Chris Bascombe

[Cardie]

Except Rijkaard has won things as a club coach aqnd Klinsmann hasn't. We aren't talking about appointing Rijkaard the novice, but Rijkaard the Barcelona manager, dumbo.

 

But if it's a strategy suitable for the second prettiest club in the whole world ever then it's good enough for us surely?

 

Especially when Klinsman's stock is arguably higher without having managed anyone for a few years than the recently relegated Rijkaards was.

[Brownie]

This thread was quality the other day and now it's descended into farce. I agree with Paul. I'm not surprised though because after that awesome post of his the other day, I did mention that it may happen unfortunately!

[Guest TK-421]

This thread was quality the other day and now it's descended into farce. I agree with Paul. I'm not surprised though because after that awesome post of his the other day, I did mention that it may happen unfortunately!

 

Hi Brownie.

 

Regarding your reply to my post (and there was no need to apologise, by the way), if you accept that Rafa was capable of getting the most out of his players in his first two seasons, then don't you think he is capable of doing it again?

 

Also you say that he hasn't been capable of getting the most out of his players over 38 games for three seasons - I assume you mean his first season, last season and this one? I would argue that he is capable of getting a sustained level of performance out of the players in the league as evidenced by the 82 point season, and there have been other times when we have gone on long unbeaten runs in the league.

[WeAreTheBest]

I did mention that it may happen unfortunately!

 

You should write "I did mention this before" and "You may get some abuse for that like I always do, poor hard done by me" in your signature bit to save the bother of writing it everyday.

[Rashid]

Hi Brownie.

 

Regarding your reply to my post (and there was no need to apologise, by the way), if you accept that Rafa was capable of getting the most out of his players in his first two seasons, then don't you think he is capable of doing it again?

 

Also you say that he hasn't been capable of getting the most out of his players over 38 games for three seasons - I assume you mean his first season, last season and this one? I would argue that he is capable of getting a sustained level of performance out of the players in the league as evidenced by the 82 point season, and there have been other times when we have gone on long unbeaten runs in the league.

 

Do you genuinely think Rafa has been getting the most out of the players in attacking sense ever since he came here? I think our goals for record has been poor under Rafa.

 

The proof really is in the league table isn't it? We have been closer to Everton than we have to the Champions since he has been here.. in the league. Is that good enough?

[EmilHamilton]

'Only a matter of days' Rash, 'I'm wanking as I type', we've heard it all before.

 

Even though it's not related to DIC, you're opinion is automatically thrown in the bin.

 

I mean even David Bond's disappeared off the face of the earth.

[Cardie]

Do you genuinely think Rafa has been getting the most out of the players in attacking sense ever since he came here? I think our goals for record has been poor under Rafa.

 

The proof really is in the league table isn't it? We have been closer to Everton than we have to the Champions since he has been here.. in the league. Is that good enough?

 

Not that putting out weakened teams in the last 4-5 games when we have nothing to play for in the league and a final in the offing has anything to do with that.

[Rashid]

Not that putting out weakened teams in the last 4-5 games when we have nothing to play for in the league and a final in the offing has anything to do with that.

 

If we weren't shit in the first place there would no need to send out weakened teams. Do you not see the irony in what you just wrote?

[Malarkey]

If we weren't shit in the first place there would no need to send out weakened teams. Do you not see the irony in what you just wrote?

 

Teeheehee, I do, Rash.

[Terry Tibbs]

This thread was quality the other day and now it's descended into farce. I agree with Paul. I'm not surprised though because after that awesome post of his the other day, I did mention that it may happen unfortunately!

 

Allow Terry Tibbs to bring this thread back on track and inject some fackin sense into this circus. Since Terry Tibbs joined this forum he has noticed a few things. Terry Tibbs is a man of business and in business we use figures. A figure that springs to the old grey matter is that 87. Terry Tibbs has done some maths here and figured out that 87% of Forumites are as clueless as a fackin jar of jellied eels. Terry Tibbs wonders how you donuts dress yourselves in the morning. All you fackin do is whinge about the same old fackin thing on every thread. It's like listening to a Celine Dion 12" on a knackered gramaphone. Sort it out for the love of god, sort it out.

