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Crystal Palace 1 Liverpool 3 (Jan 23 2022)

     

     
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    Dave Usher

What a strange game that was. Brilliant for 35 minutes, mostly awful for the next 55. Decisions went our way for once and thankfully we had Alisson in beast mode. The net result is a big three points which has closed the gap on City a little and ensured that we’ve come through AFCON completely unscathed. 

 

Maximum points from both league games and a semifinal win without Sadio and Mo (and Naby, just in case Klopp or Ljinders are reading this) is everything we could have hoped for. We needed others to step up and they have. Mainly Jota - who we would have expected to - and Oxlade-Chamberlain who we probably wouldn’t.

 

I’m an Ox guy, I root for him and I’m probably more positive about him than most but I’ve said time and time again that he’s a waste of a shirt playing in the front three and that I never wanted to see him there. Yet when Mo wasn’t there and we needed someone to step into the huge breach, he did it and scored in both games he started.

 

It hasn’t changed my opinion about him playing in the front three, well maybe a little, but that’s irrelevant. We needed someone to step up and he was the one that did it. We’ve scored six goals in the two league we played in their absence and Ox scored one third of them. Good for him. I’m made up for him as he’s a top lad. Of course this one probably shouldn’t have counted because Bobby was offside, but I’ll talk about that shortly. 

 

We had gone in front early through Virgil’s thumping header from a Robbo corner. About time. He should be scoring half a dozen of these a season. Even at that early stage the goal had been coming as we’d started the game looking really sharp with and without the ball. That opening 30-35 minutes or so was right up there with anything we’ve produced all season.

 

Palace were overwhelmed, they couldn’t get out and they couldn’t put more than a couple of passes together before we won it back. It was us at our best and we looked really good in and around the box, especially on the left where Robbo and Jota linked up well a few times early on. Curtis was bossing it in midfield too.

 

So all good, especially when we got the second goal. Lovely cross by Robbo and a fine finish at the back post by Ox, but Bobby was offside in the middle and he made an attempt to head the ball. He didn’t quite get a touch on it but his presence impacts the positioning of the defenders. I don’t know why that isn’t offside but VAR looked and said it was fine, so what do I know? 

 

It feels like offside has become far too subjective now with phases of play and whether players are active or inactive and all that nonsense. To me that’s got to be offside, but that doesn’t make it so as frankly I don’t know what is technically on or off anymore. For the record, I also thought the Palace goal was offside, but I’ll get to that in due course.

 

So we’re 2-0 up and cruising and then all of a sudden we went from looking in total command to suddenly becoming ragged as fuck. It felt like it started with a sloppy pass across his own box by Joel that was intercepted by the impressive Olise. He shifted it away from Virgil and got his shot away, but Alisson saved it.

 

Soon after that Bobby gave it away inexplicably too and Palace were in again. Matete went around Alisson and thought he’d beaten him, but Ali somehow managed to keep his feet moving and spread himself brilliantly to get enough on the shot to divert it wide. Ridiculously good that. 

 

The best save he made had come earlier when he instinctively flicked out an arm and turned away a powerful close range effort from Matete (I think), but it wouldn’t have counted anyway as there was an offside. Alisson didn’t know that though and it was an incredible save.

 

So anyway, we went from being in total command to somehow having to hang on for half time. It wasn’t even that Palace had done anything themselves, it was entirely self inflicted but those chances we gave up got the crowd going and Palace suddenly had their tails up.

 

Half time arrived at a good time for us and I thought Klopp would be able to sort it out by basically just telling the lads to wake the fuck up. We had a few scares that should have served as warnings, but worryingly we came out for the second half completely flat and Palace started to put us under real pressure.

 

Their first half chances were a result of our mistakes but in the second half they looked a different team and were creating chances for themselves. They were impressive, as they had been when we beat them at Anfield. 

