suley

no... just no

this has the feel of one of those we dominated but drew/lost games...

Puts into perspective how hard it would be to finish 4th from where we are now: source: oh you beauty Infographic – Forecasting the Finish We've been hearing an awful lot about fourth place lately. Not necessarily because of Liverpool's improvement – and there has been improvement – but more because the Ministry of Truth the official site seemingly wants us all to always look on the bright side of life. So, is it feasible? I admit that the "best case scenario" is wildly optimistic. Wildly. And I do not expect that it will happen. But it is "possible." It projects wins against West Brom (h), Wigan (a), Southampton (a), Villa (a), West Ham (h), Reading (a), Everton (h), Fulham (a), and QPR (h); draws against Swansea (h), Tottenham (h), and Newcastle (a); and a loss to Chelsea (h). The three matches against sides above Liverpool in the table are all at Anfield, the six away matches are all against sides currently placed between 13th and 19th. Regardless, I will be incredibly surprised if Liverpool managed 9W-3D-1L during this stretch, no matter the opposition. Liverpool's points per game over the first 25 matches is a meager 1.44, better than last season's total (1.37) or the dismal 1.25 earned under Hodgson, but still nowhere good enough. Were Liverpool to finish the season with the same points-per-game average, they'd end on 55 points. Since the league switched to three points for a win, Liverpool have finished with a worse total just twice: 54 points in 1998-99 (Houllier's first season) and 52 in last year's campaign. However, if you ignore the opening five matches of the season, where Liverpool took just two points, the points-per-game average rises to 1.70. Which, incidentally, is also Liverpool's points per game average in the last ten matches. Were Liverpool to continue that form, they'd finish with 58 points – the same number as in Benitez's first season, as well as 2010-11. Liverpool have bettered that points-per-game average in the last six matches, despite traveling to the 1st, 2nd, and 6th-placed sides. By averaging 1.83 points per game for the rest of the season, Liverpool would finish with 60 points. Which actually borders on respectable. But 60 points has gotten fourth place just once in the last ten years: 2003-04. That was actually Liverpool's total in Houllier's final season. But chances are, 60 points won't do it this season; Tottenham already have 45, Everton 42, and Arsenal 41. And if you go by Liverpool's results in equivalent fixtures last season, they'd reach 56 points: wins over Southampton (replacing Blackburn), Villa, West Ham (replacing Wolves), Chelsea, Everton, and QPR; draws against Swansea and Wigan; and losses to West Brom, Tottenham, Reading (replacing Bolton), Newcastle, and Fulham. If you do the same for the four teams directly above Liverpool, Arsenal and Everton actually have worse comparable results in last season's fixtures. Arsenal won five, drew one, and lost seven; Everton won three, drew three, and lost seven. That'd give Arsenal 57 points and Everton 54 points, both catchable even with mediocre Liverpool results over the next 13 matches. But both Tottenham and Chelsea decimated their comparable fixtures last season – Chelsea's record was 8W-2D-3L, Tottenham's 9W-2D-2L, which would give Chelsea 72 points and Tottenham 74. Over the last 10 seasons, the average number of points needed for fourth place is 67.8. Tottenham would need 1.77 points per game – say, 6W-5D-2L or 7W-2D-4L – to reach that mark. Liverpool would need 10W-2D-1L, two points more than the above "best case scenario." Liverpool aren't reaching 68 points. And Liverpool probably won't reach 4th, no matter how many interviews with players they post on the official site. But Liverpool will almost certainly better last season's point total, while playing better football. And, honestly, after the last few seasons, discernible, continued progress remains all we can really hope for.

only 7pts behind 4th with 15 games left. Not that far off really. If, and its a big IF, we could just get a few wins together in a row things would look so much more rosy around here.

This is why I wouldnt want him---- he is finished. The Torres we had initially is not the same one that left for Chelsea. Unsafe at any Price: Why Fernando Torres is gone for good - We Ain't Got No History

Yes, exactly my point also.

Yeh its a complicated issue and to a certain degree I agree with you but all I'm saying is if he owned up to the handball today no one could go around calling him a cheat anymore as owning up to a handball as 99% of players wouldnt own up to it if it happened to them and it would earn him much respect. Maybe then all the goals and penalties that get disallowed may be allowed on more occasions and cause us to win those few extra games which would change the course of our season in a significant manner. Again, I'm not asking Suarez to bend over backwards and kiss anyones ass but every now and then when opportunity arises he needs to do the right thing and today was one of those days where if he did the right thing it would make his life a lot easier going forward.

I really think Suarez is an idiot though. I mean, rightly or wrongly, he is viewed as a cheat in this country and he had a great chance to remove that label off of himself today but he missed it completely and now the repercussions are going to extend a lot further for him. Yes I believe he is being unfairly targeted and he is by no means the only player who has 'cheated' during a game as it happens week in and week out in the league but the fact is the spotlight has been on him for a while. I understand his desire to win and that during a game when your so pumped up it would be hard to admit something that will impact your team negatively. However, he really did have a great chance to put himself in the good books today but stuffed up. Good luck to him getting another penalty this season. Still, along with Agger, he is becoming my all time favourite Liverpool player. Their commitment and desire for the shirt is unrivalled.

