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I'm not going to bother watching those tempting Sahin videos because it doesn't answer the question of where he's going to play.

 

We're not going to drop Lucas, or Gerrard, or Allen. Unless we play with four central midfielders, then I'm just scratching my head at this one. He's not going to come here to be a sub either, that's why he's leaving Madrid. So what's the answer? Lucas on the bench? Allen on the bench? Gerrard on the right of a 4-3-3?

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I'm not going to bother watching those tempting Sahin videos because it doesn't answer the question of where he's going to play.

 

We're not going to drop Lucas, or Gerrard, or Allen. Unless we play with four central midfielders, then I'm just scratching my head at this one. He's not going to come here to be a sub either, that's why he's leaving Madrid. So what's the answer? Lucas on the bench? Allen on the bench? Gerrard on the right of a 4-3-3?

 

Lucas is now undroppable. I see.

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Guest Numero Veinticinco
I'm not going to bother watching those tempting Sahin videos because it doesn't answer the question of where he's going to play.

 

We're not going to drop Lucas, or Gerrard, or Allen. Unless we play with four central midfielders, then I'm just scratching my head at this one. He's not going to come here to be a sub either, that's why he's leaving Madrid. So what's the answer? Lucas on the bench? Allen on the bench? Gerrard on the right of a 4-3-3?

 

Other than for rotation and injury, Lucas would surely be dropped. Şahin is a significantly better, more rounded player than Lucas.

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Other than for rotation and injury, Lucas would surely be dropped. ªahin is a significantly better, more rounded player than Lucas.

 

Wrong answer. You don't go dropping someone like Lucas for a loanee. It wouldn't be a popular decision either on the field or in the stands.

Now, it could be that we're going to be careful with Lucas who has just come back from a bad injury and we don't want him playing every game. But to suggest that Sahin is a much better player for us, considering he's not played a minuted of Premier League football, is just a wild stab in the dark based on youtube highlights.

 

I remember being in a similar position with regard Alonso and Aquilani. Look how good he was for Roma in this youtube video...wow...he's like Alonso but with more goals! Win.

 

Lucas has faults, indeed he does, but now is not the time to start fixing the dent on the Bentley but ignore the gas leak in the kitchen.

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Wrong answer. You don't go dropping someone like Lucas for a loanee. It wouldn't be a popular decision either on the field or in the stands.

 

What are you babbling on about? Just because he's on loan, it doesn't mean he won't ever be permanent. Did Mascherano sit on the bench for months? Did Adebayor?

 

As for 'in the stands', people want to have the best players on the pitch. Only a psychotic moron would sooner have Lucas on the pitch over Şahin.

 

Now, it could be that we're going to be careful with Lucas who has just come back from a bad injury and we don't want him playing every game. But to suggest that Sahin is a much better player for us, considering he's not played a minuted of Premier League football, is just a wild stab in the dark based on youtube highlights.

 

I said he's a better player, which he quite obviously is. That's based on actually watching him. I'd be shocked if you'd heard of him before we were linked. You seem to be pissed off because you're a Lucas fanatic.

 

I remember being in a similar position with regard Alonso and Aquilani. Look how good he was for Roma in this youtube video...wow...he's like Alonso but with more goals! Win.

 

Yeah, that's very similar. By similar, I mean totally different.

 

Lucas has faults, indeed he does, but now is not the time to start fixing the dent on the Bentley but ignore the gas leak in the kitchen.

 

Great metaphor. When I say 'great', I mean 'shit'.

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Sahin, Walcott & Johnson would all be great additions

 

don't fancy selling Agger to finance the deals tho...

 

although not a fan of Walcott really and a huge fan of Agger I'd probably accept selling him if we were to get those 3 (maybe Dempsey instead of Walcott) plus someone like Godin to replace Agger, no chance that'd happen mind

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main reason i don't want to sell Agger is that we don't have a ready made replacement

 

i think Kelly will make a good CB but he didn't get as many prem games as i thought he would last season - so he would need time to adjust etc

 

time we can't really afford...

 

saying that if we get a £20m+ bid Agger will go

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What are you babbling on about? Just because he's on loan, it doesn't mean he won't ever be permanent. Did Mascherano sit on the bench for months? Did Adebayor?

 

As for 'in the stands', people want to have the best players on the pitch. Only a psychotic moron would sooner have Lucas on the pitch over Şahin.

 

 

 

I said he's a better player, which he quite obviously is. That's based on actually watching him. I'd be shocked if you'd heard of him before we were linked. You seem to be pissed off because you're a Lucas fanatic.

 

 

 

Yeah, that's very similar. By similar, I mean totally different.

 

 

 

Great metaphor. When I say 'great', I mean 'shit'.

 

 

What Funnneeeee tried to say, which I agree with, no matter how talented any European player is (or non-European player in this case), there is no guarantees that he will be successful in the Premier League.

 

Plus I would not try him in a key position where you have to be very physical and aggressive, which Lucas already owns.

 

Actually sacrificing Lucas for Sahin in that position could backfire on you greatly, hamper the players confidence and invite pressure on him early on.

 

Therefore it makes sense in the grand scheme of things, to use Sahin further forward to see what he cant do before deciding where to play.

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What Funnneeeee tried to say, which I agree with, no matter how talented any European player is (or non-European player in this case), there is no guarantees that he will be successful in the Premier League.

