Go fuck yourselves FSG

[Jairzinho]

We need exactly what we needed in the summer. To bin Chamberlain and Keita and replace them with one player who is good at football and not made of crisps.

 

 

[Barrington Womble]

21 minutes ago, Section_31 said:

 

I think he's just a very average player. I don't even know what he does except for take the occasional long range punt.

 

We built our sides around players like this Pre-Klopp, as in players who'd show 'flashes' then vanish for the rest of the match or indeed, season, that's why we never won anything. 

 

You need consistency and reliability to build a decent side, and they're qualities Chamberlain and Keita definitely do not have.

I don't disagree with that, I just find it interesting he performs at a better level when the teams level is lower and he in effect becomes one of the leaders. 

 

I think both him and keita (when we bought them at least), we bought to be players who can go past someone and take them out of the game (keita with his dribbling, Chamberlain with his power forcing his way through), so we can break the lines and change the shape of teams who dig in. I think mostly they've both failed in that, Chamberlain because he's lost that burst of acceleration and keita because he's a giant shithouse who doesn't want to get kicked. I think Elliott's elevation to the side at the start of the season was a reflection of klopp's thinking that keita and Chamberlain can't do what we bought them to do.

 

This is the frustrating thing with our midfield going into this season. Those two just don't do it. Milner is fading away. Jones is still finding his way. That's 4 out of 7 (not counting Elliot as he's literally never played that position before this season) who just carry no consistency and thiago who misses half the season anyway and has his whole career. 

[Leyton388]

26 minutes ago, Jairzinho said:

We need exactly what we needed in the summer. To bin Chamberlain and Keita and replace them with one player who is good at football and not made of crisps.

 

 

You got anyone in mind who you'd like to see come in? 

[General Dryness]

4 minutes ago, Leyton388 said:

You got anyone in mind who you'd like to see come in? 

The club has scouts for that. They get paid and everything.

[Jairzinho]

25 minutes ago, Leyton388 said:

You got anyone in mind who you'd like to see come in? 

Depends what money we have to spend. Barela would be ace, but would cost a lot. Similarly Llorente at Atletico. He could play several positions which Klopp would like. Merino at Real Sociedad is another. I only really watch Serie A and La Liga so don't have any idea about alternatives in Germany or France. 

 

For me it needs to be someone between the ages of about 22-26. Younger than Henderson and Thiago (and Milner obviously), but older than Elliott and Jones. Scope for a bit of improvement, but capable of performing straight away.

 

 

By essentially doing fuck all in the transfer window for about three years we've left ourselves in a position where each transfer window we have more to sort out. A bigger change required, bringing with it the inevitable risks. Keita, Chamberlain, Milner, Gomez, Origi, Minamino, Phillips, Williams, all the shit back up keepers, and whatever turds we have out on loan, will (and probably should) go soon, you'd hope/imagine. There are question marks due to age or injuries about Thiago, Henderson, Mane, Firmino. 

 

Is anyone confident that in 12 months time we'll be in a better position with fewer issues in the squad to deal with?

[Barrington Womble]

27 minutes ago, Jairzinho said:

Depends what money we have to spend. Barela would be ace, but would cost a lot. Similarly Llorente at Atletico. He could play several positions which Klopp would like. Merino at Real Sociedad is another. I only really watch Serie A and La Liga so don't have any idea about alternatives in Germany or France. 

 

For me it needs to be someone between the ages of about 22-26. Younger than Henderson and Thiago (and Milner obviously), but older than Elliott and Jones. Scope for a bit of improvement, but capable of performing straight away.

 

 

By essentially doing fuck all in the transfer window for about three years we've left ourselves in a position where each transfer window we have more to sort out. A bigger change required, bringing with it the inevitable risks. Keita, Chamberlain, Milner, Gomez, Origi, Minamino, Phillips, Williams, all the shit back up keepers, and whatever turds we have out on loan, will (and probably should) go soon, you'd hope/imagine. There are question marks due to age or injuries about Thiago, Henderson, Mane, Firmino. 

 

Is anyone confident that in 12 months time we'll be in a better position with fewer issues in the squad to deal with?

I think even the seasons we won the league and the CL getting best part of 200 points there were question marks over the squad, it's just we didn't get a lot of injuries (certainly to key players) and we didn't have covid congestion to deal with. Klopp massively prioritised the 2 major trophies to try and enable our best players to play in the most important games and he's a fucking genius. We'll go into the end of every season thinking 6 or 8 players could go and 4 or 5 will come in and it'll likely be about a 3rd of both. 

[Jairzinho]

1 minute ago, Barrington Womble said:

I think even the seasons we won the league and the CL getting best part of 200 points there were question marks over the squad, it's just we didn't get a lot of injuries (certainly to key players) and we didn't have covid congestion to deal with. Klopp massively prioritised the 2 major trophies to try and enable our best players to play in the most important games and he's a fucking genius. We'll go into the end of every season thinking 6 or 8 players could go and 4 or 5 will come in and it'll likely be about a 3rd of both. 

Agreed. We were lucky re injuries with the front three in those seasons. 

