The FA publish written reasons for Suarez's ban

[TheDrowningMan]

That's the thing...if he were guilty of the exact rant, as xenophobes like Martin Lipton tell their readers, eight matches wouldn't be enough. It just wouldn't be. The "he's not racist!" thing is a shameless attempt to cover ther arses legally as a result of what they know is a questionable finding.

 

If the FA really cared about ridding the game of racism, they'd have referred this to the CPS as soon as it became evident that there was no chance of them reaching a clear conclusion. It soared above their pay grade some time ago.

[ngogswilly]

That's the thing...if he were guilty of the exact rant, as xenophobes like Martin Lipton tell their readers, eight matches wouldn't be enough. It just wouldn't be. The "he's not racist!" thing is a shameless attempt to cover ther arses legally as a result of what they know is a questionable finding.

 

If the FA really cared about ridding the game of racism, they'd have referred this to the CPS as soon as it became evident that there was no chance of them reaching a clear conclusion. It soared above their pay grade some time ago.

 

Yeah as you say if Evra's version, the version being peddled to the masses was in anyway true Luis should be up in front of a judge.

 

But its not now nor ever will be proven true because as the report shows the evidence is not there.

 

All thats there is Luis admitting saying Negro once, the circumstances of which became muddled rightly or wrongly.

 

But the fact remains, Evra's version of events is being used to stick the boot into our club and Luis, and Evra's version is bald faced lies which there is no evidence for.

[Anubis]

What was admitted to was enough, I'm afraid.

 

It wasn't. Any reference to colour has to be in the context of abusive language, which has not been admitted. The rule in question is quite clear on the point. But do carry on.

[Redshadow]

Is it me or does anyone else find how the 'advice' being dished out from all & sundry (those jokes on the Sunday Supplement yesterday morning to anti-racism groups opening their mouths Yet again & all inbetween) to be of a similar "leave it alone, Don't rock the boat" nature but with All of it actually stopping short of telling us we have No grounds to appeal and/or take this case to the Civil Courts? Does anyone else here get the impression as I do that many are actually worried we might just do That & they're not worried so much about us in that we could damage the club or our standing/about us embarrassing ourselves as they so piously claim; But instead? That they might just be worried that we could take their precious FA judgement in such case & Utterly Destroy it in public no less? In short? What if they're only to aware of the holes in their precious FA judgement & are Very worried we'll use them to eviscerate the case against Luis in a Civil Court hence the attempt to scare us into giving up?

 

Anyway - I get the feeling the advice to us to "leave it alone/rock the boat etc" is now reaching Such hysterical levels & there is such a concerted barrage in that vein? That there is more than one party involved in this that are worried that we might Just win should we take this further & that more? We might just set their precious movement back years by exposing it & them as bullies when it suits them & this judgement that they've staked themselves on publicly? As flawed from the start thereby destroying their credibility completely. I wonder if those people might therefore just rather we shuffle off stage left quietly & take our utterly unjust 'merited punishement' (in their view) Rather than confront & take said judgement to pieces in public as it so Richly deserves. Fortunately I've a feeling we might (for once) do the latter & humiliate the FA in public by utterly destroying their precious judgement in a Proper Court.

 

Now, doing this might not make us well loved but it's the right thing for us to do & might Force others to leave us alone as not an easy target in future. I've a feeling in view of this to? That we might just be about to face a Little more condmenation from the so-called Anti-Racism Groups (Vested Interests), bleeding hearts supporters of Evra/Them etc & the FA/it's allies over this. I think to the more we defend ourselves & The better we do against this for Luis? The louder & more frenzied the condmenation of us will get which in view of How things have gone with us in recent years? Must mean we're doing Something right. I think in the end? As long as we ignore them & defend Luis at All costs? Then eventually he'll be vindicated & rightly so........................

[ngogswilly]

Is it me or does anyone else find how the 'advice' being dished out from all & sundry (those jokes on the Sunday Supplement yesterday morning to anti-racism groups opening their mouths Yet again & all inbetween) to be of a similar "leave it alone, Don't rock the boat" nature but with All of it actually stopping short of telling us we have No grounds to appeal and/or take this case to the Civil Courts? Does anyone else here get the impression as I do that many are actually worried we might just do That & they're not worried so much about us in that we could damage the club or our standing/about us embarrassing ourselves as they so piously claim; But instead? That they might just be worried that we could take their precious FA judgement in such case & Utterly Destroy it in public no less? In short? What if they're only to aware of the holes in their precious FA judgement & are Very worried we'll use them to eviscerate the case against Luis in a Civil Court hence the attempt to scare us into giving up?

