Red Sun Rising

from the Torygraph.... As Saglam was apologising and leaving, Liverpool fans were disappearing into the night, chattering excitedly about the penalty-box feats of Benayoun, Crouch, Babel and Gerrard. Back inside Anfield, it was little surprise to see Liverpool's chief executive, Rick Parry, chatting intently to Mascherano's "owner", Kia Joorabchian. Having paid a fee of £1.5 million for an 18-month rental period of Mascherano, Liverpool will need to pay Joorabchian £17 million to make the deal permanent. The little Argentinian was magnificent, patrolling in front of the back-four, nicking the ball off enemy feet and sliding short passes left, right and centre. With Mascherano dictating the tempo, the "wall of noise" predicted by Gerrard soon emerged from 10,000 throats on the Kop. MOM for me!

Which team? The one that started, the one that finished? We used 14 players, he can only pick 11!

Perhaps that is part of the problem. I have a hunch that Pako was good kop to rafa's bad cop. Just a thought - Sammy Lee for the #2 job?

Henry Winter has a go at Fantasy Rafa: Jamie Carragher and particularly Sami Hyypia will need the protection of Javier Mascherano in front of them. Mascherano may be partnered by Xabi Alonso, now fit following metatarsal trouble, with Gerrard breaking forward in support of Dirk Kuyt. Ryan Babel and Jermaine Pennant are expected to provide the width while restraining Besiktas' attacking full-backs.

Crouch must heed Cissé's lesson to prevent his own Anfield departure Andy Hunter Wednesday October 3, 2007 The Guardian History suggests there is no way back for a player who falls from grace with Rafael Benítez and the consequences of crossing the Liverpool manager should be apparent to Peter Crouch at Anfield tonight in the shape of the man wearing the No9 jersey for Marseille. Djibril Cissé's return to Merseyside for the first time since joining the French side last summer after a loan period at the Stade Vélodrome, along with his former Anfield team-mate Boudewijn Zenden, illustrates not only the professionalism of Benítez, who has introduced new signals for his team at set pieces to confuse their former colleagues, but his ruthlessness too. Though hindered in his Anfield career by a horrendous double leg fracture at Blackburn, from which he recovered to feature in Liverpool's Champions League and FA Cup triumphs under Benítez, it is fair to say Cissé was never one of the Spaniard's trusted charges. The French international arrived at Liverpool in the same close season as Benítez but only as the delayed product of a £14m transfer from Auxerre agreed by the former manager, Gérard Houllier, the previous summer. Benítez had no hesitation in accepting Marseille's offer for the 26-year-old. The Liverpool manager frequently played Cissé on the wing or not at all and the player's difficulties in accepting rotation - that old chestnut - led to frustration being aired in public and private. Benítez now finds himself in a similar situation with Crouch, who was omitted from the Liverpool squad for the fourth time in seven Premier League matches at Wigan and has also struggled to handle a bit-part role. Ultimately it will take one man to change for the England international to rediscover the form that made him Liverpool's leading scorer last season and to prevent a parting of the ways. That man will not be Benítez. "At Wigan [Yossi] Benayoun showed if you work hard and you are ready then you will get your chance and I think Crouch is learning," said the Liverpool manager, who has been irked by reports of the striker's disappointment. "In a top side players must prove they have character, quality and a very good mentality. That is a winning mentality to fight for your position and to show you are good enough on the pitch. If you are not ready you cannot say it was because you have not been playing. I don't want excuses." Eric Gerets' recent appointment as Marseille's manager and a fixtureless weekend has disturbed Benítez's analysis of tonight's opponents. However, mindful of Crouch's outstanding performance and two goals against Gerets' Galatasaray in last season's group phase, the manager is considering a place for the £7m forward. "I know he is frustrated because players want to play every game," said Benítez, who is without the suspended Jermaine Pennant. "But he has been training really well and he must be ready. I think he knows." Sami Hyypia will continue to deputise at the heart of defence for Daniel Agger, who has a broken metatarsal.

by your own account it's tantamount to murder... "but i hate them manc cunts so much id rather slit her throat than them win it again thats how strong i feel"

The best bit for me...."Ive even been arguing with my girlfreind who is a manc"

"I don't need Torres for playing Birmingham if I have Dirk Kuyt, Andriy Voronin and Peter Crouch," he said. I have a certain amount of sympathy for Rafa's point here - we should be beating Bham with or without Torres.

