Troubadour

Not sure about that view of Juve's backline mate - Buffon's been playing behind Chiellini and Cannavaro this season, with players like Legrottaglie (a mentalist Christian), Caceres and Zebina knocking about. They are all either comparatively new, far too old or utter shite, apart possibly from Chiellini. That squad needs a major overhaul, just like Milan's, and has for years. Also, City'd probably give you £20 million for Buffon. That's a substantial transfer budget right there, and then you go and pick up Marchetti or Amelia or someone for peanuts. A fair few of the players probably would work with Rafa again - Kuyt, Skrtel, Lucas, Insua, Ngog etc. They might not be the players you'd miss, but they'd go with him if he wanted them to. Mascherano and Reina probably wouldn't mind, either. That said, I think the reason Pepe signed is because he likes it at Liverpool. Some players still have some loyalty to a club, rather than a manager or a medal collection.

Bit long. Who wrote it, an American Tomkins?

Yeah, the xinxim's ace. On the one hand, Mexican football's not too bad, so he'll probably be ok, and Manucho cost them pretty much nothing and this lad's up to £10 million. But on the other, Manucho, Dong, Forlan, Diouf...all of Ferguson's attempts to be clever with strikers end up being shite, Solskjaer apart. Plus Kleberson, Veron and Anderson suggest he doesn't really do Latin America well. And on my third hand, I have £10 million that, even with their finances in a fucking huge mess, the Mancs can spend on, what, a fourth, fifth choice striker.

Agree with you wholeheartedly, but think the word domination should probably be in "quotation marks". Two winners in 10 years...weird sort of domination. English teams - mostly us - have dominated the semi-finals of the competition, not the competition itself. Anyway, as long as the Mancs get put out, then we can all sit back and enjoy it. As for Argentina, the rule of thumb with the World Cup is that the team that wins it is the side everyone's forgotten about. If Carlos Bilardo gets hold of Maradona and explains that he's in charge of the tactics, they'll do the sensible thing and play Messi, Tevez and Di Maria just off Higuain with Masche and Veron or Cambiasso in midfield. Easy side of the draw, a side as strong on paper as anyone...I'd get some money on them while everyone's talking about Spain.

Is Iker Casillas being ignored on footballing grounds or because you've all decided he's a cunt? Always seemed a decent sort to me. Buffon's a cunt, obviously, what with him being a fascist, but Casillas? Good beard, too.

I don't think any of us were estimating that you were any sort of genius.

Utter, utter bollocks. Ted, I don't want to turn this into a Rafa thread, especially because we're basically just disagreeing on the use of one word. 06/07 wasn't a bad season because we comfortably made it into the CL while also getting to the final, and 07/08 was average, rather than bad, because we achieved our minimum aim. I'm not saying either season was good, just that it's unfair to call either of them bad seasons. Plus this is only taking into account the league, not Europe, when the first was definitely a good season and the second wasn't bad either.

In league terms alone - which isn't especially fair - I'd say it's his second and a half. 2005 was a bad season league-wise, because we regressed, and then 2008, when we finished fourth for the second year in a row was bad, but less bad, because we didn't move forward. One of those years, obviously, was not a bad season in any other way. Fourth isn't good enough for Liverpool, obviously, but it is the minimum requirement now, for better or worse. You can't say it's been a bad season if we achieve our minimum requirement. Just because it's not a good season doesn't mean it's a bad season, I suppose. It's not black and white etc

The presence of Oswaldo de Oliveira is genuinely baffling at odds that short. Done well at Kashima Antlers, apparently, but that shouldn't be enough, really, should it? I suppose Wenger came from Japan...you still wonder if someone at Sky Bet's had a tip, mind. Del Bosque's a great shout after the World Cup. He'd help ease the transition for some of the Spanish lads, too, and he's unquestionably a top drawer manager. Big mates with Rafa, though, so you wonder if he'd be happy to play dead man's shoes. Blanc's the best bet if you want a young, hungry manager despite his Manc connections (he was shit for them, though, which means he's not a proper Manc) and Hodgson is the only English manager who doesn't get totally and utterly found out in Europe. Rijkaard would get us playing nice football but his choice of relaxant may be a problem and Kenny would ensure the easiest transition. Other than those, Prandelli, Laudrup and Jorge Jesus would get us playing good football and would all be comparatively cheap. Guardiola is irrelevant - Luis Enrique's his reserve manager, though, if you want to take a real pot shot - and I still think Mourinho would need money, however big the potential ego boost. Fact is, changing manager is a risk, whoever you get in. The bigger the name, the smaller the risk, but it's still there. Or do you stick with a manager who's had one bad season in six?

Left-back, you have to imagine, would be a priority for whoever's manager, but they're not exactly 10 a penny. It costs £7m even for a fat Italian one. Imagine how much you'd have to pay to get a good one... Kyrgiakos is the obvious one, with probably Carra at left-back, because Agger gives us a bit more composure. You could put Mascherano at right back and Johnson on the left, but with Babel suspended and Aquilani injured, that leaves us short in midfield.

