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Man City 2 Liverpool 3 (Apr 16 2022)

     

     
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    Dave Usher

My confidence against City has taken a real battering over recent seasons. I went from being bullish to the point of telling the world that City are terrified of us, to fretting that they’ve got our number and that we need to change what we do in order to match them. 

 

I felt differently going into this one though and I was confident. Not my usual notorious over confidence, but I did think we’d win when I saw City’s starting eleven. Even before that I was talking myself into us winning.

 

I started to feel confident in midweek really after seeing what they had to go through in Madrid. Our lads either had their feet up or their slippers on, while City were going to war against the most horrible team in world football. To go through what they did and then have to deal with a fresh and fired up Liverpool… I honestly don’t think that’s possible. And then when I saw the team Guardiola had picked, that’s when I felt that they were there for the taking.

 

Not because it was a really weak line up. Clearly it wasn’t. That team would win against most opponents. We’re not most opponents though. To face us without Ederson, Walker, Laporte, Dias, Rodri and De Bruyne, yeah that’s a seriously tall order, despite the quality they still had. Especially given how fired up and rabid our lads were obviously going to be.

 

That said, 3-0 at half time was much more than I was expecting. The way the game went wasn’t surprising to me, I thought we’d be on the front foot and would be fresher than them, but scoring three unanswered goals was not something I’d have predicted. We were good value for it though.

 

Without the ball we were incredible in that first half. With it we were pretty good too but I think we can do better. I’m not we can do any better without the ball though as we just smothered them. 

 

I’m not sure why City tried to play out from the back as much as they did. I thought they’d learnt that lesson years ago as they’ve really toned that down since. Maybe it was due to the changes they made and they wanted to keep the ball more to conserve energy. 

 

Whatever the reason I’m glad they did it, because they were just laying down a trail of chum in the water for our hungry sharks. 

 

I made the point last week that a big problem for us in the game at the Etihad was we only had one corner. We’re so good at corners that if we get half a dozen you expect us to make one count. Games like this are often decided on the little details and being boss on corners is a big advantage for us.

 

The emergence of Konate as a huge threat on corners has been most welcome, especially as the goals have dried up from Mo. We needed to replace his output somehow and we’ve done it via the most unlikely of sources. Three goals in consecutive games for Ibou now.

 

This was the best of the lot. Good corner by Robbo but that’s all about the dominance and aggression of Konate. It’s one of those “get the fuck out of my way, this is mine” kind of goals. He just bulldozed his way through the box and then soared above Ake to plant a header past the keeper.

 

When you watch the replay, Ake does nothing wrong. He jumps pretty high but Konate is just too much for him to deal with. He’s a fucking powerhouse, but the most impressive thing has been that when he wins these headers he directs them exactly where he wants to.

 

So that gave us the perfect start and you could really see we had the bit between our teeth and City were rattled. From the first couple of minutes I thought they looked dodgy at the back and that keeper didn’t seem convincing at all.

 

I had no idea who he was so I had no pre-conceived opinions on him. I rarely watch City and I never watch them in domestic cups, so I’d never even heard of this fella. Honestly, I thought Claudio Bravo was still their number two.

 

But the first few touches this fella had suggested he wasn’t to be trusted. I even said to my dad early on that we should be pressing him any time he has the ball. And then lo and behold he goes and does that.

 

It’s great from Sadio because it’s not just that he pressed him, he did it flat out and turned on the afterburners. The keeper messed up his touch but Sadio is on him so quickly. It’s just brilliant from him.

 

The keeper obviously has had a complete ‘mare with that but when you’re encouraged to play around in your own six yard box like that then this is an occupational hazard. Playing out from the back is all well and good but I never like seeing keepers playing about near their own goal line. Even Ederson, great as he is with his feet, almost got caught by Jota last week.

 

Sadio deserves all the credit for that because he’s so good at it. He almost did it earlier in the season at Anfield but was denied by VAR. It might have been against Brighton, I can’t remember. He’s a fucking menace though isn’t he?