 

Anyway - I get the feeling the advice to us to "leave it alone/rock the boat etc" is now reaching Such hysterical levels & there is such a concerted barrage in that vein? That there is more than one party involved in this that are worried that we might Just win should we take this further & that more? We might just set their precious movement back years by exposing it & them as bullies when it suits them & this judgement that they've staked themselves on publicly? As flawed from the start thereby destroying their credibility completely. I wonder if those people might therefore just rather we shuffle off stage left quietly & take our utterly unjust 'merited punishement' (in their view) Rather than confront & take said judgement to pieces in public as it so Richly deserves. Fortunately I've a feeling we might (for once) do the latter & humiliate the FA in public by utterly destroying their precious judgement in a Proper Court.

 

Now, doing this might not make us well loved but it's the right thing for us to do & might Force others to leave us alone as not an easy target in future. I've a feeling in view of this to? That we might just be about to face a Little more condmenation from the so-called Anti-Racism Groups (Vested Interests), bleeding hearts supporters of Evra/Them etc & the FA/it's allies over this. I think to the more we defend ourselves & The better we do against this for Luis? The louder & more frenzied the condmenation of us will get which in view of How things have gone with us in recent years? Must mean we're doing Something right. I think in the end? As long as we ignore them & defend Luis at All costs? Then eventually he'll be vindicated & rightly so........................

 

I think you're right in what you're thinking.

 

If somehow we could take this case to a different arena they would be utterly destroyed.

 

But the problem is seemingly we can't take it to a different arena for some mental fucking reason. Basically a lot of people suggest all thats open is for Luis to take some sort of Civil case.

 

But without doubt, I think something has to be done. If we run off with out tails between our legs like some people suggest thats just letting them win, makes us look weak and leaves us open to even more shit in the future because yet again we'd be lying down and taking it up the ass.

 

Right now the least we have to do is totally and utterly make a big statement highlighting that

 

A. Evra's version of events cannot be proven. There is no evidence. In fact theres probably more video and audio evidence to prove Luis's version is correct than his.

 

B. Luis said "Negro" once as part of a question in return to Evra's abusive language which has been ludicrously excused by the Panel. Fair enough Luis fucked up there but its no way how Evra described it went down.

 

C. The report is full of inconsistencies and ridiculous contradictions easily highlighted. All the club would have to do is read our thread here and the thread over on RAWK to get even a fraction of the things we can rip that report apart with.

[Redshadow]

Au Contraire my dear Ngogs'? I think it would be Very easy for us to take it to a different arena - Or rather Luis Suarez to on his own if necessary. How? Simple - He could take out a Private Prosecution against the FA in the Civil Courts of England based on this joke of a decision against him amounting to Libel/Slander of his good name or Defamtion of his character with the intention of Ensuring that Any subsequent judgement relying on such information as the Document provides (as indeed that joke of an 8 match ban Did rely on it)? Is inherently weighted against Luis. Yes maybe Liverpool FC would find it difficult to take the FA to a Sporting Court re' Luis or our Own good name (although we could always go Over The FA's head to the Court of Sporting Arbitration if we so wish regarding that arena). Either way? Nothing is stopping either Luis or ourselves defending our names in the Civil Courts of England in the manner I've suggested & before you say we need overwhelming proof to do this?

 

Plenty of such cases have been brought before, examined in the cold, legal, public eye of a civil court & then dismissed for lack of evidence sufficient to Warrant a Full case (e.g. remember H & G's attempts to Stop Us selling the club?). Even doing That would completely destroy the FA's credibillity as it would effectively refute their case in public & were there somehow to be enough there to warrant such a trial? It's pretty clear the FA/Evra et al's case would be almost completely destroyed in Very short order. Oh & the 2 biggest signs that I'm on the right track with this thinking IMO? Firstly is the clubs silence on the subject right now which in contrast with the public defiance & assasination of the FA's decision we mounted a few weeks ago? Would seem to indicate we're up to Something with regard to all this legally but more importantly?

