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Arsenal 3 Liverpool 4 (Aug 14 2016)


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Dave Usher
 
 
 

Welcome back football. Bloody hell, that was some way to kick things off. Prior to this fixture I felt like this season was going to be a trip into the complete unknown. I had no real idea how it was going to go, as there are just too many variables and too much uncertainty. There’s a chance we could be really, really, good, but there’s an even greater chance we won’t be. After this game I’m even more uncertain, but it feels good to have gotten off to a winning start, and even better that it was Arsenal we turned over.

 

We’re a team capable of playing anybody off the park and completely embarrassing some really good sides. We knew this already, so from that perspective this wasn't too surprising. We’re also a team that can capitulate under the slightest bit of pressure and give away stupid goals. We saw both sides of Liverpool in this game, but the fact we held on for the win - and did so without any real problems in the final ten minutes - is hopefully an encouraging sign for what’s to come.

 

Klopp’s team selection wasn’t too surprising but Emre Can missing out was somewhat unexpected, while Origi can feel a little aggrieved at not getting the start. There’s real competition for places all over the park now (except at both full back spots) and I’d suggest that the squad ‘depth’ might be the best we’ve ever had. The starting line up isn’t the best, not even close, but the drop off from starter to replacement is probably as small as it’s ever been. Part of that is because there aren’t any genuinely world class starters, just lots of good, and in some cases very good, players, while the back ups are of a similar standard.

 

That was in evidence looking at the bench and even players who didn’t make the 18 for this. A lot of them are arguably at the same level as most of the starters (Sturridge, Milner, Ings, Sakho etc), which makes picking the team difficult. I’m not sure whether this is a good thing or a bad thing, I suppose it will only become clear when we see how these players perform over the course of the season. We know what they can do on a good day, but we also know that there are far too many bad days with them. What they did here showed both how strong and how weak they can be. 

 

We started poorly and everyone’s worst fears about ‘Albert the Moron’ beginning the season as first choice left back proved to be justified as he delivered a car crash performance in the opening 45 minutes. In fact, he picked up exactly where he left off in his last competitive game in the Europa League Final. He was erratic from the start, making silly, unorthodox looking challenges, some of which he got away with and others he didn’t. His poor header almost set up a goal for Ramsay but the Welshman miscontrolled and Moreno was able to get back and make a challenge. A wild looking challenge, but one which won the ball.

 

Soon after he wasn’t so fortunate, as another wild lunge saw him bring down Walcott for a penalty. He got a slight touch on the ball, but even had the referee seen that he’d have been within his rights to give a spot kick for it anyway. Mignolet made a fine save (in fairness he’s improved massively on pens over the last year) to get Moreno off the hook but it wasn’t long before he cost us again, and this time Walcott made no mistake.

 

It might be a little unfair pinning Arsenal’s first goal on Moreno, but his role it wasn’t a minor one. When Walcott went through I’m sure the first thing everyone thought was “where’s that fucking dickhead left back?”. He got caught miles out of position but without knowing what his specific instructions are for when we have the chance to counter attack, it’s perhaps harsh to blame him for it. He initially won the ball which gave us a chance to break quickly, which is something that is very effective against Arsenal as they’re vulnerable as fuck to counter attacks. 

 

So having won the ball he got on his bike and started to sprint upfield. The problem was that Lallana quickly got caught in possession, and Moreno was left stranded. Perhaps he should have held his position for a few seconds longer, I don’t know. That’s up to Klopp really, as maybe he wants Moreno to use his pace to break into the space left behind when Arsenal attack? What counts against Moreno is this happens to him regularly, yet it never happens to Clyne on the other side? Why is that? Presumably because Clyne waits a few seconds to ensure we’ve got good possession before he vacates his post?

 

I don’t generally need a second invitation to pile into Moreno but on this one particular incident I’m holding fire I think, as if Lallana hadn’t been so easily dispossessed maybe Moreno would have ended up being clean through on goal. He gambled and lost, but maybe Klopp wants him to gamble? There was more than enough other stuff in that half to pin on him, but I have a hard time blaming him personally when all he’s doing is what he always does, and what everyone - except Klopp it seems - has come to expect from him. 