 

So 2-0 and we’re in dreamland. City were completely rattled, we were dominating them all over the park but a two goal lead isn’t enough against these, especially when they had De Bruyne and Mahrez on the bench.

 

I felt like the third goal was the key because if we could get to 3-0 we’d probably go on and get more. So that third goal felt massive when it came, and what a goal it was too. Just brilliant football.

 

The first two goals had shown two sides of our game where we excel. A set-piece and a high press. The third showed we can also build up attacks from deep and carve through opponents. It’s one of the best goals we’ve scored all season.

 

The cross field ball from Trent to Diaz is great. The persistence between Diaz and Robbo. Then the sheer quality of Thiago and finally the finish by Sadio.

 

Fingers will be pointed at the keeper again as he was beaten on his near post, but I don’t think he can save that. His position is ok as he has to assume Sadio is going across goal. His body shape suggested that’s where he was going, but then he slices right across it and it flies in at the near post. The keeper isn’t wrong footed and he tries desperately to get down and save it, but the strike is too good.

 

Sadio was sensational all day. He’s really starting to look the part in the middle and is getting better every time he plays there. He’s great at coming deep to collect the ball and then getting turned and running at people, and he’s scoring goals at a good rate too.

 

Klopp is spoiled for choice right now, especially up front. That’s going to lead to some potentially surprising choices over the coming weeks I think. There were a couple in this game actually. Konate for Matip wasn’t really a shock and given the goalscoring exploits of Konate of late it made sense to keep him in, and that decision paid off big time.

 

I didn’t like the decision to leave Henderson out for Keita and I wouldn’t have started Diaz either, but I was fine with that. Keita over Hendo though? In a game this big? Nah, I didn’t like that one bit. 

 

Naby actually did well and justified the decision but I didn’t really see anything from him that Hendo isn’t going to give us either. That said, a fresh and angry Hendo lining up against the Mancs on Tuesday is something I can’t wait to see.

 

Keita was brilliant in his pressing and positioning, and he was pretty good with his use of the ball too. I think he can play better but I have no complaints about this. He’s contributed a fair bit this season. He’s not been brilliant by any means but he’s not a weak link anymore either. The fact he’s being trusted to start big games and he’s not being subbed before half time is certainly progress.

 

Last week at the Etihad the midfield didn’t really function. Thiago was the pick of the three but Fabinho had a stinker and Hendo didn’t make much of an impact either. Klopp’s solution to it was to pick Keita and even though I didn’t like it, I can’t argue with it now given how we played.

 

There’s a lot more to how we played than just that change though. Fabinho wasn’t himself last week but he was back to his best in this one. Klopp referenced that and said they had to look at the reasons Fabinho struggled. He rested him midweek so presumably fatigue was the problem.

 

Thiago though, fucking hell he was playing football from another dimension. Not enough is being said about what he did in this game. I said on the post match pod that I think this might have been a perfect performance.

 

By that I mean literally everything he did was good. The decision making, the execution, just everything he did was perfect. It was one of the most accomplished midfield performances I’ve ever seen. He’s amazing.

 

City’s midfield couldn’t really handle us at all, but then Rodri and De Bruyne weren’t there so that makes a difference. I would have thought Gundogen might have started as that midfield three was always going to struggle to deal with us. 

 

I’ve got to say that at half time I was thinking we might be about to witness something epic. Like a 6-0 or something. That was naive of me really. It very rarely works out like that. When one great side has a big lead over another, it rarely ends up as a rout and more often than not the other side gets back into it.

 

3-2 flattered City of course, but its not surprising. We’ve seen that before. Remember the game at Anfield when we raced into a big lead and then ended up hanging on desperately at the end? This wasn’t like that as we were never under the cosh, but it is fairly typical of what often happens.

 

We didn’t get complacent or ease off massively, but when you’re 3-0 up against a great side something changes and you just get a little bit more pragmatic and safe. We didn’t play with the same kind of breathless intensity we had in the first half, but then we didn’t need to as we were 3-0 up.

 

City scoring so early after half time didn’t help of course. Good goal to be fair. Robbo gave it away when trying to play a forward pass but it was on halfway and didn’t scream out immediate danger. City played it really well though.