'And then she cut her hair and I stopped loving her.'

It's an emotive issue, hence some of the more exrtreme vitriol heading Bascobme's way. However I agree with you, I don't buy the Sun & never will but I can see that the NOTW isn't the same paper. That being said, I'll never by the NOTW either becuase it's a nasty scandal mongering piece of nationlistic crap that aims for the lowest common denominator everytime. If anything I'm dissapointed for Bascombe that he's stooped so low, I think he has more talent than that. If he thinks he will be part of a revolution from within I think he's about to be very dispointed. But, his life, hope he proves me wrong.

There is logic to Rafa's youth recruitment drive.... New Uefa regulations stipulate at least three members of a side's Champions League squad must be "association-trained players", who are affiliated to the domestic national association, and a further three "club-trained players", who have been registered with their club for three years between the ages of 15 and 21. Chelsea, however, only have one player who meets the latter criteria - captain John Terry - and thus had to leave two places open.

Legends have gotta retire or at least talk about it...(Carra's status pretty assured)

This is a business not fantasy manger wank fest. Clubs buy who they need, conditional on if they'll sign, with due consideration to the balannce sheet; the alternative is called Leeds.

That's very unfair ^ there was some real crap wearing blue & white.

something I posted in the match thread...better off here: I hope Sami stays with us until he retires, testimonial and all that thown in. I'd be very dissapointed if he/we did a Didi and he went to some other Prem side to see out his time. Robbie aside, Sami is the closest thing we've had to a legend (in the proper sense of the word) in the last 10 years.

They let you read the accounts?

Absolute bollocks!

Damn right a "thank you" is in order, they are lucky to have us, could have been West Ham or Villa or City! I'd expect a little more gratitude. Americans, no humility!

and this bit... "they sidestepped the sort of qualifying-round stumbles of which they have been guilty in recent years to record their fourth victory in five games this season" I'll admit we've made hard work of it last couple of years but surely we'd have to fail to qualify to be guilty of a stumble.

Oh him, utter wanker!

I like him, seems to be a card carrying member of the Rafalution!

Is Ole Gunnar Solskjaer the superest sub ever? Rob Smyth and Paolo Bandini Wednesday August 29, 2007 Guardian Unlimited Solskjaer: scored 29 of his 126 United goals from the bench. "In terms of goals scored, is Ole Gunnar Solskjaer the best substitute in English football history?" asks Peter Brown. He's certainly the best in Premiership history. (What do you mean football didn't begin in 1992? Pass the muesli.) Solskjaer has scored 17 league goals after coming off the bench, which puts him comfortably clear of Jermain Defoe, Kanu, Andy Cole and Tore Andre Flo, each of whom have 13. In all competitions, Solskjaer scored 29 of his 126 United goals from the bench. His first goal for United, in August 1996, came six minutes after he was introduced in a home match against Blackburn in August 1996; spookily, his last goal for the club also came six minutes after he had come off the bench at home to Blackburn. It is hard to say with absolute certainty that Solskjaer is the most prolific substitute in English football history, as records from the pre-Premiership era are less comprehensive. But he is above his most likely rival, Liverpool's David Fairclough, who scored either 18 goals (according to the official Liverpool site) or 20 (various newspaper reports) as a substitute in his time at Anfield. Fairclough also played for Norwich, Oldham, Tranmere and Wigan but, in the absence of cold, hard data, we're presuming he wasn't a substitute too often. And he only scored three goals for them anyway.

Last year I'd have been very twitchy going into the Tolose game at home 1-0 up without Carra & Gerrard. Last nite we were without the above mentioned; plus, either benched or in the stands Finnan, Torres, Alonso, Tennants (possibly our best player so far this season) Babel, Voro and more. 4-0, no bookings, no injuries (I think), we hardly broke sweat. If that's rotation, bring it on. Rafa doesn't give a toss who is happy and who isn't - just ask Benni & Crouchino's agents. He wants to win things and two players for every position taking turns is how he thinks it should be done. You really need to accept that fact, have some faith and move on. Try it, feels pretty good this morning! PS - "I Find Myself Agreeing with Andy Gray " - well don't!