Benitaur

Net spend or not net spend.

 

The fact is that Rafa spent more than £200M on players in his time here and if he had not wasted around £100M of that on pure dogshite he probably would still have been here and we might even have won something during the last 4 years.

 

The end.

 

One more thing by the way.

 

Wanting to get rid of Alonso for around £15M one summer and then finally have to sell him the summer after for £30M might look good for the net spenders, but for anyone else it is a proof of poor judgement that could easily be seen as a liability when it comes to how he used the clubs assetts.

Net spending is a logical argument when you don't have a budget and are forced to buy cheaper options in hopes of upgrading season by season, which we are. It is not a good argument if you have an unlimited budget like Chelsea or City

As for the Alonso saga:

Rafa stated that he wanted to keep Alonso AND buy Barry for the left midfield

Barry said he didn't want to join Liverpool because he wanted to play in the middle, not the left

Alonso stated when he left that the tax changes in England were unattractive

Make your own conclusions based on what is actually said, not newspaper headlines with no quotes

So what your saying is it wasn't rafas fault when we needed a striker he bought Keane for £20m, when we needed a leftback he bought a shit fat one in Dossena for £8m, an injured average midfielder for £18m, and £18m on an average rightback, ok I see.

What I do see is a manager who is forced to buy not his first choices, but second or third or maybe further down the bin choices, and hoping to upgrade sometime in the future. At the same time, while this is happening, he is forced to make a profit by wheeling and dealing.

Show me where the Keane money went to after reselling him?

Who would you have recommended as left back at that time, and is doing so fantastically well now?

When Alonso was sold for 30 mil, who would you have bought as a CM?

Name me a better attacking right back, considering we missed out on Alves years before that, and there is no way we are getting Maicon or Alves?

Decent Article, alot to agree with, but IMO Rafa totally lost his way in the final season and since the Torres/ Yossi signings everything he went near in the market was a failure to which he deserved to lose his job for, not one player signed in the 2008 and 2009 summers was a success, and he and he alone is at fault for that, he let Risse(who was poor) go paid double on a worse player, let Crouch go payed double on a worse player, then he bought riera a fuckin Donkey.

Arbeloa sold for £3.5m and we paid 4 times that for a worse player, and the cream of the crop Aqualani, a player who had barely played 100 games in 5 years he paid £20m for, these signings are the reason we finished 7th last season, and no manager at any club should be forgiven for such total disregard and ignorance in the transfer market and a drop of 5 places in the league.

You mean since the time our club seems to have to make a net profit every transfer season? I'm SURE Rafa intended that every transfer season since

What this match showed is:

4-4-2 = obsolete

man for man marking = obsolete

Woy = ??

I think we would only be an outside chance for the 4th spot, forget about winning the league

I am still optimistic about UEFA spots only because I suspect Villa and the bitters are worse off than us.

I can't believe the level of optimism Roy generated when all we added to our team was a couple of 2 mil players and a couple of Bosmans

On the other hand we loaned out a 20 mil player, and sold Benayoun who nearly guarantees 10 goals a season

Can't wait to see if we sell our other 10 goal a season "midfielder" Dirk Kuyt

I think Huang doesn't have a choice but wait for bankruptcy proceedings. Look at the Texas Rangers. Hicks refused to sell too until it was out of his hands. Being in sports in the US, I think Huang knew this that is why all his dealings have been with the bank

The initial offer was to the bank, not the club

The supposed proof of funds etc was given to the PA, and the bank. Not to the club

IMO it is time for the FA to step in and put a stop to any bank even thinking of refinancing. I will willingly take the 9 point deduction if we get rid of the cancer, even if it costs us a champions league place (I don't think it will relegate us)

I think our players will stay if we get a good buyer that invests in great players, and will understand the reason we are not in the champs league for another year

You think they want to sell? Read up on the Texas Rangers, the similarities are uncanny.

Yep. I am guessing it needs to go to bankruptcy court before these twats will be forced to sell

I'm not really a fan of Martin Samuel but he was spot on with these comments about Huang I thought:

 

Martin Samuel: Oh boy, this is what the Premier League is really all about | Mail Online

 

Huang is all hype

 

The very rich, as F Scott Fitzgerald wrote, are different from you and me. For a start, they don't mess about.

