Aston Villa fans

[Bourbon]

If our best player was leaving I'd be fucked off.

 

I would too but they haven't offered him a sniff of silverware or CL action in 10 years, bar the odd Cup run.

 

O'Neill is simply covering his arse; dragging it into public display to put us off and absolve himself of responsibility as the manager who came in and sold Barry.

 

That said in blaming Benitez for "leaking" to Tony B isn't something most of us can speculate on as we won't know so there is a small chance - (even so the story was that we had put in a bid for a player - fuck me Martin, have you never tried to buy players and the press reporting on it?) if it is true, Rafa has been foolish but not to the extent of O'Neill's bile which genuinely shocked me.

 

Those press and radio interviews where he's droning on about what happened day by day were fucking horrible and small time in the extreme.

 

If he'd have laughed the first bid off and said "Hargreaves and Carrick aren't getting a game and they're worth £16 and £18m - £20m cash or no deal, end of matter", I'd have respected him for it and willed us to leave well alone.

 

But no. So fuck him. Let him take us on, see who wins.

 

I hope Rafa did counter by asking Gerrard to get involved and now Barry has to pubilcly state his intentions, which automatically brings the fee down.

[Red Nick]

Short memories lads, if this was happening the other way round, the very same people saying we have behaved ok here would be up in arms.

 

My take on it is that this is the way of football these days, loyalty to a club doesn't come into it. Its not right but morals don't come into modern day football, if you accept this, then this behaviour is the fine, its what bigger clubs do to smaller ones. Its probably going to happen to Torres in a couple of years too. But when the shoe is on the other foot I expect the moral high ground brigade to have convieniently forgotten that we also do it when it suits us

 

Nail firmly hit on the head

[KevieG]

I would too but they haven't offered him a sniff of silverware or CL action in 10 years, bar the odd Cup run.

 

 

By that rationale you'd agree then that Gerrard and Torres should either head to Chelsea or United to get that elusive premiership gong?

Especially if the ownership debacle continues.

[GOLDMEMBER]

It does bring back Gerrard/Chelsea memories looking through some of there threads.

[RedinSweden]

"I really believe it's because they just want to prove the point that they can sign whoever they want now more than actually needing the player's skills."

 

Holy fuck.

[JMARKH]

Gerrard is a born and bread scouser tho, and a Liverpool fan so the Gerrard thing was different in my opinion, Barry was signed from Brighton I think and is not a brummie or Villa fan.

[coop]

The story of us putting an official bid for Barry was leaked by The Birmingham Echo not our side so i would be tempted that Aston Villa should look a little closer to home before giving us abuse.

 

Rafa did not bring this into the public as O'Neill decided to comment on it.

 

Its hard for us to say well if it was the other way round we would be pissed off because why the fuck would a player want to leave Liverpool to better himself at Aston Villa.

 

If Aston Villa were playing in the Champions League then Gareth Barry would not be leaving them but as it is they are not and are probably not going to be for quite some time so this is Gareth Barry last chance of actually playing in the competition with a team who since Rafa has taken over have as good a record as any in the tournament.

 

This situation is not like Gerrard to Chelsea because the only thing they have better then us is money.

 

Fans, history everything is not as good as Liverpool and whilst at Chelsea there is a good chance Gerrard would have won the Premier League by now by his own admission it wouldnt have felt right it not been with Liverpool.

 

If you worked in an offce if you had any motivation in you you would be striving for promotion within the company. This company however are not progressing and there is very little chance of you getting promotion but if another company come in and offered you more money and a higher job then what you currently have working in a world famous business you would be foolish to turn it down.

[KevieG]

Gerrard is a born and bread scouser tho, and a Liverpool fan so the Gerrard thing was different in my opinion, Barry was signed from Brighton I think and is not a brummie or Villa fan.

 

I think you're splitting hairs there. He's their club captain, been there for over 10 years and got his break there. He's about as homegrown as you can get these days.

[Bourbon]

By that rationale you'd agree then that Gerrard and Torres should either head to Chelsea or United to get that elusive premiership gong?

Especially if the ownership debacle continues.

 

No. I would argue that Gerrard and Torres have hugely enriched both their careers and club profiles and in Gerrard's case can understand his desperation in wanting to win us the league - I wouldn't begrudge him a move then.

 

The same clearly cannot be said of Gareth Barry and Villa.

 

Gerrard has won everything here bar the League and is revered by Liverpool fans for that - can Barry claim the same bond/pull/pursuit?

 

No. He's won fuck all with them in 10 years. Looking for a fresh challenge and a proven step up is very different.

 

In fact, fuck knows what Torres has got to do with it - he's been here a year. Nothing is yet elusive.

[GOLDMEMBER]

"I really believe it's because they just want to prove the point that they can sign whoever they want now more than actually needing the player's skills."

 

Holy fuck.

 

We'd sign Messi if that was true!

[Bourbon]

Coop, is that true about the Birmingham Echo leak - it was on their side?

 

How do we know?

[coop]

Pretty sure it was their Echo which carried the story first.

[GOLDMEMBER]

Pretty sure it was their Echo which carried the story first.

 

I think i remember reading something by Tony Barratt in the pink, that contact had been going on for weeks between the two clubs before the news was leaked. Can't be sure though.