 

Was any of this even remotely surprising to you? No, it was utterly predictable. Criticising Moreno for defending haplessly and making rash decisions is like blaming the shark for attacking the surfer. He can’t help it, it’s in his nature. I’d always blame the surfer for putting himself in that situation, and I’m blaming Klopp for the same reason.

 

In fact, every time Moreno fucks up this season I’m going to blame Klopp for it as this is all on him. Last year he had no choice, he had to make do with what he had. Now there’s no excuse. When last season ended virtually everybody I know would have said that replacing the left back was our number one, or at worst number two, priority this close season. 

 

Seven new players have arrived so far but no new left back. In fact, we sold the only other left back we have (who wasn’t good enough either, but it rubbed salt on the open sore). There’s still time for Klopp to right this wrong, but it’s pretty fucked up that we’ve got to this point with Moreno still in the team. It's negligence, there's no other way to describe it.

 

The disappointing first half display wasn’t just down to Moreno though as none of the attackers or midfielders bar Mané were doing anything of note at the other end. Mané was bright and positive and tried to take the game to Arsenal whenever he could, but aside from him and the overlapping Clyne, it was pretty ineffective. 

 

Everything changed with that one glorious strike from Coutinho though. As usual, I’d been bitching about the “little Magician” doing his disappearing act, and as usual he made me eat my words by producing something wonderful completely out of nowhere. That free-kick was inch perfect and it completely turned the game on it’s head.

 

We went in at the break level despite having played poorly (not that Arsenal were much better though) and whatever Klopp said at half time certainly did the trick as we came out flying. The football in that opening 15-20 minutes of the second half was breathtaking. Dare I say not too dissimilar to the opening 20 minutes of the 5-1 a couple of years ago? And the goals were glorious. All of them.

 

First, some lovely play around the box saw Coutinho free the previously poor Wijnaldum, who picked out the previously poor Lallana to calmly take the ball on his chest and then roll it under Cech. It’s interesting to see Lallana getting the nod in a midfield three rather than in the forward line. I don’t know if he’ll hold down a place long term in that position but if he did it would negate his biggest weakness (not enough goals) and could make him a very useful asset. If he still chips in with his seven or eight a season from that deeper position (and this was a good start) that would utterly transform how he is perceived. It’s very early days though and my gut feeling is he'll be on the bench soon.

 

Next a move that felt like it included about 50 passes ended with Clyne racing to the byline and fizzing a brilliant ball in for Coutinho to beat Cech from close range. He almost bagged a hat-trick soon after too after brilliant play from Firmino set him up, but Cech saved and Lallana was a split second away from converting the rebound but was beaten to it by Bellerin.

 

The fourth goal wasn’t long in coming though, as Mané picked the ball up on the touchline and just turned on the afterburners to beat two defenders and then fire an arrow like shot into the top corner. That was just breath taking. The run, the control, the strength, the composure, the technique. Just stunning. 

 

Klopp got involved in the celebrations and then chastised himself for it after the game, but who can blame him for getting caught up in that moment? It wasn’t all over but it should have been and the good thing is we got away with it and lessons will have been learned.

 

When you go 4-1 up like that the one thing you need to do is go 10 minutes or so without conceding. If you do that the other team will generally give up and you can either close it on or put your foot on their throat and get more goals. We let them score straight away which quelled the revolt in the stands and kept Arsenal’s players’ spirits up.

 

It was a bad goal to give away, just really sloppy. Clyne and Lallana got caught out by Oxlade-Chamberlain and then Mignolet was beaten by a shot he had easily covered until it flicked up off Lovren’s foot and left him helpless. Maybe a keeper with super human reflexes, like De Gea or Lloris maybe, flicks up a hand and saves it, but I can’t criticise Mignolet for that.

