Coronavirus

[Pureblood]

Just now, SasaS said:

Such as... the only heavily vaccinated country with a significant Indian variant spread. Russia is not heavily vaccinated and Israel still has very low numbers.

Do you think that will remain the case? 

 

It's predicted to become the dominant variant in the USA and EU over the course of the next six weeks.   90% of cases in EU will be the delta variant by August.

 

We can pretend that it won't spread rapidly, but it will. 

[TheHowieLama]

2 minutes ago, TK421 said:

the USA

Cases are not tracking with the UK's increases nor are deaths.

 

You might be on your own here pal.

 

#rulebrittania

[Pureblood]

2 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

Cases are not tracking with the UK's increases nor are deaths.

 

You might be on your own here pal.

 

#rulebrittania

20% of cases in USA are delta according to Fauci. It's pretty obvious that it's becoming dominant. 

[SasaS]

Just now, TK421 said:

Do you think that will remain the case? 

 

It's predicted to become the dominant variant in the USA and EU over the course of the next six weeks.   90% of cases in EU will be the delta variant by August.

 

We can pretend that it won't spread rapidly, but it will. 

If you look at what happened with Kent, that would suggest you are right, UK is a proper super spreader country, so Mutti may have a point when she says Britain should be wiped from the face...should be put on a more restrictive travel list.

 

Good news is that the vaccinations still seem to hold in the UK, admissions are at 17 percent rate and cases over 40 percent up, lets not forget that these 16k cases come from huge number of tests, so they probably catch everybody, which was never near during second and third wave.

 

Many European countries are already on 50 percent one jab, 30 to 35 second. so much better prepared than when Kent hit them.

But vaccination hesitancy is now the number one problem in most countries. In Europe, cases are down, summer is here, people are calculating.

 

 

[TheHowieLama]

Just now, TK421 said:

20% of cases in USA are delta according to Fauci. It's pretty obvious that it's becoming dominant. 

You do understand we are measuring any and all variants at the same time right? That is what the case, hospitalizations and death numbers do. So that includes beta, alpha, brazil, delta, India.

You can do the math man - if it is already 20% yet those numbers are falling in the US - then...

 

#rulebrittania

 

 

 

[Pidge]

It's primarily spreading amongst unvaccinated (or single dosed) people, of the 800 or so admitted patients, ~80 had received two doses (Covid-19: Cases of delta variant rise by 79%, but rate of growth slows | The BMJ). This isn't a total shock based on the efficacy rates of the vaccinations, and does not suggest that the vaccines are any less capable of preventing infection against this variant to other strains. 

 

Don't want mandatory vaccination, but still see it as the way out of this.

[Captain Turdseye]

SUPERB

[TheHowieLama]

2 minutes ago, Captain Turdseye said:

SUPERB

 

[Pureblood]

14 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

You do understand we are measuring any and all variants at the same time right? That is what the case, hospitalizations and death numbers do. So that includes beta, alpha, brazil, delta, India.

You can do the math man - if it is already 20% yet those numbers are falling in the US - then...

 

#rulebrittania

 

 

 

I didn't understand any of that. Word salad. 

[TheHowieLama]

10 minutes ago, TK421 said:

I didn't understand any of that.

Yea - I get that.

 

You need to be focused on the macro anyway -

 

Masks vs Vaccine

[Pureblood]

2 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

Yea - I get that.

 

You need to be focused on the macro anyway -

 

Masks vs Vaccine

No, it's not binary like that at all. 

 

I'm not anti-vaccine - I want them to work. 

[TheHowieLama]

4 minutes ago, TK421 said:

No, it's not binary like that at all. 

 

I'm not anti-vaccine - I want them to work. 

I get that you have said that too, but as before - unfortunately it is. Take the quiz below to help understand how binary it is:

 

Do you wear a mask to mitigate spread?  Y/N

Have you been vaccinated to mitigate spread? Y/N

[Pureblood]

3 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

I get that you have said that too, but as before - unfortunately it is. Take the quiz below to help understand how binary it is:

 

Do you wear a mask to mitigate spread?  Y/N

Have you been vaccinated to mitigate spread? Y/N

It's not binary for me. 

 

I have vaccine hesitancy on a personal level and have doubts over their effectiveness and concerns about long term side effects.

 

Notwithstanding these personal feelings and views, I want the vaccine to work and prevent harm/death. 

[Chris]

1 minute ago, TK421 said:

It's not binary for me. 

