West Ham vs Liverpool, 20th September 2014

[stringvest]

I just don't get the point of Gerrard, what is his point? I think we need a "how long can we carry a player like Gerrard?" thread

 

why don't you start one then?

[stringvest]

Neither would be in the top half of players in the league in those positions if their roles were swapped.

 

Lucas will not be in the top half of players in any position he plays in as long as he's got a hole in his arse.  

[stringvest]

A telling fact about our squad (ok injuries aren't helping) is a mate of mine just challenged me to name a balanced 11 for the league cup game Tuesday.... I couldn't do it, not unless it's a midfield made up of attacking midfielders..

 

Try it (keeping in mind we need to rest Gerrard) and probably protect some of our usual starters.

 

Best I could do without picking reserves was

 

Jones

 

Manquillo

Enrique

Toure

Skrtel

 

Coutinho

Suso

Lallana

 

Borini

Lambert

Markovic

 

For my money our squad is unbalanced, has too many similar players - namely attacking midfielders and not enough quality in terms of defensive/central midfielders and we are light up front.

 

we'll never have the ball if we pick that team.  Though our rock solid defence will absorb any danger like a super sponge.

[stringvest]

Well that was shite.  Who would have guessed it, looking at that starting line up?  If Rodgers takes the plaudits for last season, he has to take the blame for this being a massive fuck up.  

 

Trying not to overreact, but it's looking more like 8th or 9th this season rather than 1st or second.

 

And to get 8th or 9th, we've got to play a damn sight better than we're doing now.

 

I have no idea what Rodgers is trying to achieve putting a side out like that.   I can't believe that he believed that side was capable of winning a PL game.  I knew we were getting beat from the moment that side was mooted the other day.  How the hell are we supposed to play a high energy game with Lucas in the midfield?   Christ almighty.  Not just him though - Gerrard and Henderson were almost as bad.  Whatever confidence and vitality we had last season has been blown to smithereens.  It will not be back until Sturridge, Allen and Lallana are fit, and Gerrard and Henderson have found some form. 

[derykw]

Sorry I am not buying into this new players settling in argument. Could be said that West Ham had more new players on the pitch today than we did...didn't stop them giving us a 3-1 defeat did it.

 

Our problems stem from the fact that we are still shite at the back...serious lack of communication all too evident (again) between our centre backs.

 

That and the other elephants in the room...namely the glaring lack of a quality defensive midfielder, and the selection of Gerrard and Lucas in midfield..which just does not fucking work.

 

How much longer is it going to be Brendan until you realise this?

 

This for me is the true acid test for Rodgers i.e binning Gerrard off, unfortunately I don`t think he`s got he balls to do it. Why else does he refuse to buy the top DM we all see we`re crying out for?  because he won`t countenance not picking Gerrad. I know options are currently limited with injuries but Gerrard`s surely in the team on name alone because it`s certainly not due to form. his pace has gone, his energy levels have dropped, he doesn`t press and all he does is play long balls in a supposed passing team.

 

I hate feeling this way about a true great who`s carried us on his shoulders for a decade or more but time waits for no man and it seems to have caught up with our Stevie.

[Jairzinho]

Not quite as bad, but not much better.  As was Henderson.

 

Ok. Well, I disagree. I think if anything he was slightly worse. Lucas was completely anonymous. Gerrard was more involved, and almost everything he touched turned to shit. Not that you needed stats to prove as much, but those that someone posted earlier about him not playing a single through ball, making a single tackle, completing a single cross, or winning a single header were some pretty damning evidence.

 

As I said earlier, they should both be behind all the other central midfielders in the first team squad in the pecking order. Lucas shouldn't start any games. Gerrard should play the odd game further up the pitch, the rest of the time he should be on the bench.

[stringvest]

Ok. Well, I disagree. I think if anything he was slightly worse. Lucas was completely anonymous. Gerrard was more involved, and almost everything he touched turned to shit. Not that you needed stats to prove as much, but those that someone posted earlier about him not playing a single through ball, making a single tackle, completing a single cross, or winning a single header were some pretty damning evidence.