 

Just look at the sheer Number of posts on Twitter/articles in Newspapers/idiots in studios suggesting, asking & in certain cases? Virtually Begging us in "support of Liverpool's good name/to avoid embarrassment/as an appeal is doomed etc" to leave the Whole affair (not Just any appeal) & give up quietly by accepting the ban & decision on Suarez - Now you'll note that None of them deny Suarez or LFC has the Right to defend themselves in a civil court but they are all Very worried for some reason about us continuing our defence of Luis - each piously stating that we are damaging the Anti-Racism cause by doing so but if you ask me? I think there's more to it than that here with regards to the media & the inbuilt Manc' bias we see everywhere nowadays. I think those who have built & keep up such bias? Now all Know their heros Ferguson/United/The FA (never mind themselves) by supporting Evra & the Racism cause without anything Like sufficient evidence have made a hideous error here as they've by doing so? Virtually handed us a rocket launcher armed & ready to fire & said "Go on, Launch it at us" basically? Daring us to attack them over this. And in the panic of realising that we might actually Do just that? They've now realised the defences they traditionally rely on for defending the Manc's & their constant inbuilt bias to them & all they've done recently along with their ridiculous defence of United getting away with anything they choose against anyone they like?

 

Well? All this might just collapse like a house of cards forever leaving United exposed like Never before to others turning their tactics (frivolous legal cases, spurious accusations of uncertain natures, media attacks on certain clubs etc) back On them along of course with their own good name being Utterly destroyed. Of course this may only happen were we to Use the weapon they've thereby handed us (a case that can be turned back against them by dint of a Huge lack of evidence to support it). That IMO is what they're all afraid of & what scares them more than anything right now? Is that they can do Nothing to stop us taking that course of action bar scare us out of doing so hence the recent (last 2 days or so) absolute storm of attempts to do Just that. Not that they'll succeed - This time? They've cut their own throats, handed the weapons we need on a plate and? Can do as I said, precisely Nothing to stop us nor will they. I think we will wait a while, digest the reports findings & then? Use the weapons of destruction they have given us? To provide Precisely that as far as Evra's case is concerned................

 

NB In short? I think our options to attack & destroy this are not only many & varied? But also nearly all have a Very good chance of success - Why do you think the fans of the ban & the FA decision are all begging us now Not to challenge it? It's not us or our reputation they're concerned for as they all so piously claim. No, no, no - They're worried that by virtually Picking a fight with us over this? The FA have given us a chance to make ourselves feared once more in the fashion normally only United use (the legal route). They know we could now do this by taking on a decision with more holes in it than a sieve & embarrassing not just the FA but their beloved United (via humiliating their player) by completely destroying the basis of the judgement made against our player & in favour of the United man in As public a fashion as is possible in this country. The thing they all fear more than anything else now? Is that we'll do just That. Seriously if you ask me? The articles I've seen & various figures I've seen on TV/heard on radio talking about all this in recent days? Smack of one thing above all else in virtually pleading with us to give up quietly & that is? Fear...................

Edited January 2, 2012 by Redshadow

[ngogswilly]

Well we'll find out one way or the other Redshadow.

 

I just hope no matter what happens, we do our utmost to show the world that the statement Evra gave against Luis is utter bullshit. The statement where he accuses Luis of calling him Negro numerous times and basically very aggressively racially abusing him.

 

Sort of blows a hole in the FA's Evra is an impressive and reliable witness. Yeah makes sense, his main statement is utter bollox for which no evidence exists but hes an Impressive witness. The main crux of evidence in the whole report actually suggest Luis's version is more likely and the version Evra gave just couldn't have happened.

 

Funny how not one fucking Journo has highlighted this slightly huge fucking contradiction.

[Redshadow]

No Ngog's the thing that blows a Real hole in Evra's argument if you ask me? Is the twofold fact that firstly the Commission accepted inconsistent arguments by Evra, United employees & even possibly Ferguson himself that had different words/meanings Each time & yet Every such instance of similar testimony on Suarez behalf? Was held up as evidence of his Clear unreliability as a witness whilst similar testimonies on Evra's behalf beforehand? Were risibly excused with an apparent acceptance on the part of The FA Panel that "no-one has perfect recall"/testimonies should Not be expected to be Identical every time.

 

Yet Every such instance on the part of Suarez is then shot down!!! And I suppose we're meant to accept out of hand as these dinosaurs apparently did that Evra is thus a Perfect witness with perfect recall & all inconsistencies on his part were incidental & to be explained away whilst all such instances from Suarez? Are Clear proof that he was lying/omitting evidence no? Don't make me laugh - If anything stinks & will have the FA destroyed in Open Court? It's That & ruin their case? I feel this eventually will do whatever they do to avoid it - What's more? They know it now to - Why else do you think they're begging us via the media Not to pull the trigger on the gun they've given us & pointed at their own heads? But pull it? We shall & rightly so..................