 

Jesus got himself back onside and then darted back in behind. Great movement. Fernandinho’s pass was perfect and took Virgil out, but Fabinho was still back covering. Jesus turned him inside out though and then rolled it to Grealish who lashed it in. Really good goal and that’s what they can do at any moment.

 

That gave them a lift and could have caused us to wobble. It didn’t really. The second half was pretty even but I never felt we were in any danger until stoppage time really. We were mostly keeping them at arms length and always looked dangerous ourselves.

 

They got in behind us twice and Jesus was the problem. He got in behind Virgil and Alisson needed to make a save from a tight angle. Virgil nudged him in the back to put him off and if Jesus had gone down there I think he’d have got a pen. He stayed up and tried to score but it knocked him out of his stride. The commentators said it was great defending by Virg, I think he was pretty lucky.

 

Jesus got in again a bit later and Alisson needed to make a great save with his left foot. That came about because Konate tried to play a ball down the line that was cut out, and Virgil was about 20 yards behind everyone else which allowed Jesus to get in. I think Konate was also playing him on, but Virgil’s position seemed odd at the time. I think he’d dropped deep wanting a pass from Alisson but it went out to Konate instead and he was slow to push out.

 

Those were the only real moments of danger I can remember. Aside from that we were in control and had chances of our own. Sadio shot straight at the keeper when well placed and Mo had a few openings he didn’t make the most of.

 

I’d have subbed Mo with about 20 minutes to go and brought Bobby on. Other than Hendo for Naby, Klopp didn’t make any changes until later than that and when he did he brought off Diaz and Mané, who were both brilliant. Mo was left on, presumably just because we need him back in the goals.

 

I didn’t mind those changes but I did recoil somewhat when Jones was brought on for Thiago. It felt as though we were acting like the game was over and I didn’t feel that it was. There were only five minutes left but even so, that change made me a bit itchy and scratchy. To be fair, that change had no bearing on what happened and Curtis wasn’t responsible for the panic at the end.

 

The late goal for Silva gave the scoreline a false look but it also set up a grandstand finish in which City had three chances to equalise. We should NEVER have found ourselves in that position but top players can do that to you and I’m just glad we had a three goal cushion. 

 

I don’t even really blame anyone for the City goal. Mahrez did absolutely brilliantly to create that and although Robbo looked all at sea there’s really not much he can do. By the time he’s in position to even foul him it’s too late as Mahrez is in the box. 

 

It was a bit unfortunate for us as the initial pass from Foden wasn’t even meant for Mahrez. He was looking for Sterling and Robbo had tracked that run before having to then veer off course and close down Mahrez. He was struggling to get there, his angles weren’t right and Mahrez was able to completely skin him.

 

His shot from a tight angle almost squirmed through Alisson into the net but we were fortunate that the deflection took it away from goal. Not so fortunate that it fell perfectly for that little rat Bernardo.

 

After that City had three chances to equalise. Van Dijk did enough to deflect a Fernandinho shot over the bar. Then Jota did the same to deny Mahrez. The best chance they had fell to Sterling who found himself unmarked in the box but hit a tame shot straight at Alisson.

 

I know I shouldn’t feel this way, but the way this ended did take some of the shine off it for me. Not too much and in time when I look back on this season I won’t be thinking about how this game ended. For now though it is a little annoying.

 

If we’d taken one of the gilt edged opportunities we had in stoppage time to make it 4-2 that would have been more palatable. It doesn’t matter that we didn’t, it just would have been nice. Mo had one that he put well wide when there were three or four team-mates in the box wanting a pass. 

 

You could actually make a case that he should have gone to the corner flag with it. He’s never going to do that though. Diaz might have. Maybe Sadio would too. Bobby wouldn’t have any hesitation in doing it. Mo is always going to try and score though.

 

Bobby should have scored in the dying seconds too when the keeper headed it out to him after racing out to deny Salah. I thought Bobby should have just lobbed it over him but yet again we saw one of our strikers spurn that and try to dribble instead. 

 

In fairness Bobby went around Fernandinho like he was a cone on a training pitch, but as he went to shoot, a City defender came flying in through the back of him.

