Kenny's future

[corro]

Can't say i'm surprised to see such a shit house thread on here! The anti Kenny Taliban is imminent! I fucking hate the modern football fan!

 

The old school do themselves no favours mate. Kenny came in to help us out when we needed him and he has never let us down . Ever.

[ngogswilly]

KD needs time and money to sort this shit out. He's made mistakes in the transfer market, and in his team selections. We may finish in 10th this season. There is no room for sentiment in this game.

 

But this is Kenny Dalglish. I cannot believe anyone would not want him to have a chance to put this right. I have not lost the faith. I have spent too many times, boy and man, watching you repay that faith on and off the field. Come on Kenny. Come on Liverpool.

 

I'm the same way. I'm far from happy right now but for me theres no two ways about it. Kenny needs more time.

 

No matter how this season goes, he deserves another season.

[G Richards]

I think this is the sort of situation the owners were trying to avoid when they waited and waited to get rid of Roy. Had he been able to steady the ship after G&H, and get us to finish say 6-7, then the owners could have brought in their man for the long term in the summer. Instead, Roy was so bad that they needed to act, and since it was mid season, a caretaker was needed. Kenny was the man. And who can argue with what he did in the second half of last season? It filled us with such hope for this current campaign and he was, rightly based on performance, given the job beyond a caretaker tenure.

 

And now? Well, the upside is silverware in the cabinet. The downside is that with over a quarter of the season to go, a top four finish seems too far away, even for hopeful fans. That is just not good enough.

 

So they have a big decision to make this summer. If we want top four next year, we must invest wisely in the summer, not least on a striker and a winger. But will they do that given the question marks over some of the big buys of the past year?

 

I suppose the rest of the season will reveal more and we will then look at it in the summer.

[cracker]

I think this is the sort of situation the owners were trying to avoid when they waited and waited to get rid of Roy. Had he been able to steady the ship after G&H, and get us to finish say 6-7, then the owners could have brought in their man for the long term in the summer. Instead, Roy was so bad that they needed to act, and since it was mid season, a caretaker was needed. Kenny was the man. And who can argue with what he did in the second half of last season? It filled us with such hope for this current campaign and he was, rightly based on performance, given the job beyond a caretaker tenure.

 

And now? Well, the upside is silverware in the cabinet. The downside is that with over a quarter of the season to go, a top four finish seems too far away, even for hopeful fans. That is just not good enough.

 

So they have a big decision to make this summer. If we want top four next year, we must invest wisely in the summer, not least on a striker and a winger. But will they do that given the question marks over some of the big buys of the past year?

 

I suppose the rest of the season will reveal more and we will then look at it in the summer.

 

Thats a fair analysis - unlike various stuff I am reading on this forum and elsewhere. I can understand and tbh expect it from non LFC fans but a lot of it is from our fans which saddens me.

 

Yes I too am maybe more down about todays result than almost anything else this season as prior to today I (maybe stupidly) still had hopes for 4th as we have no 'top teams' to play away and can make up ground on CFC by beating them at home and AFC have a hard prog so will drop points. Also most games we have played well (like V AFC last week) but after losing today maybe it is too much to make up.

 

Oh well - we press on. get as many points as we can and evaluate it at the end of the season but imo sacking Kenny or moving him upstairs are non starters - imo Carroll not cutting it as a free scoring natural striker has cost us dearly - and I don't just mean 35m. FTs bombshell on 31st Jan last year led to us panic buying AC and really he does not fit the way Kenny would want LFC to play (which would be built around Luis' strengths - with a more clinical pacy main scorer instead of AC to help Luis) so to me if he went I'd not be sorry. Also Adam has looked a shadow of the player he was for BFC and altho I like Hendo's attitude i am not sure he'll ever be that good so thats 2 more we could bin. Personally I cannot understand the underuse of Shelvey as I am sure he could do at least as well as Hendo. Also Enrique defensively has looked shaky - but yes we do have to persevere with him.

 

In the summer i think we need smart business not mega bucks business and that will prob mean abroad - but KK knows who we are and what we want so we have to give him the chance to get it right. Maybe if it continued to go wrong in a year or 18 months time then serious questions would have to be asked - but I'd hate us to ever sack KK, I like to think he'd just walk away for the good of the club when the time comes as the guy has so much class but imo that time has nowhere near come yet.

[clangers]

Personally I think it would be a huge mistake to get rid of Kenny now despite the reservations many of us share. If we choose to go down that road then really we're Chelsea without the billions. We get a new manager in, give him funds and if it hasn't worked out by Christmas we're all baying for blood. We can't go down that route because clearly FSG don't have that level of resources and it's doubtful they spend like that even if they did.

