Wigan at Home 24/03/12

[Jairzinho]

I think it means we put a couple of youngsters on the bench.

[Paco]

I think it means we put a couple of youngsters on the bench.

 

average age of our most played premier league players is under 27 and that's excluding shelvey, flanagan and sterling. now of some of them could stop playing like they're 57 we'd be getting somewhere.

[piscinin]

It's not taking one for the team it's mollycoddling under performing players. There's protecting players but then there's going too far. Wigan where the better team because there will to win was better than ours we deserved to lose and not through tiredness but because players aren't performing, I think fans deserved honesty after that performance more than the players need an arm around their shoulder. I been annoyed by some of Kenny's after game interviews but yesterday I just felt gutted by it.

 

I don't think we should sack him but I want to see action from the manager, not persist with the same non working shit or same players that offer next to zero on the pitch. Kenny and the back room staff don't seem to be reacting to our problems just hoping for the best and I'm tired of hearing about a wee bit of luck, it's not luck that puts the ball past the post it's skill.

 

I don't disagree with much of that, but let's not play him as some old doddering deluded guy who is in denial. He's not. He just felt the players needed protecting more than you needed a sacrificial lamb to tear to pieces. If the press didn't exist he'd no doubt leave a few offerings, but with them around these things have a way of gathering an inexorable momentum that he can't afford.

 

Look at Lucas, look at what happened to benitez when he called out senior players. The man who refused to grieve the death of his father. These things aren't as simple as we would like them to be and no matter what you do you are wrong.

 

As for the problems on the pitch, the solution to that isn't in the squad he has. So he has to nurse them through until the end of the season and see if FSG are going to give him a chance to fix the mistakes.

[Jairzinho]

average age of our most played premier league players is under 27 and that's excluding shelvey, flanagan and sterling. now of some of them could stop playing like they're 57 we'd be getting somewhere.

 

I think quite a lot of them are actually play more like they're 17. There seems such a lack of maturity, a lack of wisdom. Lots of aimless jogging, but not a lot of intelligent movement.

[xerxes]

I don't disagree with much of that, but let's not play him as some old doddering deluded guy who is in denial. He's not. He just felt the players needed protecting more than you needed a sacrificial lamb to tear to pieces. If the press didn't exist he'd no doubt leave a few offerings, but with them around these things have a way of gathering an inexorable momentum that he can't afford.

 

Look at Lucas, look at what happened to benitez when he called out senior players. The man who refused to grieve the death of his father. These things aren't as simple as we would like them to be and no matter what you do you are wrong.

 

As for the problems on the pitch, the solution to that isn't in the squad he has. So he has to nurse them through until the end of the season and see if FSG are going to give him a chance to fix the mistakes.

 

A well argued point of view.

[smicer07]

Where's this 100m bollocks coming from? We may have spent that but we also lost 50m plus worth of talent. The owners haven't put their hands in their pockets yet.

[Marko121]

Where's this 100m bollocks coming from? We may have spent that but we also lost 50m plus worth of talent. The owners haven't put their hands in their pockets yet.

 

This is something that is rarely remembered.

 

Whilst our owners are not G & H, we should not kid ourselves that they are cuddly John and Tom who are here for our benefit or cos they love LFC

 

FWIW, I dont think they have any intention of spending a lot of their own money and they are looking for us to be self sufficient. Whilst this is much more prefferable that what the last set of cunts were trying to do, we will not get back to where we need to be without major investment. Once we get back there, we can then look after ourselves to a greater degree, but not now.

[xerxes]

This is something that is rarely remembered(Where's this 100m bollocks coming from? We may have spent that but we also lost 50m plus worth of talent. The owners haven't put their hands in their pockets yet).

 

Whilst our owners are not G & H, we should not kid ourselves that they are cuddly John and Tom who are here for our benefit or cos they love LFC

 

FWIW, I dont think they have any intention of spending a lot of their own money and they are looking for us to be self sufficient. Whilst this is much more prefferable that what the last set of cunts were trying to do, we will not get back to where we need to be without major investment. Once we get back there, we can then look after ourselves to a greater degree, but not now.

