Chris Foy

[Gym Beglin]

How the Refs treated Man U last season | Referee Decisions

 

"FINAL CONCLUSION

 

There is no denying the fact that Manchester United had a clearly positive bias from the refs in general. If you want to deny it be my guest and go through all the 32 games and point at where we are wrong in our numbers. It is in the open and you can check each decision.

 

In fact those few games when the ref made mistakes that went against United they dropped points. And maybe that is the best indication of them all that shows how important the refs can be."

 

.

 

Statistics and other damn lies.

 

I oppose their shabby article, and I have neither the time nor the compunction to deconstruct their work, but am happy not to, totally happy and confident that they are not using the right methodology or reading the statistics in the right context.

 

Dont fucking tell me how to suck lemons, I've been watching footy for over 20 years, I can see the obvious and I can make my own assumptions and some goofy cunts with pie charts aren't going to hold much weight with anyone who values their own sanity.

[Stu Monty]

That is one stat that has context - in 8 years how many teams have been in the league that entire time - more than 10? Do the math, then look to see if he is doing a disproportionate amount of games for certain teams. If he is not, then it is skewed - if he is, why?

 

Possibly because Watford never got in the opposition area for a whole season, Sunderland do it once a game and United pretty much set-up base-camp there.

 

I also reckon that if you're classed as the top ref you are going to be involved in more of the type of crunch matches which feature red cards.

 

There are lots of variables and if you're making the argument these articles are then you need to set out your case better.

[Stu Monty]

Here's an example:

 

Lee Mason reffed Liverpool four times in four months. After sending off three players in the middle two of these games he then didn't get a single Liverpool game for a year.

 

FACT!

 

The argument needs to be better fleshed out than that.

[Trumo]

Here's an example:

 

Lee Mason reffed Liverpool four times in four months. After sending off three players in the middle two of these games he then didn't get a single Liverpool game for a year.

 

FACT!

 

The argument needs to be better fleshed out than that.

 

Would you accept "they sent Kevin Friend instead" as valid reasoning?

[Iceman]

Statistics and other damn lies.

 

I oppose their shabby article, and I have neither the time nor the compunction to deconstruct their work, but am happy not to, totally happy and confident that they are not using the right methodology or reading the statistics in the right context.

 

 

Boo hoo. Write your own article then, you certainly have the time.

[ngogswilly]

Here's an example:

 

Lee Mason reffed Liverpool four times in four months. After sending off three players in the middle two of these games he then didn't get a single Liverpool game for a year.

 

FACT!

 

The argument needs to be better fleshed out than that.

 

Thats a well made point and it certainly proves its not just United it happens to.

 

What I will say though is Mason was dreadful in those games, he looked incredibly biased against us. And it still take 4 games.

 

United have got Foy demoted after 1 game, and I'd bet it will be longer than a year before he has 1 of theirs again.

 

Although it may turn out differently.

 

But surely you can see a difference there, with us it takes 3/4 really bad performances with red cards galore for us to get a ref taken out of the firing line.

 

For United it takes 1 performance where he does little wrong besides get 1 penalty decision wrong.

[TheHowieLama]

Possibly because Watford never got in the opposition area for a whole season, Sunderland do it once a game and United pretty much set-up base-camp there.

I also reckon that if you're classed as the top ref you are going to be involved in more of the type of crunch matches which feature red cards.

 

There are lots of variables and if you're making the argument these articles are then you need to set out your case better.

 

That would be a good argument except it is based on assumption.

In 2010-11 for instance it looks like Sunderland were awarded 5 and so were United.

Interestingly Sunderland got one more than them the year before as well.

 

That season - City looks to have got the most. We were 2nd - Atkinson seemed to give by far the most as well as show the most red.

 

Here is a link for last year

 

FA Premier League 2011/2012 penalties

 

By far the highest plus/minus that I have seen for Utd there

[Gym Beglin]

Boo hoo. Write your own article then, you certainly have the time.

 

I don't have any time.

 

Sans time.

[SCOUSE TAPAS]

I think people need to look at the bigger picture here and not just at refs in United games.

 

Refs arnt paid mega money to officiate matches and they are the person who can influence a game more than anyone else.

 

If people are that naieve to think there immune to corruption they need to take a serious look at how they come to that conclusion.

 

There is millions betted on games from corners to fouls to final scores and numerous other things.

 

The Asian handicap system which is mainly based on a over or under 2.5 goals a game is huge.

 

A ref could go his entire footballing life making a fortune, either by backhanders or even on his own in these types of markets without ever being suspected of doing anything dodgy.

