A Few Thoughts from the Match: Leicester City 2 Liverpool 3

I am about to watch match of the day to confirm which one us is mental.

 

Mingolet had a shocker, is shit and now we can add coward to his CV.

 

Are you blind? 

Mignolet is doing a Hodgson on our fans expectations of goalkeepers.

Expectations are so low now any kind of half decent performance is now deemed acceptable. 

 

That would explain why he gets away with never winning us any points like the good goalkeepers in the league do but fuck me, the leicester game was as bad as he's ever been and there's plenty making excuses for the clown.

That would explain why he gets away with never winning us any points like the good goalkeepers in the league do but fuck me, the leicester game was as bad as he's ever been and there's plenty making excuses for the clown.

 

A way of judging how good / bad  a player is if we sold that player where would they end up ?

As an example if we sold Mane or Coutinho they would be going to Barca/Madrid. If we sold Mignolet he'd probably end up at Palace or Swansea.

A way of judging how good / bad  a player is if we sold that player where would they end up ?

As an example if we sold Mane or Coutinho they would be going to Barca/Madrid. If we sold Mignolet he'd probably end up at Palace or Swansea.

 

Doubt either would go for him too cause he's definitely not a huge upgrade on Hennessey and Fabianksi.

I think the more I read the forum the more I realise how little people actually watch and pay attention to other teams and players in the league. That and people come up with some absolutely mental shit because of the opinion they've already formed.

 

We are a one off case. Nobody else plays football like us and has the problems we do and everyone is trying to pigeonhole the problems. I've always felt like the defence and Mignolet isn't half as bad as people make out. Take this weekends game as an example. The majority of the game they were twatting it up the pitch and Lovren won pretty much every single header that come near him, Matip looked composed and Mignolet punched a shitload of crosses and actually caught a lot as well. He made some solid stops and saved a penalty. I then come one here and read he doesn't command his area and is a shit shot stopper anyway. I honestly wonder do people just erase the memory of him claiming and punching those numerous balls or am I just imagining them. Their second goal the guy is inside the box about 10/15 yards away from him and blasts a shot at him. It's his fault though because he should parrying that somewhere else. Honestly people are actually writing that down.

 

Like nearly every game we play though we have spells where everything goes to shit and we just can't help conceding. Mignolet was fouled on their first goal but I actually think he's making a mistake coming for that one anyway as there's too many players there. Whoever wins that ball is unlikely to get an unsavable header off. He also delayed clearing the ball once and smashed into Vardy I think. That suddenly means he's been shit with his kicking all game and delaying too much.

 

I personally don't think the penalty was a penalty and I actually don't think he's made a mistake going with his feet either. Vardy is rapid and plenty of keepers dive at the players feet to find he's nicked round them and bought the penalty. He's more likely to make contact with his foot and he does, in the same motion he kicks Vardy. The ball doesn't spill Vardy's way either.

 

Gomez was fairly solid all game and then went to shit in the last 15 or so minutes. Now because of those short spells everyone labels these players complete shite etc but in reality they aren't. They restrict the shots and chances on our goal considerably well. I think maybe this is what Klopps interpretation is. We obviously just have this problem with these spells in games and Klopp probably thinks whoever we bring in would have those spells as well as it down to something else than just the individual that causes the errors.

I think the more I read the forum the more I realise how little people actually watch and pay attention to other teams and players in the league. That and people come up with some absolutely mental shit because of the opinion they've already formed.

 

We are a one off case. Nobody else plays football like us and has the problems we do and everyone is trying to pigeonhole the problems. I've always felt like the defence and Mignolet isn't half as bad as people make out. Take this weekends game as an example. The majority of the game they were twatting it up the pitch and Lovren won pretty much every single header that come near him, Matip looked composed and Mignolet punched a shitload of crosses and actually caught a lot as well. He made some solid stops and saved a penalty. I then come one here and read he doesn't command his area and is a shit shot stopper anyway. I honestly wonder do people just erase the memory of him claiming and punching those numerous balls or am I just imagining them. Their second goal the guy is inside the box about 10/15 yards away from him and blasts a shot at him. It's his fault though because he should parrying that somewhere else. Honestly people are actually writing that down.

 

Like nearly every game we play though we have spells where everything goes to shit and we just can't help conceding. Mignolet was fouled on their first goal but I actually think he's making a mistake coming for that one anyway as there's too many players there. Whoever wins that ball is unlikely to get an unsavable header off. He also delayed clearing the ball once and smashed into Vardy I think. That suddenly means he's been shit with his kicking all game and delaying too much.