 

You are right to point out that we do not know how he net spend has been financed yet - there is no evidence that it has been by FSG cash injection.

 

I don't understand your last two sentences. Without major cash investment thetre is jo way that we can self-generate sufficient cash to compete at the top.

[TheDrowningMan]

Where's this 100m bollocks coming from? We may have spent that but we also lost 50m plus worth of talent. The owners haven't put their hands in their pockets yet.

 

It's not bollocks at all, it's an irrefutable fact that Kenny has spent about £100m. Regardless of how that was generated and who he had to replace, he's spent about £100m and he's spent about £70m of it in an unprecedentedly poor way.

[Bobby Hundreds]

If we don't have real investment into the side we won't improve enough to be successful, to win more money and attract bigger sponsors. There's no way fsg can expect the club to compete at the very top with minimal investment which is what the club earns, we don't have a great side 20 million a season won't cut it at the minute. We are Liverpool we rarely scout quality cheap players. We buy shite in large quantities it's our thing.

[Newport]

All of you who spouts shite about the post-match interviews should listen to the last podcast. Actually, why haven't you done it already. Criticism is fair and well deserved, but do you really think Kenny is going to slag off his players after the game to please the journalists?

[smicer07]

 

It's not bollocks at all, it's an irrefutable fact that Kenny has spent about £100m. Regardless of how that was generated and who he had to replace, he's spent about £100m and he's spent about £70m of it in an unprecedentedly poor way.

 

But net spend is the important issue here.

[Danny_Kop]

Very poor performance, Definately need to spend in the summer.

 

Was good seeing Raheem Sterling getting on though, seemed quite lively.

[Guest San Don]

All of you who spouts shite about the post-match interviews should listen to the last podcast. Actually, why haven't you done it already. Criticism is fair and well deserved, but do you really think Kenny is going to slag off his players after the game to please the journalists?

 

Is correct but too many people think he should go public just so they can believe he has.

 

People need to grow a pair. People are already now calling the owners for 'not putting their hands in their pocket.' So, we are to believe these people want us to be run on the chelshit model and comerade ambramovich's model, a model that they despise?

 

Or do they want us run on a smaller version of the chelshit model then they can still whinge that we arent buying the 'top' players?

[Gym Beglin]

But net spend is the important issue here.

 

No, it's not, stop.

 

We didn't sell a £50m player, we sold him for that but he was never worth it.

 

If I was FSG there ain't no fucking way I'd throw money into this at the moment. It's such a ludicrous risk considering the facts in front of them. Kenny and Comolli are in no position to demand anything from them until they right their wrongs by selling the dross they bought. Yes it'll be a massive loss on the outlay, but it'll at least be a sign that they are admitting culpability and trying to redress it. THEN they might be in a position to ask for some money.

 

Kenny is doing more harm than good, I don't think he realises it, he's too driven to succeed and will not admit defeat, but at what cost?

If he sells the players and generates some spending money, great, let's start again. If he doesn't, then he's got to be pushed this Summer.

 

I will never begrudge Kenny making a few mistakes, but I will lose a lot of respect for him if he refuses to admit them and allow us to suffer any longer with these cowardly bastards on the field.

[piscinin]

If we don't have real investment into the side we won't improve enough to be successful, to win more money and attract bigger sponsors. There's no way fsg can expect the club to compete at the very top with minimal investment which is what the club earns, we don't have a great side 20 million a season won't cut it at the minute. We are Liverpool we rarely scout quality cheap players. We buy shite in large quantities it's our thing.

 

What we need is a manager who specializes in getting under-resourced teams over-performing . . .

[TheDrowningMan]

But net spend is the important issue here.

 

Selling £70m worth of players and spending upwards of £100m on replacements doesn't mean the vast majority of that has to be spunked by decree on utter shit. That's just crap scouting and awful management.

[PaulMcC]

If he's recouped 70m and spent 100m, he's only spent 30m.

 

Still spent loads of money poorly.