 

When Roman Abramovich wanted to buy Chelsea, there was no delay while he tried to scare the money up. He came in, did the deal, went to work the next day.

 

The same with Sheik Mansour at Manchester City.

 

There was no fanfare, no tedious round of will he, won't he?

 

These new regimes promised fabulous transfer budgets and it was obvious they could deliver because they bought the club in a heartbeat.

 

Yet weeks after Kenny Huang promised Liverpool the financial backing to compete with the richest clubs in Europe, his representatives casually dropping names such as Lionel Messi into the hype, the board are still waiting for his offer to buy the club.

 

Huang now rates his chances only 50-50, which is mystifying.

 

If the money was there to buy Messi, it was there to buy Liverpool, and if it was not, all he says is open to question.

 

The difference between Huang and Liverpool's current band of cowboys is negligible, not least as Anfield has entertained enough potless billionaires to last a lifetime.

 

We heard too much of Huang too soon.

Chelsea was sold for £140 million

Manchester City, £220million

Both had willing sellers

Supposedly Huang is bidding £400million, more than the total sub of both clubs. We still have an expensive stadium to build and a winning squad to assemble

Both owners of Chelsea and City may act like big shots, but they have still spent roughly £400million, which is what Huang is supposedly bidding, not including money to build a stadium and invest in the team.

So I don't forsee too many billionaires queueing up to see how much money they can throw away to show off.

This article stating "rich people don't mess about" is stupid. Why? Well, Abramovich is perhaps the most extravagant toy spending billionaire around. And the Abu Dhabi family, while not as foolish with their money as the Dubai ones, are pretty spendthrift

I don't forsee any other billionaires in that are that loose with their wallet.

I do prefer the Chinese bid compared with any middle east buyers for several reasons

- they have a real strong market in China. they are in it for the business of making money through marketing and promoting brand Liverpool FC

- they are not going to be a plaything of a billionaire, rather a well run business

I don't think they are dumb. I just think after the owners keep fucking them around, they will (and have) just go and put the offer on the table to the bank and wait for the loan to come due.

How about someone British and probably cheap:

Kevin Davies, battering ram supreme

I believe Huang is waiting for the bank to call on the loan, and he buys from the bank at an agreed price. Thats what I would do in his shoes

The owners are fucking around with delaying tactics and fake stalking horses. If I were a serious and competent buyer, I wouldn't put up with this nonsense.

So bid straight to the bank. One way or another, I would get the club at the bare minimum price. The only way this isn't happening is if the owner finds some sucker to buy the club before that happens, and probably at the price they want ie 600-800 million, which is highly unlikely IMO.

So my guess is Huang is playing chicken with the owners

Man City have Balotelli now so maybe Inter will bid next week with the help of that cash. I don't want him stuck here if he's not happy.

I have a feeling City are just fucking around. They know the transfer musical chairs will only start with them, so they probably will make a deal on the last day of the transfer season

If you look at their transfers, they are always not just to buy good players, but to sabotage their closest rivals.

That is why IMO the Milner transfer will also take place on the last day

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Only logical response

Neither. For that money, someone young but potential. Remy everyone keeps mentioning. Or maybe Lukaku for that money

nope, i hate slow strikers in general. Plus i can see us switching to long ball with him in the team. Basically just playing like england. Id rather a striker with genuine pace, skill and trickery.

Completely agree with that. Crouch is the lazy option. I know he is good with his feet and scores decent amount of goals. But our midfielders and especially our defenders see a player one head taller than the rest, long ball goes up, crouch gets the first touch and we lose possession

Happened with us, happened in other clubs after us, happens for England. I don't blame the lad, but he provides the lazy option that is taken every time

This means they are financially way better off than us

Well I gave my reasons to that in an earlier post, not being chased by barca or madrid doesnt mean his any less good, it's not particularly a yard stick to judge a player by, some players are simply less coveted despite any brilliance they may have, there are probably a few more reasons one can come up with.

 

When I think of the CL 2005 Final, were 3-0 down and getting dominated by Milan, we need a holding player to get back control of midfield, the game etc, we have a choice between Hamann, an intelligent, calm player who keeps hold of the ball, possession and plays his game in a sophisticated composed demeanour. Then we have masch, an aggressive, tought tackling player, likes to hustle and bustle. who would you have? for me it would hamann all the time, he had a little more in his game too, could pass really well and take some awesome freekicks, i'm not trying to say masch is shitter then hamann, but they both had somewhat a difference in their style of play, and imo hamann's game was much sophisticated in certain ways.

