should have researched a bit more.

 

9000 could be equivalent to the 35% figure in 2008 or it could mean the city as a whole but its highly unlikely in just the city centre alone.

 

You dont know that 9000 apartments wont be filled by the time the project is complete.

 

Peel Holdings as someone said earlier have long term visions they are not going to blow 5.5bn on a project if they dont think 9000 apartments, offices and hotels etc cant be completed.

 

The first thing they did in Salford Quays was get the BBC into the area as they new other companies would follow. I assume they have similar aspirations for Liverpool to attract major corporations from down south who are cost cutting to re-locate to a more affordable location that is both modern and historic. I dont know the full ins an outs as a sure a lot of us dont but Peel Holdings seem to have a long term vision for the North West.

[VladimirIlyich]

You dont know that 9000 apartments wont be filled by the time the project is complete.

 

Peel Holdings as someone said earlier have long term visions they are not going to blow 5.5bn on a project if they dont think 9000 apartments, offices and hotels etc cant be completed.

 

The first thing they did in Salford Quays was get the BBC into the area as they new other companies would follow. I assume they have similar aspirations for Liverpool to attract major corporations from down south who are cost cutting to re-locate to a more affordable location that is both modern and historic. I dont know the full ins an outs as a sure a lot of us dont but Peel Holdings seem to have a long term vision for the North West.

 

Do we really need any more new apartments in the city centre?

I fully support the Cruise Terminal as I'm certain there's a market for it and it benefits the city.

I'm just not convinced even more apartments will really help.

Building projects are always needed but there needs to be some individuality about what is built in each city.

[Sugar Ape]

Do we really need any more new apartments in the city centre?

I fully support the Cruise Terminal as I'm certain there's a market for it and it benefits the city.

I'm just not convinced even more apartments will really help.

Building projects are always needed but there needs to be some individuality about what is built in each city.

 

They are building them with their own money I assume, the onus is on them to fill them, so let them get on with it. They will be looking on this as a long term investment, so who knows what they have planned. They must be confident of getting them filled eventually.

[VladimirIlyich]

They are building them with their own money I assume, the onus is on them to fill them, so let them get on with it. They will be looking on this as a long term investment, so who knows what they have planned. They must be confident of getting them filled eventually.

 

Are they?

 

Not a loaded question,just asking thats all.

[Dougie Do'ins]

Do we really need any more new apartments in the city centre?I fully support the Cruise Terminal as I'm certain there's a market for it and it benefits the city.

I'm just not convinced even more apartments will really help.

Building projects are always needed but there needs to be some individuality about what is built in each city.

It's not really in the city centre is it ?

 

They are building them with their own money I assume, the onus is on them to fill them, so let them get on with it. They will be looking on this as a long term investment, so who knows what they have planned. They must be confident of getting them filled eventually.

I doubt that. It'll be borrowed money against other assets.

 

Didn't Peel sell the Trafford Centre not long ago ?

[bri]

no one with any brains does anything of that scale with their own money. It'll be borrowed or through an investment fund.

[Sugar Ape]

My point was, pedants, however they are funding it they must think they can fill these apartments. I say let them build them. I'm all for the development, this city spends too much time looking backwards.

[Fugitive]

How does it compare with other airports ?

 

Cheaper than Manchester.

 

Cheapest for 7 days is £20 and most expensive is £52 in the premium car park.

 

Manchester's cheapest is £25 and goes up to £70.

[Tyler Durden]

They don't use their own money or borrow against assets, they have investors in their projects, I'm pretty sure they were drumming up finance in china recently. It's a long term vision with which they are looking to link us up with Manchester over the next 50 years or something, it can't be a bad thing, they are building the terminal and Southampton are worried about it and trying to put the blockers on any public money going towards it.

 

At the end of the day it isn't government money that has changed Liverpool from the dump it was 20 years ago it's majority private that has kick started it, half the docks are just sat there doing fuck all so I can't see why people would have a problem with building on them, there is still plenty of our heritage on the waterfront. I seen unesco were saying that these new tall buildings would over shadow the 3 graces, what a load of bollocks, the waterfront would look immense when Wirral waters and seaforth docks are transformed, you would think we were knocking them down the way they carry on.

[Hooch]

Well said Tyler.

[stringvest]

Cheaper than Manchester.

 

Cheapest for 7 days is £20 and most expensive is £52 in the premium car park.

 

Manchester's cheapest is £25 and goes up to £70.