Big deal liverpool have scored 2 more goals than Messi for the calendar year. oh you beauty: Liverpool versus Messi: The Battle for 2012 :yes:

Couldnt have said it better myself mate.... I hate to be a pessimist but expect the worst people... but hope for the best....

sorry didnt realise it has been posted on another thread.

Reina not ruling out Utd move | Sky Sports | Liverpool News | Football | Premier League Liverpool goalkeeper Pepe Reina has refused to rule out a move to bitter rivals Manchester United. United are considering their goalkeeping options as they seek a replacement for Edwin van der Sar when the Dutchman hangs up his gloves at the end of the season. Reina has been mooted as a possible transfer target after establishing himself as one of the best keepers in Europe during his time at Liverpool. The 28-year-old has admitted he could be tempted to make the move to Old Trafford as he wants to be challenging for trophies on a consistent basis. "Yes, well Van der Sar will hang up his gloves in the summer so of course they are looking," Reina told Spanish radio station Ondo Sera. "I can't do anything. I can't say anything logically as I have a contract with Liverpool. "Of course one likes to fight for titles and be in a team that does that. We always fought to be in the Champions League and try to win the title. But unfortunately it hasn't been the case in the last couple of years." Former Barcelona and Villarreal custodian Reina has left the door open to quit Anfield if they fail to qualify for the Champions League. "I won't lie, I want to play in the Champions League and challenge for titles," added Reina. :/ .... Oh deary me...

I always sit and wonder what if Messi never played in La Liga and rather played in the premier league. Would we be sitting here saying how great he is. La Liga is completely dominated by two teams and im sure it benefits Messi alot playing in a team with such quality and a team thats grown around you and thus works around what suits you best rather than you trying to fit into the team. Now I'm not in any way saying that Messi isnt a great footballer. But just interesting to think about how he would have performed in another league with another team that may have not been suitable to him. You have to remember that he very rarely performs at such a level for his country.

That's sad on so many different levels

I understand that everyone is pissed. But lets be honest, this guy spends most of the season out injured. He may one of the best strikers in the world but thats no good to us if he barely plays half the matches in a season. I would take the 40 million in a heartbeat. Just the timing is horrible. The thing that pisses me off the most is the realisation that there really is no loyalty left in football. Everyone is after trophies and money and they will go to whatever club that will give them those things.

You really aint wrong or right yet. The man has only managed 3 games so far. Time will tell how he performs. I sincerely hope he succeeds, as much for his own sake as well as for liverpools as I would hate for Kenny to ruin his reputation.

Your joking right? Well for one football isnt static. It is always evolving and changing and as such managers must keep up with that. There is plenty of other arguments but there not even worth discussing.

Great news... although lets not get carried away...

LOL... at least theres someone there to give me a giggle even in times like this

Arsenal post record pre-tax profits - CNN.com

London, England (CNN) -- English Premier League club Arsenal have posted record pre-tax profits of $88 million. The north London team, of whom American businessman Stan Kroenke is a major shareholder, announced they had paid off their debt on former stadium Highbury, which was turned into a development of apartments. With an increased capacity at their new Emirates Stadium, and money received from high-profile transfers, the Gunners' financial figures up to May 2010 revealed pre-tax profits had increased by $16 million on the previous year. Ivan Gazidis, Arsenal chief executive, told the club's website: "It is important that we continue to develop a vibrant and robust business with sufficient revenues to sustain success. "The group has made good progress over the last year and I am excited by the opportunities which we have in front of us." Arsenal's accounts show they have sold 362 apartments at the Highbury Square site -- the club's home between 1913 and 2006. The sale of apartments, combined with a social housing site nearby, made the club $247.6 million and allowed them to repay $204.5 million of bank loans. The club's turnover increased from $493 million to $599.4 million as a result of successful property sales while operating profit before depreciation and player trading in the football business was down $9.3 million to $89.6 million due to increased wage costs. Arsenal's profit from transfers -- including the sale of Emmanuel Adebayor and Kolo Toure to rivals Manchester City -- was $21.4 million up from $4.5 million the year before. Peter Hill-Wood, Arsenal's non-executive chairman, told the club's website: "The most pleasing aspect of these results is that the returns generated in the property business during the year, particularly at Highbury Square, have allowed us to repay £130 million ($205 million) of bank loans and significantly reduce the group's overall net debt. "We now have a debt free property business which is accumulating surplus cash as further unit sales are made at Highbury Square and which has three further property assets to realize over the next few years." Cant help but feel a little envy.... i feel like the little poor kid watching the rich kid in his fancy car drive by

It is so painful and difficult to watch my beloved team play these days... I feel like we have become Newcastle where try as we might nothing will stop this rot and down is the only way were heading....

Exactly... Its not like the guy was purposely getting injured... These so called fans we have shit me to tears sometimes. Some of the shit i read on these boards really shits me as well. Especially the way they slag off our manager as well. Im the first to admit im not impressed with what Rafa has done to this team. But i will never slag the guy off. At the end of the day i dont know whats happening in the day to day of the club. Im in no position to pass judgement on the man. I can only speculate. The same goes with Harry Kewell.

i just want to go to sleep and wake up when this seasons over.... i dont know how much more of this season i can take... how can it all have gone so pear shaped... not in my worst dreams would i have imagined us being in the state we are now... especially after last season....

the end is near....