Rafael Benítez on the brink of leaving Liverpool over Anfield rift

[stringvest]

Because he wants to stay?

Likes the club, remembers the good times, family settled in the area?

Is a stubborn bastard who doesn’t want to give in to the owners/board?

Thinks the current ownership is likely to change soon so is hoping to cling on in the hope that we might be run by someone with good intentions?

Still thinks he can win stuff?

 

Jose, if he really wanted to stay, he wouldn't be lifting his skirts and waving his minge at any passing club. He may well end up staying, but that's only because he didn't manage to solicit an offer he felt worth taking.

[piscinin]

Jose, if he really wanted to stay, he wouldn't be lifting his skirts and waving his minge at any passing club. He may well end up staying, but that's only because he didn't manage to solicit an offer he felt worth taking.

 

It's just leverage. If he really wanted to leave he'd be gone.

[stringvest]

Yes John, you did get taken to task because it is treated as fact that Rafa is a greedy bastard just trying to wrangle a way to get sacked and earn a shed load of cash. There is nothing whatsoever to suggest this as even if Rafa did decide on this, there is no way on earth that he would tell anyone so it's all conjecture just used, as per usual, to try and paint the manager as the worst human to ever set foot in the club. And yes, the contract is, as far as we are all guessing because no one actually knows, slanted in his favour in that he has one and if he wants to stay, then that is a bit of a tie. He is a very very rich man as it is, and will get a nice big sign on fee from whatever club takes him should he leave us, so the money thing, in my opinion, is used far too much as a stick to beat an already very wealthy man who will get a wedge regardless of what happens.

 

I think Rafa probably lacks a personality, and is a bit dull, and may be a bit of a bolox to work for; but to go from there, to him being a total cunt trying to get sacked to get a bit more money then what he'd get anyway at his new club, all seems a bit tiresome James Bond villian.

 

Hes probably a bit nearer the cunt end of the spectrum than you like to paint him Johnny. That said, I don't think he's doing it just for the money - but he knows that the financial issues at the club have a material effect on its ability to sack him, and he's making hay while the sun shines. Leaks, agent chit chat, all the political stuff.

 

How you can square that with your opinion that Rafa is motivated by doing what is right for the club, lordi only knows. Rafa doesn't really give a fuck about the club imo. It's blarney in pidgin English.

[Jose Jones]

Jose, if he really wanted to stay, he wouldn't be lifting his skirts and waving his minge at any passing club. He may well end up staying, but that's only because he didn't manage to solicit an offer he felt worth taking.

 

Stringy, I was just offering suggestions as to why Rafa wants to stay as opposed to quitting entirely.

I agree that if he received a concrete job offer from a good club he’d probably leave. I also think Rafa offering his man-minge around has been for different effect now than in the past.

 

In the past it was used as a “stop fucking about and support me or I might leave” to the board, now I think he is genuinely testing the waters, if he either gets sacked or decides to jump.

 

I still think some of the issues in my previous post are true as to the reason why he hasn’t just quit – a mixture of stubbornness, not wanting to give in and still thinking he can do the job and there may be a bit of monetary reasons as well.

[stringvest]

It's just leverage. If he really wanted to leave he'd be gone.

 

This does not need to be done through the press though. It's disrespecting the club and the fans. I don't think he's been offered anything to accept yet. He couldn't get what he wanted from Juventus, and the opportunities elsewhere are diminishing. He'll be bumming us next year because he couldn't find anything more attractive once the lights went up and the DJ called for time.

[Jose Jones]

Bit confused here Stringvest.

Rafa’s been lifting his skirts and showing off his minge, but then he’s also going to be bumming us?

Are you saying he’s some sort of Lady Gaga/Nicole Kidman/Jamie Lee Curtis* disco hermaphrodite?

 

 

* Delete as per chosen rumour.

[torahboy]

What's Maddock doing, auditioning for The Mail? No quotes, no story. Time for bed.

[AmerScouse]

i hate the fact that this is all happening in the press, but its no different if one of us was looking for new employment. its not smart to leave a job before you've got another one, so in this case i don't blame him for wanting to stay.

 

i've read so many articles, opinions etc and to be fair they are all slanted one way or the other, but rafa is in a pretty tight spot right now. liverpool could be the summit of his career if he doesn't play his cards right. i agree with johnny about the money thing, although i think rafa is doing it out of spite towards both purslow and the owners. this is a man that grew up with madrid politics, so he knows what is going on. at some point it becomes about professional pride, and maybe just maybe he wants them to sack him to prove a point as to what is going on at the club.

