Go fuck yourselves FSG

[dockers_strike]

14 minutes ago, Scott_M said:

You could quite easily go further and say given the UK is in worst recession since WW2 and given forecasts in unemployment levels, they could have under-estimated how many people would be in a position to pay £70+ for a shirt?

 

Or, I’m assuming these shirts are made in some more of the under privileged areas of the world, what would social distancing look like in these factories and would they be able to make the same volume based on reduced staff?

 

These are all hypotheticals, none of us know anything behind all this really. To me the above doesn’t seem unfesable.

 

Which if shirts weren’t available, could be considered a problem. But they are. So getting angry about lack of supply absolutely nonsense!

Again, wouldnt disagree. Forecasting anything is very difficult. Under estimate and you have a shortage, over estimate and you have over supply.

 

I tend to use my John Henry shill money to put towards a new shirt but it's not going to make the cut for these inflated Nike prices. So, if they included me in their projections, they made a mistake!

[Scott_M]

16 minutes ago, dockers_strike said:

Again, wouldnt disagree. Forecasting anything is very difficult. Under estimate and you have a shortage, over estimate and you have over supply.

Tell me about it. My job at the moment is like trying to hit a moving target, using a bow and arrow, while blindfolded and with 1 arm behind my back!

 

Anyhoo, back to Nike. Given the uncertainty in the worlds economical position and all the unknowns at the moment, I think a lack of supply would be understandable (more than lack of data as I’m sure LFC are aware of how many shirts NB sold) which again would be an issue, if it were true. Which it isn’t. 

[Barrington Womble]

2 hours ago, No2 said:

You can order for delivery on August 31st, not ideal but it's not losing business totally. They also direct you to Nike for presale on the new 2nd kit.  I know I'm becoming a shrill but I really don't see an issue with it.

It's not 1948, it's pretty fucking pathetic there is no stock in the club shop, although I suspect that's more likely LFC incompetence than Nike. There was also a shortage on sports direct this week though, but someone told me that's sorted now. The launch was delayed, there's no excuse for it imo. 

[Harry Squatter]

I'm gonna go and order it from Barnett Shieldhouse in Walton. 

 

I ordered a Topper Brazil kit from there once,said it would take 3 months to turn up and never did. My Dad must have phoned them about 200 times.

[Scott_M]

3 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

It's not 1948, it's pretty fucking pathetic there is no stock in the club shop, although I suspect that's more likely LFC incompetence than Nike. There was also a shortage on sports direct this week though, but someone told me that's sorted now. The launch was delayed, there's no excuse for it imo. 

While it clearly isn’t ideal, given people are relying more on online purchases & delivery at the moment (see Amazon’s current stock increases as an example), I’d say it’s a possibility that more have ordered online rather than going to their local sports shop to purchase one.

 

There were plenty of shirts in the actual shop on Tuesday. 

 

Also, I’ve no idea if Sports Direct off the same champions sleeve patches / lettering & numbers, which would again rely on buying from LFC.

 

It is a positive the club have managed the message there won’t be any until 31/8. In the past we’d have taken the money & not set expectations.

[No2]

17 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

It's not 1948, it's pretty fucking pathetic there is no stock in the club shop, although I suspect that's more likely LFC incompetence than Nike. There was also a shortage on sports direct this week though, but someone told me that's sorted now. The launch was delayed, there's no excuse for it imo. 

It's not Persil we're selling, people won't go and buy Ariel instead. They will order it and receive it we'll before we kick another ball.

 

[dockers_strike]

34 minutes ago, Scott_M said:

While it clearly isn’t ideal, given people are relying more on online purchases & delivery at the moment (see Amazon’s current stock increases as an example), I’d say it’s a possibility that more have ordered online rather than going to their local sports shop to purchase one.

 

There were plenty of shirts in the actual shop on Tuesday. 

 

Also, I’ve no idea if Sports Direct off the same champions sleeve patches / lettering & numbers, which would again rely on buying from LFC.

