Liverpool 0 Fulham 1 (Mar 7 2021)

[dave u 6,172]

In terms of losing Van Dijk affecting the way we play, again, I think it's been overstated. We miss his long passing to release the forwards early, but Hendo was playing back there for a while and playing those passes. Didn't really make us any more effective did it?

 

We hugely miss him on set-pieces at both ends and it is a massive problem on our attacking set plays. No doubt about that. We're no threat from corners anymore when with Virgil we were the best in the league.

 

So yeah that has hurt us a lot. We've lost his leadership, his pace and his general aura. All of that has hurt us and as I say, its a valid excuse for not retaining the title.

 

You know what it isn't a valid excuse for? Being behind fucking Everton and West Ham. I'm embarrassed by that. It's horrible. 

 

I wish the players felt the same but I'd be willing to bet that half of them don't give a fuck about Everton being above us. If they did maybe they'd have actually tried to do something about it in the derby instead of serving up that fucking pitiful 'performance'.

[an tha 6,337]

15 minutes ago, dave u said:

 

I know that, I just think it's been massively overstated as used as a crutch to let the midfielders, full backs and strikers off the hook for being shit since the turn of the year.

 

It's easy to blame losing Virgil for everything, but guess what, we were top at Christmas and he was injured in October. Not having Virgil (and Gomez and Matip) is an excuse for not retaining the title. It would even be a valid excuse for finishing below United (and maybe Chelsea).

 

It doesn't excuse the absolute fucking dogshit they've served up for months.

No argument there. Sadly we seem to have let the losses affect our mentality (look at the meek shithouse way we approached the fucking derby after all that had happened - unforgiveable that) and frankly given up......and as a management and coaching team we seem to have decided that there is no Plan B and no adapting to fit with players we do have...just send them out set up same, being asked to do jobs they aren't as good at as the players they are replacing or as a team missing and seemingly hope it suddenly works again.

 

Fucking depressing isn't it.

[dave u 6,172]

Yep, I'm with you. The derby was the day I went from feeling sorry for them to being pissed off with them.

[index1000 507]

12 hours ago, m0e said:

Best analysis I've read on where we are. Honestly. Kudos.

While i agree that the analysis is good it does not excuse what has happened to this team. I am sorry but it doesn't. This team swept all before them home and abroad for three years and now they can't work out how to beat fucking West Brom and Brighton and Newcastle and fucking Everton? 

Klopp has been (rightly) hailed as one of the greatest minds in Football with players that every team wanted and now they cant beat fucking Fulham! South -fucking cant win a fucking game- Hampton?

These football geniuses are unable to adapt? Really.

It is inexcusable and an embarrassment to the name of the club.

If i could say something to the players it would be 

'Put some fucking effort in and get above a light jog at least once in the game'

 

[Crazy Dave 218]

5 hours ago, grazywalker said:

Not that fully him blame him as his forward options are limited and will not have the cover at the back like he did, but it feels like Andy Robertson passes backwards 90% of the time. We get it to him and then it is stop, look around,see nobody in a good position so play it back.

The passes to each other seem to be a bit slow, and either right to them or slightly behind them which helps kill the momentum. This very rarely happened in the last 2 years.

I’ve started to notice that too. He turns and passes the ball backwards from the edge of our box all the time now. In fairness, he’s looking up and seeing about one red shirt in the box surrounded by 5 defenders normally. Our midfield is scared to get into the box, probably because the defense is so high behind them and they’re worried about being turned around. 
 

He also just looks completely burnt out. 

[ben48 274]

10 minutes ago, Crazy Dave said:

I’ve started to notice that too. He turns and passes the ball backwards from the edge of our box all the time now. In fairness, he’s looking up and seeing about one red shirt in the box surrounded by 5 defenders normally. Our midfield is scared to get into the box, probably because the defense is so high behind them and they’re worried about being turned around. 
 

He also just looks completely burnt out. 

The thing that I’ve noticed is that Mane isn’t there to help him out anymore, he’s playing in some inside position. The two of them working together on the wing was one of our great successes 

[dockers_strike 2,253]

Robbo cant pass forward to Sadio if Sadio is fucking swanning around the pitch and not looking for any link up. Personally, I dont think Andy Robertson is in the equation of being part of the problem.

 

He's one of the few players who looks like he gives a fuck in games. Shame his finishing is on a level with Neco Williams but hey, they are fullbacks for a reason.

[3 Stacks 2,580]

I hate our style of football now. I watch less football around Europe than I used to but I can't imagine there's a more depressing team to watch right now than us. All first half we were pumping long balls to Salah. It's either that, or the slow, ponderous, side-to-side possession. Klopp needs to figure something out for next season. Our recruitment recently has been geared more towards more technical players, who want the ball to feet, probably because Klopp and co. thought that's what we were missing.