 

either way it doesn't really matter what i think, but i'd like him to leave because his time is up here. sometimes a manager hits a peak with a club and can't maintain it over a period of time and needs to move on to a fresh challenge. i think its that time for him

[piscinin]

This does not need to be done through the press though. It's disrespecting the club and the fans. I don't think he's been offered anything to accept yet. He couldn't get what he wanted from Juventus, and the opportunities elsewhere are diminishing. He'll be bumming us next year because he couldn't find anything more attractive once the lights went up and the DJ called for time.

 

Whether it's conducted through the press or not, it's still about leverage. If he wanted to leave, he would be gone. He doesn't need to work again, he's a multi-millionaire.

 

The cold hard facts are that we have given him an opportunity (control) that he probably couldn't get anywhere else. That opportunity is clearly worth more to him than what others can offer.

 

He's only at the disco because someone is coming up "short" somewhere, if he was being taken care of, he wouldn't need to be there would he. And you are probably right, unless the track record of coming up "short" changes, then once again there will be leverage to provide resources commensurate with expectations.

[piscinin]

Bit confused here Stringvest.

Rafa’s been lifting his skirts and showing off his minge, but then he’s also going to be bumming us?

Are you saying he’s some sort of Lady Gaga/Nicole Kidman/Jamie Lee Curtis* disco hermaphrodite?

 

 

* Delete as per chosen rumour.

 

Strap-on. Ask Postma. (There's a line about "filling you in" there somewhere).

[piscinin]

i hate the fact that this is all happening in the press, but its no different if one of us was looking for new employment. its not smart to leave a job before you've got another one, so in this case i don't blame him for wanting to stay.

 

It's completely different. He's a multi-millionaire. He probably doesn't need to work again.

[AmerScouse]

It's completely different. He's a multi-millionaire. He probably doesn't need to work again.

 

if your goal in life is to be a top class manager then it does matter. and leaving liverpool because you've got a ton of money, but might not get another top job, could be career suicide if the chips don't fall properly.

 

12 months ago juande ramos was managing real madrid, where is he now?

[stringvest]

Whether it's conducted through the press or not, it's still about leverage. If he wanted to leave, he would be gone. He doesn't need to work again, he's a multi-millionaire.

 

The cold hard facts are that we have given him an opportunity (control) that he probably couldn't get anywhere else. That opportunity is clearly worth more to him than what others can offer.

 

He's only at the disco because someone is coming up "short" somewhere, if he was being taken care of, he wouldn't need to be there would he. And you are probably right, unless the track record of coming up "short" changes, then once again there will be leverage to provide resources commensurate with expectations.

 

I know he doesn't have any financial imperative - but by the same token he doesn't want to find himself out of a job for a year if he can help it. It's all very sleazy, yet his behaviour is entirely typical and betrays once again the lack of respect he has for the supporters and the club as an institution.

 

This manager has fucked the club about and generally taken the piss more than any other Liverpool manager in my lifetime, while at the same time producing football that any manager with the same resources should be ashamed of. He certainly doesn't produce a deliverable commensurate with my expectations. But he'll probably be here for at least part of next season, so I guess we'll just have to stand helplessly by and watch the rot continue.

 

If the domain under his 'control' includes a £0 transfer budget, and an increasing Celtic influence around the junior ranks, he may find that in this context ''control' is overrated.

[piscinin]

if your goal in life is to be a top class manager then it does matter. and leaving liverpool because you've got a ton of money, but might not get another top job, could be career suicide if the chips don't fall properly.

 

Trust me if you are one of the top 10 managers in the world you will get another job. No question there is risk but quality is more important than timing. The cream will always rise to the top and time on the sidelines in inevitable.

 

12 months ago juande ramos was managing real madrid, where is he now?

 

And 36 months ago Capello was managing madrid. These things go in cycles. Look at Van Gaal too.

[piscinin]

I know he doesn't have any financial imperative - but by the same token he doesn't want to find himself out of a job for a year if he can help it. It's all very sleazy, yet his behaviour is entirely typical and betrays once again the lack of respect he has for the supporters and the club as an institution.

 

This manager has fucked the club about and generally taken the piss more than any other Liverpool manager in my lifetime, while at the same time producing football that any manager with the same resources should be ashamed of. He certainly doesn't produce a deliverable commensurate with my expectations. But he'll probably be here for at least part of next season, so I guess we'll just have to stand helplessly by and watch the rot continue.

 

Well that's an entirely different discussion.

 

If the domain under his 'control' includes a £0 transfer budget, and an increasing Celtic influence around the junior ranks, he may find that in this context ''control' is overrated.

You're right IMO, if they take away "control", he will be gone. He really will want to leave then.