 

NB There's also the fact Evra's QC was far to aggressive in questioning Luis & Not pulled up on it, Evra was allowed to view the video evidence & go over his own testimony twice whilst Luis could only go over His testimony once & the video evidence? Not at all. Then there's the fact that........You get the picture - This whole case Screams "Stitch Up" a mile off & unfortunately for the FA? It's very Far from Sewn up as they're about to find out emphatically..................

[ngogswilly]

No Ngog's the thing that blows a Real hole in Evra's argument if you ask me? Is the twofold fact that firstly the Commission accepted inconsistent arguments by Evra, United employees & even possibly Ferguson himself that had different words/meanings Each time & yet Every such instance of similar testimony on Suarez behalf? Was held up as evidence of his Clear unreliability as a witness whilst similar testimonies on Evra's behalf beforehand? Were risibly excused with an apparent acceptance on the part of The FA Panel that "no-one has perfect recall"/testimonies should Not be expected to be Identical every time.

 

Yet Every such instance on the part of Suarez is then shot down!!! And I suppose we're meant to accept out of hand as these dinosaurs apparently did that Evra is thus a Perfect witness with perfect recall & all inconsistencies on his part were incidental & to be explained away whilst all such instances from Suarez? Are Clear proof that he was lying/omitting evidence no? Don't make me laugh - If anything stinks & will have the FA destroyed in Open Court? It's That & ruin their case? I feel this eventually will do whatever they do to avoid it - What's more? They know it now to - Why else do you think they're begging us via the media Not to pull the trigger on the gun they've given us & pointed at their own heads? But pull it? We shall & rightly so..................

 

NB There's also the fact Evra's QC was far to aggressive in questioning Luis & Not pulled up on it, Evra was allowed to view the video evidence & go over his own testimony twice whilst Luis could only go over His testimony once & the video evidence? Not at all. Then there's the fact that........You get the picture - This whole case Screams "Stitch Up" a mile off & unfortunately for the FA? It's very Far from Sewn up as they're about to find out emphatically..................

 

All very good points.

 

Its stuff like what you've just highlighted which makes the whole thing seem utterly bizarre than no one in the media is highlighting this.

 

So Luis needs someone to do that for him.

[Redshadow]

Not Bizarre Ngogs' Mate - I find the Lack of such emphasis in the media utterly disgusting & completely unforgivable but the One thing I do Not find it? Is bizarre. Think about it for a minute - Who other than the media (i.e. which Club?) along with their beloved FA; Lords & Masters of the Engerland team that gives them half their footy stories a year stands to lose the Most from this case If they were exposed as liars/fitters who deliberately timed/engineered this mess in order to;

 

A ) Stop us coming close to said club that stands to lose The most were Luis to be publically exonerated (I think you know just Who I'm on about here no?) & B ) To take as much as they can of the spotlight away from the Big Man/England's Brave Lion/The Brave Lionheart Captain of the National Side John Terry & the circus surrounding His current court case. It All makes sense now yes? Put all That together & think of the implications were Man U, the FA & particularly Evra publically humiliated & vilified for months afterwards as their case would thus have been completely destroyed in public & them exposed as liars?

 

Think of all that & the unthinkable (for the media) prospect of thus having to write about their Great club favourites And their beloved National Side/Sacred Cow in scathing terms & with constant attacks for Months afterwards as they Would Have to do were Luis to be exonerated? (Either that or be attacked themselves) & it all makes perfect sense - Not that they seem to have a problem doing to Liverpool what they Dare not do to the others - & That if you ask me? Is the very Crux of the matter as far as the media are concerned - Liverpool or the FA & Man United?

 

Don't make me laugh - Put like That? It might appear a choice but is not a choice at all since it's one they could (and virtually Would) make every time with their eyes shut - And they've clearly followed suit here hence the evidence Against Evra being brushed under the carpet & the media becoming Witchfinder General with Regard to Luis Suarez. In fact? The media have gone Precisely to form here if you ask me - I'm only surprised More of them weren't as blatant in seizing the opportunity to attack us this offered by following the Daily Mirror's disgraceful & utterly reprehensible lead - Incidentally? That to is something they'll pay for eventually & pay in full as well.........................

