Keir Starmer

[Numero Veinticinco]

7 minutes ago, Jairzinho said:

If Labour lose the 2032 election it'll definitely be Corbyn's fault.

 

He was also responsible for Brexit.

 

Herp.

I think it’s fair to say I’ve been a critic of Corbyn but even I can’t pin an event on him that will happen half a decade after he stopped being leader. Might be a *touch* harsh. Tell you what though, Attlee has some fucking questions to answer about 2010. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

5 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

The analogy is being 4.0 down at half time becuase of goal keeping howlers, substituting the goalie and losing the game 4.2. According to your logic it’s not the fault of the original shit goalie becuase he didn’t play in the second half. Corbyn bequeathed the Tories an insurmountable majority. It’s very rare in politics to get swings that large so yes it will be his fault for leaving such a massive deficit in seats. 

There were some pretty exceptional circumstances, to be fair. Brexit isn’t the only factor in why Labour lost, but it’s certainly a factor in why they lost so badly. Also, your analogy is daft. That’s two halves of one match. You’re blaming Dudek for us losing the 2018 CL final. Half a decade is a long time for a leader. 

[Jairzinho]

11 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

The analogy is being 4.0 down at half time becuase of goal keeping howlers, substituting the goalie and losing the game 4.2. According to your logic it’s not the fault of the original shit goalie becuase he didn’t play in the second half. Corbyn bequeathed the Tories an insurmountable majority. It’s very rare in politics to get swings that large so yes it will be his fault for leaving such a massive deficit in seats. 

Well, not "the analogy". "Your analogy". It's not a very good one.

[Strontium]

In any case, everyone knows it's Tony Blair's fault.

[Bruce Spanner]

4 minutes ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

In any case, everyone knows it's Tony Blair's fault.

 

We all know it was Smiths fault for dying on the job, selfish bastard.

[sir roger]

3 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

I used to be a member but gave up when Corbyn was elected. Starmer is trying his best but its a hopeless cause given the numbers and he knows somebody else, probably not even an MP yet, will be the next Labour PM. I might give it a go !

Fuck me , I wondered what it would take to get me to warm to Starmer.

[Captain Howdy]

59 minutes ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

In any case, everyone knows it's Tony Blair's fault.

Yes, rocking up with his fancy election wins, we’ll not have that nonsense around these parts.

[Bruce Spanner]

6 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

I suspect I am preaching to the deaf here but Butler swings > 10 points are very rare in UK and there has only been 1 since the war. To win the next election, Labour needs an unprecedented 10.3% swing or to put it another way, it needs to gain 123 seats to have a majority which is almost twice what it needed to do in 2019. So the impact of the Corbyn candidacy was to double the number of seats his successor needs to change allegiance in order to win an election. This is just maths.

 

Corbyn and Milne knew a defeat of this scale would happen from private polling data being presented to the Leaders office from the summer of 2019. Corbyn didn't bother attending the normal civil service security briefings for the potential PM in the weeks leading up to the election because he knew he would lose and he was wasting everybody's time by attending. Despite this he and Seamus Milne chose to contest the election knowing they would lose and indifferent to the damage it would cause to the party. Milne has now gone back to the Guardian on a £100k salary and Corbyn is now taking the party to court. He was a disaster for the party and put them in opposition for 10 years maybe more.

 

I used to be a member but gave up when Corbyn was elected. Starmer is trying his best but its a hopeless cause given the numbers and he knows somebody else, probably not even an MP yet, will be the next Labour PM. I might give it a go !

 

 

 

Polling has been shifting in his favour for months.

 

You should get off your wifes twitter feed.

[Bruce Spanner]

9 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

Ok I bet you £100 to your chosen charity that the Tory's will win the next election. Are you willing to risk it ? 

Not saying they won’t, you claiming it’s a hopeless cause is what I’m questioning based on the numbers I presented.

 

Why would I bet money on an election where I don’t know the candidates, circumstances, context, impacts and all manner of other things.

 

We may as well bet on who’ll see the next red car. 
 

Now, back to the point. 
 