 

The ball ended up in the keeper’s arms but Michael Oliver blew for a free-kick. What the actual fuck? It’s either play on or a penalty. I have no idea what he thinks he saw there but giving a foul against Bobby in that situation ranks as one of the worst decisions you’ll ever see. 

 

It’s an irrelevant footnote now but I thought it was worth mentioning because he’s literally five yards from it and somehow came up with that decision. Fucking mental.

 

Overall I thought Oliver was pretty good though, aside from showing the same failing that pretty much every other ref in the Premier League has had over the past decade. I am of course referring to the different set of rules that Fernandinho is allowed to play by compared with everyone else on the pitch.

 

This isn’t about refs being biased towards City. It’s not that, it’s Fernandinho specific. It’s been a running joke for years how he’s allowed five or six fouls before he eventually picks up a card, and we saw that again here. Honestly, there has to be something going on here as the cunt gets away with fucking murder every time he plays.

 

He could easily have had four yellow cards in this game. Other players - from both sides - were booked for similar or even lesser offences, yet he just bounces around booting fuck out of people without any kind of recourse. At this point it’s just completely bizarre.

 

He’s like that South African twat in Lethal Weapon 2, smugly taunting Murtagh and Riggs by saying “diplomatic immunity”. Fernandinho must have something on Premier League refs that means he gets three free ones before they can book him.

 

The first one he did on Thiago was nasty as fuck. He didn’t just foul him, he booted him and was wanting to hurt him. There was another wild one on Diaz too, as well as numerous other persistent offences. 

 

Eventually he got a yellow for a challenge that could easily have been a red when he lunged in at full speed and caught Sadio. He went in with both feet. It wasn’t exactly two footed as the first foot missed but the trailing one didn’t. It was worse than a yellow but not quite bad enough to justify a red under normal circumstances, but when he’d got away with so much before that then he’d have had no right to complain if he’d been sent packing there. Absolute fucking shithouse him.

 

There seems to be a genuine respect between the two sets of players and there’s very little needle there. A lot of them are mates. Virgil was chatting with Ake afterwards, the Brazilian lads all seem to get on well with each other and I even saw Jones and Sterling having a friendly conversation at full time.

 

Fernandinho seemed to piss most of our lads off though and is probably the most disliked other than Bernardo. I reckon half of our lads hate that little rat. Fabinho is a former team-mate of his and I reckon even he can’t stand him. Jota is probably the only one who doesn’t, because they’re international team-mates. And Alisson of course, he doesn’t hate anyone as he’s a saint. 

 

Even the managers seem to get on. I despise Guardiola but he’s been alright these last couple of weeks. I thought he’d say something to piss me off but he hasn’t. He’s been sound. Even when the City fans ruined the minute’s silence, the club put out a statement immediately and it was unequivocal in its condemnation. Guardiola hammered them afterwards too, so fair play for that.

 

I’m not even bothered about it to be honest as I expected it. There were always going to be some scumbags who were not going to respect it. When this happens I tend to feel sorry for the decent fans who get tarred with the knobhead brush. There were loads of City fans absolutely mortified and embarrassed by that. The dickheads don’t represent the entire fanbase. That’s United, not City. Although they are getting worse every year.

 

I haven’t read the replies to the statement they put out but I expect the whataboutery is off the scale and I imagine there will have been countless references to Koppaberg bottles too. City’s response to it was as good as we could have hoped for so I’m not going to dwell on it. 

 

I heard Guardiola on the radio afterwards and he didn’t make excuses even when they were offered to him on a plate. Of course the Atletico game made things tougher for them but he made an interesting point about why they weren’t at their best. He said that when one team plays well the other usually doesn’t. He’s right when you think about it. 

 

It happened last week in the first half too, only with the roles reversed. You rarely get both teams playing well and I think it’s just because of the strength of the two teams. When one is on top the other is going to struggle to do what they do because the team in the ascendency doesn’t allow it.