 

I expect us to be really quite shit when Klopp leaves. Whoever replaces him won't be able to mask the under investment, and overachieve, in the manner that he has done.

[Barrington Womble]

7 minutes ago, Jairzinho said:

Agreed. We were lucky re injuries with the front three in those seasons. 

 

I expect us to be really quite shit when Klopp leaves. Whoever replaces him won't be able to mask the under investment, and overachieve, in the manner that he has done.

I think what we're watching at arsenal now is probably where we'll end up unless were able to develop some real continuity and we're able to continue klopp's work. 

[m0e]

4 hours ago, Jairzinho said:

We need exactly what we needed in the summer. To bin Chamberlain and Keita and replace them with one player who is good at football and not made of crisps.

 

 

Aye.

 

We also need to bin off Mane. He's no longer good enough for a starting role in a side wanting to win the major trophies.

[3 Stacks]

4 hours ago, Jairzinho said:

We need exactly what we needed in the summer. To bin Chamberlain and Keita and replace them with one player who is good at football and not made of crisps.

 

 

That is the thing we always come back to. They have turned out to be two bad to mediocre transfers and we've not been proactive enough in getting rid. That is a clear mistake, especially as the rest of our midfield bar the two kids and Fabinho are ageing.

 

Also, we could have tried harder to replace either Firmino or Mane, but that's a more delicate situation.

[TheHowieLama]

Mane would be a great guy to come off the bench. Whether he would be happy doing that dunno, I don't think at this point any bigger club is going to come in for him though. Huge upgrade on say Minamino.

Salah, Jota, new guy with Mane and Firmino on THE BENCH!!

[TheHowieLama]

8 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

They have turned out to be two bad to mediocre transfers

Both were perfect examples of the kind of midfielder we needed (and still need) to add - and at the time were the perfect age to transition us. That is 100 mil worth there.

To miss back to back on that kind of player hurts.

[3 Stacks]

2 minutes ago, TheHowieLama said:

Both were perfect examples of the kind of midfielder we needed (and still need) to add - and at the time were the perfect age to transition us. That is 100 mil worth there.

To miss back to back on that kind of player hurts.

Agreed. In terms of profile, they both made loads of sense. You can't fault the thought process, they just haven't worked. 

[an tha]

11 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

That is the thing we always come back to. They have turned out to be two bad to mediocre transfers and we've not been proactive enough in getting rid. That is a clear mistake, especially as the rest of our midfield bar the two kids and Fabinho are ageing.

 

Also, we could have tried harder to replace either Firmino or Mane, but that's a more delicate situation.

Have you had a change of heart? I see you across a couple of threads complaining about the midfield.

 

I recall quite clearly at start of season you being quite vocal about both the numbers and the options we had being enough and being satisfactory...

[Mook]

13 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

That is a clear mistake, especially as the rest of our midfield bar the two kids and Fabinho are ageing.

Do you need someone to explain how time works?

[3 Stacks]

8 minutes ago, Mook said:

Do you need someone to explain how time works?

You know what I mean, dickhead.

[3 Stacks]

11 minutes ago, an tha said:

Have you had a change of heart? I see you across a couple of threads complaining about the midfield.

 

I recall quite clearly at start of season you being quite vocal about both the numbers and the options we had being enough and being satisfactory...

No. I've always said Keita and Chamberlain were the problem. I would have replaced Keita in a heartbeat. I was arguing against the fact we didn't replace Wijnaldum adequately and that we didn't have enough numbers in midfield.

[an tha]

4 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

No. I've always said Keita and Chamberlain were the problem. I would have replaced Keita in a heartbeat. I was arguing against the fact we didn't replace Wijnaldum adequately.

Fair enough just not as i recall it...thats all

 

Take this post for example - does not look to me as you advocating selling Keita - quite the opposite.....

 

"We have 8 midfielders. Do you want 9? 10? 8 is already way more than enough. We have a backup for the 3 positions and 2 extra. That's more than almost every club. Were we meant to sell all of Jones, Milner, Ox and Keita because people don't rate them. Should we have sold and replaced Thiago as well, who some people don't like? Should we have replaced 6 midfielders this summer?

 

Also, no matter how much people want to frame that Elliott isn't an actual option because he's 18, he just played 90 minutes in midfield against one of the best teams in the world. You can't just keep ignoring that. 

 

Look, the injuries are a worry, they're a worry everywhere, that's always a risk. But when you have the number of midfielders we do, it's less of a problem than for almost anyone else, even when we have soft cunts like Keita.

 

The forward line is a far bigger problem."

[3 Stacks]

6 minutes ago, an tha said:

Fair enough just not as i recall it...thats all

 

Take this post for example - does not look to me as you advocating selling Keita - quite the opposite.....

 

"We have 8 midfielders. Do you want 9? 10? 8 is already way more than enough. We have a backup for the 3 positions and 2 extra. That's more than almost every club. Were we meant to sell all of Jones, Milner, Ox and Keita because people don't rate them. Should we have sold and replaced Thiago as well, who some people don't like? Should we have replaced 6 midfielders this summer?