What numbers, at your suggestion, show that ‘Starmer is trying his best but its a hopeless cause given the numbers and he knows somebody else, probably not even an MP yet, ‘? 
 

All current indicators have him performing well where he needs to pick up votes.

 

Out of interest, why ditch Labour because of Corbyn, not reduce tax(y) enough? 
 

Edit: I’ve always suggested a coalition would be a great outcome.

[Section_31]

The post covid world, all bets are off. People are blitzed and baffled at the moment but when the dust settles who knows what society will look like. James O brien and Owen Jones were talking about the polls at the moment and o brien made a good point about Churchill being ousted in 45. People stick with what they know until the danger has passed. 

 

The biggest threat to Labour is it not being taken seriously as an alternative, as in a party of potential government, which it never will be as long as infighting continues.

[Vincent Vega]

I think this is a good point in regards to current Tory polling. I wonder if they will be just as popular when Sunak implements a new tax for furloughed workers in the future to pay back some of that tax payers money.

 

[Section_31]

1 minute ago, Vincent Vega said:

I think this is a good point in regards to current Tory polling. I wonder if they will be just as popular when Sunak implements a new tax for furloughed workers in the future to pay back some of that tax payers money.

 

 

The polling stuff makes total sense. There's a term for it, the name of which escapes me, but basically when the shit hits the fan the public don't stray far from mummy's apron strings. 

 

For better or worse, the Conservative party is all that stands between many people and oblivion, a dire state of affairs indeed, but even if you were minded to switch your support to Labour you know they can't do anything about it anyway, save moan.

[Duff Man]

Pretty sure Milne isn't back at the Graun.

[Bruce Spanner]

6 minutes ago, Duff Man said:

Pretty sure Milne isn't back at the Graun.

 

Not wrote for them in years.

[Jairzinho]

"While you're here...we're absolutely totally independent, you see, and er, could you givvus a fiver towards the upkeep of Polly Toynbee's villa in the Dordogne?"

 

Nah, you're alright, mate.

[A Red]

6 hours ago, Numero said:

Then no. There was no fanfare, a word you clearly still don’t understand. Like I say, you’re on ignore. I’m only reading these posts because watching your slow collapse into madness is pretty entertaining. It couldn’t happen to a nicer cunt. 

How far would i need to look back to find posts you've made about wanting a more caring society?

 

If you are of the opinion gnasher is having mental health issues, which you obviously do, isnt it a bit nasty to point out that you are enjoying it?

[Jairzinho]

7 hours ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

The Guardian were bequeathed a huge legacy by the owner of auto trader (?) and simply pissed it all away. No Internet paywall so just giving away their content  for free. Really basic stuff, you pay journalists to write copy and you charge people to read it but this simple concept seems to have eluded the Guardian management. Numpties. 

And they seem to have an enormous quantity of writers on their payroll. 

 

They could make it a fairly cheap subscription and fire half of the "Talking to Koala bears can reduce sexism by 12%" journalists. 

 

I fear, though, that they're buried inside their own arse. 

[Skidfingers McGonical]

20 hours ago, Scooby Dudek said:

As a way of bringing everyone together, and maybe explaining my mood I have just watched this;

 

 

 

To be fair, I actually found it interesting as a discussion between two Labour supports who have different views on Brexit, Corbyn and Starmer but actually managed to talk without calling each other cunts, hard left or right wing sell outs. 

I watched this yesterday felt it was good to see O'Brien out of his LBC environment and not hear him be a self-righteous bell end (but given his audience on LBC that is understandable) and explain his feelings about Corbyn in this way. I agree with what he says about Corbyn being an empty vessel and how was never going win because he would not bring a knife to a knife fight (paraphrasing obvs)

 

Even Jones did not irritate me as much as he has done. O'Brien was also bang on about Corbyn supporters refusing to acknowledge that the man never stood a chance and wasn't that good a leader because of the hope he brought with his principles and policies but lost the remain voters because he wasn't going to be their challenger against Brexit.

 

I am going to give O'Brien a bit of slack moving forward, but Jones can fuck off with his fucking Cloud (Final Fantasy VII) hairdo.