 

Klopp said last week City were brilliant but that we weren’t ourselves. He wanted us to play like ‘us’ this time and we did, but there’s no doubt that we were helped to do that by City’s starting line up and tired legs. Against anyone else they could probably get away with it, but we just blitzed them and they couldn’t do anything.

 

There’s a lot of talk now about how this might impact the title race. It won’t. If anyone thinks City will start to doubt themselves because they lost this game, they’re kidding themselves. If they think this will have any bearing on the Champions League final should we both get through, again, it’s wishful thinking.

 

City know they didn’t have their best team out there and that they were goosed after their midweek game. Next time we play them, they won’t even be thinking about this. It’s possible we might get a bit of a boost from it though. We’re reached another cup final and we beat City to do it, so we should be feeling good about ourselves.

 

We can’t afford to think about that yet anyway as there’s so much football to play. We’ve got United and Everton this week and those are two games where we should be absolutely filling our boots. I don’t want to hear anything about them being “derby games” and form counting for nothing. Both of those teams are absolutely pitiful and should have no chance against us. This is the worst Everton side of my lifetime and it’s possibly the worst United one too. And this is our best ever side.

 

We need to be battering both of them to keep the pressure on City and to cement our goal difference advantage. That might be crucial because if they lose a game and we draw one, it will come down to goal difference. And City have to play Watford which is nailed on to be about 8-0.

 

Star man is Thiago but I feel really bad for not going with Sadio as he was sensational and was the catalyst for everything we did. The whole team performed really well though so it’s hard singling people out. Special mention to Trent for his defending. He won pretty much every duel he had regardless of who he was up against and made a mockery of Shearer’s lazy analysis pre-game.

 

Konate too. It’s easy to forget how young he is because he’s so dominant. What he’s doing at 22 isn’t normal. He shouldn’t be this mature and this good. Playing alongside Van Dijk obviously helps with that, but this kid is special. There is no bigger Joel Matip fan in the world than me, but right now I’d stick with Konate because defensively there’s no real drop off when he plays and now that he’s on such a hot streak in front of goal why wouldn’t you just keep playing him?

 

I’d defo play him on Tuesday and then probably bring Joel back for the derby. The selection on Tuesday might raise some eyebrows as I could see Klopp mixing it up big time to go with fresh legs. I could see Tsimikas maybe getting a run out, and the midfield will be interesting. Maybe Curtis comes in with Hendo and one other. Up front is anyone’s guess. I expect Jota will come in and probably Bobby too, but who do you leave out?

 

Does it even matter? Whoever doesn’t start will come on anyway and that’s such a luxury to have. Whoever we pick on Tuesday should be good enough to swat United aside and I can’t wait for that one. 

 

These are such exciting times and we need to savour every second of this. We might be on the verge of seeing something that’s never been done before. In fact, we already have because no team has ever reached this stage of the season and still been in the hunt for every competition. If we beat Villarreal we will play every single game that we could have played this season. It might not lead to four trophies, or even three. Maybe we won’t even get two, who knows. But to be where we are at this stage of the season is just incredible. 

 

What a team we have. What a manager we have.

 

 

Team: Alisson; Alexander-Arnold, Konate, Van Dijk, Robertson; Fabinho, Keita (Henderson), Thiago (Jones); Salah, Mané (Firmino), Diaz (Jota):

 


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Great report Dave. Have to say I dont see the 2nd half many others do. I think we were on the back foot right from when city scored within a minute of the restart. The words 'keep it tight and dont give away an early goal' just didnt seem to register with the player who'd been brilliant in the first half.

 

I know city didnt score again until the 91st minute, in part due to Alli's saves and a great block by Virgil and I thought we were really stretched. I dont mind admitting from being very comfortable after 45 minutes to my arse letting go in the 91st.

 

Said before, Im concerned at the goal we're now shipping even if city are as good as us.

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Great report Dave. This is the team/manager of our lives, make no mistake. I thought the 87-88 team (5-0 Forest) were the best but this lot are on another level. Thiago, oh my god what a player! Trent, the guy who ‘can’t defend’ - what a pile of balls! If Salah can throw the switch then who knows where this will end up…

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Great job sir.