 

You only have to look at how he can influence some of these markets without ever been suspected of anything dodgy.

 

Nobody can tell me that there wont be a number of refs who arnt making money on these type of markets seriously.

 

The exploitation of these markets and the slim chance of ever been caught if your a ref would seriously tempt anybody to exploit it.

 

You would have to be totally crazy not to.

[ngogswilly]

That would be a good argument except it is based on assumption.

In 2010-11 for instance it looks like Sunderland were awarded 5 and so were United.

Interestingly Sunderland got one more than them the year before as well.

 

That season - City looks to have got the most. We were 2nd - Atkinson seemed to give by far the most as well as show the most red.

 

Here is a link for last year

 

FA Premier League 2011/2012 penalties

 

By far the highest plus/minus that I have seen for Utd there

 

Just been looking through that and I'm not suggesting anything untoward.

 

But I just find the figures hard to believe if I'm reading them right.

 

It says in the 08/09 season United only got 4 penalties if I'm reading that right.

 

Christ I'm almost certain they got a fair few more than that. I'm sure I remember thinking they had got a shitload that season when they beat us to the league.

 

Now in fairness I remember us getting a lot to it has to be said.

 

But maybe I'm wrong.

[TheHowieLama]

Just been looking through that and I'm not suggesting anything untoward.

 

But I just find the figures hard to believe if I'm reading them right.

 

It says in the 08/09 season United only got 4 penalties if I'm reading that right.

 

Christ I'm almost certain they got a fair few more than that. I'm sure I remember thinking they had got a shitload that season when they beat us to the league.

 

Now in fairness I remember us getting a lot to it has to be said.

 

But maybe I'm wrong.

 

I am trying to check it against other sites too - is it possible Utd did not have a penalty called against them for two seasons? 02 and 03

[TheHowieLama]

Fast forward to today and the penalty kick has become a pivotal point of many games.The low scoring nature of football means that a large proportion of scores are important and do induce large swings in "in game" win probabilities.They are also great theatre containing an ever changing cast of heros, villains and a hint of conspiracy often played out over a relatively protracted timescale where audience participation is almost obligatory.Allegiances and differing lines of sight and perspective change radically a person's honest opinion of what happens on a football pitch.With subjective interpretation inevitably playing a part in the awarding of fouls,one man's penalty can often appear to be another man's corner kick.As the Manchester United Newcastle game so aptly demonstrated at the weekend.

 

Few will feel much sympathy with Manchester United following Saturday's controversial and almost certainly incorrect decision to allow Demba Ba a chance to equalise from the spot as there is an ingrained opinion amongst supporters of other teams that ManU,especially at Old Trafford receive more than their share of decisions,including penalties.The Red Devils certainly have had the lions share of spot kicks awarded in their favour over the seasons.Eight of the ten penalties awarded in their games in 2009/10 were given to them,six out of six in 2007/08,seven out of eight in 2002/03.Sir Alex is no doubt wondering what went wrong last year when they were given just five out of 11.

 

This is from The Power of Goals blog, pretty good post there.

[Trumo]

Here's something interesting from today. Reading's manager has said that his team have had decisions go against them because they didn't appeal enough! He learned of this from a match delegate and a fourth official no less. With Mike Riley in charge of referees, a state of confusion, inept decision-making and a lack of transparency or accountability is inevitable.

 

Manager Brian McDermott told his Reading players need to appeal more | Reading News, Fixtures, Results, Transfers | Sky Sports

 

Manager Brian McDermott told his Reading players need to appeal more

 

Brian McDermott says Reading have seen refereeing decisions go against them this season because his players did not appeal enough.

 

Reading were on their way to a first league win of the season against Newcastle last weekend before Demba Ba's 83rd-minute equaliser was put through the net by the striker's arm.

 

And McDermott admits he is baffled with comments made by officials, which suggested a more passionate appeal could have seen a different outcome.

 

"I feel a sense of injustice because there was an injustice - obviously the goal shouldn't have stood," said McDermott.

 

"My concern slightly, or more than slightly, is the conversations with two people now; the match delegate at the Chelsea game said that my players didn't appeal for the (Fernando) Torres offside goal, and the fourth official said to my goalkeeping coach that only two of my players appealed (against Newcastle).

 

"For me it is very difficult to take that, what are we asking? If we appeal for every decision we might get one or two?

 

"The last thing we want is for our players to start trying to referee the game, we have to let the referee and the assistant referees get on with their job and that is what we are trying to do.

 

"So that is the concern for me, the two separate things that have been said to me."