 

you can pay well over £70 a day in Heathrow. It's been the same since the 1990's.

[bri]

More from the FT this morning. What's the time line on a £10 - £11 Billion spend for Liverpool and the Wirral..... 10 years?? worth of work. Not to be sniffed at.

[bri]

The Financial Times: Liverpool steams ahead with development plan

London did it with Canary Wharf, Bilbao with the Guggenheim. Now Liverpool wants to announce its resurgence and attract investment with a £5.5bn thicket of skyscrapers that would transform one of the most famous waterfront vistas in the world – putting its world heritage status in peril.

Liverpool Waters, on 60 hectares of redundant dockland to the north of the famous Three Graces at Pier Head, will create 9,000 apartments, office blocks, hotels, shops and restaurants.

That anyone would dream of such as scheme, let alone apply and be granted planning permission, shows how far the city has travelled since 1981, when the Conservative government considered consigning the city to “managed decline” after the Toxteth riots.

But more than £4bn of private and public investment since 2000 has transformed Liverpool. It has grown faster than any city outside London and this week becomes the first European host of the Global Entrepreneurship Congress. Speakers range from Sir Richard Branson, the Virgin founder, to John Bishop, the Scouse comic. However, austerity has hit hard in a city heavily reliant on public sector jobs, leading many to welcome the development by Peel Holdings, the private property group, with open arms.

Pitched at Chinese investors, Liverpool Waters features the Shanghai Tower, a 55-storey edifice that will dwarf the Liver Building, the city’s symbol.

English Heritage has opposed it and Unesco, the UN cultural agency, said it could take away the world heritage site designation Liverpool earned in 2004 as a example of a maritime city at the height of Britain’s empire.

Henry Owen-John, North-west director of English Heritage, said it had not blocked recent buildings on the waterfront. But Liverpool Waters was too dense and would eradicate the 19th century docks that revolutionised world trade.

“We would like to see Liverpool open a new chapter without obliterating what has gone before,” he said.

The objection means the government is obliged to consider a public inquiry. Asked what would happen if it called one, Lindsey Ashworth, development director of Peel, has a simple answer. “That’s it. We will go and spend our money somewhere else. The message the government needs to send is that the local people have decided. That is what localism is about.”

He said government support was important to attract investment from sovereign wealth funds and Chinese companies.

Peel, controlled by billionaire John Whitaker, has already formed a joint venture with Sam Wa, a Chinese import company, to build a trading outpost on the opposite bank of the Mersey at Wirral Waters, a similar £5bn scheme.

Stella Shiu, chairman, said Chinese brands wanted an outlet to showcase their wares to European retailers. “There is a lot of interest,” she said.

Joe Anderson, Labour leader of the city council said last week after it approved the scheme: “Liverpool has to grow and redevelop if we are to thrive and succeed in the future. We do not live in the past. We are not a museum.”

Much of the population agrees with him. There was little dissent among passengers when the FT took a trip on the Mersey ferry, offering its sweeping views of the Three Graces.

Andy Franklin, 50, an IT support worker from New Brighton, said he would sacrifice his view of the Liver building for the jobs on offer. “It is a change for the better. That area has been derelict for years.”

Roy Jackson, 66, a retired shopkeeper from Liverpool, asked: “What does world heritage status do for us?”

The Mersey Partnership, the city’s tourism board, said that was impossible to quantify. Since the status was achieved, annual visitor numbers have grown from 23.1m to 28.2m, with spending up from £1.5bn to £1.9bn. Some 39 per cent of visitors – even more among those from overseas – cited the Unesco status as a reason for coming.

In a 2008 survey, half of tourism businesses said it was a significant brand. “It is clear that there would be an impact,” TMP said.

Chuka Umunna, shadow business secretary, in a speech in Liverpool on Monday, accuses the government of “betraying the legacy” of Lord Heseltine by failing to support British business with an active industrial strategy. Lord Heseltine is to be awarded freedom of the city in recognition of his role in Liverpool’s redevelopment.

[WaltonRed]

still think a tricks been missed by not going for a fuck off bridge over the mersey

[dennis tooth]

Japanese Lamp Fights | Oddity Central - Collecting Oddities

 

[Liverpool lad]

I reckon we should have a tunnel connecting us to the Wirral

[Guest ShoePiss]

I reckon we should have a tunnel connecting us to the Wirral

 

You'd probably want a tunnel for trains too, some people!

[Liverpool lad]

You'd probably want a tunnel for trains too, some people!

 

And a ferry crossing