 

I thought he may have done a little better with the third though. Not to the point where I’d put the blame on him for it, but he got close to it and seemed to be a fraction slow in getting down. Again, someone like De Gea saves that I reckon. Whether Karius would have is the real issue though isn’t it, and at this point we don’t know.

 

For all the talk about us not being able to defend corners we seem to have far more difficulty with free kicks from out wide. We’ve given away several goals like this and always look in danger. When the ball is as good as Cazorla’s and you’ve got loads of players running in, it’s a nightmare for keepers. I’ve often wondered why the defenders don’t rush out and play offside just as the ball is played, or at the very least just hold the 18 yard line and not run towards their own goal. 

 

We were in danger of blowing it and Arsenal had their tails up, but in fairness we never really even came close to letting another one in. The players regrouped, defended well and saw it out in a composed manner. That’s progress I guess. It would have been better if we’d actually managed to put together a counter attack or two to kill them off, but at least we shut them down.

 

All in all there’s a lot more positive than negative to come out of this, but it’s probably a good thing that there are in fact some negatives because it’s stops us getting too full of ourselves. Imagine if at 4-1 we’d gone on and added another couple? Fucking hell, there’d be no living with us, we’d all be running off and lashing bets on us winning the title and then it would all come crashing down when we inevitably lose 1-0 to Burnley next week.

 

Almost blowing it is a good thing as it shows there’s still a lot of work to be done. We’ve got some wrinkles that need ironing out but it certainly looks like we’ve got a lot of firepower now and it’s hard not be excited about Mané and what he might do.

 

Ultimately though, it’s not going to be games against Arsenal, City and the rest that determine where we finish. It’s whether we can avoid fucking up against the likes of Hull, Burnley, Watford and West Brom that will be be the difference between a season like 2013/14 and most of the shit that happened before and since. 

 

Star man is Coutinho but Mané ran him very close. Klavan had a solid debut and everyone was much improved in the second half, even Moreno who to his credit didn’t do anything stupid after the break. In fact, we barely saw him at all, which was a little strange as I would have expected Arsenal to target him at every opportunity. Instead most of their attacks came down the other side and they left soft lad alone, so cheers for that, Arsene. 

 

Somehow I doubt other teams will be so generous though, so for the love of all that’s good and pure Kloppo, sign a fucking left back will you?

 

 

Team: Mignolet; Clyne, Lovren, Klavan, Moreno; Henderson, Lallana (Origi), Wijnaldum (Stewart); Mané, Firmino, Coutinho (Origi):


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I hated Rush for a good while towards the end of his career.

 

Actually I never really liked him and it's only in recent years I've appreciated how great he was.

This is worse than some of the stuff posted on the GF breakfast thread.

 

Fuck me.

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That thing Roy Evans had about keeping or bringing in older players like rush and riedle, that was a step away from Paisley 'don't let their legs go on your pitch'

 

How well did that work for us? Rush schooled fowler and he won a couple of league cups, fa cup and uefa cup. Think he won young player of the year as well. Owen schooled briefly by riedle won a couple of league cups, fa cup and uefa cup plus European footballer of the year. Did he win any domestic player awards? Was he spoty?

 

His joint manager, Houllier brought in mcallister probably with an eye on him helping Gerrard. Stevie won 3 league cups, 2 fa cups, uefa and champions league as well player of the year and young player of the year.

 

This schooling has brought the club lots of cup success and the players individual achievements but no leagues. Unfortunately we have no one coming through the ranks with an ounce of the talent of these 3 to look at doing it a different way or was this something we did before? Was callaghan kept on to school heighway or did we get rid of everyone as soon as they started going down hill?

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Probably cos we stopped winning and he was older and not as good and the ball bounced off him for cantonas goal in 96. Didn't appreciate how important he was when we were winning everything. Totally took him for granted.

Negged.

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I never said I liked Moreno.

 

Hating rush is probably a bit like United fans hating Rooney now. He's won everything. He's top goal scorer but he's not the player he was and the memories of cup final wins over Everton are clouded by some God awful performances at the end of his career when we also went from winning everything to winning nothing. I preferred stylish creative players like Kenny who made the goals and as I said it's only in recent years I ve truly realised how great rush was. Will we see anyone beat his goal scoring record in our life times?