 

We need to ask ourselves are we the type of club who if our manager has a bad six month spell or brings in a few failed transfers then we show him the door?

 

Clearly we've screwed up in the transfer market and brought in several big money buys that haven't worked out and obviously we've not improved the first team from the end of last season. I've no objection to the likes of Adam or Henderson being in the squad but as first team regulars and for differing reasons definitely not.

 

I'm not going to do all the superfan, flag waving in Kenny we trust nonsense. Despite his history with us his record during his tenure should be viewed objectively but equally we need to yet again show patience. Difficult I know, the inevitability of each year passing without success at the level we feel our club deserves brings frustration and impatience.

 

Summer is pretty much make or break for me, we need to show a bit of inventiveness with our transfers otherwise it really will be us done as a top flight force for a very long time.

 

There's definitely a good side in there somewhere, what worried me today was the performance was very much an end of season nothing to play for attitude. We've won a cup, lost to Arsenal so 4th place is out of the window and we can't be bothered giving it all until the FA Cup.

Edited March 11, 2012 by clangers

[Hades]

Unless Guardiola or Mourinho are available, the answer is pretty clearly to give the King another season to get into the CL. 18 months is too short a time to gel in 5 new signings.

[Randy Marsh]

depends how you see it. last season we finished 6th with 58 points. I don' think we'll improve on that this season so does winning the carling cup excuse a league season that is worse than a poor league season last year?

 

Personally I think we need to see improvement in league position at least every year. really the minimum should be 5th this season. I'd settle for 6th and the carling cup. below 6th and the 2 cups I could live with but the league has to be the priority next season

 

I'm not getting at you here mate as I Can totally understand what you are saying, but that is the problem with this club nowadays. We dont aim for first place. Second, or 4-6 is now acceptable. Mediocrity is acceptable. It's a real underlying problem with this clubs attitude and mentality. Until we stop tolerating mediocrity we won't be going anywhere.

[xerxes]

Unless Guardiola or Mourinho are available, the answer is pretty clearly to give the King another season to get into the CL. 18 months is too short a time to gel in 5 new signings.

 

 

What makes you think that Guardiola or Mourinho would come? It is part of the same flawed thought process that deems that Kenny is “not good enough” (for what?).

 

Kenny has another two seasons on his 80k a week contract – he isn’t going to walk away from that. No-one had given him a managers job for ten years previous, and he won’t get that again anywhere else.

 

From FSG’s perspective his first year has offered improvement, one cup (maybe two) and European football ( and J&L will have enjoyed their day out at Wembley).

 

Unless FSG pump significant net funds into the club, and there is no evidence that they will, a top four tilt will probably do for them financially. I fully expect Kenny to see out his contract.

[melons]

Could you at least when creating threads like this, make them public polls so i can come back and neg the fuckery out of the knob heads without reading their posts?

 

 

Cheers.

[kalasoma]

Knob heads have the right to privacy too!

[Skidfingers McGonical]

you don't give a manger £70m to spend to 'steady the ship'

 

Transition is a nice buzz word but from a period of desperation we should be showing signs of progress.

 

As said, Kenny will be given another season. lets see where we are from 12 months from now. Hopefully at least 10 points better off.

 

It's not a nice buzz word at all George. It's a fact.

 

You don't make the substantial squad changes we did and expect to hit the ground running. Never in a million years.

 

The only problem with our fan base and the reasons for the over reacting threads are that the majority set their expectations too high, so in turn they become desperate and start calling for the managers head.

 

We have not won the league for 20 years and people seem to think after the previous 'custodians' had left it would all be glory days again. It takes time for the radical changes we needed to move forward to take shape. It doesn't happen overnight. I would also change the phrase from season of transition to sustained period of transition.

 

Liverpool Football is all about winning trophies. Of we can't win the league, we win the cups we are competing in. People moaned about not winning anything for 6 years, we win something and 2 weeks later it's all talk about shifting Kenny, not being in transition, being shite and to be honest I could go in but I can't be arsed. Our Internet fan base has become like a petulant child demanding things yesterday. It's a joke.

 

People need to wake up and accept where we currently are at the moment.

 

Kenny has made mistakes, Downing and Adam the two big ones for me, and I would hope that he either a) shifts them out in the summer or b) brings in a better quality if player in their position so they solely become squat players.