 

Gallagher headed a great chance wide from close range and then Alisson had to make a really good save from an Edouard back heel. We were giving the ball away continuously and couldn’t the the sting out of the game by keeping possession. It was really poor from us but good from Palace.

 

And then they deservedly got a goal. Schlupp’s through ball to Matete was excellent but Virgil’s defending left a lot to be desired. He chose to hold the line to play Edouard offside but seemed completely unaware of Matete running in on his blind side. His body shape was terrible, not for the first time this season.

 

Edouard was offside but Matete wasn’t so suddenly they had two players running through on Alisson’s goal. Ali is great but even he can’t stop two of them as Matete unselfishly squared it and Edouard had a tap in.

 

Again though, morally that should have been offside. I knew it wouldn’t be because it was much less contentious than Bobby’s. Should it be though? Is there that much difference? I suppose the argument is that Edouard did not go for the initial ball when he was offside whereas Bobby did.

 

However, if Ox had squared for Bobby to score instead of going himself, would that then have been disallowed? I don’t know but I think it probably would have because the offside player gained an advantage and scored.

 

My argument for the Palace goal not being legal is that Edouard scored the goal and the only reason he was in that position is because he gained an advantage by running offside. The rules have changed now but not necessarily for the better. Morally both of those goals should be offside but under the modern interpretation the Palace one was fine and ours probably was too, albeit it was more of a subjective call.

 

We were on the ropes now though. Their fans were making a right noise and Palace are a handful these days. They’ve got pace and skill right across the forward line (unless Benteke is there) and they played with intensity, aggression and a directness that was giving us all we could handle.

 

We weren’t really posing any threat of our own now either and the inability to keep the ball just meant it kept coming back at us. The closest they came to an equaliser was when Olise made a diagonal run off Robbo and in behind Virgil. He was onside, and Alisson initially came out before realising that not only was he not getting there, but it was a bouncing ball which makes it much easier for the forward to lob the keeper. 

 

Olise didn’t quite get enough on it though and Ali was able to get back and just about make the save before crashing into the post. Thankfully he wasn’t injured as that could have been a bad one.

 

After that we managed to calm things down a bit and kept possession a bit more. The game was still in the balance but we weren’t getting stretched as much and it felt like they’d maybe ran out of steam.

 

So I think we’d have held on for the win anyway but you never really know as anything can happen in the closing stages, so the penalty was a nice present for us but I take issue with the way it keeps being talked about as being ‘decisive’. Vieira even said it ‘changed the game’. I only know that because I read it, as you know I could never sit through one of his interviews without nodding off.

 

The fact is we were winning 2-1 and we scored a penalty in the 89th minute to make it 3-1. That penalty didn’t win the game, it just took away any chance Palace had of grabbing a late equaliser. They might have been able to do that but the odds aren’t in their favour. They were running out of time and didn’t really look like scoring at that point, so the points were 90% in the bag by the time we got the penalty.

 

Palace are understandably pissed off by it and I would be too, but let’s not overstate things here. That penalty didn’t win the game. The game was almost certainly won anyway. It’s also nowhere near the worst decision we’ve seen either and I’m baffled by some of the hyperbole I’ve seen about it. 

 

It’s not a penalty but it’s not categorically not a penalty either, if that makes sense. Technically, the keeper has come out, not got the ball and collided with Jota. So you can absolutely give a pen for that. Whether you should give it is another matter, as there is more nuance to it than that.

 

Jota took too long and then made a mess of it by missing the ball as he tried to evade the keeper. He then moves towards the keeper and runs into him. The keeper is also moving towards him so he is not the innocent victim some are making him out to be. 

 

You can say Jota was clever and initiated the contact deliberately. Maybe he did, I mean he is Portuguese and they learn those things before they even learn to pass or trap a ball. Few do it better.

