Is Trent Really Worth It?

[Code]

Trent was awful yesterday, sloppy as fuck with his passing, and should obviously have won the gamenm for us when Salah set him up nicely. All he needed to do was to hit target.

 

One of the worst games I've seen him play I think. 

[gkmacca]

When he's on form, he's worth it, when he's not, he's not. What bothers me is the apparent imprecision of his position: either play him at RB or as CM but when you try to do both, the rest of the team becomes his servants, and, long term, that's just unacceptable (especially when he doesn't play that well). At times, such as yesterday, he seems to find his own image almost erotic in its appeal - the stupid cut-off socks, the Gerrard-at-his-most egomaniacal swagger, and the brushed-aside overhit passes: deeply depressing stuff. He needs to shake-off the 'evolution of a superstar' outlook and get back to being one player amongst others. It's the team that's important, not him.

[El Dangerous]

We’re hardly the first team in history to sacrifice certain facets of its team to accommodate a playmaker. It’s just we’re probably the first to do that for a playmaker starting from right back. I imagine if he was starting in a Pirlo style role people would be a lot more understanding of him. 
 

 

[Barrington Womble]

19 hours ago, TheHowieLama said:

We have played with an inverted RB all season, even when Trent wasn't on the field or as part of the midfield three.
Doubt we would change that overnight.

 

I agree it's unlikely we'll change it..we do look a more cohesive attacking unit on the small occasions we play with a more traditional right back (I'm thinking position and not the person), like when Gomez did it yesterday and him and Trent a few times before. 

 

18 hours ago, George Costanza said:

I don't understand why he can't play both roles as a traditional fullback and inverted one.  Read the game, if we're lacking width go on the overlap, if we're strugglin to get on the ball and create from deep come in field and provide some creativity.  Don't know why it has to be one or the other, cant we be adaptable and flexible in our play?

 

I think in the modern game, the coaching team send the players out with plans. For me it was clear yesterday klopp had asked Trent to go into a more traditional role in the 2nd half, but he just couldn't help himself drifting infield for whatever reason, like inside 5 or 10 mins he'd just forgotten instructions, which undermined everything else when he did, because Salah was no longer providing the width he was in the first half. I pretty much hated our overall performance yesterday and I felt Trent was a big part of that. But as down as we are on the back of 2 points chucked away, over the long term it's still pretty hard to argue with our progression.

 

I think yesterday showed me Trent has a long, long way to go to be considered a midfielder. 

[aws]

52 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

 

I agree it's unlikely we'll change it..we do look a more cohesive attacking unit on the small occasions we play with a more traditional right back (I'm thinking position and not the person), like when Gomez did it yesterday and him and Trent a few times before. 

 

 

I think in the modern game, the coaching team send the players out with plans. For me it was clear yesterday klopp had asked Trent to go into a more traditional role in the 2nd half, but he just couldn't help himself drifting infield for whatever reason, like inside 5 or 10 mins he'd just forgotten instructions, which undermined everything else when he did, because Salah was no longer providing the width he was in the first half. I pretty much hated our overall performance yesterday and I felt Trent was a big part of that. But as down as we are on the back of 2 points chucked away, over the long term it's still pretty hard to argue with our progression.

 

I think yesterday showed me Trent has a long, long way to go to be considered a midfielder. 

I don’t see Trent as a controlling central midfielder at the moment - maybe he might develop into one but I doubt it.  If he’s going to be playing in midfield, he’s more  Beckham than Gerrard. 

[Barrington Womble]

1 minute ago, aws said:

I don’t see Trent as a controlling central midfielder at the moment - maybe he might develop into one but I doubt it.  If he’s going to be playing in midfield, he’s more  Beckham than Gerrard. 

We're not playing him in the right part of the pitch for that. And Beckham was shite central. And Trent did all beckham could from his old right back role. 

[Captain Turdseye]

I switched straight off after the game yesterday and haven’t read much about the game but I was seething with Trent towards the end yesterday. Just pinging Hollywood balls all over the place and giving it away every time. 
 

I said it to my boy during the game, he’s starting to think that he’s Steven Gerrard. He isn’t. What he is or was, was one of the best right backs in world football. 

I don’t watch England games but I’ve seen enough of him in a Liverpool shirt to know that he’s not a midfielder. 

[aws]

4 hours ago, Barrington Womble said:

We're not playing him in the right part of the pitch for that. And Beckham was shite central. And Trent did all beckham could from his old right back role. 

That’s my point. He should be playing to his strengths from the right side either at RB or RM. 