 

So if we're going to do that and sign players like Thiago and Minamino and play people like Shaqiri and Keita, we can't be hitting it over their heads so often to Salah, it just doesn't make any sense. There's an incoherence there. Either commit to playing possession football, with overlaps and a real number 9, or go buy more brutes to play in midfield and fast forwards to run straight towards goal after we win second balls. Right now, we're a jumbled mess. 

[dave u 6,172]

31 minutes ago, ben48 said:

The thing that I’ve noticed is that Mane isn’t there to help him out anymore, he’s playing in some inside position. The two of them working together on the wing was one of our great successes 

It's this. Robbo gets the ball and Sadio is either down the line or he makes an angle for a pass that often leads to a one two. Recently that option hasn't been there, so Robbo either has to go back or try to beat the man and put in a cross where we often have two or three players against eight.

 

Plus Robbo looks goosed recently.

[Mark M 1,533]

3 minutes ago, dave u said:

It's this. Robbo gets the ball and Sadio is either down the line or he makes an angle for a pass that often leads to a one two. Recently that option hasn't been there, so Robbo either has to go back or try to beat the man and put in a cross where we often have two or three players against eight.

 

Plus Robbo looks goosed recently.

If you asked me to pick two players that could do with a 'rest' or taken out of the first 11 - its Robbo and Gini even after all the changes at the weekend I felt that was strange not prioritising both of them to come out of the side.

[an tha 6,337]

We have faced adversity for all the many reasons stated and instead of adapting, adjusting, fighting harder, making tactical changes, working out a way to solve problems etc.....we have basically appeared to have let it overwhelm us, given up and come up with no potential answers to the problems, individually and collectively - players and coaching/management.

 

Where is the siege mentality?

 

Where is the pride in the shirt?

 

The pride as champions?

 

Where is the leadership?

 

Where is the tactical nous to change what isn't working?

 

It is deeply, deeply worrying on many levels how we have collapsed - yes we have big problems and have been decimated, used 73 different centre half pairings etc...and yes we all know as we all say all the time on here how that has affected us....

 

But to this degree of utter collapse and the kind of perfornances we are putting in....sorry but its not on.

 

Deeply, deeply worrying.

[BeefStroganoff 118]

Half the problem is our players have lost the ability and instinct to dribble and shoot as well. 

 

Its like its been drilled out of them to not take risks. Mo and Sadio used to run with the ball and dribble rings around the opposition, they also shot from outside of the box on average. now we try to recycle possession constantly going from side to side. If you look at Mane most of his game was built around powerful running with the ball.

 

Remember his goal at Arsenal? Or his goals against us for Soton? Or his goal against Everton at Anfield? Remember when Mo dribbled around the entire Watford defence and midfield and still stabbed home?

 

Now no one knows how to do it.

[Captain Howdy 1,171]

2 hours ago, dave u said:

It's this. Robbo gets the ball and Sadio is either down the line or he makes an angle for a pass that often leads to a one two. Recently that option hasn't been there, so Robbo either has to go back or try to beat the man and put in a cross where we often have two or three players against eight.

 

Plus Robbo looks goosed recently.

Robertson, Trent and Mane in particular are absolute shadows of their former selves. This has been one of the key problems.

[Closer To God 97]

19 hours ago, Stouffer said:

Fuck the match reports off until we win Dave; I can't imagine how shit it is having to do them.

I can totally understand if he would do that and I wouldn't complain one sec about it but I'm glad he's still doing them.

They're almost therapeutic to me. Me head's all over the place because of this and it feels good reading them as he's so good at putting words on this fucking misery. 

[Bucksinator 13]

Spot on about Fabinho,I think if he started we would have won,I saw enough in the last 15 minutes to justify that.He doesn’t let the opposition turn and get 3-4 passes away that gets them up the pitch.Jurgen needs to be starting him in midfield from now to end of season preferably with Gini and one other from Keita and Jones.Defensively we haven’t been brilliant but we haven't been terrible either so im actually not laying any blame at our defence.The forward line also benefit from Fab in midfield as space opens up once he nicks it back quickly.It is that one position I believe has been the biggest contributor to our downfall,hopefully we have seen the end of it and the lads get some confidence back.

[m0e 1,643]

5 hours ago, index1000 said:

While i agree that the analysis is good it does not excuse what has happened to this team. I am sorry but it doesn't. This team swept all before them home and abroad for three years and now they can't work out how to beat fucking West Brom and Brighton and Newcastle and fucking Everton? 

Klopp has been (rightly) hailed as one of the greatest minds in Football with players that every team wanted and now they cant beat fucking Fulham! South -fucking cant win a fucking game- Hampton?

These football geniuses are unable to adapt? Really.

It is inexcusable and an embarrassment to the name of the club.

If i could say something to the players it would be 

'Put some fucking effort in and get above a light jog at least once in the game'

 

Great. So what's your analysis?

 

Or are you just going to complain about fucking this and fucking that?

[m0e 1,643]

8 hours ago, dave u said:

In terms of losing Van Dijk affecting the way we play, again, I think it's been overstated. We miss his long passing to release the forwards early, but Hendo was playing back there for a while and playing those passes. Didn't really make us any more effective did it?