[Dirk]

Not that putting out weakened teams in the last 4-5 games when we have nothing to play for in the league and a final in the offing has anything to do with that.

 

The same people who don't accept that we eased up last season because of the final are the very same ones who say Chelsea eased up in our 82 points season. That's why I won't take half of them seriously, it's called "selection bias," it happens a lot. It's a psychological mechanism people use to try and amplify the failings/flaws of a person or a group whilst simultaneously trying to denigrate or reduce their pluses or positive achievements.

 

Wiley InterScience :: Session Cookies

[Malarkey]

Allow Terry Tibbs to bring this thread back on track and inject some fackin sense into this circus. Since Terry Tibbs joined this forum he has noticed a few things. Terry Tibbs is a man of business and in business we use figures. A figure that springs to the old grey matter is that 87. Terry Tibbs has done some maths here and figured out that 87% of Forumites are as clueless as a fackin jar of jellied eels. Terry Tibbs wonders how you donuts dress yourselves in the morning. All you fackin do is whinge about the same old fackin thing on every thread. It's like listening to a Celine Dion 12" on a knackered gramaphone. Sort it out for the love of god, sort it out.

 

Celine Dion? You're defo gay, Terence.

[Malarkey]

The same people who don't accept that we eased up last season because of the final are the very same ones who say Chelsea eased up in our 82 points season. That's why I won't take half of them seriously, it's called "selection bias," it happens a lot. It's a psychological mechanism people use to try and amplify the failings/flaws of a person or a group whilst simultaneously trying to denigrate or reduce their pluses or positive achievements.

 

Wiley InterScience :: Session Cookies

 

Do you mean that through our failings we use the Final and fielding a weak side and losing an excuse?

[Paul]

The same people who don't accept that we eased up last season because of the final are the very same ones who say Chelsea eased up in our 82 points season. That's why I won't take half of them seriously, it's called "selection bias," it happens a lot. It's a psychological mechanism people use to try and amplify the failings/flaws of a person or a group whilst simultaneously trying to denigrate or reduce their pluses or positive achievements.

 

Wiley InterScience :: Session Cookies

 

This is the kind of stuff that ruins debates, Dave. Instead of sticking to the debate itself, it chips away at the motives of those with opposing view. You appear to be suggesting that people want us to be shit or are pleased about it. Admittedly your point is more intelligent than the sarcastic sniping, but it's tantamount to the same thing.

[Cardie]

If we weren't shit in the first place there would no need to send out weakened teams. Do you not see the irony in what you just wrote?

 

But we were, we started slowly so you have a decision do you put out a full strength team for the sake of an extra 10 points that see you get second and a points tally closer to the winners or do you stick with 3rd and make sure you have a fit squad for a Champions League Final?

 

Personally I'd rather the second option even if 2/3 years down the line we have blerts like you complaining that we didn't finish 2nd and within 5 points of the winners while shining your minature CL trophy.

[Dirk]

Do you mean that through our failings we use the Final and fielding a weak side and losing an excuse?

 

No, Mick. What happens is that somebody might continue to focus on the weakenesses of a person or a group, Rafa in this case, and continually attack him to try and highlight his flaws but at the same time they selectively reject information that shows Rafa in a better light, even if it goes against logic. This is what a selection bias is, they become biased towards accepting and highlighting information that fuels their negative perceptions but won't accept information that contradicts their perceptions, even if doing so goes against the grain of logic. Not all people critical of Rafa are like this, Paul offers up a balanced critique and whilst I don't agree with everything he says, I can accept that.