[The Guest]

He was never the best right back in world football.  We played an absolutely mad style of football not really seen before that completely shook nearly every team we played.  We suffocated teams by pressing so high and forcing them to either give it away trying to play out or by going long to Virg.  We were largely unplayable.  Trent benefitted as much as anyone.

 

His attitude to defending, his concentration and more than anything his complete lack of responsibility to that side of the game has always been beyond awful.  He’s had the odd big game where he’s managed to keep it together and he has the odd moment in games where he busts a gut and saves the day like he did after Alissons brilliant save last week and with Garnacho yesterday and this seems to be enough to convince people that “he’s not shit at defending and it’s complete myth.”

 

It’s been getting even worse though over the last few seasons and I thought maybe he was doing it to try to force Klopps hand and a move to midfield would see him try to do a Gerrard impression and put the effort in there to solidify his position.  He’s still just walking around though.  The winner he scored against Fulham was largely needed because of how poor defensively he was for their 3rd goal.  He’s lazy and his head is only getting bigger and bigger.  Personally I reckon he’s running his contract down and when/if he does go and thinks he’s going to be in for a big shock.  I think he will go like most players that do that leave Klopps Liverpool.  No other club will stand for him just behaving like a cone and watching players walk past him.

 

It’s only a small thing but it made me laugh in the first 5-10 minutes of yesterday when we had them under loads of pressure and probably had our best spell.  We win a corner and he purposely starts walking as slowly as he can without stopping to encourage the crowd to start sucking him off instead of getting over there and taking it and keeping the pressure up.  There were signs of it a while ago when he started talking about being able to see things nobody else can.  He’s gone off the deep end and you can see it pretty much any times he speaks lately.  He’s a complete bell end and I think everyone will see it eventually.

[VladimirIlyich]

5 hours ago, The Guest said:

He was never the best right back in world football.  We played an absolutely mad style of football not really seen before that completely shook nearly every team we played.  We suffocated teams by pressing so high and forcing them to either give it away trying to play out or by going long to Virg.  We were largely unplayable.  Trent benefitted as much as anyone.

 

His attitude to defending, his concentration and more than anything his complete lack of responsibility to that side of the game has always been beyond awful.  He’s had the odd big game where he’s managed to keep it together and he has the odd moment in games where he busts a gut and saves the day like he did after Alissons brilliant save last week and with Garnacho yesterday and this seems to be enough to convince people that “he’s not shit at defending and it’s complete myth.”

 

It’s been getting even worse though over the last few seasons and I thought maybe he was doing it to try to force Klopps hand and a move to midfield would see him try to do a Gerrard impression and put the effort in there to solidify his position.  He’s still just walking around though.  The winner he scored against Fulham was largely needed because of how poor defensively he was for their 3rd goal.  He’s lazy and his head is only getting bigger and bigger.  Personally I reckon he’s running his contract down and when/if he does go and thinks he’s going to be in for a big shock.  I think he will go like most players that do that leave Klopps Liverpool.  No other club will stand for him just behaving like a cone and watching players walk past him.

 

It’s only a small thing but it made me laugh in the first 5-10 minutes of yesterday when we had them under loads of pressure and probably had our best spell.  We win a corner and he purposely starts walking as slowly as he can without stopping to encourage the crowd to start sucking him off instead of getting over there and taking it and keeping the pressure up.  There were signs of it a while ago when he started talking about being able to see things nobody else can.  He’s gone off the deep end and you can see it pretty much any times he speaks lately.  He’s a complete bell end and I think everyone will see it eventually.

You made some fair points until you resorted to personal insults of the lad. He doesn't appear to be a bad person at all,but I do concur that he appears to be getting a bit ahead of himself on the pitch.

[dave u]

8 hours ago, The Guest said:

It’s only a small thing but it made me laugh in the first 5-10 minutes of yesterday when we had them under loads of pressure and probably had our best spell.  We win a corner and he purposely starts walking as slowly as he can without stopping to encourage the crowd to start sucking him off instead of getting over there and taking it and keeping the pressure up.  

 

And here's me thinking he's walking slowly to give Van Dijk and Konate time to get in the box and for everyone in there to get set up for the runs they were going to be making.

[Bjornebye]

Sign of the times I guess, people being hysterical fannies when we draw. God bless you Jurgen x

[dave u]

11 hours ago, Captain Turdseye said:

I switched straight off after the game yesterday and haven’t read much about the game but I was seething with Trent towards the end yesterday. Just pinging Hollywood balls all over the place and giving it away every time. 

 

Yeah I came away from the game thinking he'd been shite. On reflection, he wasn't. He did a lot of good things in the game and overall didn't play badly, but the shit you're talking about there was bad and distorted how people have seen his performance. Those stupid overhit crosses to the back post that ended up in the stands were ridiculous. Not because of the poor execution, but because of the terrible decision.