[TheDrowningMan]

If he's recouped 70m and spent 100m, he's only spent 30m.

 

Still spent loads of money poorly.

 

He's still spent £100m. He has, yes, recouped money, which he's in turn spent, and spent appallingly.

[Marko121]

You are right to point out that we do not know how he net spend has been financed yet - there is no evidence that it has been by FSG cash injection.

 

I don't understand your last two sentences. Without major cash investment thetre is jo way that we can self-generate sufficient cash to compete at the top.

 

Sorry if I wasn't clear. What I mean is - if FSG want us to be self sufficient now, we will finish 7th ish every year. At this point of the season, the table doesn't lie. However, if FSG want us to compete for the title, they need to invest to get us up to that level and once we are there generating prize money, sponsorship and attracting better players, we can then be left to our own devices to an extent and be tinkered with every year not the major surgery that has been needed for some time.

[xerxes]

(but do you really think Kenny is going to slag off his players after the game to please the journalists?)Is correct but too many people think he should go public just so they can believe he has.

 

People need to grow a pair. People are already now calling the owners for 'not putting their hands in their pocket.' So, we are to believe these people want us to be run on the chelshit model and comerade ambramovich's model, a model that they despise?

 

Or do they want us run on a smaller version of the chelshit model then they can still whinge that we arent buying the 'top' players?

 

Firstly, those interviews are relayed to the fans. The fans understand when they are being taken for mugs.

 

If you say after the QPR game that the players are not tired and are amongst the fittest in the league - and then claim after playing Wigan Athletic that the players are tired, you deserve what's coming to you.

 

We don't know how the net spend has been financed- we will find out soon enough.

 

Chelsea and Man City are supported by owners of great wealth, Arsenal and Man u have stadia churning out an extra £1.5m revenue a game.

 

Contrary to what Ayre thinks, that gap will not be bridged by a new club shop in Kuala Lumpar and a Polynesian language LFC website. It will take significant net investment in the team - and the stadium to self generate enhanced revenues in the future.

 

We cannot compete for the best players now - that is the problem. Much of the goodwill to FSG has been forthcoming because they are not G&H. That warm glow does not last forever.

[xerxes]

But net spend is the important issue here.

Net spend (£30 odd million) is the measure of the extent to which FSG are supporting us (or loaded the club with debt which they have not underwritten).

 

Gross spend is the measure by which Comolli and Kenny are judged, how much have they spent, and what have we got for each pound spent ( around £100 odd million).

[Satan]

We cannot compete for the best players now - that is the problem. Much of the goodwill to FSG has been forthcoming because they are not G&H. That warm glow does not last forever.

 

 

Lets be realistic - who can? City, Real, Barcelona, yes, but the rest? I don't see Utd dishing out that much money on a player, I doubt Chelsea can go on like that and neither does Arsenal. I don't think we need to be too worried about the moeny part. The more serious question is what do we have to offer, as an example lets take a player like Cavani. Why would he come here? Past glories?

 

We need to strengthen our squad and improve our first XI - one player won't cut it. Three or four decent/good players are a gamble, if they don't work out, we will have very serious problems next season. Chelsea and Arsenal will be better, Spurs won't fall off like that (unless they lose Modric) and City and Utd...oh well.

 

FSG has to invest some decent money in the summer and paying over the odds for one star signing won't help or be good enough to really make a push for better things.

[clangers]

As many have pointed out when we're referring to Kenny spending £110 million or so we're referring to disposable income made up of player sales (in the case of Torres for a significant profit) and something around £37 million of new money (we don't know exactly where that came from).

 

If there is one saving grace it's that FSG haven't really had to put a significant amount of new money in yet. By the summer they'll have been owners for nearly two seasons, realistically if they want us in the top four they are going to have to invest at some point.

 

They bought a club that wasn't top four material at the time so if they want us back there any time soon they're going to have stump up a significant investment.

[stringvest]

 

What we need is a manager who specializes in getting under-resourced teams over-performing . . .

 

I've always liked Moyes too...