Rafa opinion poll

[LFC Ultra]

Football is a game that divides opinion and what floats one man’s boat sinks another’s. I am all for freedom of speech and I will always respect somebody else’s opinion but some of the drivel and vitriol being spewed out of late is becoming almost unbearable.

 

Why is it certain individuals, usually the fickle contingent, think Liverpool have a divine right to win trophy's and titles?

 

Level playing fields are a thing of the past and have been since Rafa took charge. Time for a reality check folks, if you can bare to drag yourself away from the hysterical phone-ins dictated by tabloid media driven propaganda.

 

Never has one manager become the focus of such crass and biased media attention from two-bob journalists, taking cheap shots in the hope of grabbing a sensationalist headline with articles devoid of substance.

 

Since Rafa took control who have been the only two teams to lift the premier league title? Answer: Man Utd and Chelsea. What is the common denominator? Answer: money, a precious commodity Liverpool have very little off. In fact, Rafas total net spend in his first 5 years in charge wouldn't even buy him the loveable Christiano Ronaldo. Although £12 million might have done if the board had backed him before Man Utd nipped in to sign him!

 

The league table as it stands confirms that money dictates success. No team above Liverpool has less money, they all have more OR have spent more. Football has moved on since our halycon days of the 70's and 80's and the 'fickle contingent' have to accept that we are were we are.

 

The truth is, Liverpool cannot and will not win the Premiership title unless new owners come along capable of propelling the club into the same financial stratosphere as the big hitters. It doesn’t matter who is in charge, whether it be Capello, Hiddink, Mourinho, Ferguson, they will all have the same budget as Rafa, meaning they will only be able to sign the same average players as Rafa and that is a FACT.

 

The truth is, Liverpool are no better than a top 6 side at best. A bitter pill to swallow indeed but nevertheless something I as a Liverpool supporter and we as the supporter have to accept. Man Utd, Chelsea and now Man City have all got or in Man Utd’s case had, unlimited transfer budgets. Arsenal will be up there with the big spenders once they get their house in order, Aston Villa have got money, Spurs always seem to find money and even Sunderland & Birmingham have money! As much as I am sure Rafa would like to buy them, Messi, Ribery and Alves are just not available on his budget. And they won’t be available on the next manager’s budget either.

 

It is easy to criticise from the stand or from the comfort of the armchair but put yourself in Rafa's shoes. All his rivals are shopping at Harrods and he has to make do with freebies or two bob journeymen from TK Max.

 

Do you really think that Rafa wants to sign average players? Many of the 80 or so players Rafa has brought in were for free or small undisclosed amounts (They were also brought in as part of the restructuring of the academy and reserve teams). When you go to the board and tell them you need a right winger and they give you £6 million to spend, you get Jermaine Pennant. Because that is what you get for £6 million. When you go to the board and say you need a left winger and they give you £8.5 million, you get Albert Rierra. Because that is what you get for £8.5 million. If you haven’t got a pot to p**s in you get Voronin, Deggen and Rodriguez.

 

For the record, word on the street is that contrary to popular belief, Aquilani cost only £5 million and not the reported £20 million. There are add-ons to the £5 million based on success i.e. LFC win the league, Champs Lge, FA Cup etc. As that isn’t going to happen, Rafa could have bagged himself a bargain. That won’t deter the ‘fickle’ contingent from criticising though. He has played less than 300 minutes of football in a disjointed team devoid of confidence and consistency, but the initial comments on forums and phone-ins are that he is ‘crap’. I remember one Thierry Henry’s 1st 18 months at Arsenal when he was also ‘crap!’ Who had the last laugh there? Patience is a virtue!

 

Yes I agree mistakes have been made in the transfer market but who isn't guilty of that? The facts speak for themselves, if you haven’t got socks on, you can’t pull them up! Liverpool have one player who who Rafa paid over £20 million for and he is now worth £80-£100 million. Rafa paid £18 million for Mascherano and £17 million for Johnson proving that when he is spending big money, Rafa gets it right. Dossena and the highly regarded Babel where in my humble opinion mistakes but they weren’t - £32 million Berbatov, £28 million Veron, £18 million Hargreaves, £17 million Carrick, £17 million Anderson, £16 million Nani – mistakes, I won't even go there with the numerous £5 million mistakes, yet Sir Alex slips under the radar or nearer to the truth, the hacks are terrified of him!

 

The team is crying out for a leader, somebody to set an example and get hold of games by the scruff of the neck and take the team forward, but it would appear we have nobody brave enough at the moment, sad times indeed. Player’s who don’t want to wear the red shirt and give their all need to be rooted out and moved on, rapido and if that means saying adios to Stevie ‘me’ then so be it. To lose our talisman would be devastating but we can’t afford to pussyfoot around especially if he is having the alleged negative effect on the team, we are in a dire situation here. We need 100% commitment, nothing less!