[Dirk]

This is the kind of stuff that ruins debates, Dave. Instead of sticking to the debate itself, it chips away at the motives of those with opposing view. You appear to be suggesting that people want us to be shit or are pleased about it. Admittedly your point is more intelligent than the sarcastic sniping, but it's tantamount to the same thing.

 

It's not sniping at all, it's why I won't take the opinions of "most" of them seriously. Where did I suggest people want us to be shit? I am implying that "some" people, not all, are being biased in their criticism of Rafa.

[Brownie]

You should write "I did mention this before" and "You may get some abuse for that like I always do, poor hard done by me" in your signature bit to save the bother of writing it everyday.

 

And you should write 'internet warrior' on yours.

 

How old are you WATB?

[Malarkey]

This thread has turned into an Orgy of big words.

[WeAreTheBest]

 

How old are you WATB?

 

Mentioned my age a few times before, I'm not into the habit of writing the same thing day after day incase anyone missed it. Sure you can use the search facility if you're that arsed.

[Guest TK-421]

Do you genuinely think Rafa has been getting the most out of the players in attacking sense ever since he came here? I think our goals for record has been poor under Rafa.

 

Sometimes he has and sometimes he hasn't. He got the most out of Cissé, who I don't rate, but he did make some sort of contribution under Rafa. He has definitely got the most out of Gerrard, especially in the 82 point season. Gerrard's goal scoring record under Rafa is magnificent. He looks to be doing well with Torres so far and Crouch wouldn't have all those England caps if it wasn't for Rafa. So in that sense Rafa has done well. He has also bought a few duds and struggled to bring out the best in some players; Morientes, Bellamy and Kuyt to name but three. I don't know what our overall "goals for" record is like in the league since Rafa arrived, but we have a healthy goal difference this season. I don't think Rafa has been an unqualified success in terms of attacking play, but I don't think he's been a total failure either.

 

The proof really is in the league table isn't it? We have been closer to Everton than we have to the Champions since he has been here.. in the league. Is that good enough?

 

That's why I like to emphasise the 82 point season, as it shows Rafa is capable of doing well in this league. I like to look at the positives. You don't think he's good enough and although you say you'll judge him at the end of the season it's quite apparent you want him sacked. I don't have a problem with that and can live peacefully with your opinion, like black and white keys side by side on a piano.

[stringvest]

Ebony and Ivory?

[Guest TK-421]

Ebony and Ivory?

 

Just like that, but without the racial connotations. Purely in relation to a difference of opinion in respect of Rafa's tactical approach.

[Brownie]

Hi Brownie.

 

Regarding your reply to my post (and there was no need to apologise, by the way), if you accept that Rafa was capable of getting the most out of his players in his first two seasons, then don't you think he is capable of doing it again?

 

Also you say that he hasn't been capable of getting the most out of his players over 38 games for three seasons - I assume you mean his first season, last season and this one? I would argue that he is capable of getting a sustained level of performance out of the players in the league as evidenced by the 82 point season, and there have been other times when we have gone on long unbeaten runs in the league.

 

Hello mate.

 

The 82 point season definitely showed that Rafa can have a good season in the league, and I wouldn't argue with that. The only problem I have is that it's one out of three (soon to be four?) seasons.

 

In a way, Rafa's lack of options that year may have worked in our favour because there were less players to choose from and the issue of changes wasn't as big as it is now. It was still an issue but as much as now.

 

The way I look at the league performance is a bit of a pyramid - starting low, high peak and then low again and that's never a good sign.

 

I'm looking at it purely from a league perspective here and in that case he's actually only gotten the best out of the squad in one season. The CL runs were brilliant, as was the FA Cup, but any truly great side is measured by their league performance and we've underachieved.

[Guest World Party]

It started going downhill for me in the summer of 2006. He seemed to be in a huge rush to rip up the formula that had got us 82 points the previous season and bring in too many players instead of just one or two genuine top class ones.

 

That season is looking more and more like a one off, maybe aided by confidence of the CL win, and what we're seeing two seasons down the line is Rafa's methods fully implemented.