 

How on earth we ended up with three yellow cards to their two, I'll never know.

 

We left immediately after the final whistle (sorry and all) and saw a minor scuffle halfway down the Wembley Way, caused by their lot being more than a little provocative. They were bolstered, no doubt, by their fans outnumbering ours by about 10 to 1; so many of them had left early. That's the only time they outnumbered us. There were huge numbers of empty seats in their end. A whole section of unsold seats were hidden by an enormous Man City flag. 

 

Anyone know what the fuck was that golden Blue Peter-esque ship doing going back and forth in their end? 

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Great report, Dave. Agree with most of it. We certainly controlled majority of the 2nd half. They created chances in that half but so did we. 3-2 flattered them. Thought we also did well to take the sting out of any momentum they could have gotten from their first goal.

 

Which is probably why Pep didn't bother throwing on any subs for most of the game. He knew that at 3-1, we were mostly in charge of that game. The only sub he made was Mahrez for Jesus due to injury. It's great that even in the periods when we were outplayed by them in the first two games, we never got blown away like they did by us on Saturday.

 

Which is why I previously stated that Pep hasn't really figured us out per se. It's now 2 wins each and 3 draws from 7 games in the past 3 seasons. If City had racked up 4 or 5 wins from those 7 games against us, then I would have truly believed they had our number.

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You make a great point there, Dave, should we overcome Villareal....  

It is ridiculous to think we could make all 3 Cup finals and top 2 in the League.

 

I do actually fear we'll only finish with one trophy - which would be an absolute travesty - but what an unbelievable performance, regardless.

 

And all this, against and in the face of the most financially privileged, unfairly advantaged team in the history of the game... which does, unfortunately, make it very very difficult to enjoy.

 

Maybe this is a little what it felt like for everyone else in the 70s/80s, when we were "invincible"... but back then, no one came near to living anywhere near with us as consistently and sustainably as we are with City.

 

Amazing.

 

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Great article but I do slightly disagree with the point on Naby. I love Hendo and until about now he'd have been nailed on as one of the three, but I think Naby is now in the conversation as he is giving us something Hendo isn't. He's half a yard sharper to the ball which is crucial with our press, he's using it slightly better and more positively, and he's been superb with it in tight spaces, which makes a crucial difference against city's press.

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Great report. Can't agree on Oliver, though. I thought he was awful, for the Fernandinho non-decisions if nothing else. He also could easily have booked the rat a couple of times in the first half, yet who gets the first booking?! It's somewhere between a mystery and a scandal that we picked up more bookings than them.

 

As much as everyone (media-wise) has been banging on about our supposed defensive issues, I'm more concerned about our wastefulness at the other end. We should have had at least another 4 or 5 across two legs against Benfica and we should have picked this lot off in the 2nd half on Saturday. Mo is the main problem, but we could be doing better at turning good attacks into clear chances, and converting the clear chances we do create. (I guess I could just settle for averaging three goals a game!)

 

There are a lot of teams out there who wish they had our 'problems'! 

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5 hours ago, etho said:

Great article but I do slightly disagree with the point on Naby. I love Hendo and until about now he'd have been nailed on as one of the three, but I think Naby is now in the conversation as he is giving us something Hendo isn't. He's half a yard sharper to the ball which is crucial with our press, he's using it slightly better and more positively, and he's been superb with it in tight spaces, which makes a crucial difference against city's press.

Agreed. I would have been shocked to see us field the same midfield against City twice. Fabinho took a lot of flak last time out, but Hendo rarely gave him an out ball all afternoon last time. 