[JohnnyH]

Hes probably a bit nearer the cunt end of the spectrum than you like to paint him Johnny. That said, I don't think he's doing it just for the money - but he knows that the financial issues at the club have a material effect on its ability to sack him, and he's making hay while the sun shines. Leaks, agent chit chat, all the political stuff.

 

He might be Stringy, or he might not. We don't know. It's the given as fact nonsense that seems to get said about Rafa once someone decides something about him that is tiresome. From anyone with a bit of knowledge on these issues that I have discussed the £16m redundancy with, they tell me it'll not even be anywhere near half that, yet it is treated as fact. It is fact that Rafa is a cunt and just wants to be sacked for the massive pay off. The idea that he might actually want to stay is not even entertained.

 

How you can square that with your opinion that Rafa is motivated by doing what is right for the club, lordi only knows. Rafa doesn't really give a fuck about the club imo. It's blarney in pidgin English.

 

In your opinion. I have no doubt that Rafa is self serving. Of course he is. But I don't think he is any more self serving then anyone else. I actually do think that he wants to do right by the club. Of course he wants the club to do well. This will be for his own good also as if the club is doing well then so is he. I also think his wife has huge affection for the club and this rubs off on him. In fact I find it quite easy to "square away" my opinion as I don't have this movie badguy imagine of Rafa trying to do everything to ruin the club that others have. And I don't have this image because I think it's all bullshit and just part of a very significant campaign to badmouth the manager.

 

I also think Gerrard, Torres, and Reina have huge affection for the club but they will leave for their own interest if the ownership mess continues.

 

Anything the manager now says is picked apart and a bad slant is developed somehow. Look at Pepe Reinas recent comments about having to lower our targets next season because of the ownership mess. Pepe was called a ledge for speaking out. Can you imagine what would have been said had Rafa made the exact same comments?

 

I see the massive respect and the desire that Reina has for Rafa to stay here, and that is a much bigger indicator of what Rafa brings to LFC. Certainly much bigger then the smear campaign that is been worked on so hard to convince everyone that Rafa is some evil genius hell-bent on killing the club.

[goatboy59]

Jose, if he really wanted to stay, he wouldn't be lifting his skirts and waving his minge at any passing club.

 

 

"Ever drunk Bailey's from a shoe?"

[stringvest]

He might be Stringy, or he might not. We don't know. It's the given as fact nonsense that seems to get said about Rafa once someone decides something about him that is tiresome. From anyone with a bit of knowledge on these issues that I have discussed the £16m redundancy with, they tell me it'll not even be anywhere near half that, yet it is treated as fact. It is fact that Rafa is a cunt and just wants to be sacked for the massive pay off. The idea that he might actually want to stay is not even entertained.

 

 

 

In your opinion. I have no doubt that Rafa is self serving. Of course he is. But I don't think he is any more self serving then anyone else. I actually do think that he wants to do right by the club. Of course he wants the club to do well. This will be for his own good also as if the club is doing well then so is he. I also think his wife has huge affection for the club and this rubs off on him. In fact I find it quite easy to "square away" my opinion as I don't have this movie badguy imagine of Rafa trying to do everything to ruin the club that others have. And I don't have this image because I think it's all bullshit and just part of a very significant campaign to badmouth the manager.

 

I also think Gerrard, Torres, and Reina have huge affection for the club but they will leave for their own interest if the ownership mess continues.

 

Anything the manager now says is picked apart and a bad slant is developed somehow. Look at Pepe Reinas recent comments about having to lower our targets next season because of the ownership mess. Pepe was called a ledge for speaking out. Can you imagine what would have been said had Rafa made the exact same comments?

 

I see the massive respect and the desire that Reina has for Rafa to stay here, and that is a much bigger indicator of what Rafa brings to LFC. Certainly much bigger then the smear campaign that is been worked on so hard to convince everyone that Rafa is some evil genius hell-bent on killing the club.

 

Johnny, that's all fine, but you must take into account that there is spin on both sides. I don't think Rafa is trying to ruin the club at all. I do think he doesn't really give a toss whether he's here or somewhere else. His wife will have huge affection for the next club he goes to. And the one after that. There is such a thing as PR, which as I said can be taken as fact by either side when it suits them.

[WaltonRed]

So more plums in the papers and still no movement on anything

[Whelan]

Johnny, that's all fine, but you must take into account that there is spin on both sides. I don't think Rafa is trying to ruin the club at all. I do think he doesn't really give a toss whether he's here or somewhere else. His wife will have huge affection for the next club he goes to. And the one after that. There is such a thing as PR, which as I said can be taken as fact by either side when it suits them.

 

Oooh you're a cynical man! I bet you stopped believing in Santa when you were two!