 

Also, no matter how much people want to frame that Elliott isn't an actual option because he's 18, he just played 90 minutes in midfield against one of the best teams in the world. You can't just keep ignoring that. 

 

Look, the injuries are a worry, they're a worry everywhere, that's always a risk. But when you have the number of midfielders we do, it's less of a problem than for almost anyone else, even when we have soft cunts like Keita.

 

The forward line is a far bigger problem."

Yes, I was saying we can't buy more midfielders without selling because the numbers were already more than sufficient. I would have gladly sold Keita or Ox or Milner, in exchange for a better or more reliable midfielder. I think selling two, Wijnaldum plus another would have been reasonable.

 

But last summer, people were arguing about the midfield depth, which was weird. The numbers were never the problem.

 

But the forward line we could have added another player easily without selling 

[Mook]

12 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

You know what I mean, dickhead.

 

[an tha]

17 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

Yes, I was saying we can't buy more midfielders without selling because the numbers were already more than sufficient. I would have gladly sold Keita or Ox or Milner, in exchange for a better or more reliable midfielder. I think selling two, Wijnaldum plus another would have been reasonable.

 

But last summer, people were arguing about the midfield depth, which was weird. The numbers were never the problem.

 

But the forward line we could have added another player easily without selling 

Personally i think there is a bit of revisionism going on there, but no big deal....it could easily just be how i am perceiving it.

 

The midfield was flagged at start of season by a lot of people as being the area of concern on our team and as it stands those concerns have been realised.....the constant chopping and changing has been a big problem and then of course the performance levels of Oxlade and Keita  being all too often below what is needed.

 

We have only managed to put out an unchanged midfield 3 a mere 5 times this season so far in the league....some of it has been rank bad luck to be fair, but its just been almost constant change in there game after game and it has upset our balance, our cohesion and fluidity in there....just no partnerships/understanding and rhythm has been built up as players are in, out, in and out again/playing with different players game to game.

 

I think we have managed to get what most  would call our 'best' 3 on the park starting together just 5 times....In 19 games we have only managed to get an unchanged midfield out 5 times and longest we have gone without a change is 3 games.

 

I think we should start the overhaul of our midfield in January by selling and buying and continue the work in the summer.

[TheHowieLama]

2 minutes ago, an tha said:

 

I think we should start the overhaul of our midfield in January by selling and buying and continue the work in the summer.

Cannae sell what no one wants.

[3 Stacks]

12 minutes ago, an tha said:

Personally i think there is a bit of revisionism going on there, but no big deal.

 

The midfield was flagged at start of season by a lot of people as being the area of concern on our team and as it stands those concerns have been realised.....the constant chopping and changing has been a big problem and then of course the performance levels of Oxlade and Keita  being all too often below what is needed.

 

We have only managed to put out an unchanged midfield 3 a mere 5 times this season so far in the league....some of it has been rank bad luck to be fair, but its just been almost constant change in there game after game and it has for more upset our balance our cohesion and fluidity in there.

 

I think we have managed to get what most  would call our 'best' 3 on the park starting together just 5 times....In 19 games we have only managed to get an unchanged midfield out 5 times and longest we have gone without a change is 3 games.

 

I think we should start the overhaul of our midfield in January by selling and buying and continue the work in the summer.

What people were mostly saying was "Wijnaldum played every game, who is going to replace that?". I thought that made no sense because we had essentially replaced him with Thiago and Elliott, two players, and we'd bought a centre back in Konate, which meant Fabinho could go back to midfield full time. I thought that was more than sufficient. Hence, if we were adding to the squad last summer, I thought forward was a bigger need because bar 4 players there, no one else is reliable.

 

Despite this, I have fully agreed that midfield is the weakest position, but if you have Keita and Ox taking up squad spots and you have 6 other options, how much can you reasonably expect us to bring in another expensive, top player in there to give us 9 bodies? That's what made no sense. That's why I thought we had to sell one of Keita or Ox or Milner and replace like for like in order to improve the midfield.

[an tha]

1 minute ago, TheHowieLama said:

Cannae sell what no one wants.

The geordies are primed with a 75m dual bid for Ox and Keita....aren't they, aren't they, aren't they...!

[an tha]

2 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

What people were mostly saying was "Wijnaldum played every game, who is going to replace that?". I thought that made no sense because we had essentially replaced him with Thiago and Elliott, two players, and we'd bought a centre back in Konate, which meant Fabinho could go back to midfield full time. I thought that was more than sufficient. Hence, if we were adding to the squad last summer, I thought forward was a bigger need because bar 4 players there, no one else is reliable. 

 

Despite this, I have fully agreed that midfield is the weakest position, but if you have Keita and Ox taking up squad spots and you have 6 other options, how much can you reasonably expect us to bring in another expensive player in there to give us 9 bodies? That's what made no sense. That's why I thought we had to sell one of Keita or Ox or Milner and replace like for like in order to improve the midfield. 

Fair do's but when you say things like "Were we meant to sell all of Jones, Milner, Ox and Keita because people don't rate them" that does not come across the same as the perfectly reasonable argument you make above.

 

Anyway, ta for clearing up.

 

Hopefully the overhaul in midfield happens and soon.