Rafael Benitez: Football’s forgotten man

[Hand Shandy]

I've said it before, but I'll say it again.

 

Code, you really need to get out more.

[FrenchEyeGlass]

He didnt even sign the first player on that list.

 

Code, Skidfingers, moof are some of the worst posters on here but never get called up on it for some odd reason. And they all think im a cunt. And thats why im very probably not a cunt.

[Code]

I've said it before, but I'll say it again.

 

Code, you really need to get out more.

 

It was from an old thread on the subject, where the question was if there was a long term strategy behind the transfers or if it was all because of a budget.

 

Looking at the ins and outs its difficult to find a pattern, more man searching for solutions year in year out because of lack of vision and an overall strategy to our set up and how to make it work.

 

Like I,ve said, one step up, two steps back.

[Skidfingers McGonical]

 

"Wrong" this, "wrong" that. "He blew it". What thoroughly obnoxious turns of phrase.

 

I like you Skidders, I'm pretty sure we'd get on well in Real Life, but in this instance I think you're being an ungrateful cunt. Sorry 'bout that.

 

No worries fella. I reckon we would too.

 

Opinions are allowed. It just seems that many of those on the subject of Rafa are not allowed to change or be questioned by some.

 

I'm not a hater I've just looked back at aspects of his reign and changed my opinion and realised certain things.

 

However I have said the same thing about the 2007 CL since 2007 and will continue to say it. I was equally as gutted as any red that night.

 

I'm not saying he's shit, because he's not. Just pointing out the arguments used to laud Rafa because things aren't going great at the moment, are the same things we argued about back in the day and are currently ring used against Kenny.

 

I am grateful for two CL Finals in 3 years, but it should have been 2 wins in 3 years. The excuses started at the press conference straight after the game.

[Guest TK-421]

So you think we were the better team in 2005 and clear favourites?

[Jairzinho]

Shit first team squad, reserves and academy on arrival. Not, in relative terms, a huge amount of money to spend. So "Scattergun" was probably the only available option, as so much had to be done, and quickly.

 

Gradually improve first team squad, reserves and academy. Then Herp and Derp arrive and start raping the club. All areas inevitably weaken.

 

Long term strategy impossible.

[FrenchEyeGlass]

To criticise Rafa's transfer policy whilst defending Kenny's is the most laughable thing i've heard in my life. Kenny couldn't have signed worst players if he tried.

 

But again. Im sure you three/four/handful of absolute fucking mongs know better than the rest of the world. I mean, Rafa was such a terrible manager during his time here that he only got an offer from the European champions (and hence, the best club team in Europe at the time).

 

I actually think that Code thinks he himself would be a better manager than Rafa Benitez.

[dirk grout]

Shit first team squad, reserves and academy on arrival. Not, in relative terms, a huge amount of money to spend. So "Scattergun" was probably the only available option, as so much had to be done, and quickly.

 

Gradually improve first team squad, reserves and academy. Then Herp and Derp arrive and start raping the club. All areas inevitably weaken.

 

Long term strategy impossible.

 

As soon as you start making a profit in transfer windows the team only goes in one direction. The trick is trying to get the fans to blame the manager. Fortunately, we have the best fans in the world and are not that gullible...

[Skidfingers McGonical]

So you think we were the better team in 2005 and clear favourites?

 

No, I'm saying he should have added a second title in 2007.

 

2005 we were far from favourites. About a gazillion miles away.

[Skidfingers McGonical]

To criticise Rafa's transfer policy whilst defending Kenny's is the most laughable thing i've heard in my life. Kenny couldn't have signed worst players if he tried.

 

But again. Im sure you three/four/handful of absolute fucking mongs know better than the rest of the world. I mean, Rafa was such a terrible manager during his time here that he only got an offer from the European champions (and hence, the best club team in Europe at the time).

 

I actually think that Code thinks he himself would be a better manager than Rafa Benitez.