 

I personally don't think the penalty was a penalty and I actually don't think he's made a mistake going with his feet either. Vardy is rapid and plenty of keepers dive at the players feet to find he's nicked round them and bought the penalty. He's more likely to make contact with his foot and he does, in the same motion he kicks Vardy. The ball doesn't spill Vardy's way either.

 

Gomez was fairly solid all game and then went to shit in the last 15 or so minutes. Now because of those short spells everyone labels these players complete shite etc but in reality they aren't. They restrict the shots and chances on our goal considerably well. I think maybe this is what Klopps interpretation is. We obviously just have this problem with these spells in games and Klopp probably thinks whoever we bring in would have those spells as well as it down to something else than just the individual that causes the errors.

 

Totally agree.

I think the more I read the forum the more I realise how little people actually watch and pay attention to other teams and players in the league. That and people come up with some absolutely mental shit because of the opinion they've already formed.

We are a one off case. Nobody else plays football like us and has the problems we do and everyone is trying to pigeonhole the problems. I've always felt like the defence and Mignolet isn't half as bad as people make out. Take this weekends game as an example. The majority of the game they were twatting it up the pitch and Lovren won pretty much every single header that come near him, Matip looked composed and Mignolet punched a shitload of crosses and actually caught a lot as well. He made some solid stops and saved a penalty. I then come one here and read he doesn't command his area and is a shit shot stopper anyway. I honestly wonder do people just erase the memory of him claiming and punching those numerous balls or am I just imagining them. Their second goal the guy is inside the box about 10/15 yards away from him and blasts a shot at him. It's his fault though because he should parrying that somewhere else. Honestly people are actually writing that down.

Like nearly every game we play though we have spells where everything goes to shit and we just can't help conceding. Mignolet was fouled on their first goal but I actually think he's making a mistake coming for that one anyway as there's too many players there. Whoever wins that ball is unlikely to get an unsavable header off. He also delayed clearing the ball once and smashed into Vardy I think. That suddenly means he's been shit with his kicking all game and delaying too much.

I personally don't think the penalty was a penalty and I actually don't think he's made a mistake going with his feet either. Vardy is rapid and plenty of keepers dive at the players feet to find he's nicked round them and bought the penalty. He's more likely to make contact with his foot and he does, in the same motion he kicks Vardy. The ball doesn't spill Vardy's way either.

Gomez was fairly solid all game and then went to shit in the last 15 or so minutes. Now because of those short spells everyone labels these players complete shite etc but in reality they aren't. They restrict the shots and chances on our goal considerably well. I think maybe this is what Klopps interpretation is. We obviously just have this problem with these spells in games and Klopp probably thinks whoever we bring in would have those spells as well as it down to something else than just the individual that causes the errors.

How many mistakes do you think is acceptable for a goal keeper or defender to make before their performance is deemed inadequate? It isn't up for debate that he was at fault for the Okazki chance in the first half, a fucking easy chance at that. Some how a sizable number think the penalty wasn't his fault, it was 100% on him, he should have been there quicker and used his hands like a proper goal keeper.

How many mistakes do you think is acceptable for a goal keeper or defender to make before their performance is deemed inadequate? It isn't up for debate that he was at fault for the Okazki chance in the first half, a fucking easy chance at that. Some how a sizable number think the penalty wasn't his fault, it was 100% on him, he should have been there quicker and used his hands like a proper goal keeper.

 

And risked sliding out of the area? 

 

He did nothing wrong there. But, as some have said - maybe because he has a reputation for mistakes the ref gave the pen. 

 

But that isn't Guests point - he is pointing out the habit of confirmation bias by a fair and sizable number of our fans. 

4. I’m now all in on Team Mig. He’s never going to be a true great, but the lad is now a very good keeper with no real weaknesses in my view. He was ripped off for the pen but saved it anyway, dealt with all kinds of aerial bombs and his kicking has improved exponentially. People throwing mud his way now are not watching what’s in front their eyes in my opinion. 

 

 

I broadly agree with Paul on most things, but this is so far wide of the mark in my view. Like a real Rosenthal missing an open goal style point. 

I think the more I read the forum the more I realise how little people actually watch and pay attention to other teams and players in the league. That and people come up with some absolutely mental shit because of the opinion they've already formed.

 

 

This is something called "confirmation bias".

And risked sliding out of the area? 

 

He did nothing wrong there. But, as some have said - maybe because he has a reputation for mistakes the ref gave the pen. 

 

But that isn't Guests point - he is pointing out the habit of confirmation bias by a fair and sizable number of our fans. 