 

To the bolded part, he's just a much better presser and ball-winner than (at least the current version of) Hendo. I mentioned this in another thread, but playing against the top sides (Chelsea, City, Madrid) we either need to replace Hendo or bring in Bobby to gain control of the midfield. Hendo is just too passive in his pressing, he literally never wins the ball against the very best midfielders, and if we want to set the press from the front, we need everyone to be a real threat to the opposition. I know Hendo looks busy, but he never really gets close enough to the opposition player with the ball for fear of being gone past. Keita's way of playing is much more volatile, giving us different issues than when Hendo is playing. Hendo plays it safe, Keita goes for the ball. It will give us a better press overall, and more chances created, but as Keita isn't perfect in his execution of it, he will also give the opposition a couple more chances to get behind our midfield whenever he misses his attempt to nick the ball. For us to play Klopp football though, I'll take Keita over Henderson against the top sides. Against the mid-table sides, our pressing doesn't need to be perfect, as they will relent the ball much more easily. We'll cope fine against Utd for example with less aggressive press. It's a bit easier making Pogba and McTominay lose the ball in possession than Kovacic, Mount, Foden, Silva, Kroos and Modric.

 

I'm sure Klopp will defend Hendo to the hilt for his leadership, enthusiasm, his verbal qualities, his attitude etc. On the field against the top sides though, I think Hendo's on the verge of being replaced with Keita. I'll give Hendo this though, he's been through tough periods before and come out of them stronger. Might be age, might be recurring injuries, he's had a rough few months on the field in my opinion. I sincerely hope he'll get to lift a couple more trophies this season, and I hope he stays on as club captain as he's guaranteed to be a great influence in the dressing room and on the training pitch. I just don't want him to start the most important games BECAUSE he's the club captain (I don't think Klopp does that, either). We've had captains on the wane before, and with such a strong leadership culture in the squad, I don't think it matters that much that the 1st captain is playing, as long as van Dijk is there, or even Trent/Robbo.

 

Anyway, nice to have you back on the reports and pod, Dave! 

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11 hours ago, s(k)aturation said:

I do actually fear we'll only finish with one trophy - which would be an absolute travesty - but what an unbelievable performance, regardless.

I've a feeling this is what will happen, shades of Leverkusen in 2002 (they didn't have a league cup to ease the pain though).

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I'm absolutely not ready to be putting Keita ahead of Hendo. He hasn't done anywhere near enough yet for me.

 

That said, enough people are suggesting it to make me consider that I might not be seeing something because I don't want to. Maybe I've got Hendo blinkers on.

 

I fully expect a fired up Hendo to absolutely fucking rip United a new one tomorrow, but if not then maybe I need to rethink my position.

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I don’t believe Henderson has a dominant performance in him, I certainly haven’t seen one in years. If he plays and produces a match winning performance I’ll be genuinely over the moon, but I shall not hold my breath for it. 

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1 hour ago, dave u said:

I'm absolutely not ready to be putting Keita ahead of Hendo. He hasn't done anywhere near enough yet for me.

 

That said, enough people are suggesting it to make me consider that I might not be seeing something because I don't want to. Maybe I've got Hendo blinkers on.

 

I fully expect a fired up Hendo to absolutely fucking rip United a new one tomorrow, but if not then maybe I need to rethink my position.

I've always backed Hendo but he doesn't look right lately. A bit slower to the ball and more reluctant to put a tackle in. Maybe he's nursing an injury. Hopefully it's just a patch of poor form because we need him firing for the run-in. 

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21 hours ago, lebron said:

Agreed. I would have been shocked to see us field the same midfield against City twice. Fabinho took a lot of flak last time out, but Hendo rarely gave him an out ball all afternoon last time. 

 

To the bolded part, he's just a much better presser and ball-winner than (at least the current version of) Hendo. I mentioned this in another thread, but playing against the top sides (Chelsea, City, Madrid) we either need to replace Hendo or bring in Bobby to gain control of the midfield. Hendo is just too passive in his pressing, he literally never wins the ball against the very best midfielders, and if we want to set the press from the front, we need everyone to be a real threat to the opposition. I know Hendo looks busy, but he never really gets close enough to the opposition player with the ball for fear of being gone past. Keita's way of playing is much more volatile, giving us different issues than when Hendo is playing. Hendo plays it safe, Keita goes for the ball. It will give us a better press overall, and more chances created, but as Keita isn't perfect in his execution of it, he will also give the opposition a couple more chances to get behind our midfield whenever he misses his attempt to nick the ball. For us to play Klopp football though, I'll take Keita over Henderson against the top sides. Against the mid-table sides, our pressing doesn't need to be perfect, as they will relent the ball much more easily. We'll cope fine against Utd for example with less aggressive press. It's a bit easier making Pogba and McTominay lose the ball in possession than Kovacic, Mount, Foden, Silva, Kroos and Modric.