 

Personally though I thought it was more that because he didn’t get the touch on the ball it looks worse because he ended up going one way while the ball went the other. Had he not collided with the keeper he would have reached the ball before it went out and might have scored. It wasn’t a certainty as there were defenders on the line and the angle would have been tight.

 

So I didn’t think it was a penalty but it was definitely worth a VAR check as you need to make sure. I was surprised at how many replays the VAR looked at, and the more he looked the more I thought we were getting it. Not because the replays changed my mind, but because you could tell by how many times he replayed the bit where contact was made that the VAR (Craig Pawson I think) thought it was a pen. Then he checked for offside and you knew he was going to tell Kevin Friend he thinks its a pen.

 

Friend took a look and immediately pointed to the spot. Fabinho buried it with aplomb once again and we could all take a deep breath and finally relax.

 

Palace fans have every right to feel aggrieved about the penalty, but all the cryarsing from everybody else is a joke. We’ve been screwed so many times by shot decisions, but the moment we get a dodgy one everyone is up in arms. Fuck off. 

 

People have short memories. Remember Jota at Spurs? Maybe that played a part in this. The refs will ALL know what a fucking scandal that decision was, so then you have the same player involved in a debatable penalty incident and this time they find in his favour. Maybe the Spurs one influenced this in some small way, who knows.

 

I don’t really care, I’m just glad that for once it went our way. City have had fucking loads of iffy calls at big moments this season. This was as much of a pen as that one Bernardo got at Arsenal, and let’s not even start on the ‘handball’ they got against Wolves. And both of those WERE decisive.

 

This one wasn’t decisive, it just made the final few minutes a lot less stressful.

 

The one thing I do want to say about the pen is I’m irritated that it even came to that as Jota should have finished it off the way he did the other night. Everyone is talking about the penalty when really they should be talking about the fucking incredible ball by Trent that put Jota in. That was unreal, but it will be overlooked now because of the ‘controversy’. If Jota buries that we’re talking about that Trent pass for years.

 

Still, no harm done and Jota was clinical when it mattered most - the other night in the semi. The only thing that mattered here was winning the game. I don’t care that the performance was patchy as that’s not important in the big picture. Tiredness might have played a part in that as we put a lot into that game on Thursday night.

 

Maybe it wasn’t tiredness and it was just one of those days. I don’t know and it doesn’t matter anyway. What matters is we’ve coped without Sadio and Mo (yeah yeah and Naby) and by the time they get back we’ll be two points closer to City and looking forward to a cup final. Not bad eh?

 

Does this change how I see the title race? Not really, because I’ve said all along that City aren’t as incredible as people are making out and that they’ll drop points. That’s not my worry. My worry is that we are dropping too many ourselves and nothing I saw here eases those concerns as we only won this thanks to Alisson’s brilliance. 

 

My thoughts on the overall title picture haven’t changed but it’s a big positive that AFCON didn’t derail us in the way many feared it would. City have two walkover games coming up so don’t bank on them dropping any more points any time soon. They will slip up again at some point though so we just need to keep winning and then see where it takes us.

 

Star man is obviously Alisson, by a fucking mile. Robbo was good too (despite having problems with the lively Olise) and I liked most of what I saw from Curtis. Fabinho was decent but overall I felt that virtually everyone was below par to varying degrees. But we won anyway, which is great.

 

And by the time we play again we might actually be full strength, or at least very close to it. If only we hadn’t completely fucked up that game at Leicester we’d be right up City’s arses putting the pressure on them. Grrrrrr. Will that game ever not haunt me?

 

Final word on the Palace fans. Now I wasn't there so it's possible I've missed something, but from watching on TV and speaking to someone who was there my impression is that there was none of the usual bollocks about sign on, victims and food poverty. They just sung about their own team (and the ref!) for the whole game.

 

As I said, I may have missed something but the reason I bring this up is that I remember making a similar observation about them the last time they came to Anfield. They were probably the only set of fans to come here and not go down that road, which is actually very refreshing.