 

Sliding out the area giving the wet pitch and where the incident was is a good shout.

How many mistakes do you think is acceptable for a goal keeper or defender to make before their performance is deemed inadequate? It isn't up for debate that he was at fault for the Okazki chance in the first half, a fucking easy chance at that. Some how a sizable number think the penalty wasn't his fault, it was 100% on him, he should have been there quicker and used his hands like a proper goal keeper.

It's difficult to say how many mistakes is acceptable because of a number of variables. If a player/keeper is put in a difficult situation a lot of times they will no doubt end up making more mistakes than somebody not put in that situation as many times. Don't get me wrong I think we can upgrade on Mignolet but there aren't many guarantees. He's not as bad as people make out.

 

As jockey said though the point I was making was that keepers and players make mistakes all the time yet a lot of the people whinging about it appear to not watch other teams. The keepers ranked higher than Mignolet make mistakes that he would be crucified for. It's got to the point with Mignolet now that he takes the blame for everything. There's always a number of fans who will try to find a way of apportioning every goal to him and ignoring the various good things he does throughout the game. It's confirmation bias.

You don't have to be his 'biggest' fan to agree that the first goal was a foul. End of discussion - it wasn't his fault. Any objective reading of the first goal would acknowledge that. Same with the penalty he got the ball - he's sliding and got there first that is his job, and he did well. It wasn't a penalty. Just as some newspaper reports don't even mention the foul by Okozaki for the first goal (independant). It is shitty reporting like that - re-enforcing the stereotype, which I think influenced Taylors decision for the penalty 'that clown again - must be a pen'! 

 

And I am not a fan and think we should be getting a better keeper in. But, Klopp wants Karius to make it, so it really isn't worth point out who bad Mig is. 

It's difficult to say how many mistakes is acceptable because of a number of variables. If a player/keeper is put in a difficult situation a lot of times they will no doubt end up making more mistakes than somebody not put in that situation as many times. Don't get me wrong I think we can upgrade on Mignolet but there aren't many guarantees. He's not as bad as people make out.

As jockey said though the point I was making was that keepers and players make mistakes all the time yet a lot of the people whinging about it appear to not watch other teams. The keepers ranked higher than Mignolet make mistakes that he would be crucified for. It's got to the point with Mignolet now that he takes the blame for everything. There's always a number of fans who will try to find a way of apportioning every goal to him and ignoring the various good things he does throughout the game. It's confirmation bias.

I don't doubt for a second that confirmation bias is live and well, I know I'm guilty of it myself with Emre Can.

 

With regards our keeper and his performance on Saturday I had to double check what I was seeing. During the match I saw a keeper open the door and invite Leicester into a match they had no business being part of. When I went online afterwards I couldn't believe the internet wasn't on fire. A couple of sites I visit were praising his performance, that's why I logged on here. I expected to be able to share the rage at another awful display, the worst bit being his cowardly behavior for the penalty. I honestly can't believe anyone thinks that wasn't a bog standard collection with his hands.

 

His hesitation for the Okazki chance got the crowd involved and offered encouragement to a team who's only thoughts should have been about avoiding an embarrassing scoreline. He spread panic among our team and support, all of it totally avoidable. He does this shit all the time, something stupid to offer hope and remind everyone this Liverpool team gives up goals.

 

He should be binned, when he is it will be mid table Italian clubs looking for loan agreements, serious clubs won't want to know.

Mignolet was terrible. Even giving him the benefit that he was fouled for the first goal it was a cross he was getting nowhere near,and just to compound that if Leicester hadn't have scored that first Mig would have been red carded for trying to rugby tackle Okazaki before the ball crossed the line into the net. The penalty was caused by him not going for the ball with his hands even though it was in the penalty area. The penalty was awful by Vardy and I'd have been disappointed if any PL GK hadn't saved that. The second goal wasn't all Mignolet's fault but he did display very weak wrists when pushing the shot away,he'd never be expected to catch it,thats unfair,but he did push it into a more dangerous area than if he'd have pushed it straight back out. The fact that we are still discussing him 4 or 5 seasons into his time here says everything about his lack of ability. Surprisingly I'd have to say that our defence as a whole wasn't that bad,not great but not particularly bad.

And risked sliding out of the area? 

 

He did nothing wrong there. But, as some have said - maybe because he has a reputation for mistakes the ref gave the pen. 

 

But that isn't Guests point - he is pointing out the habit of confirmation bias by a fair and sizable number of our fans. 

 

Confirmation bias works both ways.  There is an element of truth in the criticisms.  Pretending otherwise is just as much confirmation bias as the hyperbolic BS. 