 

As I said earlier, they should both be behind all the other central midfielders in the first team squad in the pecking order. Lucas shouldn't start any games. Gerrard should play the odd game further up the pitch, the rest of the time he should be on the bench.

 

I wouldn't be massively disappointed not to see Gerrard play too much this year if we can keep Allen, Henderson and Can fit and in form.  As for the other one, I just hope thats the last we see of him.  

 

What the fuck was Rodgers playing at?  If anyone deserves a kick in the bollocks tonight, it's him.  I loved him last year for playing players in form.  This year, I fear his ego is getting the better of him, and I hate it.

[John101]

Sorry I am not buying into this new players settling in argument. Could be said that West Ham had more new players on the pitch today than we did...didn't stop them giving us a 3-1 defeat did it.

 

Our problems stem from the fact that we are still shite at the back...serious lack of communication all too evident (again) between our centre backs.

 

That and the other elephants in the room...namely the glaring lack of a quality defensive midfielder, and the selection of Gerrard and Lucas in midfield..which just does not fucking work.

 

How much longer is it going to be Brendan until you realise this?

 

 

I would expect that West Hams players have had a more settled introduction than ours, both in terms of the personnel and the system they have been asked to play. I would imagine that its easier for a number of players to settle when there is stability than constant chopping and changing.

 

If we are going to look at individual players then yes, Gerrard is a worry. Without Suarez i do think there will be significantly less space for the other forwards and Gerrards balls from deep will be less effective. That is before we even get to the defensive side of his game.

[TheHowieLama]

Possibly.  As a team we would be better, though.  I'd like to see the manager to walk the walk, figure out the practical formation.  We do not get results now, that much is clear.  

 

Lets put it this way - with Suarez instead of Borini we win this game, and Villa too - even if we play with 10.

 

That is tougher to figure out than you are assuming.

[Boss]

We've spent 120 million to field an inferior first eleven, that in and of itself is mental. We'd of got better results this season fielding Mig, Enrique, Agger, Skrtel, Johnson, Gerrard, Henderson, Allen, Coutinho, Sterling, Sturridge every game than this current lot trotting out for us.

[Baltar]

Truthfully I'm not that surprised we got turned over today. We could and probably should have lost at home to that Bulgarian team whose name I can't spell. If we only barely scraped past them then we'd have no chance away to a Premiership team.

The team is struggling without Sturridge and this might not be a popular opinion but selling Agger was a mistake. We look totally clueless at the back.

[TheHowieLama]

Revamp Anfield with the Luis Suarez stand for the good of everyone is what you are saying.

[bossy]

Whiskey Jar has jumped the shark I reckon.

[Lfc Verve]

Could easily have lost to Southampton too.

[ratcatcher]

Could easily have lost to Southampton too.

 

We did at home last season

[ratcatcher]

Truthfully I'm not that surprised we got turned over today. We could and probably should have lost at home to that Bulgarian team whose name I can't spell. If we only barely scraped past them then we'd have no chance away to a Premiership team.

The team is struggling without Sturridge and this might not be a popular opinion but selling Agger was a mistake. We look totally clueless at the back.

 

Oh yeah cos agger would have stood up to west hams physicality, wouldnt he?

[stringvest]

Big test for Rodgers.  Bit of humility, learn from mistakes, and quickly.  The alternative is to turn into Pardew, and no-one wants to see that.  

[Saintslfc13]

Gerrard was just as bad as Lucas.

Lucas was better for me today. Sad to say but that's what I saw, I get why we subbed him instead of Gerrard but on in game form Lucas deserved to stay on over him.

[Saintslfc13]

Truthfully I'm not that surprised we got turned over today. We could and probably should have lost at home to that Bulgarian team whose name I can't spell. If we only barely scraped past them then we'd have no chance away to a Premiership team.