Negged.

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A plague of locusts be upon thee, may the extra terrible shithouse ebolaids infest your underpants and bugger up your shit Mr Spaco Molesteran.

 

Hate Ian Rush ???

 

I'm going to sleep and hope I never again wake up in a world inhabited by such unGodly insanity.

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That thing Roy Evans had about keeping or bringing in older players like rush and riedle, that was a step away from Paisley 'don't let their legs go on your pitch'

 

How well did that work for us? Rush schooled fowler and he won a couple of league cups, fa cup and uefa cup. Think he won young player of the year as well. Owen schooled briefly by riedle won a couple of league cups, fa cup and uefa cup plus European footballer of the year. Did he win any domestic player awards? Was he spoty?

 

His joint manager, Houllier brought in mcallister probably with an eye on him helping Gerrard. Stevie won 3 league cups, 2 fa cups, uefa and champions league as well player of the year and young player of the year.

 

This schooling has brought the club lots of cup success and the players individual achievements but no leagues. Unfortunately we have no one coming through the ranks with an ounce of the talent of these 3 to look at doing it a different way or was this something we did before? Was callaghan kept on to school heighway or did we get rid of everyone as soon as they started going down hill?

He was our Morientes of the 90s I suppose but he was more of a team player, and as you say, was a crucial mentor for Fowler.
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He was our Morientes of the 90s I suppose but he was more of a team player, and as you say, was a crucial mentor for Fowler.

Yes but was it of the greatest benefit to us that these players who's legs were going or gone were kept on as mentors and players rather than bringing in competition for the players like fowler?

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A plague of locusts be upon thee, may the extra terrible shithouse ebolaids infest your underpants and bugger up your shit Mr Spaco Molesteran.

 

Hate Ian Rush ???

 

I'm going to sleep and hope I never again wake up in a world inhabited by such unGodly insanity.

Come on, if this place had ve been around he'd have got the same treatment from plenty that Kenny Stevie Rafa and Carra got. Don't kid yourself.

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LFChistory.net @LFChistory

A little known Welshman joined #LFC from 3rd div Chester on 18 August 1980. He scored 346 goals in 660 matches!!

10:23 AM - 18 Aug 2016

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h

 

How did you feel about him when United were winning the double in 96? Be truthful.

honestly that he was one of the least of the problems we had with that team. best to stop digging a hole mate take your negging like a man.

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Personally, Rush has always been a massive hero of mine, I remember being absolutely devastated when he joined Juventus, getting into fights with my brother over it and everything.

 

Just born to score goals, his movement in the box was legendary. Helps that he was a top bloke.

 

Can't understand any red disliking Rush, at any stage of his Liverpool career, let alone hating him.

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Yes but was it of the greatest benefit to us that these players who's legs were going or gone were kept on as mentors and players rather than bringing in competition for the players like fowler?

I didn't do him justice and he scored many more than I thought. Leaving out the 91-92 season when he was injured, here's his record in the 90s:

 

1990-91 - 26 goals

1992-93 - 22 goals

1993-94 - 19 goals

1994-95 - 19 goals

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Same way United fans hate Rooney and wonder why he's still there.

The United fans who hate Rooney are twats in my opinion. You can think it's perhaps time for a player to move on while at the same respecting what he's done for the club, you can be decent about it and 'hate' is such a strong word.

 

They're wrong for 'hating' Rooney (if there are any, I know quite a few, none of whom 'hate' Rooney) and you were wrong for 'hating' Rush at the time.

 

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The United fans who hate Rooney are twats in my opinion. You can think it's perhaps time for a player to move on while at the same respecting what he's done for the club, you can be decent about it and 'hate' is such a strong word.They're wrong for 'hating' Rooney (if there are any, I know quite a few, none of whom 'hate' Rooney) and you were wrong for 'hating' Rush at the time.

Next time United lose tune in to any football phone in.

 

It's a different time now but the sentiments are the same.

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