 

It is a positive the club have managed the message there won’t be any until 31/8. In the past we’d have taken the money & not set expectations.

Correct. The club's main supplier has just changed over and that was delayed while NB were rightfully given the opportunity to be recognised as the club's kit supplier.

 

NB didnt provide any new stock of shirts to the club despite the club asking them to do so. Some disingenuous people could take NB to task for taking their ball home over losing the contract but there you go.

 

Could Nike have pre stocked items? Well they werent even able to officially unveil the new shirts until 1 August, that 14 days ago.

 

It doesnt even take into account this virus situation that put most of the world into lock down and inhibited the movement of all but essential goods. Even supermarkets had shortages of bogrolls and virtually everything else.

 

There's always logistical issues with a new supply chain etc.

[Barrington Womble]

49 minutes ago, Scott_M said:

While it clearly isn’t ideal, given people are relying more on online purchases & delivery at the moment (see Amazon’s current stock increases as an example), I’d say it’s a possibility that more have ordered online rather than going to their local sports shop to purchase one.

 

There were plenty of shirts in the actual shop on Tuesday. 

 

Also, I’ve no idea if Sports Direct off the same champions sleeve patches / lettering & numbers, which would again rely on buying from LFC.

 

It is a positive the club have managed the message there won’t be any until 31/8. In the past we’d have taken the money & not set expectations.

but you are saying this like it is a surprise that people may buy more online. it isn't and is entirely predictable and has been since march. they've had plenty of time to sort this and volumes of sales are crucial to the clubs rewards on the kit more than ever. No matter any way people try to spin it, it is incompetence at some level if you can't meet demand.

 

You can't get the same badges off SportsDirect (just premier league). and only adult numbers (in the PL variety). and no numbers for shorts. But that's not new news either, that has always been the case. 

36 minutes ago, No2 said:

It's not Persil we're selling, people won't go and buy Ariel instead. They will order it and receive it we'll before we kick another ball.

 

So here's one example of 2 x £125 kits they haven't and hopefully won't sell. I always buy my kids at least one kit per season, my eldest actually isn't that fussed but gets swept up with the youngest and her enthusiasm. I went to order it yesterday (1st chance I had since we went away). As soon as it was pre-order only, my eldest just said "the summer will be over by the time it comes, don't bother". My youngest said "let's wait till one of the other kits comes out". So up to now I won't be spending at least £125 with the shop as my eldest has backed out. I might even persuade my youngest to have something else - or i might order a jarg one from china as the kit is fucking jarg anyway.

 

Liverpool make this deal work by selling to people who aren't desperate to have one - those who are desperate, I would guess ordered before today or will go into a physical store somewhere. It's part of why we moved to Nike, because of their increased reach at a time where pretty much anyone in the world could just shop online - get a shirt in someones eye and create an impulse sale. The success 100% needs people like me to buy 2 and maybe the kits to be nice enough for me to buy them more than one (last season they got the red kit, the 3rd kit and would have had the home goalie kit had they not sold out too). So last season they got 4 kits out of me, they could have got 6 (the black goalie kit i actually bought jarg from china, it was spot on and i got in 3 weeks when it took LFC 3 months to restock). Up to now all they've managed to do is get zero out of me and i suspect the maximum they will get is 1 kit. It seems pretty unlikely with a club of our size I am the only one in that position. 

 

Any idea it doesn't matter that we are out of stock is fanciful and if rick parry was still here he would rightly be getting absolutely slaughtered for running us like a corner shop. 

 

EDIT: and one final thing about that "persil" nonsense. Actually, loads and loads of the kids all over the world pick players now and not clubs. If their dad can't get them a mo salah liverpool shirt, he might well buy him a messi barca short or some other top player. having kits in stock is just such a priority. 

[Rotpeter]

3 hours ago, Scott_M said:

I’m forever amazed at the amount of accountants, auditors, budget analysts, controllers, forecasters, economists, financial experts and legal / financial lawyers this forum has. 
 