 

Over 100 players signed under his tenure. 100. How the fuck can that not be questioned.

 

And you say I should be pulled up.

[FrenchEyeGlass]

No worries fella. I reckon we would too.

 

Opinions are allowed. It just seems that many of those on the subject of Rafa are not allowed to change or be questioned by some.

 

I'm not a hater I've just looked back at aspects of his reign and changed my opinion and realised certain things.

 

However I have said the same thing about the 2007 CL since 2007 and will continue to say it. I was equally as gutted as any red that night.

 

I'm not saying he's shit, because he's not. Just pointing out the arguments used to laud Rafa because things aren't going great at the moment, are the same things we argued about back in the day and are currently ring used against Kenny.

 

I am grateful for two CL Finals in 3 years, but it should have been 2 wins in 3 years. The excuses started at the press conference straight after the game.

 

Opinions are allowed but yours are stupid. As fair and non-confrontational as one wants to be, its impossible to have a sensible discussion when you come out with some of the stuff you do.

 

"It should have been 2 wins in 3 years". Not asking for much are you? You quite obviously aren't grateful for the two CL finals because you seem to think you deserve more. We lost because of a freak-free kick. We weren't exactly played off the park. If anything we dominated large parts of the game and should have scored.

 

Rafa had every right to ask for more money, it wasn't a fucking excuse. If he hadn't have, we wouldn't have got Torres. Look at how much money Madrid, Chelsea spend, how often have they been in the final in recent history? You're opinion is moronic.

 

I do hope he comes back and wins the title just so we can watch you, Code, moof and alike morons celebrate with glee. Its funny that you all come out with the "sky generation" line when the only ones who portray such qualities are people like you.

[Guest the boy]

I'm glad the Sky generation of supporters have finally admitted that they class success as finishing fourth and not winning any trophies.

 

I'm a season ticket holder, thanks.

 

 

He's had the money to spend but has refused to spend it because he was stubborn enough to believe his young guns would come good.

 

This statement beggars belief. Are you suggesting that Arsene Wenger has declined the funds to strengthen a threadbare squad?

 

Arteta is good but he's no Cesc or Nasri.

 

You're right, he isn't. Which is why his fee was a fifth of Fabregas, and half Nasri's, without taking into account contract situations and the fact that his salary is likely to be half of those players' as well.

 

Arsene Wenger has won nothing for 7 years since he started building his own team and he has had the money to spend. He just refuses to.

 

Again, peddling this myth. On what basis do you take it as fact that he has refused to spend? The implication that his success was achieved with an inherited team is so ludicrous that no further comment is needed.

 

It's amazing how people keep pointing out that Rafa brought £100 million in from transfers, yes, brilliant, well done.

 

I was actually referring to the £100+ million brought in from our success in European competition, which is a triumph in addition to the profits made on Torres / Alonso et al.

 

But then he went and spent it on shite, absolute total shit. £40 million on Aquilani and Keane, money wasted on the likes of Voronin, Degen, Dossena, Insua and a whole load of other youngsters that were never going to make it. Don't get me wrong, he did buy some good players, no doubt.

 

Reassuring to know that he did buy some 'good' players at least.

 

Thing is people use net spend to suit the Rafa argument, but Kenny brought money from sales but people say 'He's spent £80 million on shite"

 

Which sales?

 

How much has Wenger wasted on centre backs and forwards? And still no trophies since 2005.

 

Taking £10 million as an arbitrary fee that would represent a 'good' Premier League player, kindly state players that Wenger has wasted money upon. Or do you mean to say that you are surprised when a bosman or £>5 million player performs according to their fee?

 

 

But I'll say this, Kenny's signings have twice the talent and potential than the majority of Rafa's signings. Excluding Alonso, Torres and Mascherano.

 

The major downfall of posters such as yourself, and Code72 for the sake of arguement, is an inability to grasp simple economics. Please state which Dalglish singings have 'twice the talent and potential' compared to Benitez alternatives, relative to fee and wages paid.

