Can We Just Stop and Think About This for a Moment?

[Bobby Hundreds]

2 minutes ago, Jurgen Knows said:

I’m looking forward to the campaign against FIFA for granting the next World Cup to the USA then. It would be a good idea to start that one early if we are to have any chance of getting it moved elsewhere. Let’s not repeat the mistake of leaving it too late take the moral high ground.

I want everybody to fuck fifa off and uefa they are both a disgrace.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

1 hour ago, Jurgen Knows said:

I like your use of the word “currently”. We’ve just decided to take the moral high ground. As of this day. Good try.

Bullshit.

 

There were protests about FIFA corruption and host-nation homophobia in Russia four years ago. The protests weren't as loud as this year, because in Qatar the corruption is more flagrant, the homphobia is more extreme and many (many more than 3, ffs) workers died because of the appalling conditions in building the tournament infrastructure.

 

Try again, dickhead.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

51 minutes ago, Jurgen Knows said:

Are American human rights breaches less relevant than Qatari ones? 

How many American workers are likely to die building the tournament infrastructure?

 

How many visiting fans are likely to get official grief just for being themselves?

[Jurgen Knows]

34 minutes ago, Burgess said:

Not a regular poster but couldn’t not in this case.

please don’t spout about human Rights and women’s rights and women being honoured -see below.

 

Rape without justice is an occurrence world wide - punishment for being bring raped however isn’t . 
apologies for being serious 

 

A British tourist was recently arrested in Dubai on the charges of extramarital sex, after she reported to authorities that two British nationals had raped her in a hotel room. A statement from the Dubai government said reports given by the woman as well as investigating officers from Dubai police “showed that the act happened with the consent of the three parties in question.” Just a few days ago, however, the United Arab Emirates’ authorities decided to drop the charges. The two men she accused of raping her have also been exonerated.

Situations like this one are not an uncommon occurrence in the UAE. A number of couples have also been jailed or threatened with prison for adultery or having sex while unmarried. In 2013, Dubai officials pardoned a Norwegian woman who was sentenced to prison after reporting being raped when her case gained international notoriety. In 2010, a British woman was arrested after she went to the police to report she had been raped. When she eventually decided to drop the rape charges and produce a marriage certificate, she and her fiancé were allowed to go back to Britain. In 2008, a woman in Fujairah who had broken ribs and evidence of violence from being raped after her drink was spiked was charged with sex outside of marriage and held in the country for eight months. Amnesty International Gulf researcher Drewery Dyke explains that  “rape victims are accused of having engaged in illicit sexual relations”, while “the rape allegations themselves have been left uninvestigated”.

The UAE has a large presence of westerners, both as tourists and workers. Dubai, for example, sees about 1 million British visitorsevery year, and is home to about 100,000. It is a popular tourist destination and with its “skyrise buildings, slick bars and glitzy shopping malls,” Dubai may seem like any other Western capital. Behind this appearance, however, are very strict morality laws. In the UAE, it is illegal for married couples to have sex outside of wedlock, as well as for a single person to have sex with someone who is married. The prescribed punishments for extramarital sex in the UAE include imprisonment, deportation, as well as floggings and stoning.

Perhaps the largest judicial drawback to these already troubling laws is the burden of proof the law puts on victims of any kind of sexual assault. A confession from the rapist, for example, as well as four adult male witnesses to corroborate the crime are necessary for the rape accusation to be considered. Radha Stirling, founder of Detained in Dubai, calls the system of justice in the UAE, “tremendously disturbing… Police regularly fail to differentiate between consensual intercourse and violent rape”.  Sexual assault and rape victims go to authorities expecting justice under the law, and not only do they often become invalidated, (a phenomenon that is certainly not specific to the UAE), but they actually end up being punished for it. When the Foreign and Commonwealth Office of the UAE was asked to give advice to rape victims, their response was: “The UAE is a Muslim country. Laws and customs are very different to those in the UK. You should respect local traditions, customs, laws and religions at all times…There may be serious penalties for doing something that might not be illegal in the UK.” The way that laws are structured in the UAE, however, can often be vague, due to their traditional nature, as well as the overarching influence of Sharia law. Rothna Begum, a women’s rights researchers at Human Rights Watch London notes, for example, that UAE authorities “have not clarified what they mean by indecency” and therefore “the judges can use their culture and customs and Sharia ultimately to broaden out that definition and convict people for illicit sexual relations or even acts of public affection”. Furthermore, laws are structured so they are left to the wide interpretation of any given authority, which often entirely lacks gender equality. Under UAE judicial interpretation of civil law, for example, it is completely permissible for a husband to physically punish his wife, whereas it is a crime for a wife to work without her husband’s permission. The system of law and justice in the UAE is inadequate and unusable for women seeking support in cases of sexual abuse. Ms. Stirling told The Independent: “We get people contacting us asking whether they should report a crime and – whether it be a rape or anything else – I often say no. Absolutely not.”