 

Our performances on the whole have not been a abysmal as yesterday, and people need to take a step back and realise it's our finishing that has mostly let us down. Even through bad performances a goal here or there would have gotten us those extra points, however that does not excuse any bad performance. What it does mean is that many people would not be moaning if we had more points on the board and more goals in the + section no matter how poor the performance.

[Gav]

It's not a nice buzz word at all George. It's a fact.

 

You don't make the substantial squad changes we did and expect to hit the ground running. Never in a million years.

 

The only problem with our fan base and the reasons for the over reacting threads are that the majority set their expectations too high, so in turn they become desperate and start calling for the managers head.

 

We have not won the league for 20 years and people seem to think after the previous 'custodians' had left it would all be glory days again. It takes time for the radical changes we needed to move forward to take shape. It doesn't happen overnight. I would also change the phrase from season of transition to sustained period of transition.

 

Liverpool Football is all about winning trophies. Of we can't win the league, we win the cups we are competing in. People moaned about not winning anything for 6 years, we win something and 2 weeks later it's all talk about shifting Kenny, not being in transition, being shite and to be honest I could go in but I can't be arsed. Our Internet fan base has become like a petulant child demanding things yesterday. It's a joke.

 

People need to wake up and accept where we currently are at the moment.

 

Kenny has made mistakes, Downing and Adam the two big ones for me, and I would hope that he either a) shifts them out in the summer or b) brings in a better quality if player in their position so they solely become squat players.

 

Our performances on the whole have not been a abysmal as yesterday, and people need to take a step back and realise it's our finishing that has mostly let us down. Even through bad performances a goal here or there would have gotten us those extra points, however that does not excuse any bad performance. What it does mean is that many people would not be moaning if we had more points on the board and more goals in the + section no matter how poor the performance.

 

perfectly summed up ...our performances and style under Kenny have mostly been good,it says it all when the mancs turn up and park the bus and after the last 8 years of lets face it ,shit football,its a joy to see us return to our pass and move philosophy...Kenny really has only had 1 window to change things too ,the first one was fucked up by Torres and the last one was strangly unused .We had a good window when we shipped out the dross ,now we need to get the likes of Downing and co settled in and playing with consistancy...

You're far too easy on our internet knobs and gimps though ...

[spider-neil]

give kenny another season to put right his mistakes. you open a revolving door of managers and it wont stop, managers need time. and before anyone mentions that roy wasn't given time, roy utilised tactics that I didn't want to see perfected in the long term.

[SCOUSE TAPAS]

I think if there isnt some sort of turn around in the league games,alot is riding on the FA cup.

 

If we go out of the cup and theres no major turn around in winning league

games,then imo Kenny will offer his resignation at the end of the season.

 

The way it stands I think only winning the cup is what will make him at least think about not doing it.

 

I still think the same way over his appointment back as boss,when he took over for the rest of the season,imo he was the only person capable of pulling the club together.

 

I admit because of how well he done I change my mind about him taking it on full time.

 

Originally I didnt want him to take it as to me,he was on a hiding to nothing from the start,and as soon as his honeymoon period was over,the so called fans would be crawling out calling for him to go.

 

I didnt want to see that happening to a guy whos heart and soul is in the club.

 

To see and hear this starting to already happen is like a kick to the balls.

 

If theres one person in the history of the club since its start,who dosent deserve to be treated in a way so belittling of the fans wanting him out,its him.

 

It rips to pieces the whole values of the club and the fans imo.

 

To those of us who seen Kenny from his arrival at the club from Celtic and witnessed everything he achieved here,especially with the way he dealt with Hillsborough,they will know totally what I mean about having to watch and listen to calls for his head so soon.

 

I am not saying the fans who want him out etc are wrong because it has been a bit of let down the league form this season,it just hurts to see it being said about the guy who has gone way way beyond the normal expected from any person at a club.

[Liam]

Losing Torres and signing Carroll has defined our season. Had we kept Torres to partner Suarez or waited until the summer and signed a proper £20-30m striker, we would be a lot closer to a top 4 finish this season. Maybe Kenny is to blame for that, maybe the owners and Comolli. Either way, I dont think we need to do a lot in the summer but we do need some brave decisions over which PLAYERS come and go. The management of the club should remain in place. The rewards will be greater down the line with stability and the current structure in place.

[Unrighteous]

Flabbergasted by this thread. Deary me...

[billypilgrimnz]

Its less tactical and more that we simply don't have good enough players. Watching that last night, it is clear we have a raft of players who simply aren't all that amazing at close control, quick passing, dribbling or heading. Add to that a general lack of athleticism in some key areas and some of the worst "shooting" imaginable, and it's hardly surprising that we labour so often.