 

I'm sure Klopp will defend Hendo to the hilt for his leadership, enthusiasm, his verbal qualities, his attitude etc. On the field against the top sides though, I think Hendo's on the verge of being replaced with Keita. I'll give Hendo this though, he's been through tough periods before and come out of them stronger. Might be age, might be recurring injuries, he's had a rough few months on the field in my opinion. I sincerely hope he'll get to lift a couple more trophies this season, and I hope he stays on as club captain as he's guaranteed to be a great influence in the dressing room and on the training pitch. I just don't want him to start the most important games BECAUSE he's the club captain (I don't think Klopp does that, either). We've had captains on the wane before, and with such a strong leadership culture in the squad, I don't think it matters that much that the 1st captain is playing, as long as van Dijk is there, or even Trent/Robbo.

 

Anyway, nice to have you back on the reports and pod, Dave! 

I agree with the looking busy part. 

He does plenty of running and chasing the ball but their players had plenty of time to get a pass away by the time he gets to them and by then he's also out of position with a load of space behind him. 

 

Thiago just seems to have a knack for being in the right place, he won the ball back a lot because he was already near to their player receiving the ball so he was on to them quickly without exerting himself too much. 

 

Can't fault Hendos effort, but he needs to be more intelligent with his positioning and knowing when to press and when to mark their outs. 

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18 hours ago, dave u said:

I'm absolutely not ready to be putting Keita ahead of Hendo. He hasn't done anywhere near enough yet for me.

 

That said, enough people are suggesting it to make me consider that I might not be seeing something because I don't want to. Maybe I've got Hendo blinkers on.

 

I fully expect a fired up Hendo to absolutely fucking rip United a new one tomorrow, but if not then maybe I need to rethink my position.

Nah, I agree with you, Dave. Keita hasnt done nearly enough to consider replacing Hendo. I find it strange people are overlooking Keitalosing possession and wildly firing shots miles wide. I dont subscribe this this view some are spouting about Henderson being a 'coward'?!

 

Fucking hell, I may not think a player is good enough but calling one of the manager's most trusted players a coward? Have a word with yourselves.

 

When Jurgen decides and sees Hendo isnt worth a regular place in the team, he'll act on it. Like I keep saying, everyone in the Liverpool team can pass sideways and backwards. Except Hendo. Then the usual detractor is droning on and on about him.

 

I thought Henderson's only poor moment during the game was when he just didnt seemalert to snuff out one of city's attacks not long after he came on.Not sure if it was the lead up to their 2nd goal or just an attack.

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19 hours ago, stringvest said:

I don’t believe Henderson has a dominant performance in him, I certainly haven’t seen one in years. If he plays and produces a match winning performance I’ll be genuinely over the moon, but I shall not hold my breath for it. 

 

Years???

 

Goodison this season he was ridiculously dominant. One of the best individual displays we've seen all season.

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44 minutes ago, dave u said:

 

Years???

 

Goodison this season he was ridiculously dominant. One of the best individual displays we've seen all season.

It must have been one of the (few) games I’ve missed as I genuinely don’t remember any dominant performances.   Anyway, if he puts one in tonight and we win we’ll all be happy.  

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4 hours ago, dave u said:

 

Years???

 

Goodison this season he was ridiculously dominant. One of the best individual displays we've seen all season.

Not sure what everyone else are saying about Hendo, but being dominant against Everton just about proves my point that he still has a part to play. Just not in the games against high quality, press resistant midfielders.

 

He can still alter the tempo in a game with his drive, enthusiasm and verbal contributions. Playing him tonight is  obvious for example. I just don't want to see him in the games against Chelsea, Real, City, and I'm also not thrilled with him against really poor teams that defend super-low. While I don't agree with the term coward, his passing and lack of take-ons/shots in those games are certainly on the bland side of what I want from my number 8's...

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