The team is struggling without Sturridge and this might not be a popular opinion but selling Agger was a mistake. We look totally clueless at the back.

Rodgers bird must've been making the eyes at Daniel.

[an tha]

we'll never have the ball if we pick that team. Though our rock solid defence will absorb any danger like a super sponge.

Exactly.

 

Which shows me how unbalanced the squad is... Ok nobody can help the injuries, but then injuries are all a part of the game.

 

I just don't think we have the depth we need in the right areas, which is why we are fucking around with our shape and making changes game to game at the mo... Which is hurting our cohesion.

[Russ Atmosphere]

So how many high salary earners are going to 'solve' the problem? 3, 4, 5, 6 and at what, 200 grand a week each?

 

Yeah Im presuming the fans will just love the ticket increase or the shirt price increase to pay for them.

 

Or are we supposed to go down the mansour route now and to fuck with any FFP fines we will undoubtedly get?

 

The team did fucking great last year and but for a couple of shite performances would have won the league. I dont recall high salary earners or number of them of the kind some seem to think would be the panecea.

The wage savings we have made by culling high wage earners over the last few years haven't been reinvested into high-earning new signings. When we were seventh in the league that made a fair amount of sense, but this transfer window just gone we were in a great position to attract quality players on high salaries that could have reinvigorated the team.

[Jairzinho]

I wouldn't be massively disappointed not to see Gerrard play too much this year if we can keep Allen, Henderson and Can fit and in form.  As for the other one, I just hope thats the last we see of him.  

 

What the fuck was Rodgers playing at?  If anyone deserves a kick in the bollocks tonight, it's him.  I loved him last year for playing players in form.  This year, I fear his ego is getting the better of him, and I hate it.

 

Allen/Henderson/Can would be a solid, functioning midfield. Perhaps without a proper holding midfielder they need to be first choice and players like Coutinho and Lallana (who I thought was the best of a shitty bunch today) should play as the number ten in our diamond formation or as a wide forward in the 4-3-3. A more pragmatic team.

 

I'm starting to worry that Rodgers has misjudged just how important Suarez was. The amount of games we had (well, most of the time) put to bed within 20 minutes meant that we killed teams mentally early in games. They're not scared now. We needed to sign a really good defensive midfielder and another forward we could really rely on. We didn't.

 

Not sure its ego with Rodgers. I think he's confused, and under a level of pressure he's never felt before. First season, he got carte blanche especially because of the shite he inherited, second season we overachieved. He's spent lots of money on new players. It's on him now, it's his team, and he's got to make it work, and quickly. Three losses in the first five league matches is pathetic, and we were shit against Southampton as well.

[J-V]

Did he fuck. Unless you mean by getting players to feign injury and kick shit out of us aided and abetted by the ref.

 

Fucking funny how if mason or atkinson ref us, we'd have players off for that two footed challenge.

 

But, I really can be fucked arguing if people seriously thought fat sam tactically out thought us.

 

Exploited our right hand side with diagonal balls over the top from our left time and time again scoring two goals in the process.  Easily defended against us as well.  Out done by Fat Sam.

But yeah it was all because they were dirty cunts....

 

[TheHowieLama]

Exploited our right hand side with diagonal balls over the top from our left time and time again scoring two goals in the process.  Easily defended against us as well.  Out done by Fat Sam fucking hell.

 

 

I think the first goal came from the left off a set piece, the second directly from the left off the break.

 

So you mean our right hand side in the air? Like the CB? Off a set -Once?

[ZonkoVille77]

This is not a slight on Gerrard but as long as BR continues with him in that role we are fucked. He's a genius in the last 3rd of the pitch and should be played there. He did well last season but let's me honest he did terribly at times too through no fault of his own.

 

I like BR. But I think he's chancing his arm at times this year and hoping it works rather than just ding the right thing.

 

What I wouldn't give for a tidy 1-0 win at the moment. Just a solid display all over the park. Can't be that hard with the squad we have, can it?