 

People forget that he blew the 2007 CL final with his tactics but then came out and blamed the lack of funds which a lot of us believed. It was ironic that he won the CL with a lesser squad but did not come out screaming "I need more money" after that final.

 

You consider that winnng the European Cup in 2005 with a team whose resources were dwarfed by those around them, and falling at the last hurdle at European Cup final in 2007 with a team whose resources were dwarfed by those around them, is best described as an 'irony'?

 

It's very similar to Mancini blaming Balotelli for City not winning the title this season. Both need to look closer to home to their own failings.

 

People can point to Hicks and Gillette or the player power of Gerrard and Carragher that people said happened. But what it comes down to, and with the likes of Wenger and Mancini is their own faults as managers have. It's them. Their decisions, their tactics and their signings, nobody else's. Same with Kenny if he does not pick us up from this seasons poor league showing.

 

The only point of interest that I can glean here is the comparison of Mancini with Wenger / Benitez. Do you consider the sums spent by Mancini relative to those spent by Wenger / Benitez to be similar? If not, can the same levels of success / points tally in the league be expected?

 

---

 

The remainder is rhetoric that needn't be re-posted.

Edited April 9, 2012 by the boy

[FrenchEyeGlass]

Over 100 players signed under his tenure. 100. How the fuck can that not be questioned.

 

And you say I should be pulled up.

 

In 6 years.

 

With half of them being youth players. Many of which make up our current YOUTH SYSTEM. That includes a certain Raheem Sterling im sure you was cheering on the other week.

 

Its funny you all talk about his shit signings. Most of them were fucking free! The only big signings that went awry were Keane and Aquilani. One who actually WASNT a big signing because he was sold for 14m leaving us with a 6m loss. The other currently plays for the champions elect and just played in the Champions League QTR Final. He was obviously too shit for us.

 

Hes not a Henderson thats for sure.

[Whelan]

I was gutted (and still don't think it was the right decision) when Rafa left but this thread is the reason why I don't want him back! It would be pointless as the different groups would become more entrenched.

 

But until we have a manager who has us competing for the champions league then the arguments against his removal will continue to be valid! There can be no comparison between Rafa's expectation to win the league and Kenny's expectation to challenge for the top four! The reason why Kenny is being criticised is because the low expectations have still not been met, we can't even argue that our minimum requirements have been met as they haven't.

 

There is a real possibility that we will finish this season mid table, behind Everton, Swansea and Sunderland, but with a Carling Cup, which is nice but not when you factor in the money spent. I can't speak for anyone else, but after the arguments about Rafa which generally focussed upon his ability to win the league, I am struggling to accept the argument that I should be patient and accept a mid table finish! The only reason it is even being debated is because it is Kenny, as a manager this season has been piss poor and not really given any note of optimism to look to.

 

But the fact remains that it is Kenny, and he does deserve patience. But anyone expecting Rafa to disappear is sadly going to be dissapointed, until we have a team that is challenging then he will still be the modern yardstick.

[BringbackBiscan]

He didnt even sign the first player on that list.

 

Code, Skidfingers, moof are some of the worst posters on here but never get called up on it for some odd reason. And they all think im a cunt. And thats why im very probably not a cunt.

 

Pol pot and Hitler could think you're a cunt, you'd still be a massive cunt.

[Bobby Hundreds]

In 6 years.

 

With half of them being youth players. Many of which make up our current YOUTH SYSTEM. That includes a certain Raheem Sterling im sure you was cheering on the other week.

 

Its funny you all talk about his shit signings. Most of them were fucking free! The only big signings that went awry were Keane and Aquilani. One who actually WASNT a big signing because he was sold for 14m leaving us with a 6m loss. The other currently plays for the champions elect and just played in the Champions League QTR Final. He was obviously too shit for us.

