Andy G

We know about the debate on .tv about the greatest ever manager, and that has a thread all of its own and there is no doubt that these two are the greatest ever managers. The thing that got me though was the opening line: "No two men have done more for Liverpool Football Club than Bill Shankly and Bob Paisley" I would actually dispute that, and this thread is about your thought on the matter. There is another contender for the man who has more for Liverpool than even those two, and that is of course King Kenny. Firstly the greatest player we have ever had (along with King Billy), then as an undoubted great manager, if not to the levels that Shanks or Uncle Bob achieved, but more then anything, as a leader. What if Kenny had not resigned? There is no way of proving either way, but perhaps he would have won more than even Bob and became not only the greatest player, but the undisputed greatest manager too - he certainly had youth on his side, and proved he could build a successful team at another club too, after taking him out of the second division to boot. It is just as easy to see this happening as it is to see it not happening, but as I say, nothing can be proven. Taking up the responsibility after Heysel took a glass factories amount of bottle for any man, but for a player to take that step up was, and still is, unheard of. In those dark days where we were the scum of the earth in footballing (and other) circles, he lead us in his first season to our first and only League and Cup double. With our main rivals, Everton as reigning champions and their fans claiming to be the best team in Europe, he knocked them aside to secure both trophies at their expense. Liverpool was proud again (The city and the club). He then built the most exciting footballing side I have ever seen, including the recent (and truly great) Arsenal and United sides. The pace and skill of that team was a sight to behold and even the opposition managers and supporters were in awe of what they saw. The performance against Forest is hailed as the greatest in club football by many, including a few Forest fans that I know. But the real reason for my claim that he has done more for Liverpool than the other two legends was the reason for his resignation and therefore the reason why he cannot be held against them purely as a manger. The worst time in our clubs history came in 1989 as you all know. His dignity in dealing with Hillsborough was impeccable. He had his players to think about, as that was his job, but also the families and survivors. The way the balanced the management of his players to get them ready for the next game - whenever that may be was nothing short of a miracle. Many spoke of giving up the game and who could blame them, it went though all our heads too, but he kept them focused on their job. The thing was though, their job had now changed. It was not about winning football matches; it was about winning football matches for those that perished. It was about lifting the FA Cup for them (if the decision was to carry on) and more importantly, it was about attending funerals, visiting the physically injured, and doing something for the mentally scarred. There was at least one Liverpool player at every single funeral. They were not there as stars, they were not even treated as stars, they were there out of genuine concern and support, often embarrassed about their fame at such times. Kevin McDonald - you always have a dear place in my heart for this. Kenny himself led by example. He went to as many funerals as he could. Talked to as many families as he could. He sent my mate his shirt because of what he had been through. He showed compassion, empathy, love and leadership. He (and the Liverpool board) was not bullied by the FA into playing the next game - insisting instead that the decision was with the families. He not only led his players, but he led all of us, a city. He should also go down as one of the greatest leaders of Evertonians for this reason, or perhaps more realistically, Evertonians should go down as one of his greatest assets - for they were there alongside us in their grief, with Kenny as their leader. I will never forget them for that, even with the bile that comes form both sets of supporters today. From the day Kenny left us, he has never left us. He has supported us in all manner of ways, from the criticism of Brian Clough over his role in Hillsborough to the 2001 FA Cup final when he was asked if Liverpool was lucky and replied "It is usual that the team that scored the most goals in an FA Cup final get to lift the cup" or words to that effect. He has backed the fans, players and managers and he is a giant amongst men. In other respects, he has crossed the sectarian divide without thought, judged players and people on ability not on race, colour or creed, has been a role model as a family man, has supported his wife in her charity work, with the benefits being seen in Liverpool as well as Scottish hospitals, he has brought up children that are noble enough to take an active part in the same charity and has also kept himself to himself throughout. For these reasons I put Kenny's name forward as doing more for Liverpool FC than any other man. Am I the only person that feels like this? Your thoughts would be appreciated.

I am no economist but I would have presumed that under current laws, that players values would find themselves with no extras for English. It doesn't seem to be like that thogh, I just don't know why. If Blatters quota came in then that would then make English players much more valuable, but ir isn't. Really do not understand it.