 

Perspective

 

Arsene Wenger is lauded for his ability to sign promising talent on the cheap and turn them into superstars. Whilst not criticising Wenger’s coaching ability (in my opinion he is the best), statistics show he has only won 1 trophy (2005 FA Cup) in the whole of Rafa’s reign. In fact, Rafa’s Liverpool have finished higher in the league 3 out of 5 seasons, been to 2 European cup finals to Arsenal’s 1 and won 1 European cup final, whereas Arsenal lost their one and only appearance in Europe’s premier trophy. Arsenal’s ability to play attractive football is not in question but the fact is they haven’t won a trophy since 2005. There have also been mutterings of discontent from the ‘fickle’ minority, thankfully the board have stood firm and Arsenal continue to play the beautiful game, albeit trophy-less!

 

Sir Alex also endured a recent barren spell when big spending Man Utd finished 18 points behind winners Chelsea in 2004. In the 2 seasons that followed all they could muster was a League Cup win against lowly Wigan. The ‘Fickle’ contingent also called for his head (as they did in the early stages of his tenure back in the 80’s), accusing him of losing the plot. The board stuck with him and they went on to win 3 Premiership titles in a row and a Champions League crown, proving once again that continuity is the key.

 

C. Ronaldo, N. Vidic, D. Alves and G. Barry are all quality players who Rafa wanted to sign but was never backed by the board. All those who point to the departure of Crouch, Alonso and Keane automatically assume Rafa was to blame. Nobody knows what goes on behind closed doors so one can only speculate which is very unfair. Personally I think Crouch asked to go to improve his chances of England selection because he fell behind Torres in the pecking order, I think Robbie Keane was sold on because firstly he didn’t impress even though he is a seasoned Premiership player and secondly ‘Dick’ Parry signed him and of course fell on his sword for that grave error of judgement.

 

The selling of Alonso was obviously a business decision made by the board. £35 million for a 28 year old who Liverpool had arguably had the best years out of was obviously an attractive proposition for the owners who lumped a massive debt on to our club. I cannot believe for a moment that any manager would surely sanction that deal unless he was assured he could spend the £35 million on his replacement. As we know, that never happened. Aquilani was brought in for a reported £20 million but I am sure once Liverpool’s books are published it will show it was nearer £5 million with add-ons? Time will tell!

 

This isn't a 'big Rafa up' post, I am just a supporter trying to redress the balance, because some of the sh*t I read on this forum beggars belief.

 

For the record;

 

Rafa is not without criticism and should shoulder some of the blame for our decline. I am none to keen on negative tactics or playing players out of position. I am also no fan of mass rotation or press conferences blaming all and sundry except the team and management. But, all managers have faults and Rafa is no different. In the cold light of day, Rafas positives far outweigh his negatives, his track record is second to none and he obviously has a great affection for the club and the city. And that is good enough for me.

 

Those who want him out, should be careful what they wish for because believe me we have further to fall yet, I cdertainly don't believe we have hit rock bottom yet, not even close! There are big problems within our club that go well beyond the realms of management. Rafa Benitez and Christian Purslow are about the only two individuals I would trust in this crisis. Rant over hope you enjoyed the read!

Edited March 9, 2010 by LFC Ultra
spelling error

[shaunstrudwick]

He was tapping up his own player.

 

no - he was just saying sign me up first before you start allocating cash for player contracts - "i want the biggest cut of the wages pot please Tom"

[Jose Jones]

As I said your deliberately missing the point.

 

I think you’re always likely to get that situation when you have the manager also controlling the players wages and offering contracts. Particularly when there’s an enormous amount of internal struggle between people all pulling in different directions. And of course when the club has shit owners who don’t care about it.

Another example of how badly we’re run at the moment.

[Jose Jones]

no - he was just saying sign me up first before you start allocating cash for player contracts - "i want the biggest cut of the wages pot please Tom"

 

Nah that's bollocks and slanderous.

He was holding his control of the team and players over the owners.

“Give me a new contract or I’ll advise all our players to run theirs down and be worth less money”.

[Dougie Do'ins]

Why is it certain individuals, usually the fickle contingent, think Liverpool have a divine right to win trophy's and titles?

As I've said before, we don't have a divine right to win trophy's. We do however given the money Rafa has spent and the resources he has at his disposal, have a divine right to see some decent football.

[1892-LFCWasBorn]

Rafa should have been sacked before Xmas and someone like Hiddink should have been brought in.

 

I don't think we're gonna finish fourth now, so that will mean Rafa going in the summer. I'll be glad to be honest as I can't take any more of this fucking shit we've been subjected to, week in and week out.

 

Don't see any point in sacking him now to be honest.

 

Anyone know if we will still have to pay him off if he doesn't get us to fourth?

 

Surely the two cunts would have written this into his latest contracts.