 

Hes not a Henderson thats for sure.

 

Henderson is 21 and Enrique, Coates, Henderson and Suarez could have great futures for this club. Kenny's signing of downing and carrol are the big mistakes does he not deserve the opportunity to correct them and get his net spend certificate.

[Torvald Utne]

Fucking hell Code, you do a good job of making yourself look like an idiot.

[FrenchEyeGlass]

 

04/05:

In:

Djibril Cissé - Auxerre £14.0M

 

Wasnt signed by Rafa. Shut the fuck up.

 

Josemi - Malaga £2.0M

 

Poor buy. Shipped out immediately. Cost 2m.

 

Antonio Nuñez - Real Madrid £3.0M*

 

Liar. Antonio Nunez was free, you stat-twisting saddo. He was given to us for free as part of the Michael Owen deal. We were given a list of shit players who they would consider swapping. We wanted as much as we could get so we chose one. We needed a right midfielder.

 

Xabi Alonso - Real Sociedad £10.7M

 

Amazing player. Cost 2m more than Charlie Adam. Potentially half as much as Henderson.

 

Luis Garcia - Barcelona £6.0M

 

On and off player. Scored many crucial goals for us though and for 6m was a snip.

 

Mauricio Pellegrino - Valencia, free

 

Was brought in to add some experience to the defence and convey the managers tactics.

 

Fernando Morientes - Real Madrid £6.3M

 

At the time was one of the hottest strikers in Europe and was lauded as a great buy at £6m. Was shit hot for Real Madrid. Didn't work out.

 

Scott Carson - Leeds £1.0M

 

Poor buy. We bought too many goalkeepers under Rafa.

 

Out:

Emile Heskey - Birmingh. £6.25M

Michael Foley-Sheridan - released

Markus Babbel - Stuttgart, free

Danny Murphy - Charlton £3M

Michael Owen - Real Madrid £11M*

Stephane Henchoz - Celtic, free

 

 

05/06:

In:

Boudewijn Zenden - Middlesbrough, free

 

An experienced title-winning international who could play across the midfield and had premiership experience. Free. Wasnt great for us but at £0m i'd love for you to find better.

 

José Reina - Villarreal, £6M

 

A goalkeeper nobody really knew about until Rafa bought him. Now considered world class and has won the golden glove here three times. Absolutely adored by the fan base. Cost us 6m. Man utd just spent 20m on De Gea.

 

Antonio Barragan - Sevilla, £240.000*

 

Good youth prospect who was actually pretty decent during his time in the reserves. Sold for a profit.

 

Mohamed Sissoko - Valencia, £5,6M

 

Not-very sought after midfielder who ended up becoming part of "the best midfield in the world". A very good player on his day and dominated games during the season of his eye injury. After that though it went a little pear shaped. Better than any of our current midfielders.

 

Miki Roque - Lleida, unknown

 

No idea. Youth player. Big woop.

 

Peter Crouch - Southampton, £7M

 

Went on to play for a host of premier league clubs. Took him ages to score for us but ended up being a very effective player and prolific for England. For 7m was more than worth his money. Sold for a profit. I fucking wish Carroll was half as good.

 

Besian Idrizaj - LASK Linz, £200 000*

 

Not idea. Youth prospect. Big woop.

 

Jan Kromkamp - Villarreal

 

Free. Swapped for Josemi. Wasn't great but did a job. Let me repeat, he was FREE (or 2m, if you work backwards using the Josemi fee)

 

Paul Anderson - Hull

 

He was very highly rated. So much so that people wanted him in the first team. Didnt work out. Big woop, it happens with youth players.

 

Daniel Agger - Brøndby, £5.8M

 

Currently our best defender (though Skrtle has played very well of late). Has had injury problems. How the fuck can you tell if a player is going to have injury problems?

 

Robbie Fowler - Manchester C, free

 

Club legend. Love him.