John Durnin plays for the Liverpool Masters side as Angel does for Everton. Angel also had a good career at Derby before he joined Everton. No one would be laughing if he came out in praise of Dalglish, and he played fewer games for us. Lets laugh at somethign actually funny instead of making things up, it makes us look small time. Just an observation.

Watched by Derby County, Forest and Leicester. Rejected by all of them. Obviously really shit. My Dad was rejected by Don Welsh (aftera second trial). It is no coincidence that Welsh is the least successful of our managers, and Derby, Leicester and Forest had their glory years just before i was of age.

Great work boys

Don't be so horrible. I cry when i read that for a number of reasons:sniff:

Gobshites who have no idea how much work goes into organising stuff like this and do not appreciate and half of them still moan about it when there is a glitch. Your quote: The organiser is a very good personal friend of mine. I have more knowledge of this this kind of thing than you'll ever know. I am glad to hear that your knowledge is the kind of thing that I would never know :lol::lol::lol:. You have no idea. You were probably still shitting green when I was doing stuff like this for all away matches (my Dad did the home ones) Oh and my Mum was a teacher, does that mean that I know more about teaching than you will ever know? Perhaps! but I would not be so stupd to claim such a thing. Anyway, the point is that someone that puts so much effort in (with all the shit that comes with it) should at least get a freebie for that work, but everyone should know that is the case. I am pleased with the SOS answers so far, although they were pretty much as expected.

Shouldn't have put the apology as not really sorry. Still one of the biggest loads of bollocks that I have ever read though for reasons previously given. Gave up on the thread after a few posts. Owen is a legend, was a great player. Pissed on Keegan in every way, and he is a legend (and my first hero). You are old enough to know what I am saying is true.

And Rush never got a good reception then? He followed (any of) Keegan, Toshack, Johnson, Dalglish. All of whom were obviously shit.

I am sorry but I have never seen such bollocks in my life. Liverpool fans never gave Owen the credit he deserved, they were sucking up to an overweight and confrontational Fowler instead. Owen dis what he had to do on the pitch and got no recognition fm Liverpool fans. It is no wonder he had the attitude that he did. Every other great (and yes he is a great) Liverpool player gets affection in abundance - Owen got fuck all. Looking forward to reading the posts below yours and sorry for having a go.

I now see what you mean (refer to last post). Don't fuckin' do it for them. Gobshites like them are not worth it.

Obviously not. You obviously have no concept whatsoever as to how much work stuff like this involves. If you cannot even chip in to make sure the organiser travels for free, then shame on you.

I tell you what, after you go through all the shit organising everything, you at least deserve a free trip, that I guarantee from previous experience. Get that on the agenda with the official SOS and get it minuted - just make it transparent to customers. If you are going to make a profit, just let people know that too, I really don't think anyone would mind because of the work you will have to put in, it just avoids embarrasing accusation or questions later. There will come a day when people will ask, so make it clear from the start, and you will deserve a freebie.

Cheers for that real red, I realised not everyone could access and was going to do that. When the official response comes through I will post it on here, but BHB's response is what I expected to hear.

Posted this on RAOTL for anyone interested in the answers RAOTL.co.uk forum • Login

Favourite for me is Kenny. Best player is Kenny too, but Barnes in 88 and 89 had two better seasons than Kenny or anyone else ever had imo.

It's Pig Mountain really, but good effort.

That's a lie isn't it?

Thanks for that. Now I know :thumbsup:

I really do not have a clue what you have just told me, but thanks for the info anyway, I am sure it will be understood by some.

As an older man I can assure you that we do care about reputations. What is a neg? What do you mean by "put it out too much again"? Sorrry for my ignorance.

Ernie by Benny Hill probably.

My point is that older women do all the things that a younger woman would get a reputation as a slag for, but they are not considered slags (well not by us older men anyway), so at what age does the label go?

If the police stop you for a drugs check and ask to check your wallet, tell them to fuck off as they will only take the money out of it. I am pretty experienced in getting by in other countries, but I never saw that one coming. 200 dollars the bastards got from me. What do you do? Report them to the local criminals? Insist instead that such a search is carried out down at the local police station in from of the inpector, they will then just let you go (so I am led to believe).