 

I think you are right about the press, but I also think it is something you might have to get used to, I can't imaging a manager coming in and not using the media. I do think he has genuine affection for the club, because we were something special once, and as far as I'm concerned, that is still there, just waiting for the right time to return.

 

 

A bit like Howard Kendall!

[JohnnyH]

Johnny, that's all fine, but you must take into account that there is spin on both sides. I don't think Rafa is trying to ruin the club at all. I do think he doesn't really give a toss whether he's here or somewhere else. His wife will have huge affection for the next club he goes to. And the one after that. There is such a thing as PR, which as I said can be taken as fact by either side when it suits them.

 

Yes, there is spin from both sides. The entire club has been involved in it. However, I don’t think there is anywhere near as much spin as we think.

 

The modern age means you and I and a bunch of others will sit here and discuss every nuance of every little comment made or not made. Rumour gets discussed as fact (the point of my recent posts) and it is decided, amongst other things, that it is spin from the club or the manager. This thread started on a rumour by a journalist that Rafa was going to Juve. It has resulted in nearly 2000 posts by us declaring that Benitez is just waiting for his pay off so he can run to Juve. Benitez said he wanted to stay, and low and behold, someone else gets the Juve job and Rafa is still here. Rafa was showing he was greedy by trying to get out to Juve, and once he stayed, he was greedy for not going. It all confuses me. You can’t help but get the feeling that there was sod all in this. But a constant barrage of tweeting journos and 2000 post threads on a website make a small issue, huge. If this was 1980 then there would have been a piece in the paper, it would have been discussed in the pub, and that would be that. But new media means every little thing is turned into a massive thing. Another journo declared that Gerrard doesn’t rate Rafa. This was followed on by some fans saying that Gerrard will leave if Rafa stays. Somewhere within the 1000 posts on that thread, Stevie is said to have told Oly Kay that it is utter shite and he has rang Rafa to tell him as such. But that got lost in the hand wringing (if you’ll pardon the gag) and it became fact, and yet more personal comments were thrown around enough for them to also become fact. Yet throughout all of this, the club and Rafa have said fuck all. If anything, the only real spin may possibly be from certain players allegedly leaking stories to the press such as the ones about Gerrard not rating Rafa, or Torres going to leave.

 

For me, the majority of spin and groundless innuendo comes from the fans and from a very agenda driven place.

[Medazza]

Anything the manager now says is picked apart and a bad slant is developed somehow. Look at Pepe Reinas recent comments about having to lower our targets next season because of the ownership mess. Pepe was called a ledge for speaking out. Can you imagine what would have been said had Rafa made the exact same comments?

QUOTE]

 

Great point - so true

[Guest Pistonbroke]

Anything the manager now says is picked apart and a bad slant is developed somehow. Look at Pepe Reinas recent comments about having to lower our targets next season because of the ownership mess. Pepe was called a ledge for speaking out. Can you imagine what would have been said had Rafa made the exact same comments?

QUOTE]

 

Great point - so true

 

Slight difference being it's the close season and not mid season being promised 4th etc.

[navbasi]

if your goal in life is to be a top class manager then it does matter. and leaving liverpool because you've got a ton of money, but might not get another top job, could be career suicide if the chips don't fall properly.

 

12 months ago juande ramos was managing real madrid, where is he now?

 

Just in case anyone is interested. He went to manage CSKA Moscow in Sept 2009 and last 47 days before getting the boot!

[AmerScouse]

Trust me if you are one of the top 10 managers in the world you will get another job. No question there is risk but quality is more important than timing. The cream will always rise to the top and time on the sidelines in inevitable.

 

 

 

And 36 months ago Capello was managing madrid. These things go in cycles. Look at Van Gaal too.

 

that's the point. is rafa really one of the top 10 managers in the world?

 

of course he can get another job, he could go an manager someone like espanyol or atletico madrid or something like that. but that's a step down. its not that he can't find any old job, its that he may not have the opportunity to find the next big one. big jobs do not open that often and timing is crucial, unless of course you are real madrid at which point the job is always open.

 

i think rafa looks at managing in italy as a step down. he won't take the inter job because his ego is way too big to follow mourinho. i think he'd entertain the ac milan job but i don't think the money is there for him to build a new team and its likely a longer project because of their overall age.

 

juve i'm sure was intriguing because of the money behind them. but he's already at one of the top 10 clubs in the world and if he thinks he can win the power struggle i'm sure he's going to wait us out

 

capello isn't a good example he's in his 60s, rafa is still a youngish manager. plus i think capello's cv is much better at this point than rafa's. someone would still be taking a slight risk by hiring him.