[VladimirIlyich]

It's always 'this player' or 'that player' on these type of internet forums when in fact it's mostly other things that we aren't privvy to know. One of the fantastic things that Klopp has achieved is a system based on the collective over the individuals involved. If one or two have an off day it effects the whole team and system. It isnt Trent,it isnt Dom,it isnt Mo or Nunez its a combination of one or more of how the team works as a unit.

[Barrington Womble]

9 hours ago, aws said:

That’s my point. He should be playing to his strengths from the right side either at RB or RM. 

So we don't really play with a RM do we? I don't know what the right position is for him, but I don't think what he's doing now is getting the best out of him. It might be better for the team as a whole, but he's not the creative spark he was before. And I don't just mean those crosses. He was a great passer of the ball in general from those wide areas, be that through balls or the big switches and now he's just bogged down and getting man marked out of matches, he's just unable to get passes off (even if he's seeing them). 

[sh#t waffle]

1 hour ago, VladimirIlyich said:

It isnt Trent,it isnt Dom,it isnt Mo or Nunez its a combination of one or more of how the team works as a unit.

Totally agree, not fair to single them out - I prefer to hate every single player and member of staff equally.

[A Red]

This is might be a bit mad. For me he is our most talented player and I want to see him on the ball all the time, so I reckon he could play in the front 3 in the Bobby roll linking the midfield. Yes it would involve him running around closing down but the other stuff he could do would be sensational. In my mad opinion.

[No2]

34 minutes ago, A Red said:

This is might be a bit mad. For me he is our most talented player and I want to see him on the ball all the time, so I reckon he could play in the front 3 in the Bobby roll linking the midfield. Yes it would involve him running around closing down but the other stuff he could do would be sensational. In my mad opinion.

Repped for being out of it on a Tuesday morning.

[Section_31]

If he ends up playing in Spain where he's got more time in a midfield role he'll look different class I reckon.

[VladimirIlyich]

1 hour ago, sh#t waffle said:

Totally agree, not fair to single them out - I prefer to hate every single player and member of staff equally.

That's the way.

[VladimirIlyich]

I believe Trent is better at RB because it's plain to see that you have more space and time in that position. I think,and Jurgen has taken this view mainly too. The midfield congestion stops Trent being as effective in there.

[TheHowieLama]

1 hour ago, Section_31 said:

If he ends up playing in Spain where he's got more time in a midfield role he'll look different class I reckon.

 

He could play in Spain tomorrow and wouldn't be a patch on Bellingham as an example.

He doesn't have the skill set of a top midfielder. Was never developed as he has played all of his quality, top flight footy as a RB.

In fact he struggles to just be an average midfielder in our system, and it is set up for him.

[No2]

The issue I have with him at the minute is he seems to think he's barred from the right hand side. Szoboszlai and Henderson before him, always end up on the touchline swinging in crosses. At City and Arsenal its the position rather than the players that's important, Trent appears to me to be doing it the wrong way around.  Go where the space is and create from there, bringing everyone in to a 20 yard zone like an under 8s game isn't the way forward.

[Scott_M]

I think TAA coming inside more, although good for his personal performances, are at the detriment of the side.

 

I’m fine with him coming it inside sometimes, it shouldn’t be our go to tactic, which what’s it’s been since Luton away.

 

If Mac Allister isn’t fit, I’ve no problem him starting in midfield v Arsenal. Gomez at right back might help defensively v Martinelli. 

[Barrington Womble]

2 hours ago, Scott_M said:

I think TAA coming inside more, although good for his personal performances, are at the detriment of the side.

 

I’m fine with him coming it inside sometimes, it shouldn’t be our go to tactic, which what’s it’s been since Luton away.

 

If Mac Allister isn’t fit, I’ve no problem him starting in midfield v Arsenal. Gomez at right back might help defensively v Martinelli. 

 

Really? I think Trent coming inside might be his personal preference, I don't think he's more effective. Quite the opposite in fact. Most teams man mark him now.  We're no longer seeing that range of passing we were last season before people realised he had to be man marked or he'd destroy you. 

 

I don't completely agree with @TheHowieLama , but I think he has almost to learn in terms of influencing the game when being shutdown. Macca helps, because he can pop short passes to him and he has the quality to make things happen. Once you've got him and endo, it's a real issue because endo doesn't have the speed of thought and range of passing of Macca. Trent has to realise in that situation he has to find a way to control the game and I don't think he really had a clue how to do that at the moment.