Interesting point. But if we had Masch, do you really think he wouldn't at least done the same as Didi?

Compare our two CL finals against Milan recently. Whats the difference?

In 2005, Kaka was ripping us to shreds. We brought Didi on, he marked Kaka and we equalized and won on penalties

In 2007 Masch had Kaka in his back pocket, and we were the better team IMO on that night. But after being 1 goal down, Rafa took Masch off for Crouch, and Kaka set up the killing 2nd goal.

While we did win through penalties in 2005, in the second half I wouldn't go so far as to say we were the better team at all though we did equalise. We were still underdogs and played like it

On the other hand in 2007, we were at the very least equal to Milan, not the underdog. IMO we were the better team that night but lost.

So I don't think your point is valid.

didi was past his best when he left us and went to man city, so not surprised he wasnt highly rated there, altho he didnt do too bad.

Agreed. But no one was banging on our doors when Didi was here in his prime either

You're giving Rafa too much credit here. Almost every manager instructs their player to work on things, it doesn't mean it will happen. The talent still has to be there.

 

And for every Ayala quote, there's an Agger one claiming that they didn't practice with a 3 man defence before the Sunderland game.

And you are giving too little credit.

Look at EVERY Valencia player when Rafa left. They were considered a great team, but after Rafa left they all left as 5 mil players (Aimar, Ayala etc)

A similar example is AC Milan. They always seem to have some world class players. But nearly every one that left them have been underwhelming like Kaka, Shevchenko, or even earlier Weah and Gullit.

I won't say Torres or Gerrard won't still be rated world class, but I suspect they won't score as many from now on. Torres less than 1.4 a game, and Gerrard won't hit 20 goals a season anymore

Masch is the better player. He still has a few years to hitting his prime and already he is rated higher worldwide

Didi was good for us in his prime, however he wasn't rated as highly by anyone other than Liverpool fans, not even at City where he went to after us

Momo easily replaced Didi. Masch out classed Momo

If Insua's deal falls through, he qualifies as home grown

If we are looking for a cheap but prolific striker we should instead try for fat Ronaldo or even Ruud Van Nistlerooy. Even without pace, they both still know the back of the net

Fuck no way

This is a player who only shows up for world cups and european championships.

He might have been decent in his early years, but since joining Bayern, his scoring rate has dropped.

He only scored 4 goals last season before being surprisingly chosen for the world cup, where he not surprisingly scored plenty of goals again.

Not the kind of player I would want (only playing for the national team)

I suspect he will not be as prolific, nor will Gerrard

This is evidenced by all the Valencia players who suddenly became not so world class after Rafa left.

Most will of course say just leave him up there and let him do his thing. Unfortunately this reminds me of an interview where Ayala was asked by Renieri do just do what Rafa did in defence. They asked back, which strategy? There were 5 to chose from at any one time in a match.

Read Torres' interviews, of how Rafa used to train him specifically for specific things to happen in a match, and when it happens, to pounce on it. Read Carra's book how Owen was bemused that Rafa was telling him that he had to turn faster.

However, obviously this goes against the commonly held truths that Rafa only knows how to ruin a player's confidence

Wonder how much Romelu Lukaku would cost

Kept out of the Dutch squad by Kuyt in the world cup.

I wonder why we keep getting linked to all these guys who were potentially good but disappear when playing for the big boys ie Van Der Vaart, Huntelaar, or the eternally brought up Shawn Wright Phillips?

It is understandable that they may have been misused my ONE club, and may go on to be great in another club like Forlan (crap at the scum but great for Villareal and Atletico). But some guys like SWP, Huntelaar should be aiming for clubs their level, as they have failed at too many big clubs

Good to see that not all the Rafa supporters are writing on an Inter-forum these days.

Well, thats just me. Big fan of our last proven great European manager since Joe Fagan.

Going to miss the days of us being feared in Europe, where facing the Barcelonas and the Milans with a quiet optimism of winning is the norm.

I do hope Roy's 4-1 win for Fulham against Juve wasn't a fluke. I do hope Roy proves me wrong.