 

We hugely miss him on set-pieces at both ends and it is a massive problem on our attacking set plays. No doubt about that. We're no threat from corners anymore when with Virgil we were the best in the league.

 

So yeah that has hurt us a lot. We've lost his leadership, his pace and his general aura. All of that has hurt us and as I say, its a valid excuse for not retaining the title.

 

You know what it isn't a valid excuse for? Being behind fucking Everton and West Ham. I'm embarrassed by that. It's horrible. 

 

I wish the players felt the same but I'd be willing to bet that half of them don't give a fuck about Everton being above us. If they did maybe they'd have actually tried to do something about it in the derby instead of serving up that fucking pitiful 'performance'.

The common denominator over the past 3 years has been the front 3, VVD, Alisson and the full backs.

 

They never needed resting, and hardly ever got injured (that still applies to all of them bar Alisson).

 

We had by far the best defensive pairing in Europe, irrespective of who partnered VVD.

 

We all saw Klopp build a system, brick by brick. He didn't go out there an buy superstars.

 

That system relied heavily on the midfielders plugging the gaps. That's the reason our main 3 - Hendo, Gini, and Fab - were regularly rotated with Keita, Milner and Ox. Even Lallana got games when he was available!

 

Klopp hasn't been able to do that because of what's happened.

 

So on top of our central defence being replaced by our central midfield, we couldn't rotate the replacement midfielders!

 

And even then, the midfielders brought in were not of the same ilk (Jones, Thiagi, Shaqiri).

 

We simply don't have the know how or the legs to play the way we are set up to in the middle of the park.

 

The one argument that is valid is that Klopp could change the system. But he's clearly rolled his dice and is sticking to this system... and probably for a number of factors we, as fans, won't be able to fully grasp.

 

On top of that, we have the analysis @an tha outlined about the style from the back (it's not just the VVD passing, it's the midfield set up on front of him, and the pace / quality along side him we've missed). Not to mention the fact our threat from set pieces has been completely wiped out.

 

And of course there has been the impact of our fans not being there, mainly to celebrate our league title and to celebrate this squad of players; whilst rubbing it in to the opposition fans and players.

 

It's a fucking downer all round.

 

The system is broken, and the confidence is shot as a result.

 

You can chop it up a million and one ways and it doesn't change the fact that we are in an almost impossible position, and that heads have understandably dropped as a result.

 

In many ways, the fact that we were top in December has added to the frustration. I see it as rather remarkable we were able to do that with all the shit we had to deal with.

 

On a final note, I get the frustration about the Everton game, but Klopp has been a manager who's ALWAYS asked our players to respect the opposition and the referees.

 

We had a different (more professional) kind of anger that got us out of problems, and that's clearly no longer there, and almost certainly as a result of everything that's happened.

 

I'm ok with people having a go, and I'm occasionally jumping on that train too.

 

But no fucking way am I staying on it once the emotion dies down.

 

We are ALL hurting and we will ALL come out of this sooner rather than later.

 

Peace.

[Pidge 3,875]

Just realised they played seven loanees. That's mental.

[Butch 1,042]

Our game's Gives me a migraine now. 

[Barrington Womble 9,224]

6 hours ago, ben48 said:

The thing that I’ve noticed is that Mane isn’t there to help him out anymore, he’s playing in some inside position. The two of them working together on the wing was one of our great successes 

It's only been a couple of games we've done that though - I think sheff United and the 2 loses since. Trent is holding back a little, almost making 3 at the back at times. But in the sheff United and Chelsea games we played with a double 6 and we were almost playing a 3 of robbo, firmino and Jones with Salah and mane as inside forwards ahead of them. We seemed to chuck that away yesterday though and I actually couldn't figure out what the real shape was. 

[Ipplfc 56]

These players have been given a walk over for far too long,they need to be told in no uncertain terms what an embarrassment they are to this football club,us fans and mostly to themselves,feeling sorry for themselves and just being weak cunts has to stop now!!!!
Thanks,as usual for a great report Dave,lose or lose 

[stringvest 12,929]

1 hour ago, Barrington Womble said:

It's only been a couple of games we've done that though - I think sheff United and the 2 loses since. Trent is holding back a little, almost making 3 at the back at times. But in the sheff United and Chelsea games we played with a double 6 and we were almost playing a 3 of robbo, firmino and Jones with Salah and mane as inside forwards ahead of them. We seemed to chuck that away yesterday though and I actually couldn't figure out what the real shape was. 

Turd shape

[dave u 6,172]

2 hours ago, Pidge said:

Just realised they played seven loanees. That's mental.

 

Probably shouldn't be allowed that. I always thought the limit was three!

[Barrington Womble 9,224]

39 minutes ago, dave u said:

 

Probably shouldn't be allowed that. I always thought the limit was three!

It seems foreign loans don't count. 

[Barrington Womble 9,224]

It seems like there should be some new rules for international loans unless they were relaxed because of covid. Seems a fucker for Chelsea.