That'd be the Chelsea that had just drawn 1-1 at home with Rosenborg, would it? The one that had been beaten to the title by the Mancs? The one that was being torn apart by cliques in the dressing room and that had been unbalanced by the signings of Ballack and Shevchenko? Nobody's doubting that Mourinho's a very good manager. He clearly is - from his time at Porto, if nothing else - but he's not the fucking messiah. Bring him in, fine, and we'd get a kick and some decent coverage and there'd be a big love-in, but without money, he wouldn't win the title either. That's what it comes down to, money, and since we don't have any, we'd be better off (if rafa goes, and that's a big if, and not related to whether he should) going for someone who at least has some experience of not having a shitload of cash to spend.

That's the thing about Mourinho. He's got the money and the looks, sure, he'd buy you dinner, show you a good time, but he wouldn't NEED you. There's always a game with Mourinho, and it tends not to be what you would assume it to be. He doesn't say anything without an agenda. Whatever it is, I would be stunned if he'd touch us with a bargepole without a significant amount of investment. He'd love the chance to be a hero at Anfield, but he's smart enough to know that he couldn't be a hero without at least some money.

My inkling would be Bordeaux, too, but then Lyon have a bit more European, ahem, savoir faire. They're both decent, it just depends whether the Mancs have run out of steam by that stage. They will run out of steam at some stage. I just hope it's before June.

1-1 in France, Chamakh for Bordeaux. The stream quality's shit, but it's quite a good, if blurry, game. Which one has a better chance of beating United, that's the key question.

Lyon one up, Lisandro. It's all happening...

What you've done there is accidentally cut and pasted his entire last book. Careless.

Think Wachovia hold a very small part of the debt - £70m or so. The rest is with RBS, so they're the more important. They weren't as keen as RBS to refinance last time, because they don't have to worry about public perception.

Selling Riera, Babel, El Zhar, Degen, Plessis, Cavalieri and San Jose and releasing Itandje and Aurelio, as we probably will, would save us, what, £300,000 a week? Something like that. it would also bring in £30 million or so, with any luck, so the situation may not arise. But in order to satisfy UEM's insatiable demands for other people's opinions, it'd have to be Carra or Gerrard. The former because he's the one we'd miss least, sadly, and the latter because if we could convince Real to pay £35m for him, it would have the look of a decent bit of business.

Assuming we don't give him away on loan and try to recoup at least the majority of what we spent on him - £13m or so - Roma don't have the money. They also don't need him. They're flying. Which is something I am absolutely certain Serafino is enjoying watching. Especially with Ranieri in charge...

Q&A from as. "grit our teeth" may be slightly idiomatic, but the quotes aren't made up.

Apart from Mascherano and Pepe, I thought Maxi was the only player who wasn't utter shite last night. He's a long way from where he once was, but he's getting better, and he seems to have a decent understanding with Torres. There are far greater problems than Maxi Rodriguez, and he's certainly not one of the players who I'd suggest we get rid of next season.

I find that level of stupidity very disorientating.

Think Bilbao will pay the 3m euros or whatever it is to sign San Jose. Young Basque players are a good investment, funnily enough, because in them and Sociedad, you have a captive buying market. We should just buy loads of them for nothing, then sell them on for slightly more than nothing. Would have thought Cavalieri will go this summer. It's telling that he's not playing the cup games, and they rate Gulacsi highly enough to be the back-up. Right-back we're fine with Johnson and Kelly, with Darby just behind them in the pecking order. Degen'll go, surely. Centre-back, if Skrtel plays in/has a good WC, I'd not be surprised if we cashed in on him and brought in a centre back. Be interesting whether they keep Kyrgiakos, too, because he's not actually done anything wrong. We need a left back. Given Rafa's record at signing full-backs, this does not bode well. Arbeloa, anyone? Midfield, the big question is what happens to Aquilani. Does he get another season? Hopefully Masche will stay, and Lucas definitely will. Spearing may survive purely because of the quotas, though to be honest I'd sell him. But then I'm not the manager. Out wide, the obvious way of raising funds is to sell Riera and Babel. Between them, they may bring in £20m or so (Riera for £11m, Babel for £9m, which I don't think are irrationally ambitious). That leaves Jovanovic and Yossi for the left, Kuyt and Maxi for the right. Suspect another wide player would be just behind a left-back on Rafa's list. In the hole, Gerrard, Pacheco, Jovanovic, Yossi, Aquilani (if he's still here) can all play there, though I wish Kuyt wouldn't. That's probably the role they see Nemeth in, too. Upfront, Torres, Ngog and, I would have thought, Eccleston - new contract, rate him highly, at Huddersfield, who we clearly trust. But that they went for Chamakh shows that they know they need one more striker. So, to summarise...Skrtel, Degen, Cavalieri, Riera, Babel, Plessis, Itandje, and maybe, if Rafa can destroy whatever bargaining chip the little lad has, El Zhar out. A left-back, a centre-back, a wide player and a back-up striker in. Aquilani can be written off, because he'll either stay or we'll sell him and sign a direct replacement. Agree with UEM, though - apart from a full-back and maybe a central defender, the first team is actually alright. It's the squad that needs sorting.

It's amazing that a thread about Arda Turan has descended into a debate about whether Rafa should have signed Sergio Aguero three years ago. Kind of says a lot, really. Anyway, spending that amount of money on a 17-year-old would have been ludicrous, regardless of who we signed, and regardless of how good he turned out to be. Still, I suppose it's better than talking about a player we're not going to sign...