 

Taking polarized positions on stuff will do that to you!

I don't doubt for a second that confirmation bias is live and well, I know I'm guilty of it myself with Emre Can.

 

With regards our keeper and his performance on Saturday I had to double check what I was seeing. During the match I saw a keeper open the door and invite Leicester into a match they had no business being part of. When I went online afterwards I couldn't believe the internet wasn't on fire. A couple of sites I visit were praising his performance, that's why I logged on here. I expected to be able to share the rage at another awful display, the worst bit being his cowardly behavior for the penalty. I honestly can't believe anyone thinks that wasn't a bog standard collection with his hands.

 

His hesitation for the Okazki chance got the crowd involved and offered encouragement to a team who's only thoughts should have been about avoiding an embarrassing scoreline. He spread panic among our team and support, all of it totally avoidable. He does this shit all the time, something stupid to offer hope and remind everyone this Liverpool team gives up goals.

 

He should be binned, when he is it will be mid table Italian clubs looking for loan agreements, serious clubs won't want to know.

Repped for Can confirmation bias.  We're similarly afflicted.

Canfirmation biasers gonna bias.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soccer/english-soccer/ken-early-strong-case-for-the-defence-of-jurgen-klopp-s-vision-1.3232398?mode=amp

 

I quite enjoyed this. Some interesting points that may be right.

Confirmation bias works both ways.  There is an element of truth in the criticisms.  Pretending otherwise is just as much confirmation bias as the hyperbolic BS. 

 

Taking polarized positions on stuff will do that to you!

 

I think you'll find confirmation bias is just something other people do.

I broadly agree with Paul on most things, but this is so far wide of the mark in my view. Like a real Rosenthal missing an open goal style point.

Reading back, I realise I didn’t make my precise position clear. I stand by everything I wrote at the time (which was knocked together not long after the game without any re-viewing of any incidents) with one proviso: he has my support while he’s our number one keeper. To suggest there aren’t better keepers around would be laughable (hence my “never great” comment). I also don’t see anyone else currently here supplanting him and so he has my support.

 

I think he’s a generally very good keeper who plays in a side that offers little protection. In that context, it’s very hard to be top notch because he’s dealing with so much inconsistency around him.

 

However, I think every aspect of his game is now at least good. His issue is this team needs someone great - but that’s not his fault; it’s Klopp's. I’m not sure Klopp is interested in changing things either.

 

However, now we’re starting to spend big money, I would go all out for someone like the Atleti fella. I don’t think Klopp will though and so getting on Mignolet’s back for issues that are rarely his fault is just self-defeating.

 

That more nuanced view doesn’t lend itself to “A Few Thoughts...” though. And anyway, it got people talking, both on here and on Twitter, so job done for Dave.

Repped for Can confirmation bias.  We're similarly afflicted.

I fear we maybe on different sides of the fence. I think the sun shines out of his hole.

I fear we maybe on different sides of the fence. I think the sun shines out of his hole.

My mortal enemy! fume...

Reading back, I realise I didn’t make my precise position clear. I stand by everything I wrote at the time (which was knocked together not long after the game without any re-viewing of any incidents) with one proviso: he has my support while he’s our number one keeper. To suggest there aren’t better keepers around would be laughable (hence my “never great” comment). I also don’t see anyone else currently here supplanting him and so he has my support.

 

I think he’s a generally very good keeper who plays in a side that offers little protection. In that context, it’s very hard to be top notch because he’s dealing with so much inconsistency around him.

 

However, I think every aspect of his game is now at least good. His issue is this team needs someone great - but that’s not his fault; it’s Klopp's. I’m not sure Klopp is interested in changing things either.

 

However, now we’re starting to spend big money, I would go all out for someone like the Atleti fella. I don’t think Klopp will though and so getting on Mignolet’s back for issues that are rarely his fault is just self-defeating.

 

That more nuanced view doesn’t lend itself to “A Few Thoughts...” though. And anyway, it got people talking, both on here and on Twitter, so job done for Dave.

 

 

Fair enough that, Paul. I used to stick up for Migs (even though I didn't want him and wanted - fuck, still want - Begovic), but the lack of command, voice, authority, strength, positioning, handling, etc, just isn't made up for by occasional very good saves. The way I look at it, we've got a very serious problem with our spine. We need players running through the middle. He, along with a CB and a CM would go a really, really long way into turning us into title contenders.

Struggling to understand this point about confirmation bias when the stuff people are generally moaning about has been consistently happening for a few years now!