 

Out:

El-Hadji Diouf - Bolton, £3.5M

Alou Diarra - Lens, £2M

Vladimir Smicer - Bordeaux, released

Mauricio Pellegrino - Alaves, released

Igor Biscan - Panathinaikos, released

Jon Otsemobor - Rotherham, released

Richie Partridge - Sheff W, released

Paul Harrison - Accrington Stanley, released

Mark Smyth - Accrington Stanley, released

Grégory Vignal - Portsmouth, free

Antonio Nunez - Celta Vigo, unknown

Patrice Luzi - Excelsior Mouscron, released

Milan Baros- Aston Villa, £6.5M

John Welsh - Hull

Josemi - Villarreal

 

 

06/07:

In:

Craig Bellamy - Blackburn, £6M

 

Wasn't deployed correctly but we badly missed a winger. Had Mark Gonzalez worked out things may have been different. He thinks a lot of Rafa though and is currently loved by Liverpool fans. At 6m it was a very good deal.

 

Gabriel Paletta - Banfield, £2M

 

It was actually 1m Euros. Poor signing. He was incredibly highly rated though. Sold and money recouped.

 

Fabio Aurelio - Valencia, free

 

For free. Great player. Blighted by injuries but Rafa gambled on that. FREE!

 

Mark Gonzalez - Albacete, £1M

 

Poor signing. 1m pounds. Crippling amounts of money...

 

Jermaine Pennant - Birmingham, £6,7M*

 

Didn't work out. Was hit and miss and in the end wasnt good enough. For such a paltry fee, though, I dont know how many other wingers there are. Better than Stewert Downing by a fucking country mile.

 

Dirk Kuyt - Feyenoord, £9M

 

Frustrating player. Scored crucial goals but wasnt the goalscorer we needed. However, played a very big role in the squad tactically. Was intrinsic in our 08/09 title challenge (though, not having an alternative was our limitation). For 9m was a good buy, as we'll probably get that back if we sell him.

 

Nabil El Zhar - St Etienne, unknown

 

Shit signing.

 

Alvaro Arbeloa - Deportivo, £2.6M

 

Unbelievable signing. Out marked Messi with ease in one of his first performances (may have been his debut?). Currently plays for the leaders of La Liga and is in the CL semi final.

 

Javier Mascherano - West Ham, £1.5M

 

Couldnt get into the West Ham team. No takers. Then came here and was an amazing defensive midfielder. Currently plays for what some would call as the best footballing side in the world. The fee was higher than 1.5m though.

 

Loans:

Danielle Padelli - Sampdoria, 2006/07

Emiliano Insua - Boca Juniors, 2006/07-07/08

 

Out:

Robbie Foy - Scunthorpe, released

Fernando Morientes - Valencia, £3M

Zak Whitbread - Millwall, £200.000

Bruno Cheyrou - Rennes, unknown

Carl Medjani - Lorient, unknown

David Raven - Carlisle, free

Dietmar Hamann - Bolton(Man City), unknown

Antonio Barragan - Deportivo, £675.000

Djimi Traore - Charlton, £2M

Neil Mellor - Preston £500 000

Jan Kromkamp - PSV Eindhoven £2M

Chris Kirkland - Wigan £3.5M

Darren Potter - Wolverhampton £250 000

Stephen Warnock - Blackburn £1.5M

David Mannix - Hamkam, released

Salif Diao - Stoke, released

 

07/08:

In:

Sebastian Leto, Lanus - £1.85M

 

Poor signing.

 

Andriy Voronin, Bayer Leverkusen - free

 

Poor signing. Free, though. Next time you go to Lidl pick me up a Ferrari.

 

Lucas Leiva, Gremio - £6M

 

Currently our best midfielder (who you hate, because you're an idiot) and is worth about three times as much as that. Now nearly every liverpool fan is talking about how he would have "definitely won us an extra 20 points this season".

