Peter Crouch

[Stu Monty]

Stu, if we'd peppered their goal with shots I'd have had no complaints about Rafa's decisions, but we didn't. For all the possession we had and all the pressure we applied, we only created two really clear chances apart from the goal, one of which fell to a player who's only scored once this season and hardly ever finds himself in shooting positions. The rest were half-chances.

 

That together with the fact that their first was a fluke doesn't add up to enough to say that nothing could have been done differently and better. Not for me it doesn't.

 

It could have been done better but what we did was enough. There were enough decent opportunities created for various players and we were on top. It wasn't Watford we were plaing, it was Milan, and we did enough to come out as clearly the better side, it just needed that bit of a finish which certain players couldn't muster.

[RedinSweden]

Stu, if we'd peppered their goal with shots I'd have had no complaints about Rafa's decisions, but we didn't. For all the possession we had and all the pressure we applied, we only created two really clear chances apart from the goal, one of which fell to a player who's only scored once this season and hardly ever finds himself in shooting positions. The rest were half-chances.

 

That together with the fact that their first was a fluke doesn't add up to enough to say that nothing could have been done differently and better. Not for me it doesn't.

 

we had 12 shots on goal to their 5. The fact that it is only 4 - 3 on target in our favour is the telling part.

[Paul]

Neil, I completely agree. We did not look like a dangerous atacking side at all on Wednesday night. I've seen people say how well Pennant played and use that as justification for his future inclusion at Liverpool. I don't disagree that he played well for his ability. The fact is, though, that the best he's got isn't good enough for us as he produces little or no end product.

[sh#t waffle]

Neil, I completely agree. We did not look like a dangerous atacking side at all on Wednesday night. I've seen people say how well Pennant played and use that as justification for his future inclusion at Liverpool. I don't disagree that he played well for his ability. The fact is, though, that the best he's got isn't good enough for us as he produces little or no end product.

 

I just don't agree with that. When we've had two strikers up top, Pennant has had a fairly consistent record of assists recently. On Wednesday I think Rafa felt that the best way to beat Milan was to put their defence - when they have the ball - under quick and constant pressure. Therefore Dirk was the natural choice. However, Dirk up on his own does most of his work outside the penalty area, and thus our goal threat was diminshed. I don't know whether our formation was correct - we lost and we didn't score, but with Crouch instead of Dirk we may have found that Milan had more time and space to get into their stride and play their natural game. I thought Pennant had an excellent game, and put Milan on the back foot everytime he was in posession. Pennant was good enough, the obvious change would be that, to play that formation, we need a player with the work rate of Kuyt, pace of Bellamy and touch of Crouch. For that we need Eto'o.

[Paul]

Jermaine Pennant has scored seven goals in his career.

[Anny Road]

This whole discussion goes back to Rafas ethos of controlling the game.

Controlling the game is one thing but to me we looked most unlikey to score the other night. Except by a riise rocket or similiar from Gerrard.

Playing the way Rafa did the other night with Kuyt on his todd for me said we are hoping for a free kick or similiar to nick the game.

Playing that style is one thing with an Henry/Drogba or even an Owen but not with Kuyt who essentially was a 6th midfielder

[Stu Monty]

We looked a lot more likely than AC Milan to score. Which is really the point.

[sh#t waffle]

Jermaine Pennant has scored seven goals in his career.

 

I would never say he's perfect. But Lennon doesn't score many, and arguably has a worse final ball with a better strike force to aim at. Yet many would cream themselves if we bought him. My belief is that Pennant probably won't be a first team regular next season, but that if he was, and continued to improve at the current rate, I wouldn't be too disappointed. If Kewell can play an injury free season, he will be the midfielder to score 15+ goals - that would take the pressure off Pennant to score.

[Anny Road]

We looked a lot more likely than AC Milan to score. Which is really the point.

 

Thing is though Inzaghi is a goal scorer and and did what goalscorers do.

We lacked that

[sh#t waffle]

Thing is though Inzaghi is a goal scorer and and did what goalscorers do.

We lacked that

 

Deflected a goal in off his arm/tit? I take your point on the second goal, he took his chance well. As Kuyt did at the end. I don't feel that we were robbed, but I do feel we were the better team, and that we would have had a damn good chance had that freak of a first goal not gone in as and when it did.

[Neil G]

I just don't agree with that. When we've had two strikers up top, Pennant has had a fairly consistent record of assists recently. On Wednesday I think Rafa felt that the best way to beat Milan was to put their defence - when they have the ball - under quick and constant pressure. Therefore Dirk was the natural choice. However, Dirk up on his own does most of his work outside the penalty area, and thus our goal threat was diminshed. I don't know whether our formation was correct - we lost and we didn't score, but with Crouch instead of Dirk we may have found that Milan had more time and space to get into their stride and play their natural game. I thought Pennant had an excellent game, and put Milan on the back foot everytime he was in posession. Pennant was good enough, the obvious change would be that, to play that formation, we need a player with the work rate of Kuyt, pace of Bellamy and touch of Crouch. For that we need Eto'o.

 

People keep coming back to this as a key point, and I keep jumping on it. Milan at their best playing their natural game are not the unstoppable force that people seem to think they are. They only looked that way against the Mancs because they had complete freedom in midfield, which they wouldn't have had in any realistic scenario where Crouch would have played.

 

I'm not knocking Dirk or Pennant, they both did themselves proud. This isn't an anti-anyone thread, it's a pro-Crouch one. I just think the big fella would have given us more cutting edge than either of those two did, and if that was at the expense of giving more of the ball to Milan then that was a risk that was worth taking. Based on what I've seen of Milan this season and what I know of their players' qualities from the past few years, together with Crouch's form in Europe this season, I'm convinced that if he'd played we'd have had more additional chances than they did, and the balance of play would have been tipped even further in our favour.

[Wig]

It could have been done better but what we did was enough. There were enough decent opportunities created for various players and we were on top. It wasn't Watford we were plaing, it was Milan, and we did enough to come out as clearly the better side, it just needed that bit of a finish which certain players couldn't muster.

 

I agree with that.

 

We did well but Milan are know for their defence. It's the first thing everyone talks about when a Milan conversation gets started.

The chances were there for the players in the last 3rd of the pitch to do something with the ball.

[sh#t waffle]

 

I'm not knocking Dirk or Pennant, they both did themselves proud. This isn't an anti-anyone thread, it's a pro-Crouch one. I just think the big fella would have given us more cutting edge than either of those two did, and if that was at the expense of giving more of the ball to Milan then that was a risk that was worth taking.

 

Maybe. But maybe not. I certainly think Gerrard may have had a far more influential game had he been playing off Crouch rather than Dirk. But the negatives of playing him mayhave outweighed the gains. I've certainly seen us look toothless with Crouch up front.

I totally agree that Milan are not an unstoppable force, but to say that the way we set up didn't make them look worse than they were is wrong in my opinion.