Edited January 2, 2012 by Redshadow

[caracaracara]

Found this reading a Daily Mail article (I know, sorry to those offended). Actually quite balanced. What seems more credible coming from a footballer on the pitch in the heat of the moment?

 

 

I read that yesterday and having played football for over 20 years against some absolute knobs, straight away said that Evra's version is totally fabricated. No way you would hear that type of exchange on a football field.

 

I am going to punch you, I am, wait a minute, I am really going to punch you. say that one more time and I am really going to punch you, I will, I will , I will , honest......

 

I haven't read the full 115 report but from the various snippets posted I thought neither the referree or any of the players heard Suarez or Evra's altercation. And importantly, Marinier never heard Evra make any reference to Suarez insulting in a racist way. The first the ref knew was after the game.

 

Making the association of pinching somebody to the racist accusation is a piss take. Remember Suarez pulling the hair of one of the brarzilian twins after he had gone over the top on Lucas. That is the snidy stuff Luis does but it doesn't make him a racist.

 

I am sure Luis is no angel and likes a good wind up. He may have been close to crossing the line or gone marginally over it. But he doesn't deserve the great stich up of all time by judge and jury.

 

I still don't believe that the FA are immune to the laws of the land and in particular the very basis of natural justice. Just because you sign up to being bound by a set of rules doesn't make you impotent if there is a clear mis carriage of justice.

 

Maybe we can not challenge the ban. The FA can probably do what they want. But we should be taking the injustice through the courts and you never know this could be a a 'Bossman' type moment in English football.

[ben48]

Is it me or does anyone else find how the 'advice' being dished out from all & sundry (those jokes on the Sunday Supplement yesterday morning to anti-racism groups opening their mouths Yet again & all inbetween) to be of a similar "leave it alone, Don't rock the boat" nature but with All of it actually stopping short of telling us we have No grounds to appeal and/or take this case to the Civil Courts? Does anyone else here get the impression as I do that many are actually worried we might just do That & they're not worried so much about us in that we could damage the club or our standing/about us embarrassing ourselves as they so piously claim; But instead? That they might just be worried that we could take their precious FA judgement in such case & Utterly Destroy it in public no less? In short? What if they're only to aware of the holes in their precious FA judgement & are Very worried we'll use them to eviscerate the case against Luis in a Civil Court hence the attempt to scare us into giving up?

 

Anyway - I get the feeling the advice to us to "leave it alone/rock the boat etc" is now reaching Such hysterical levels & there is such a concerted barrage in that vein? That there is more than one party involved in this that are worried that we might Just win should we take this further & that more? We might just set their precious movement back years by exposing it & them as bullies when it suits them & this judgement that they've staked themselves on publicly? As flawed from the start thereby destroying their credibility completely. I wonder if those people might therefore just rather we shuffle off stage left quietly & take our utterly unjust 'merited punishement' (in their view) Rather than confront & take said judgement to pieces in public as it so Richly deserves. Fortunately I've a feeling we might (for once) do the latter & humiliate the FA in public by utterly destroying their precious judgement in a Proper Court.

 

Now, doing this might not make us well loved but it's the right thing for us to do & might Force others to leave us alone as not an easy target in future. I've a feeling in view of this to? That we might just be about to face a Little more condmenation from the so-called Anti-Racism Groups (Vested Interests), bleeding hearts supporters of Evra/Them etc & the FA/it's allies over this. I think to the more we defend ourselves & The better we do against this for Luis? The louder & more frenzied the condmenation of us will get which in view of How things have gone with us in recent years? Must mean we're doing Something right. I think in the end? As long as we ignore them & defend Luis at All costs? Then eventually he'll be vindicated & rightly so........................

 

That is a good post mate,absolutely spot on, They would shit themselves if the club did that.

[Unrighteous]

The thing it all boils down to is this:

 

It doesn't matter of Suarez did or didn't say racial slurs. It doesn't matter. It's that the FA are taking one players word over another, without any solid proof.

 

It's plain my word against yours. Suarez admitted to saying Negro once. That seems more truthful than a full volley of negros/blacks/etc... that NO ONE HEARD!

 

If they punish him for saying Negro once, which he admitted, then fine. However, they are not doing that. They're calling Evra's testimony more 'reliable' and that is 100% their basis. It's ridiculous.