 

 

Team: Alisson; Alexander-Arnold (Gomez), Matip, Van Dijk, Robertson; Fabinho, Henderson, Jones; Oxlade-Chamberlain (Minamino), Firmino (Milner), Jota:


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I was there. Didn't hear any 'victim' or 'sign on' nonsense. 

 

I know not everyone likes the Holmesdale Ultras or whatever they call themselves, but I've been going to aways at Selhurst for 25 years and the atmosphere has got a lot better and less Tory Middle England since the Ultras thing started.  

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I don't want to be complaining, as I love the guy and think he still is ace, but Virg has lost a yard of pace, hasn't he? Teams are looking to get in behind him, something he used to deal quite easily with before his injury. Now he seems to struggle, especially when he has to turn. 

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11 minutes ago, HolyHank said:

I don't want to be complaining, as I love the guy and think he still is ace, but Virg has lost a yard of pace, hasn't he? Teams are looking to get in behind him, something he used to deal quite easily with before his injury. Now he seems to struggle, especially when he has to turn. 

I think a lot of people thought Virgil would recover and be back to his old self after his operation and recuperation, it was just a matter of time. But, he's lucky that twat pickford didnt end his career.

 

Jurgen made a comment about Virgil recently that 'some' things wouldnt be the same with him after the injury. I guess having one of your knees rebuilt results in you not being as quick as you once were.

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27 minutes ago, HolyHank said:

I don't want to be complaining, as I love the guy and think he still is ace, but Virg has lost a yard of pace, hasn't he? Teams are looking to get in behind him, something he used to deal quite easily with before his injury. Now he seems to struggle, especially when he has to turn. 

Yep. It makes playing the high line very difficult. Remember in 18/19 at Wolves when he gave Traore a head star and coasted past him? No chance we see that Virgil again I'm afraid. It means it's easier for people to go past him. I think after this season we'll see Konate as a first choice CB alongside Virgil as he does look quick. 

 

Gomez and VVD 2 years ago had phenomenal recovery pace. Hard to know whether Joe will still have that after his injury (I suspect it's academic to  us anyway).   

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31 minutes ago, HolyHank said:

I don't want to be complaining, as I love the guy and think he still is ace, but Virg has lost a yard of pace, hasn't he? Teams are looking to get in behind him, something he used to deal quite easily with before his injury. Now he seems to struggle, especially when he has to turn. 

I said the same after the West Ham game and somebody shot me down. It’s pretty clear that he’s a bit short of where he was pre-injury, hopefully he’ll get that back or at least learn to fully adjust. 

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Good report.

 

Interesting take on the penalty decision. Im convinced it was a stonewaller. No doubt Jota will be blatantly hacked down in the box and refs wont give him a pen, not that many have done, given the fuss created by every single pundit. Carragher can fuck off. He's royally pocketing Sky's shilling.

 

Why? Well if an outfield player clears out a player after he's played the ball it's a foul, a direct free kick. Any defending player doing it in the box and it's a foul and a direct free kick. In other words, a pen.

 

Must admit, I was concerned Ox's goal would be ruled out after Bobby's offside leap and I thought one of the 2 players involved for Palace's goal was offside, then came back onside then played a forward pass for the goal.

 

How come we see linos giving the offside coming back onside arm movement frequently in those situations during games? Where's Carragher, Redknapp and Lineker's indignation on that goal standing? Bunch of twats.

 

Onwards Reds!

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I saw Virg put on the burners in one of our matches a few and he looked as good as ever. Agree though that when he has to turn and run he doesn't look the same. 

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2 hours ago, tlw content said:

It’s not a penalty

Micah Usher.

 

Stonewall pen. The more I watch it, the more certain I am. From where I was sat, it looked a pen, but I didn't have the greatest view. Thing is though, the keeper, who was NEVER getting the ball, clatters Jota. It wouldn't have mattered whether Jota did or didn't make contact with the ball, the keeper's movement made contact inevitable. Stonewall pen.