 

Any excuse to post my new favourite GIF. 

Yeah, almost as many of them as ITKs.

[Scott_M]

18 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

but you are saying this like it is a surprise that people may buy more online. it isn't and is entirely predictable and has been since march. they've had plenty of time to sort this and volumes of sales are crucial to the clubs rewards on the kit more than ever. No matter any way people try to spin it, it is incompetence at some level if you can't meet demand.

 

And if the Nike factories had to work on reduced staffing levels due to COVID19?

 

I obviously don't know if that has happened but given it's happened around the world, it's not an impossibility.

 

Either way, not ideal, it's really not a huge issue. You should be able to get it from LFC, but you have options if not - you wait to 31/8 to get from LFC, you get it straight away from Nike or you go to a shop. It's hardly trying to buy Tracey Island on Christmas Eve.

[Barrington Womble]

11 minutes ago, Scott_M said:

 

And if the Nike factories had to work on reduced staffing levels due to COVID19?

 

I obviously don't know if that has happened but given it's happened around the world, it's not an impossibility.

 

Either way, not ideal, it's really not a huge issue. You wait to 31/8 to get from LFC, you get it straight away from Nike or you go to a shop. It's hardly trying to buy Tracey Island on Christmas Eve.

if the problem is nike's, i would rather hope that means we can punish them contractually for failing to deliver, especially as we are rewarded on sales. If you were nike and you have to make decisions on who's kit to sell and priroritise in manufacturing and one is on 5-10% royalties and the other is on 20%, who would you prioritise?

 

And I would suggest LFC would make more money selling via the club shop rather than via Nike. We get 20% royalties no matter where we sell. But at LFC we will also take the retailers margin. In addition to this the club have complained about having to meet the furloughing of staff during covid and how they will need to recover that money from elsewhere as it wasn't good PR to take it from the government. Well you would like to think they would be trying to extract maximum return. 

 

As I keep saying, if rick parry allowed this to happen we'd hammer him. 

[Scott_M]

3 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

if the problem is nike's, i would rather hope that means we can punish them contractually for failing to deliver, especially as we are rewarded on sales. If you were nike and you have to make decisions on who's kit to sell and one is on 5-10% royalties and the other is on 20%, who would you prioritise?

 

And I would suggest LFC would make more money selling via the club shop rather than via Nike. We get 20% royalties no matter where we sell. But at LFC we will also take the retailers margin. In addition to this the club have complained about having to meet the furloughing of staff during covid and how they will need to recover that money from elsewhere as it wasn't good PR to take it from the government. Well you would like to think they would be trying to extract maximum return. 

 

As I keep saying, if rick parry allowed this to happen we'd hammer him. 

 

Firstly, we don't know if there is / isn't a penalty for not meeting demand, so there is no point speculating on it (although like you, I hope there would be). 

 

Obviously I think there might be potentially mitigating circumstances behind low stock, you don't agree, no worries. There are examples of other products being delayed this year - I've read PS5's and iPhones might slip release dates, I don't see why we should be exempt from issues that are effecting numerous other global conglomerates around the world.

 

Even taking this into consideration, we've still set records for how many we've sold!

[No2]

20 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

but you are saying this like it is a surprise that people may buy more online. it isn't and is entirely predictable and has been since march. they've had plenty of time to sort this and volumes of sales are crucial to the clubs rewards on the kit more than ever. No matter any way people try to spin it, it is incompetence at some level if you can't meet demand.

 

You can't get the same badges off SportsDirect (just premier league). and only adult numbers (in the PL variety). and no numbers for shorts. But that's not new news either, that has always been the case. 