 

EDIT: I like how O'Brien called out Rishi and how his decisions have been influenced by a specific set of anti-vaxxer mentalists.

 

[Section_31]

29 minutes ago, Skidfingers McGonical said:

I watched this yesterday felt it was good to see O'Brien out of his LBC environment and not hear him be a self-righteous bell end (but given his audience on LBC that is understandable) and explain his feelings about Corbyn in this way. I agree with what he says about Corbyn being an empty vessel and how was never going win because he would not bring a knife to a knife fight (paraphrasing obvs)

 

Even Jones did not irritate me as much as he has done. O'Brien was also bang on about Corbyn supporters refusing to acknowledge that the man never stood a chance and wasn't that good a leader because of the hope he brought with his principles and policies but lost the remain voters because he wasn't going to be their challenger against Brexit.

 

I am going to give O'Brien a bit of slack moving forward, but Jones can fuck off with his fucking Cloud (Final Fantasy VII) hairdo.

 

EDIT: I like how O'Brien called out Rishi and how his decisions have been influenced by a specific set of anti-vaxxer mentalists.

 

 

I thought O'Brien's description of modern Tories as people who 'view human beings as crops to be harvested' upsettingly accurate. 

[Skidfingers McGonical]

17 minutes ago, Colonel Kurtz said:

Too many Z list celebrities writing teenage angst politics prose. Stewart Lee is one of the worst offenders. This article below is typical of his output, just childish and trite. Who would pay to read this ? 

 

Marina Hyde is the only decent writer they have. 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jan/17/oh-see-how-the-tories-now-run-from-donald-trump

I like Hyde's style of writing, but the way she has been held up as a literary 'heroine' of our times by a load of fucking shittier journos and celebs fawning over her is vomit inducing, are as equally culpable for this mess we are in by not being fair during Corbyn's time as Labour leader. She and her hack friends and the Guardian and other media outlets let the Tories off the hook, and now she's slagging them off day in day out she's some sort of legend.

 

Nah, own the shit you have helped create, move on and fuck the celeb back slapping off.

 

And, Stewart Lee isn't a Z list celebrity. I take it you have never seen his act before if you think that is childish and contrite. He's a miserable cunt at worst and best.

[Numero Veinticinco]

11 hours ago, A Red said:

How far would i need to look back to find posts you've made about wanting a more caring society?

 

If you are of the opinion gnasher is having mental health issues, which you obviously do, isnt it a bit nasty to point out that you are enjoying it?

Fuck off. Faux outrage wanker. 

[Section_31]

5 minutes ago, Skidfingers McGonical said:

I like Hyde's style of writing, but the way she has been held up as a literary 'heroine' of our times by a load of fucking shittier journos and celebs fawning over her is vomit inducing, are as equally culpable for this mess we are in by not being fair during Corbyn's time as Labour leader. She and her hack friends and the Guardian and other media outlets let the Tories off the hook, and now she's slagging them off day in day out she's some sort of legend.

 

Nah, own the shit you have helped create, move on and fuck the celeb back slapping off.

 

And, Stewart Lee isn't a Z list celebrity. I take it you have never seen his act before if you think that is childish and contrite. He's a miserable cunt at worst and best.

Didn't they back the Lib Dems at one election? Can't remember if it was 2010 or 15. 

[Bruce Spanner]

4 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

Didn't they back the Lib Dems at one election? Can't remember if it was 2010 or 15. 

 

The Grun has pretty much always been Labour, like the Mirror, apart from the shitshow last election, but it has supported Lib Dem aims, like strategic voting in marginals etc.

 

In 2010 they wanted rid of Brown, so read in to that what you will.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2009/sep/30/newspapers-backing-next-election

[Skidfingers McGonical]

18 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

Didn't they back the Lib Dems at one election? Can't remember if it was 2010 or 15. 

Yeah last election, only The Mirror backed Labour.

[sir roger]

3 minutes ago, Skidfingers McGonical said:

Yeah last election, only The Mirror backed Labour.

And even they had proper poison like Fiona Phillips in columns saying she was voting for the Lib Dems