 

And I heard no "sign on" or similar singing from them. Lots of scouse hatred from individuals but nothing collectively.

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I think its far far more likely we will drop more points than city in the remaining games than us catching up. We're so weird sometimes, play brilliant and then one mistake and the entire side falls apart basic passing goes astray and even when we're struggling under pressure we're trying back heels or forcing the issue I just wish we could reign back sometimes take the sting out of the game a bit quicker, find composure and then go through the gears again. I know there's opposition and you dont always get to do things your own way but the game management could be better sometimes. 

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When City got game-altering penalties against Wolves and Arsenal there wasn't half the noise Liverpool had to deal with when they got a penalty when leading 2 - 1 in the 89th minute.

 

Fuck the pundits when they start giving City that same energy maybe I'll feel bad but nah. I'm also sick of these I'm a Liverpool fan but I even I thought that penalty was soft showoffs when the shoe is on the other foot these pundits and fans of other clubs will have no mercy on us.

 

Take the points and go home fuck everyone else.

 

 

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57 minutes ago, dockers_strike said:

That's actually a defamatory and libellous comment by Winter about the game. Hope he gets pulled for that but I doubt it.

Looking at the thread again, in fairness I don’t think he is saying it’s fixed, rather that the officials are just poor, but the tweet in isolation is ambiguous.

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5 minutes ago, Anubis said:

Looking at the thread again, in fairness I don’t think he is saying it’s fixed, rather that the officials are just poor, but the tweet in isolation is ambiguous.

I think you mean unambiguous. Reading it, I dont get the vibe he's thinking only 2 games in the last 37 years he's been watching have had poor officials. He's clearly suggestting the result was fixed.

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2 hours ago, Anubis said:

Not that it’s of much interest, but Winter is on Twitter genuinely insinuating the game was fixed. You couldn’t make it up.

 

 

 

I'm honestly starting to think he's on Man City's payroll. Awful posh cunt.

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We’re not done with Afcon, we don’t know how the lads will feel after one month away at 35 degrees. They may need time to adjust themselves back to PL…. 

 

At least, Keita is flying back home, not injured and playing well !

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Man City have a huge PR dept feeding stories to the media and it's curious that a few Saudi friendly puff stuff has started to appear now as well. 

 

Wasn't a penalty but the same ref on VAR was the one who didn't give the Ederson charge out of his goal that wiped out Ryan Fraser of Newcastle for the most blatant penalty you could ever see. 

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I don't care about the penalty at this stage. Boring discussion of non-decisive goal. 

 

But I don't understand the fuss over our second goal or their first goal. I'm not going to moan about a certain level of consistency on these matters, whether I agree with the interpretation  of the rule or not. Basically, if you don't touch the ball or impede the 'keeper at the moment of being offside, then it's fine. 

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10 hours ago, KMD7 said:

I saw Virg put on the burners in one of our matches a few and he looked as good as ever. Agree though that when he has to turn and run he doesn't look the same. 

 

I think it's a mental thing. With knee injuries especially, you're always in fear something is going to tear again.

10 hours ago, Anubis said:

Not that it’s of much interest, but Winter is on Twitter genuinely insinuating the game was fixed. You couldn’t make it up.

 

 

 

Him and Bluto Samuel are probably on City's shadow payroll.

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The current interpretation of the offside law is nonsense and makes defending harder. Bobby’s second at Watford was a more blatant example but, under the current view, our second and their goal should stand. 
 

I don’t think Virg has deteriorated; he stopped for their goal to catch Eduardo offside. Fluke pass meant for him rather than mateta. 
 

Their fans are decent but ive heard them better than Sunday. Very quiet first half. Thought we were better than it came across on MOTD. I’m sure they tweak the microphones to suit. Utd aways seem to be loud but often made by only a few voices. My paranoia I guess. 

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