 

Fernando Torres, Atletico Madrid - £20,2M

 

A signing nearly everybody doubted due to his lack of goals. Became the fastest to fifty. The best striker in the world for two years. Not only did Rafa do well in signing him, he is currently the only manager to ever get the best out of him. Brought us in 50m which we spent on Carroll. Ha.

 

Ryan Babel, Ajax - £11.5M

 

Poor player who at the time was one of the hottest prospects in Europe. Akin to Eden Hazard was last year. Had one or two flashes of brilliance but for 95% of the time was not very good. Also poorly used.

 

Yossi Benayoun, West Ham - £5M

 

Great signing for 5m. Not the best in the world but nearly helped win us the title.

 

Charles Itandje, Lens - £2M

 

Cunt.

 

Emiliano Insua, Boca Juniors, unknown

 

A good, but limited player. Signed for peanuts. Ended up playing at left back for most of the year and held his own. Not better than our current Enrique, who was exactly the player we needed that season and has been a great signing by Kenny.

 

Martin Skrtel, Zenit St Petersburg - £6.5M

 

Best performer this season. For 6.5m, a very good buy.

 

Javier Mascherano, MSI - £18.6M

 

Ah, theres the fee.

 

Out:

Danny O'Donnell, Crewe - £100 000

Daniele Padelli, Sampdoria - end of loan

David Roberts, Bangor City - released

Robbie Fowler, Cardiff - released

Jerzy Dudek, Real Madrid - released

Boudewijn Zenden, Marseille - released

F. Sinama-Pongolle, Recreativo - £2.7M

Luis Garcia, Atletico Madrid - £4M

Djibril Cissé, Marseille - £6M

Craig Bellamy, West Ham - £7.5M

Mark Gonzalez, Real Betis - £4M

Gabriel Paletta, Boca Juniors - £2M

Jimmy Ryan, Shrewsbury - released

James Smith, Stockport - released

Mohamed Sissoko, Juventus - £9.6M

Lee Peltier, Yeovil - unknown

Besian Idrizaj, FC Wacker Innsbruck - released

 

 

08/09:

In:

Philipp Degen, Borussia Dortmund - free

 

Poor signing. Not many other RB/LB for free though. Eitherway, poor signing. Dont see how this equates to pissing away 20m on a player.

 

Andrea Dossena, Udinese - £6M*

 

Wasnt very good defensively at all. Didnt suit the PL. Poor signing. However, currently plays for Napoli - one of the best teams in Europe. In other words, hes not exactly shit.

 

Diego Cavalieri, Palmeiras - £3.5M

 

Rafa bought too many goalkeepers. This pissed me off.

 

David N'Gog, Paris Saint-Germain - £1.5M

 

Ended up as our main striker. He played like a 1.5m player. Scored goals to be fair. Poor all round play. Still, sold to Bolton for a profit.

 

Robbie Keane, Tottenham - £19M

 

Poor signing. Didnt work out. Only cost us 6m, though. And scored about 8 goals. Rafa got rid immediately.

 

its quite hilarious to beat him with this stick either way. Nearly every fucking newspaper said we were title favourites because this signing was a masterstroke.

 

Albert Riera, Espanyol - £8M

 

A good player who, for 8m, was a good signing. Never a world beater. Twice as good as Downing.

 

Out:

John Arne Riise, Roma - £4M

Anthony Le Tallec, Le Mans - unknown

Harry Kewell, Galatasaray - released

Peter Crouch, Portsmouth - £11M

Danny Guthrie, Newcastle - £2.25M

Scott Carson, West Bromwich - £3.75M

Steve Finnan, Espanyol - £2.5M

Robbie Keane, Tottenham - £16M

 

Loans:

Paul Anderson, Nottingham Forest 01.07.08 - 31.05.09

Robbie Threlfall, Hereford 21.07.08 - 01.01.09, Stockport 03.01.09 - 31.01.09

Adam Hammill, Blackpool 19.07.08 - 31.12.08, Barnsley 02.02.09 - mai 09

Miki Roque, FC Cartagena 22.07.08 - 30.06.09

Godwin Antwi, Tranmere 25.07.08 - 31.12.08, Hereford 17.02.09-21.03.09

Jack Hobbs, Leicester 25.07.08 - 31.05.09

David Martin, Leicester 04.08.09 - 31.05.09

Sebastián Leto, Olympiacos 05.08.08 - 30.06.09

Craig Lindfield, Bournemouth 22.08.08 - 31.12.08, Accrington Stanley 26.01.09 - 02.05.09

Andriy Voronin, Hertha Berlin 01.09.08 - 30.06.09

Ryan Flynn, Wrexham 27.11.09 - 26.04.09

Jermaine Pennant, Portsmouth 20.01.09 - 30.06.09

Jordy Brouwer, RKC Waalwijk 22.01.09 - 30.06.09

Krisztian Nemeth, Blackpool 26.01.09 - 28.02.09

Peter Gulacsi, Hereford 02.02.09 - 02.05.09

 

09/10:

In:

Glen Johnson, Portsmouth - £16M

 

Not as good as Arbeloa but a good signing. Bit of a hefty fee. However it was offset but the fee for crouch still owed, thought to be 7m. Still our best right back.

 

Chris Mavinga, Paris St Germain - komp

 

Crap signing.

 

Alberto Aquilani, AS Roma - £17,1M+£3M

 

Poor signing. However, he isnt a poor player. Is better than any of our midfielders and currently plays for the team pipped to win La Liga. Was never given a chance here.

 

I find it funny that many said "WHY THE FUCK ARE WE SIGNING AN INJURED PLAYER"...two years later, Kenny spent 35m on a Carroll who wasnt available for over a month and those same people rejoiced.

 

Sotirios Kyrgiakos, AEK Athen - £1,5M

 

Was a decent signing and performed well enough.

 

Maxi Rodriguez, Atletico Madrid - gratis

 

Free signing. Past it but has scored a fair few goals.

 

Out:

Xabi Alonso, Real Madrid - £25M*

Andrea Dossena, Napoli - £3,6M

Alvaro Arbeloa, Real Madrid - £3.5M

Sebastian Leto, Panathinaikos - £3M

Andriy Voronin, Dinamo Moskva - £1,8M

Jack Hobbs, Leicester - £1M

Paul Anderson, Nottingham - £250.000

Christopher Buchtmann, Fulham - £100.000

Ryan Flynn, Falkirk - £20.000

Adam Hammill, Barnsley - unknown

Sami Hyypiä, Bayer Leverkusen - free

Jermaine Pennant, Real Zaragoza -released

Miki Roque, Real Betis -released

Ray Putterill - released

Godwin Antwi - released

Astrit Ajdarevic, Leicester - released

Ronald Huth, Vicenza - released

Gary Mackay-Steven - released

Craig Lindfield, Macclesfield - released

Ryan Crowther - released

Vitor Flora, Goiás Esporte Clube - released

 

* Could be £30M depending on clauses.

 

Loans:

Mikel San Jose, Athletic Bilbao - 2009/10

Andras Simon, Cordoba CF - 2009/10

Krisztian Nemeth, AEK Athen - 2009/10

Charles Itandje, AO Kavala - 2009/10

Nikolay Mihaylov, Twente - 2009/10

 

Robbie Threlfall, Northampton - 1 month to 19.Sept, Bradford City - rest of season from 22.Feb

David Martin, Tranmere - 1 month from 16.Okt, Leeds - from 26.Nov to 10.Feb, Derby 12.Mar to 10.Apr

Dean Bouzanis, Accrington - from 26.Nov to 30.May

Nathan Eccleston, Huddersfield - rest of season from 28.Jan

Vincent Weijl, Helmond Sport - 4 months from 29.Jan

Stephen Darby, Swindon - from 12.Mar to 31.May

Jay Spearing, Leicester - rest of season from 23.Mar

Peter Gulácsi, Tranmere - 4 weeks from 16.Apr

 

Added some commentary to your bullshit.