It was not due process, but rather, the vast international attention given to the most recent case of alleged rape in Dubai that caused the charges to be dropped. The Detained in Dubai Website states, “While, of course, we are relieved that the British national…has been freed; it is impossible to ignore the fact that this decision was taken as a direct result of intensive media condemnation, and not because the legal system in Dubai performed a proper investigation into the allegations.” If the international outcry had not been so overwhelming, there is “no doubt” that this woman would still be facing charges. While it is important to give attention to the cases that are described above, it is absolutely essential to note that in every case, the woman has been a foreigner. Rape victims who are UAE citizens have not “uniformly had the same protections,” as the international eye is often only on the Western citizens in non-Western countries. Hundreds of women, some of them pregnant, are being imprisoned in the United Arab Emirates every year under laws that outlaw consensual sex outside marriage. While it is more than clear there are multiple sexist structural issues that need to be addressed in UAE governance, (like with many fundamental political problems), they must be undertaken on the prerogative of the society itself, rather than as a reaction to an outraged outsider

https://hhslawyers.com/blog/new-uae-law-unmarried-parenting-sexual-assault-extramarital-affairs/#:~:text=One change is relating to,of marriage are not illegal.

[Jurgen Knows]

11 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Bullshit.

 

There were protests about FIFA corruption and host-nation homophobia in Russia four years ago. The protests weren't as loud as this year, because in Qatar the corruption is more flagrant, the homphobia is more extreme and many (many more than 3, ffs) workers died because of the appalling conditions in building the tournament infrastructure.

 

Try again, dickhead.

Good. I’m assuming the protests for 2026 will be louder as millions of Iraqis were killed by the USA. Or was that not “currently”?

[Jurgen Knows]

5 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

How many American workers are likely to die building the tournament infrastructure?

 

How many visiting fans are likely to get official grief just for being themselves?

So that is the only type of human rights we are concerned about? Other human rights should not affect a country’s chances of hosting the World Cup. Right.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Do you think the time added has something to do with the Qataris backward ways

[AngryOfTuebrook]

2 minutes ago, Jurgen Knows said:

Good. I’m assuming the protests fir 2026 will be louder as millions of Iraqis were killed by the USA. Or was that not “currently”?

You can't really be this stupid - unless you are TK, after all.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Just now, AngryOfTuebrook said:

You can't really be this stupid - unless you are TK, after all.

VPN?

[Bjornebye]

There aren't many nations in the world that doesn't have blood on it's hands of some form. 

 

There also aren't many nations in the world who are hosting a tournament in 2022 and and persecuting gays. 

[Dr Nowt]

2 minutes ago, Jurgen Knows said:

Good. I’m assuming the protests fir 2026 will be louder as millions of Iraqis were killed by the USA. Or was that not “currently”?

Criticising America? And their involvement in football? On here?

 

 

[Jurgen Knows]

Just now, AngryOfTuebrook said:

You can't really be this stupid - unless you are TK, after all.

Does that mean you ran out of arguments?

[Jurgen Knows]

2 minutes ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

Do you think the time added has something to do with the Qataris backward ways

Let’s ask Gary Lineker about that 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

1 minute ago, Jurgen Knows said:

So that is the only type of human rights we are concerned about? Other human rights should not affect a country’s chances of hosting the World Cup. Right.

There are no footballing reasons for Qatar to host the tournament. The only reason is sportswashing.

 

The USA (like a lot of countries) falls short on its human rights record, but it's nothing like as bad as Qatar.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

2 minutes ago, Jurgen Knows said:

Does that mean you ran out of arguments?

I'm still waiting for you to reply to my post from Page 1.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

1 minute ago, Jurgen Knows said:

Let’s ask Gary Lineker about that 

Go on…..

[Jurgen Knows]

1 minute ago, Bjornebye said:

There aren't many nations in the world that doesn't have blood on it's hands of some form. 

 

There also aren't many nations in the world who are hosting a tournament in 2022 and and persecuting gays. 

But there are nations who are hosting tournaments and killing millions of people. Or is that specific kind of human rights breach exempted?

[AngryOfTuebrook]

Just now, Jurgen Knows said:

But there are nations who are hosting tournaments and killing millions of people. 

Are there?

 

Which ones?

[Jurgen Knows]

1 minute ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

There are no footballing reasons for Qatar to host the tournament. The only reason is sportswashing.

 

The USA (like a lot of countries) falls short on its human rights record, but it's nothing like as bad as Qatar.

So killing millions of people is not as bad? If Qatar had killed a few million Iraqis it would not have been an issue?

[Bjornebye]

4 minutes ago, Jurgen Knows said:

But there are nations who are hosting tournaments and killing millions of people. Or is that specific kind of human rights breach exempted?

 

Where? 

[AngryOfTuebrook]

4 minutes ago, Jurgen Knows said:

But there are nations who are hosting tournaments and killing millions of people. 

 

3 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

Are there?

 

Which ones?

 

[Jurgen Knows]

4 minutes ago, AngryOfTuebrook said:

I'm still waiting for you to reply to my post from Page 1.

I already responded to the ideas in that post. Nothing new there. I don’t have an obligation to respond to each and everyone. It is boring.

[Jurgen Knows]

2 minutes ago, Bjornebye said:

 

Where? 

USA 2026

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

This guy has an outstanding command of the English vernacular, must be from Soccer AM. Or Northumbria.

[AngryOfTuebrook]

1 minute ago, Jurgen Knows said:

I already responded to the ideas in that post. Nothing new there. I don’t have an obligation to respond to each and everyone. It is boring.

You didn't really. You just put your fingers in your ears and said "You're only criticising Qatar because you're racist."