[phc1965]

para - 453 (2) of the f.a. panel report reads thus

 

 

The burden of proof in this case is on the FA. The standard of proof is the flexible

civil standard of the balance of probability. The more serious the allegation,

taking into account the nature of the misconduct alleged and the content of the

case, the greater the burden of evidence required to prove the matter. The FA

accepted that the allegation against Mr Suarez was serious, as do we (the panel)

 

so that reads

 

the more serious the allegation the the greater the burden of proof

 

the f.a. accept the allegations were serious

 

but we reached a guilty verdict based on probability.

 

no wonder they are sticking to 'its our rules' line

 

you couldn't make it up could you

 

 

pete

[Horus]

The thing it all boils down to is this:

 

It doesn't matter of Suarez did or didn't say racial slurs. It doesn't matter. It's that the FA are taking one players word over another, without any solid proof.

 

It's plain my word against yours. Suarez admitted to saying Negro once. That seems more truthful than a full volley of negros/blacks/etc... that NO ONE HEARD!

 

If they punish him for saying Negro once, which he admitted, then fine. However, they are not doing that. They're calling Evra's testimony more 'reliable' and that is 100% their basis. It's ridiculous.

 

I'm not saying you're 100% wrong, but the defence has gone from "Suarez used the friendly Negrito/a" to "Suarez only called him a negro once."

 

Now, I think Evra has lied in this whole exchange, but the minute Suarez admitted to calling him a negro, then all bets are off.

 

Whether someone calls another player a negro once, or 8 times, becomes a little irrelevant. Either racist language is used, or it isn't.

 

Do you think there should be a sliding scale for use of negro?

 

If Evra comes out tomorrow and says that after really thinking about it, he remembered that Suarez actually only said it once, after all, then does that make it's usage any less appropriate?

 

Suarez isn't a racist, of that there is no doubt. But, he is guilty of using racial language. 8 games is over zealous, but us (the FA) moaning about Sepp Blatter just before this case was heard, always dictated that a harsh punishment was on the cards.

[Barzini]

the minute Suarez admitted to calling him a negro, then all bets are off.

 

He didn't call him "a negro" though, did he? He called him negro in Spanish, ie. he called him black.

 

It's a subtle but important difference.

[Horus]

He didn't call him "a negro" though, did he? He called him negro in Spanish, ie. he called him black.

 

It's a subtle but important difference.

 

Can you translate the sentence he used for me, into English?

[Trumo]

Evra's version as shown above reminds me of the "Bignose"/"I really will slug you SO hard!" scene in Life Of Brian.

[Barzini]

Well no, because I've got no idea what was actually said.

 

If you are talking about Suarez's version then "por que negro" literally translates to "why black", which doesn't really translate into English at all.

 

I'm not disagreeing with your post Horus, I'm just pointing out that the word negro in English and the word negro in Spanish are different and have slightly different connotations.

[Jack the Sipper]

What was admitted to was enough, I'm afraid.

 

 

Not for the eight match ban, it wasn't. The length of the ban was stated as being needed because of the amount of times Suarez is supposed to have racially abused Evra (an indicator of how the FA will treat Terry should the case end up in front of them?).

 

Suarez admitted saying 'negro' once. Even accepting that he intended to racially abuse Evra here, there's no way the commission could leave the length of the ban intact if it was successfully shown that Evra's credibility as a witness wasn't as sound as the commission concluded. And I do believe that the findings show Evra to be an unreliable witness, even if the conclusions of the findings state otherwise.

 

That said, I do agree that, even if an appeal is possible, it would be a big call for the Club. I would understand if they just wanted to put this behind them now, even if they believe (as I do) that Suarez suffered a miscarraige of justice.

[RedPaul]

What astounds me is the number of people who can't even say the word 'negro' correctly in Spanish and pronounce it 'kneegro' which sounds a lot worse than how it actually should be pronounced (and understood) in Spanish. The BBC sports correspondent did it on New Year's Eve and I was surprised that someone supposedly educated and working for such an influential media broadcaster could make such a very basic mistake on prime time news!