[Dougie Do'ins]

Nah that's bollocks and slanderous.

He was holding his control of the team and players over the owners.

“Give me a new contract or I’ll advise all our players to run theirs down and be worth less money”.

So in other words. He was getting ready to shaft us if he never got his own way ?

[shaunstrudwick]

Nah that's bollocks and slanderous.

He was holding his control of the team and players over the owners.

“Give me a new contract or I’ll advise all our players to run theirs down and be worth less money”.

 

and he deserved his new contract because....?

 

i agree it was all a game to get HIS contract sorted 1st: "make the owners believe that the club can not survive without me - check" but i seriously doubt that he had completely altruistic intentions

 

Tom and him are bff's

[jamespp]

LFC Ultra, Ronaldo was a United player in 2003...

[shaunstrudwick]

So in other words. He was getting ready to shaft us if he never got his own way ?

 

it was points scoring not shafting

 

Rafa is on to too much of a good thing here to ever voluntarily want to go anywhere else

 

£6m a year *ker-ching!*

[Iantn]

agreed - Rafa is only interested in himself and how he thinks the club should be run and not necessarily the best way for the club to be run

 

Do you not think he thinks they are the same thing though?

[stringvest]

If there's anything that would make me wish Rafa to go before the end of the season, it's him promising to take Kuyt with him.

[shaunstrudwick]

Do you not think he thinks they are the same thing though?

 

of course he does

 

does anyone else though?

 

who is there to challenge him anymore?

 

he is in Tom's pocket and he loves it

[rage]

lfc ultra reckons the selling of alonso was a business decision made by the board.

 

the rafa apologist are getting desperate now.

[Iantn]

of course he does

 

does anyone else though?

 

who is there to challenge him anymore?

 

he is in Tom's pocket and he loves it

 

A manager should be allowed to manage without anything other than some financial restrictions for me. It's now the situation we have although the financial restrictions are beyond ridiculous.

 

I'm not getting into the whole debate about whether he's doing a good enough job or not, all am saying here is he's doing what he thinks for the best of the club. That's all.

[Dougie Do'ins]

A manager should be allowed to manage without anything other than some financial restrictions for me. It's now the situation we have although the financial restrictions are beyond ridiculous.

 

I'm not getting into the whole debate about whether he's doing a good enough job or not, all am saying here is he's doing what he thinks for the best of the club. That's all.

He's doing whats best for him and his family.

[1892-LFCWasBorn]

As I've said before' date=' we don't have a divine right to win trophy's. We do however given the money Rafa has spent and the resources he has at his disposal, have a divine right to see some decent football.[/quote']

 

Nail on the head for me and the worst aspect of this shambolic season.

 

He chooses to be defensive and fill the team week in week out with null attacking options.

[Iantn]

He's doing whats best for him and his family.

 

Of course he is. Everyone does. Put in his chosen profession doing the best for him means doing the best for Liverpool Football Club.

[shaunstrudwick]

He's doing whats best for him and his family.

 

this ^

[shaunstrudwick]

Of course he is. Everyone does. Put in his chosen profession doing the best for him means doing the best for Liverpool Football Club.

 

in an ideal world maybe

 

we don't live in a such a place mind

 

Rafa is no more than Tom's pet these days

[Iantn]

Rafa is no more than Tom's pet these days

 

Massively disagree with that to be honest.

[PaulMcC]

I'd keep him for 1 more season.

 

This season has been awful though, and we need abig improvement next season.

[Jose Jones]

So in other words. He was getting ready to shaft us if he never got his own way ?

 

Yeah, I'm not condoning the behaviour at all. He was trying to get a new contract out of the owners, and using his power with the players to get it. I completely disagree with him doing that. I completely disagree that it was all about money, getting his share of the pot, and that he's Hicks' buddy. That's just all bollocks, for me. I think there's enough to complain about the manager with regards to his performance and results on the pitch without resorting to stuff like that. Most of which can be muddied by the terrible position we are at with the owners.

 

I think Rafa thinks he's a good manager, he wants to stay at the club and he wants to do well, and he thinks he'll succeed. That's where he gets the stones to act the bit of a prick sometimes. He's just fucked up lately.

 

On your "shaft us" point, I just find it hard to identify with "us" as a club anymore, when we're run by such incompetent jerks who's only purpose is to reap the club for all it's got.

[zigackly]

In fact, Rafas total net spend in his first 5 years in charge wouldn't even buy him the loveable Christiano Ronaldo. Although £12 million might have done if the board had backed him before Man Utd nipped in to sign him!

 

There are a lot of incorrect facts in your post, this being the most obvious one. I assume you mean the Valencia board? I only skimmed the rest, but it seems to be along the same lines.

[Newport]

Rafa must stay at least until new owners come in. I don't trust the Yanks to make any improvement with appointing a new manager and people who even now thinks Rafa is our biggest problem are loons.