 

Plus I would not try him in a key position where you have to be very physical and aggressive, which Lucas already owns.

 

Actually sacrificing Lucas for Sahin in that position could backfire on you greatly, hamper the players confidence and invite pressure on him early on.

 

Therefore it makes sense in the grand scheme of things, to use Sahin further forward to see what he cant do before deciding where to play.

 

Disagree. That's allowed.

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This whole 'no guarantee' thing is meaningless. Look at Suarez. Look at Carroll. Turn around three times and promise only to judge players on their attributes.

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What Funnneeeee tried to say, which I agree with, no matter how talented any European player is (or non-European player in this case), there is no guarantees that he will be successful in the Premier League.

 

Plus I would not try him in a key position where you have to be very physical and aggressive, which Lucas already owns.

 

Actually sacrificing Lucas for Sahin in that position could backfire on you greatly, hamper the players confidence and invite pressure on him early on.

 

Therefore it makes sense in the grand scheme of things, to use Sahin further forward to see what he cant do before deciding where to play.

 

He is not a player who would play instead of Lucas - he is a player who would play next to Lucas. He has never functioned as the main ball winner.

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This whole 'no guarantee' thing is meaningless. Look at Suarez. Look at Carroll. Turn around three times and promise only to judge players on their attributes.

 

I would not call it meaningless, there has been a long line of talented footballers who came to the Premier League (some of whom had huge reputations) only to fall flat on their faces.

 

Put it this way, it makes more sense to have more faith in Allen than in Sahin at this point.

 

He is not a player who would play instead of Lucas - he is a player who would play next to Lucas. He has never functioned as the main ball winner.

 

Well, that's the meat of the debate I am having with Hank about where Sahin would play.

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I would not call it meaningless, there has been a long line of talented footballers who came to the Premier League (some of whom had huge reputations) only to fall flat on their faces.

 

Put it this way, it makes more sense to have more faith in Allen than in Sahin at this point.

 

No it doesn't at all. This discussion ended when we purchases Carroll, Downing, Henderson and Adam ahead of other players.

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Never said otherwise, just thought I clear up some of the clutter in Funnneeeee response.

 

Seems was getting a bit heated there, where there was no need to.

 

Hank is being a bit of a tool on this.

 

Hank, love, you don't go dropping Lucas after we've all spent 6 months saying how much we miss him. Go tell Carra that you want to drop Lucas for Sahin, and get ready for the sort of stare that could stop time.

 

I'm not a Lucas-lover per se, I used to fucking wail on him, but there's a time and a place to start thinking about perhaps upgrading on Lucas, and it isn't now.

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No it doesn't at all. This discussion ended when we purchases Carroll, Downing, Henderson and Adam ahead of other players.

 

Case in point?

 

They all came from teams that were set up around their unique attributes:

  1. Newcastle and Carroll: Played root one football, designed to get the best out of Carroll attributes.
  2. Aston Villa and Downing: Played pretty much counter attcking football that took advantage of Downing pace and crossing ability.
  3. Sunderland and Henderson: Played him as a central attcking midfielder, most of their build up went through him, especially in the final third.
  4. Blackpool and Adam: Playing Adam in the middle allowed Blackpool to set up in such a way that Adam was picking them up with his long range passing, also a key part in their build up.

 

Sahin is coming from a different league together; he might be a hit like Suarez, or he might be a miss like Aquilani. Either way, the lack of experience in the Premier will play a bigger part than the aforementioned players.

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Guest Numero Veinticinco
.

 

Hank, love, you don't go dropping Lucas after we've all spent 6 months saying how much we miss him.

 

We haven't 'all' be saying it though, have we.

 

Go tell Carra that you want to drop Lucas for Sahin, and get ready for the sort of stare that could stop time.

 

Who gives a fuck?

 

I'm not a Lucas-lover per se, I used to fucking wail on him, but there's a time and a place to start thinking about perhaps upgrading on Lucas, and it isn't now.

 

'Wail on him'. Are you a Californian cheerleader? It's not about upgrading, it's about having a strong squad for the initial price of wages. He's better than Lucas, quite easily, so if we got him he'd play.

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Sahin is coming from a different league together; he might be a hit like Suarez, or he might be a miss like Aquilani. Either way, the lack of experience in the Premier will play a bigger part than the aforementioned players.

 

Again, I think that's total and utter nonsense. This is based on lack of knowledge of the player.

 

Would you apply this same 'logic' to Messi or Higuain?

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when was the last time we actually made a really good signing from another Premier League side

 

Johnson has been good but at 17million you'd expect so, Enrique started off excellently then was poor towards the end, Adam started off good then was poor, Downing, Carroll, Henderson and Cole have all not been good enough so far but do all at leat have the chance to redeem themselves and I think Carroll and Henderson especially have the attributes to do so if given the chance but none will ever be considered value signings, Keane utter shite, Bellamy did well but not outstanding, same with Crouch and Benayoun just value for money, Mascherano doesn't really count as a West Ham player

 

so all of our really good signings in recent years have been from abroad (and relatively cheap in most cases) Reina, Alonso, Mascherano, Torres, Agger, Suarez, Skrtel, Lucas, Garcia, Arbeloa etc, not to say we shouldn't buy from the premier league if its the right player but we've done it abysmally recently

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