So here's one example of 2 x £125 kits they haven't and hopefully won't sell. I always buy my kids at least one kit per season, my eldest actually isn't that fussed but gets swept up with the youngest and her enthusiasm. I went to order it yesterday (1st chance I had since we went away). As soon as it was pre-order only, my eldest just said "the summer will be over by the time it comes, don't bother". My youngest said "let's wait till one of the other kits comes out". So up to now I won't be spending at least £125 with the shop as my eldest has backed out. I might even persuade my youngest to have something else - or i might order a jarg one from china as the kit is fucking jarg anyway.

 

Liverpool make this deal work by selling to people who aren't desperate to have one - those who are desperate, I would guess ordered before today or will go into a physical store somewhere. It's part of why we moved to Nike, because of their increased reach at a time where pretty much anyone in the world could just shop online - get a shirt in someones eye and create an impulse sale. The success 100% needs people like me to buy 2 and maybe the kits to be nice enough for me to buy them more than one (last season they got the red kit, the 3rd kit and would have had the home goalie kit had they not sold out too). So last season they got 4 kits out of me, they could have got 6 (the black goalie kit i actually bought jarg from china, it was spot on and i got in 3 weeks when it took LFC 3 months to restock). Up to now all they've managed to do is get zero out of me and i suspect the maximum they will get is 1 kit. It seems pretty unlikely with a club of our size I am the only one in that position. 

 

Any idea it doesn't matter that we are out of stock is fanciful and if rick parry was still here he would rightly be getting absolutely slaughtered for running us like a corner shop. 

 

EDIT: and one final thing about that "persil" nonsense. Actually, loads and loads of the kids all over the world pick players now and not clubs. If their dad can't get them a mo salah liverpool shirt, he might well buy him a messi barca short or some other top player. having kits in stock is just such a priority. 

Maybe John W had you blacklisted for being a FSG hater? In all seriousness though, £125 for a kids kit, no wonder they don't have any, they probably assumed no one would be mental enough to pay it.

[Scott_M]

My final post on this - Nike didn’t have 3 months to work around COVID19. Given large parts of the world have been under lockdown until June / July, they had a significantly shorter timescale. 

[Barrington Womble]

3 hours ago, No2 said:

Maybe John W had you blacklisted for being a FSG hater? In all seriousness though, £125 for a kids kit, no wonder they don't have any, they probably assumed no one would be mental enough to pay it.

It's fucking mental is what it is. Last year with NB it was just under 100, I think maybe 96 and that was quite an increase in the year before. 

3 hours ago, Scott_M said:

 

Firstly, we don't know if there is / isn't a penalty for not meeting demand, so there is no point speculating on it (although like you, I hope there would be). 

 

Obviously I think there might be potentially mitigating circumstances behind low stock, you don't agree, no worries. There are examples of other products being delayed this year - I've read PS5's and iPhones might slip release dates, I don't see why we should be exempt from issues that are effecting numerous other global conglomerates around the world.

 

Even taking this into consideration, we've still set records for how many we've sold!

Absolutely we don't know about a clause. But if there's manufacturing or supply chain issues it matters not, as it will cost Nike. But if we're going to load a contract that relies on us selling, running out is shit. I don't see how it's up for debate. They made a big deal out of the cloth was already bought way back when the court case was on and covid lockdown here was much later than China, iirc China were full steam ahead by around mid April. And they were open enough for the press to investigate how little wages Nike we're paying! But anyways enough of it now. You seem happy with it, as does no2. I think we should be better and it's not the 1st time we've underestimated demand. 

 

I've not seen anything about volume of sales. 

[Scott_M]

5 minutes ago, The Gaul said:

It's fucking mental is what it is. Last year with NB it was just under 100, I think maybe 96 and that was quite an increase in the year before. 

Absolutely we don't know about a clause. But if there's manufacturing or supply chain issues it matters not, as it will cost Nike. But if we're going to load a contract that relies on us selling, running out is shit. I don't see how it's up for debate. They made a big deal out of the cloth was already bought way back when the court case was on and covid lockdown here was much later than China, iirc China were full steam ahead by around mid April. And they were open enough for the press to investigate how little wages Nike we're paying! But anyways enough of it now. You seem happy with it, as does no2. I think we should be better and it's not the 1st time we've underestimated demand. 