[Bourbon]

Well God knows what MON's seeing his arse over the "leaking" for, then.

 

Having re-read Tony's piece and heard the O'Neill interviews on merseyside, they just didn't match - Rafa faxed over an exploratory combination £10m offer, knowing Barry would walk here and personally backed it up by phone to see where it goes and flesh out the players mentioned, sell them in etc.

 

He went ballistic, the soft twat.

 

He's desperate.

[coop]

This is a snippet from an interview Rafa did.

 

“We made an offer but I think we were straight,” he added.

 

“When you make an official offer you do so by fax. Some people see the fax and you cannot control everything.

 

“The Birmingham press found out about the offer and it was not our fault. They were very clever and used that information.

 

“I was talking with Martin O’Neill 20 days before that and nobody knew. We were doing things properly."

 

As you can see from that interview Rafa is clearly saying that Liverpool went through the proper channels and sent an official offer via fax.

 

Someone obviously within the Aston Villa camp witnessed the fax and decided to blab to the Birmingham press.

[GOLDMEMBER]

I think O'Neill is being quite clever, Make a big fuss so when Villa do accept the bid, Gareth Barry and Liverpool look the bad guys and Villa did all they could to keep hold of him.

[Bourbon]

Barrett consequently ran it up here and O'Neill blames Rafa for telling him!

 

Think he'll play ball when we come back next year for Ashley Young?!

[GOLDMEMBER]

I personally wouldnt go a peeny over 15 million, even thats pushing it.

[Bourbon]

I now think he over-reacted because he was embarrased to be found out contemplating both selling Barry, knowing full well he would go the whole £10m combined deal and that pushed him into defensive mode.

 

He's got to go through with it all now, acting the victim and diverting Villa's fans' frustration from him, the leak and the Club to Rafa and Gerrard.

 

I agree we could have done without the Gerrard quote but we don't know what context it was made in - if he was asked straight out what he tought about the Barry link and he said he was desperate for him to join if it were possible, what's the problem?

 

if he's rang up a snout and gone off his won back, then there's clearly a counter-strategy and that's all a bit Real - tit for tat.

 

We shouldn't have to, not over Gareth Barry but until the context is known, fuck knows.

[Malarkey]

I personally wouldnt go a peeny over 15 million, even thats pushing it.

 

I wouldn't go a penny either. :tease:

[Malarkey]

Well God knows what MON's seeing his arse over the "leaking" for, then.

 

Having re-read Tony's piece and heard the O'Neill interviews on merseyside, they just didn't match - Rafa faxed over an exploratory combination £10m offer, knowing Barry would walk here and personally backed it up by phone to see where it goes and flesh out the players mentioned, sell them in etc.

 

He went ballistic, the soft twat.

 

He's desperate.

 

Spot on.

[JMARKH]

I think you're splitting hairs there. He's their club captain, been there for over 10 years and got his break there. He's about as homegrown as you can get these days.

 

We have a degree of sucess tho over the last ten years and I think leaving Villa for Liverpool is more acceptable than leaving Liverpool for Chelsea, we are bigger and more successful than them clubs put together.

[Carra_is_legend]

Short memories lads, if this was happening the other way round, the very same people saying we have behaved ok here would be up in arms.

 

My take on it is that this is the way of football these days, loyalty to a club doesn't come into it. Its not right but morals don't come into modern day football, if you accept this, then this behaviour is the fine, its what bigger clubs do to smaller ones. Its probably going to happen to Torres in a couple of years too. But when the shoe is on the other foot I expect the moral high ground brigade to have convieniently forgotten that we also do it when it suits us

 

Loyalty has to be a both way thing but it isn't. Clubs sell players when they don't need them anymore - like we sold Dudek after he had won no. 5 for us, we sold Fowler, Utd selling Stam, Beckham, Horseface etc., Arsenal selling Overmars, Petit, Pires, Viera. All these players actually played a massive part for their clubs in winning major trophies.

 

Gerrard don't/didn't owe us anything. Neither does Barry. Neither will Torres when he leaves. Just like LFC doesn't owe Alonso anything when he moves to Juventus.

 

It is hardly fair to talk about "loyalty" just from a player's perspective when the club fucks the players off when it suits them.

[GOLDMEMBER]

I wouldn't go a penny either. :tease:

 

are yuo saying i cnat spel?:tease:

[KevieG]

No. I would argue that Gerrard and Torres have hugely enriched both their careers and club profiles and in Gerrard's case can understand his desperation in wanting to win us the league - I wouldn't begrudge him a move then.

 

The same clearly cannot be said of Gareth Barry and Villa.

 

Gerrard has won everything here bar the League and is revered by Liverpool fans for that - can Barry claim the same bond/pull/pursuit?

 

No. He's won fuck all with them in 10 years. Looking for a fresh challenge and a proven step up is very different.

 

In fact, fuck knows what Torres has got to do with it - he's been here a year. Nothing is yet elusive.

 

Enriching a career is a very subjective term and one which a lot of our fans have decided includes playing in the champions league but not winning league titles.

 

I'm going to leave it off now as from my point of view this is merely the way the modern game works, I have no problem with it, we are doing to Barry, what United did for Ferdinand and Saha and what Real are doing now. Everyone acts the cunt all the way up to Real Madrid who appear to sit at the top of the tree, its the circle of life.