 

I have vaccine hesitancy on a personal level and have doubts over their effectiveness and concerns about long term side effects.

 

Notwithstanding these personal feelings and views, I want the vaccine to work and prevent harm/death. 

 

You should be happy. It is working.

[TheHowieLama]

1 minute ago, TK421 said:

It's not binary for me. 

 

I have vaccine hesitancy on a personal level and have doubts over their effectiveness and concerns about long term side effects.

 

Notwithstanding these personal feelings and views, I want the vaccine to work and prevent harm/death. 

When did this start?

 

My guess is you have had multiple vaccines over the course of your life.

[Strontium]

TK, shall we dig out what you said about people who had mask hesitancy on a personal level, along with doubts over their effectiveness, or shall we just agree there's a bit of a double standard here?

[Pureblood]

Just now, TheHowieLama said:

When did this start?

 

My guess is you have had multiple vaccines over the course of your life.

It started before they were authorised.  I think they were rushed through clinical trials, increasing the risk of side effects.  I think that's a reasonable point of view and has been borne out in reality (to a certain extent) with fatal blood clots and myocarditis, for example. 

[Pureblood]

3 minutes ago, Strontium Dog™ said:

TK, shall we dig out what you said about people who had mask hesitancy on a personal level, along with doubts over their effectiveness, or shall we just agree there's a bit of a double standard here?

You can be my guest. 

 

Although I would argue that a mask is a separate issue to a vaccine. I don't think it's helpful to conflate the two, it serves no purpose. 

[TheHowieLama]

Just now, TK421 said:

It started before they were authorised.  I think they were rushed through clinical trials, increasing the risk of side effects.  I think that's a reasonable point of view and has been borne out in reality (to a certain extent) with fatal blood clots and myocarditis, for example. 

Are you sure that level of side effect is anymore than the vaccines you have taken throughout your life?

Cuz tbh that stuff has always happened, forever - in fact it has probably been less so with this particular round of vaccines. But it is just this vaccine which you have a "hesitancy" towards right?

[Pureblood]

4 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

Are you sure that level of side effect is anymore than the vaccines you have taken throughout your life?

I've already explained my reasons for vaccine hesitancy at length. This is becoming dull and repetitive. 

[TheHowieLama]

Just now, TK421 said:

I've already explained by reasons for vaccine hesitancy at length. This is becoming dull and repetitive. 

So you are not sure of the facts?

Like the decades old reasons for MMR vaccine pushback? What we can call the glory days of the anti vaxx.

 

I appreciate your right to make that decision regardless.

 

TBH it seems you would have been vaccinated your whole life, multiple times - at your/our age it would have been quite difficult to get through the system without doing so.

 

So you are like a born again anti vaxxer. 

 

[3 Stacks]

I think Covid has probably turned @TK421 into a bit of an overthinker, would I be right in that assessment?

 

Using a medication with effectiveness that studies aren't very clear on without being sick is an odd one.

 

I was worried about the vaccine too but like it's the only way out of this really. 

[Pureblood]

3 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

So you are not sure of the facts?

Like the decades old reasons for MMR vaccine pushback? What we can call the glory days of the anti vaxx.

 

I appreciate your right to make that decision regardless.

 

TBH it seems you would have been vaccinated your whole life, multiple times - at your/our age it would have been quite difficult to get through the system without doing so.

 

So you are like a born again anti vaxxer. 

 

I'm not anti vaccine, I'm hesitant about this particular vaccine.

 

Other vaccines have decades of proven safety and effectiveness, so I'm not concerned about them. 

[TheHowieLama]

Just now, TK421 said:

I'm not anti vaccine, I'm hesitant about this particular vaccine.

 

Other vaccines have decades of proven safety and effectiveness, so I'm not concerned about them. 

Other vaccines have decades of similar levels of adverse reactions. And during their development had far more adverse reactions and nowhere near the developmental money, resources and worldwide focus - thats the point.

 

None of that has much to do with your personal decision though you may want to accept that trumpeting the mask thing now for you - ehhh...might want to sit that out.

[SasaS]

It was rushed and regulators were pressurized, on the other hand, there must be close to a hundred of these vaccines at various stages and as I understand, the trick was not how to make it safe, but how to make it reasonably effective reasonably quickly. Because they didn't start from scratch and used the technology which would be reasonably safe. 

 

Ultimately, it comes down to trust, risk assessment and alternatives.