[Hooch]

Manchester United chief executive David Gill is new FA vice-chairman | Manchester United News, Fixtures, Results, Transfers | Sky Sports

 

Manchester United chief executive David Gill is new FA vice-chairman

Last Updated: October 18, 2012 6:16pm

 

.....

 

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David Gill: UEFA candidate

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Sky Bet are offering all new customers a £10 Free Bet .Claim your free bet now ....David Gill has been formally appointed as a vice-chairman of the Football Association.

 

The Manchester United chief executive replaces Sir Dave Richards as one of two vice-chairmen, alongside Roger Burden, after his promotion was ratified at a meeting of the FA Council.

 

The move strengthens Gill's standing in the English game ahead of his campaign to win a place on the UEFA Executive Committee at next May's elections.

 

The 55-year-old said: "I'm delighted to have been appointed vice-chairman of the Football Association.

 

"The health and success of the Football Association is vital to the future of the game in England and I hope to justify the board's faith in me by helping to shape discussions and actions to deliver that."

 

Gill has been on the FA board for the past six years.

 

 

 

What. The. Fuck?

 

How is this happening?

[Reacher]

Manchester United chief executive David Gill is new FA vice-chairman | Manchester United News' date=' Fixtures, Results, Transfers | Sky Sports[/url']

 

Manchester United chief executive David Gill is new FA vice-chairman

Last Updated: October 18, 2012 6:16pm

 

.....

 

8.0..RSS FeedBookmark with del.icio.usSave to iGoogleSave to My Yahoo!Submit to redditShare on StumpleUpon....

David Gill: UEFA candidate

.Sky BetManchester Utd's Next Match

Manchester Utd 2/7Draw 9/2Stoke 9/1..Premier League Winner 12/13

Manchester City 13/8Manchester Utd 11/5Chelsea 11/4..

£10 Free Bet

Sky Bet are offering all new customers a £10 Free Bet .Claim your free bet now ....David Gill has been formally appointed as a vice-chairman of the Football Association.

 

The Manchester United chief executive replaces Sir Dave Richards as one of two vice-chairmen, alongside Roger Burden, after his promotion was ratified at a meeting of the FA Council.

 

The move strengthens Gill's standing in the English game ahead of his campaign to win a place on the UEFA Executive Committee at next May's elections.

 

The 55-year-old said: "I'm delighted to have been appointed vice-chairman of the Football Association.

 

"The health and success of the Football Association is vital to the future of the game in England and I hope to justify the board's faith in me by helping to shape discussions and actions to deliver that."

 

Gill has been on the FA board for the past six years.

 

What. The. Fuck?

 

How is this happening?

 

I can't see how he can be at UTD and the vice chairman of the FA? How is that not a conflict of interest?

[Frank Dacey]

I can't see how he can be at UTD and the vice chairman of the FA? How is that not a conflict of interest?

 

Surely it's common knowledge that the interests of United and the FA are the same?::whistle:

[gumps]

To be fair, most board/committee members of football associations are connected somehow to a particular club.

 

However, looking at the make up of the current FA board, Gill's position sticks out like a sore thumb as being slightly.........odd?

 

When it gets to that level, people should not "double job" and hold such high profile jobs at the clubs that they originally came from and still serve on boards like this.

 

Just paving the way for the post Ferguson era.

 

Of course, one would have to assume that he is automatically barred from decision making on incidents involving MUFC. Doesn't stop lobbying and influencing behind closed doors and off the record though.

[MLB]

Absolutely ludicrous situation. Even if he stepped down from his position with the mancs (which he won't) everyone would know where his loyalties would lie.

 

Just when you thought the F.A. couldn't get any more fucking ridiculous.

[Unrighteous]

This really, really, really is out of control. How the fuck is this even happening?!

[Guest ShoePiss]

Er David Dein was vice chairman of the FA and Arsenal.

 

AT THE SAME TIME!

[Reacher]

Er David Dein was vice chairman of the FA and Arsenal.

 

AT THE SAME TIME!

 

Did Arsenal have decisions thrown at them every week too?

[ngogswilly]

Well for 20 odd years Arsenal havn't got the rub of the green anywhere near to the level United have.

 

Not that it matters, Dein, Gill, whoever... No high level executive of any club should be that high up in a position of power in the FA IMO.

 

Theres just no fucking way on earth its not going to cause conflicts of interest at some point, anybody whos not a fucking idiot and has a basic understanding of human nature will know that.

[DaveT]

I can't see how he can be at UTD and the vice chairman of the FA? How is that not a conflict of interest?

 

It's not a conflict of interest. It's a quite logical marriage of interests. Next stage in the FA and ManU becoming a single entity.