 

On a side note, my Latin American wife and I had a conversation with her family on Skype last night and I noted many natural references to a person's skin colour - not just black, but white and brown too - all in the course of an everyday normal conversation. I found myself thinking we must all be racist to have the audacity to refer to someone by the colour of their skin (whatever the colour) judging by the standards set here in the UK. I thought perhaps I should hand myself in to the police. It could have been construed as racial language I suspect if an outsider HERE had been listening and chosen to take offence, but there is no way I would tell the family to change how they speak in their own language when there is absolutely no racist intent in what they are saying. I think it's very important to understand than in everyday use in Latin America the use of the word negro on its own has no racist intent, a point that needs to be made to those who have no understanding of that culture.

 

I'm not condoning Luis' use of the word once, if his account is true, because the context of its use in the report is arguable in a number of ways, but I'm not judging or condemning him on it either, for that very same reason, and also because it is in his own language which he has probably freely used for his whole life without any problem. At most he should have been warned about the use of the word in this context and that it is now specifically not acceptable for use in the UK on a football pitch.

[Horus]

Well no, because I've got no idea what was actually said.

 

If you are talking about Suarez's version then "por que negro" literally translates to "why black", which doesn't really translate into English at all.

 

I'm not disagreeing with your post Horus, I'm just pointing out that the word negro in English and the word negro in Spanish are different and have slightly different connotations.

 

Fair enough, but the fact it translates into "black," doesn't make it any less damning, and I believe John Terry is also guilty of using racial language, for calling Anton Ferdinand a "fucking black cunt."

 

Suarez isn't racist though, but he definitely fucked up here.

[caracaracara]

What astounds me is the number of people who can't even say the word 'negro' correctly in Spanish and pronounce it 'kneegro' which sounds a lot worse than how it actually should be pronounced (and understood) in Spanish. The BBC sports correspondent did it on New Year's Eve and I was surprised that someone supposedly educated and working for such an influential media broadcaster could make such a very basic mistake on prime time news!

 

On a side note, my Latin American wife and I had a conversation with her family on Skype last night and I noted many natural references to a person's skin colour - not just black, but white and brown too - all in the course of an everyday normal conversation. I found myself thinking we must all be racist to have the audacity to refer to someone by the colour of their skin (whatever the colour) judging by the standards set here in the UK. I thought perhaps I should hand myself in to the police. It could have been construed as racial language I suspect if an outsider HERE had been listening and chosen to take offence, but there is no way I would tell the family to change how they speak in their own language when there is absolutely no racist intent in what they are saying. I think it's very important to understand than in everyday use in Latin America the use of the word negro on its own has no racist intent, a point that needs to be made to those who have no understanding of that culture.

 

I'm not condoning Luis' use of the word once, if his account is true, because the context of its use in the report is arguable in a number of ways, but I'm not judging or condemning him on it either, for that very same reason, and also because it is in his own language which he has probably freely used for his whole life without any problem. At most he should have been warned about the use of the word in this context and that it is now specifically not acceptable for use in the UK on a football pitch.

 

I agree with your last sentance. If the panel had accepted that Suarez has only used it once it his own context I think they may have warned him re his future behaviour and worse, suspended sentance.

 

By accepting Evra's evidence that he said it seven times in different tones, expressions, etc allowed them to act in the manner that they did.

 

I believe this is what the club is so angry about that, nobody else can back up Evra's accusation but the panel chose to accept it. This is now accepted truth by the world and puts Suarez and LFC in a very bad light.

 

There is no way that any video evidence will show Suarez saying these words only the body language of two players have a go at each other over a two minute period. This is circumstantial and hearsay.

 

The club should accept the ban but with a qualifying statement saying how outraged they are by the way the judgment has been arrived at and they have no faith in this process to deliver a fair decison. State all the questionable findings to the world to try and alter the 'truth' which everybody now believes and have their day in court.

[corro]

We have to accept what has to be I'm afraid. This has been allowed yo get out of hand and eventually the FA, the media, have used our club to give out a phoney message of protest against racism.

They must have been delighted to find a foreign kid to slaughter especially with that racist cunt Terry bang to rights. He hasn't stood a chance from day one

There is no easy way out of this and the club need to be clever in their upcoming statements.

Ian Ayre needs to step up and take as much pressure away from the manager who is gonna cop a load of stick for his initial stance.

The press in this country are a fucking disgrace and they will not let this go. Let Luis go home for a few weeks and lets get this behind us as soon as possible.

The anger and frustration I feel over this whole affair is confirmation of the fact this country is as fucking culturally backward as it's always been.

Fuck the FA, fuck the whole media circus, lets just try and get this whole affair behind us and watch what happens in the future.

[Liverpool lad]

Can somebody sum this up for me?