 

I've not seen anything about volume of sales. 

1) We don’t know if there is a clause so no point debating. However, like you, I’d hope there is a penalty for Nike to pay.

 

2) I agree it’s not ideal that the clubs online business isn’t fully stocked with them but customers have plenty of other options on where to purchase from places that do have stock. I’ve also stated reasons why (preference for online, champions flashes / names etc) might well have contributed to a shortfall. 
 

3) Although we were full steam ahead by mid-April, I’d suggest COVID19 put a spanner in the works. A Google tells me Nike shirts are primarily made in Bangladesh and Thailand, both of which have had extensive lockdowns. 
 

4) On the sales...

 

https://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/liverpool-fans-only-losers-with-new-nike-home-kit-break-record-sales-a4520951.html

[Reckoner]

Surely they can just whip the Bangladeshi slave children a bit harder until all the westerner ungrateful spoilt brats are happy?

[Daisy]

11 hours ago, Nummer Neunzehn said:

There’s a reason they lost. You’re taking out of your hat if you think we signed a deal worse than the one we already had. 
 

FFS. 

Yeah they lost, but there is a reason that experienced corporate lawyers would have thought they had a chance of winning. 

 

Best case - the deal is only marginally better than what we had, and more likely if the pandemic continues it will be less than what we had with new balance. 

[Tony Moanero]

7 hours ago, Doctor Troy said:

I'm gonna go and order it from Barnett Shieldhouse in Walton. 

 

I ordered a Topper Brazil kit from there once,said it would take 3 months to turn up and never did. My Dad must have phoned them about 200 times.

I bought a Topper Brazil shirt in a little shop that was in St John’s. Can’t remember what it was called.

 

This one

 

 

This one was better, though, and is in my top 100 footy kits of all time.

 

[Numero Veinticinco]

1 hour ago, Daisy said:

Yeah they lost, but there is a reason that experienced corporate lawyers would have thought they had a chance of winning. 

 

Best case - the deal is only marginally better than what we had, and more likely if the pandemic continues it will be less than what we had with new balance. 

I’m going to trust the billionaire businessmen on this one, I’m afraid. 

[Scott_M]

1 hour ago, Reckoner said:

Surely they can just whip the Bangladeshi slave children a bit harder until all the westerner ungrateful spoilt brats are happy?

Who cares if Dhaka is also a COVID19 hotspot. 
 

Whip the little fuckers into earning their 75p a day.

 

If a few die along the way, so be it, as long as LFC online is fully stocked...

[Scott_M]

1 hour ago, Daisy said:

Best case - the deal is only marginally better than what we had, and more likely if the pandemic continues it will be less than what we had with new balance. 

 
Can you enlighten us onto the evidence you are basing this on please?

 

Unless your blaming Nike & LFC for the failure to predict a worldwide epidemic and worldwide recession, I’m not sure I follow?

 

Fuck me, some complete crackpots on this site. If only people would start posting on the MF again. 
 

Next outlandish theory will be FSG brewed COVID19 on purpose so they can have another quiet transfer window, allowing Linda to buy another Savannah cat.

[Scott_M]

6 minutes ago, Nummer Neunzehn said:

I’m going to trust the billionaire businessmen on this one, I’m afraid. 

Now that’s CRAZY talk.

[Daisy]

35 minutes ago, Nummer Neunzehn said:

I’m going to trust the billionaire businessmen on this one, I’m afraid. 

Maybe they will personally get some kickback to increase that personal wealth but the deal they have got for the club is simply not as good as Man Utd got, 6 years ago. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

1 minute ago, Daisy said:

Maybe they will personally get some kickback to increase that personal wealth but the deal they have got for the club is simply not as good as Man Utd got, 6 years ago. 

Or, ya know, maybe it’s an excellent deal.