 

Now, you could pin the blame for that on the manager, as he asked for (or sanctioned) some of the deeply average players we have, but I still think it;s too early to write off Kenny's tactical skills. Well, except for using Henderson on the right still.

[gkmacca]

One of the reasons I've fallen out of love with football is the whole Champions League hype. I hate that pompous, long-winded, competition, with its over-long run and it's mind-numbingly dull early matches. So I hate the obsession with staring at the table and working out what will get any team to fourth place. And when I hear that we won't get decent players unless we're in that over-rich fart of an 'event' I feel nothing but contempt for such players. Winning the league is another matter, of course,and that leads me to the same kind of frustration as everyone else, because that seems ages away from becoming a reality. How long should Kenny (and semi-forgotten man Steve Clarke) get? Certainly at least another year before he's given the chance to move upstairs with dignity intact (as far as any great man can have his dignity intact these days with forums full of rabid nutters hurling abuse on a minute-by-minute basis). Unless LFC gets as much cash as Spurs, at least, for players, I don't feel that confident about any manager improving things in the league. I'll have hope, but that's it.

[kalasoma]

Losing Torres and signing Carroll has defined our season. Had we kept Torres to partner Suarez or waited until the summer and signed a proper £20-30m striker, we would be a lot closer to a top 4 finish this season. Maybe Kenny is to blame for that, maybe the owners and Comolli. Either way, I dont think we need to do a lot in the summer but we do need some brave decisions over which PLAYERS come and go. The management of the club should remain in place. The rewards will be greater down the line with stability and the current structure in place.

 

We couldn't keep Torres, though. Waiting until the summer to sign a striker would have been even more disastrous. When we did get to the summer, we didn't sign a striker (with the exception of Bellamy who now has 6 goals). So I'm not sure you can blame Kenny or Comolli for Torres leaving when he did, Andy Carroll costing 35MM or the availability of the '20-30MM' striker in a summer transfer window.

 

I do agree with the idea that we maintain stability and not start experimenting with the manager revolving door policy. Not now.

[Gav]

Its less tactical and more that we simply don't have good enough players. Watching that last night, it is clear we have a raft of players who simply aren't all that amazing at close control, quick passing, dribbling or heading. Add to that a general lack of athleticism in some key areas and some of the worst "shooting" imaginable, and it's hardly surprising that we labour so often.

 

Now, you could pin the blame for that on the manager, as he asked for (or sanctioned) some of the deeply average players we have, but I still think it;s too early to write off Kenny's tactical skills. Well, except for using Henderson on the right still.

 

Yeah ,those shit players and shit tactics that tore Arsenal apart 5 days earlier ...bit revisionist no ??

[coops_lfc]

Haven't voted myself but I'm very surprised how that poll has gone. Wasn't expecting that at all.

[melons]

Knob heads have the right to privacy too!

 

 

Nah, they lose that when they start posting. I'm just too lazy to read the thread.

[FrenchEyeGlass]

Looking through the pane of reality (and not fantasy), the one fact fact that looms over Kenny is that he was not the owner's choice. He was the fan's choice.

 

This is quite obvious. Delaying his appointment after months of fan pressure. Giving him only a two year contract. Appointing Comolli at the same time to oversee things.

 

So 'Kenny's Future' can actually be a topic of sensible discussion. Not whether we want him to go (I personally don't) but whether he will. Because the reality is that he might.

[cracker]

We couldn't keep Torres, though. Waiting until the summer to sign a striker would have been even more disastrous. When we did get to the summer, we didn't sign a striker (with the exception of Bellamy who now has 6 goals). So I'm not sure you can blame Kenny or Comolli for Torres leaving when he did, Andy Carroll costing 35MM or the availability of the '20-30MM' striker in a summer transfer window.

 

I do agree with the idea that we maintain stability and not start experimenting with the manager revolving door policy. Not now.

 

Spending the 50m on a replacement striker seemed like a must at the time i agree but 3 things

1) Why Carroll? - i did not rate him at NUFC and still do not now if I am honest

2) Why overpay by so much?

3) Carroll hardly contributed to our improvement from Jan onwards apart from the MCFC at home game as he was injured for most of the time.

 

So what i am saying is that waitiing till the summer and getting someone for a better price who would suit our style of play more would have been much better rather than buying anyone we could get in a hurry which is what i believe Carroll was - altho that is all with the benefit of hindsight I grant you that.

[Iantn]

Lazy bugger.

 

This!