[FrenchEyeGlass]

Henderson is 21 and Enrique, Coates, Henderson and Suarez could have great futures for this club. Kenny's signing of downing and carrol are the big mistakes does he not deserve the opportunity to correct them and get his net spend certificate.

 

I never said he shouldnt get a chance to correct them?

 

Henderson is shit. He will always be shit. Hes a good lad and I feel sorry for him. I wish him the best. But he is a crap player. There is not many tactful ways of saying it.

 

Downing is the most mondane player in the world. And has been for 4 years.

 

Enrique, and Suarez are very good players. Coates could become a good player but we wont know until Kenny starts dropping somebody who is obviously past it.

[Eljeficito]

Added some commentary to your bullshit.

 

Agree on pretty much every single point raised there. Rafa got in wrong in his last season here, other than that i defy anybody to say with a straight face that he was anything other than a success here. Its amazing after all these years theres still a feeling amongst many (including myself) of unfinished business in regards to rafa, even though i doubt he will ever manage us again

[gkmacca]

It's amazing across so many forums how much people have forgotten how negative they were about Rafa when he was actually here. It's one of the most peculiar cases of collective amnesia around.

[dirk grout]

It's amazing across so many forums how much people have forgotten how negative they were about Rafa when he was actually here. It's one of the most peculiar cases of collective amnesia around.

 

Speaking as someone that was not negative about him, maybe some of those that were have realised, with hindsight, that he was doing a good job and that hicks and gillet were more to blame for his final season going wrong and that sacking him and replacing him with hodgson was a mistake.

[ngogswilly]

It's amazing across so many forums how much people have forgotten how negative they were about Rafa when he was actually here. It's one of the most peculiar cases of collective amnesia around.

 

I think plenty still remember.

 

I myself will openly admit to being driven insane by Rafa when he was here and some of the decisions he made and I have to admit when he was moved on I wasn't overly pleased about it but nor was I ridiculously disappointed.

 

But I'll also quite willingly admit we were a pretty fucking good team under him, I think anyone who can't see that is either delusional or biased.

[dirk grout]

I think plenty still remember.

 

I myself will openly admit to being driven insane by Rafa when he was here and some of the decisions he made and I have to admit when he was moved on I wasn't overly pleased about it but nor was I ridiculously disappointed.

 

But I'll also quite willingly admit we were a pretty fucking good team under him, I think anyone who can't see that is either delusional or biased.

 

The problem is that people seem to assume that the grass is always greener. It infuriates me when i see comments like 'if we get a decent offer for johnson/agger/reina in the summer i'd take it'. The assumption that we are then going to go out and buy players that are anywhere near the quality of these players is madness. As mad, in fact, as the assumption that after sacking rafa the clowns we had in charge would appoint a manager anywhere near as good. I tried to tell people at the time that if we do sack rafa, whoever we get in will do much worse. Even i didn't know how right i'd be. This is the main reason why the decision to sack rafa was so obviously wrong. There are still people on here that will, bizarrely, inform you that the sacking of one manager and the appointment of another is in no way related. Try telling that to Wolves fans.

[gkmacca]

But I'll also quite willingly admit we were a pretty fucking good team under him, I think anyone who can't see that is either delusional or biased.

 

I'd agree with that. We were rarely good to watch, but apart frommuch of the last season we were indeed pretty good. I just doubt that will be considered enough next time. Apart from 2006 we always threw the domestic cup competitions away with glorified reserve teams, and only once did we look like contenders in the league. If he came back I'd have very little faith in his transfer dealings, and not much more faith in his ability to challenge for the title. And after a few months the same old vitriol would vomit out all over this forum.