Norwich home Match Thread

[stringvest]

It won't matter as long as Carra deems himself the number one centre back at the club though. We could sign Pique and Cheillini in January and Carra would still start.

 

Ah - it's the players that decide the team is it? Right then. Though it would explain why RAWK are so pissed off with Carragher. I'd better get writing to Dirk straight away.

[Bernard Diomede]

Dont often comment on match threads but here goes.

 

I thought we were unlucky not to win the game today given the chances we created, but once again showed that we struggle to put our chances away,as has been the case all season. Despite being unlucky I thought we were desperately poor in the second half, and the midfield has become a big problem area, The amount of time that houllihan found space in the hole between our midfield and back four was very worrying and given more service he could have been very damaging.

 

For me adam and gerrard sat far too deep, and adam isnt mobile or positionally aware enough to be a first choice centre mid. I also thought Gerrard had a particularly poor second half. One of the most frustrating players so far for me has been downing. I didnt really rate him too highly before he signed but thought his first few games were very impressive. However for a supposed winger I have never seen a player cut inside so much in my life, and he often doesnt look like he has the desire to get into really threatening positions.

We also look particularly vulnerable at the back. To think a few years ago Carra was dominating Didier Drogba in European cup semi finals, and to see him getting out muscled by the likes of Grant Holte was a bit of a sickener. I fucking love the fella but he is not half the player he was 3 or 4 years ago. Johnson also didnt look as solid as Kelly has been.

For me today Kenny got his substitutes wrong. Bellamy should have stayed on the pitch and eithet Downing or Kuyt should have got the hook. I also thought we really missed the energy and positional play of Lucas in the centre.

On a positive note without being massively convincing we still created enough chances to have won 2 games and Surez, other than his finishing was top class. Incidently Fergie got what he wanted out of his jibes last week as luis never got a fucking carrot off the ref today.

All in all a frustrating game, and for me I would like to see Kenny shuffle the pack a little for next week as there are a few players in there who havent really performed for a good few weeks.

[stringvest]

Totally agree with this about these three players.

 

Although I don't think Kuyt was that wasteful, he had a few moments, but he also held the ball up extremely well at times and does at least link up with Suarez, unlike Carroll.

 

He was wasteful when it mattered. He turned attack into defence on numerous occasions today. And he's too slow of brain and feet to make the runs. He's always turning up 10 seconds after the chance has gone. I don't care what sort of shift Kuyt or anyone else puts in when it's so completely ineffective and unproductive. It's a waste of a shirt. I'd rather put Carroll on than Dirk. And that's really saying something. At least Carroll would actually inconvenience the opposition defence on occasion.

[ngogswilly]

Dont often comment on match threads but here goes.

 

I thought we were unlucky not to win the game today given the chances we created, but once again showed that we struggle to put our chances away,as has been the case all season. Despite being unlucky I thought we were desperately poor in the second half, and the midfield has become a big problem area, The amount of time that houllihan found space in the hole between our midfield and back four was very worrying and given more service he could have been very damaging.

 

For me adam and gerrard sat far too deep, and adam isnt mobile or positionally aware enough to be a first choice centre mid. I also thought Gerrard had a particularly poor second half. One of the most frustrating players so far for me has been downing. I didnt really rate him too highly before he signed but thought his first few games were very impressive. However for a supposed winger I have never seen a player cut inside so much in my life, and he often doesnt look like he has the desire to get into really threatening positions.

We also look particularly vulnerable at the back. To think a few years ago Carra was dominating Didier Drogba in European cup semi finals, and to see him getting out muscled by the likes of Grant Holte was a bit of a sickener. I fucking love the fella but he is not half the player he was 3 or 4 years ago. Johnson also didnt look as solid as Kelly has been.

For me today Kenny got his substitutes wrong. Bellamy should have stayed on the pitch and eithet Downing or Kuyt should have got the hook. I also thought we really missed the energy and positional play of Lucas in the centre.

On a positive note without being massively convincing we still created enough chances to have won 2 games and Surez, other than his finishing was top class. Incidently Fergie got what he wanted out of his jibes last week as luis never got a fucking carrot off the ref today.

All in all a frustrating game, and for me I would like to see Kenny shuffle the pack a little for next week as there are a few players in there who havent really performed for a good few weeks.

 

Good post.

 

Disagree with shuffling the pack though, Lucas in for Adam. Get him to do the donkey work, let Stevie attack. We'll win. Guarantee it. We would have won tonight easily had we converted even a quarter the chances we had.

 

If we shuffle the pack I reckon we could suffer for it.

[Bernard Diomede]

Good post.

 

Disagree with shuffling the pack though, Lucas in for Adam. Get him to do the donkey work, let Stevie attack. We'll win. Guarantee it. We would have won tonight easily had we converted even a quarter the chances we had.

 

If we shuffle the pack I reckon we could suffer for it.

 

On current form I'd have Adam downing and kuyt out of the side, put Gerrard further forward and have Lucas alongside Spearing or Henderson. With Carrol up top and Bellamy and Suarez buzzing around him. What baffles me the most is the dissapearance of the high tempo pressing game we played towards the end of last season.

[Faustus]

Good post, Dan.

 

Wouldn't mind seeing Maxi being given a crack of the whip in the coming weeks, personally. Maybe not as a week in, week out starter, but I do think he's been criminally underused this season. Probably one of the few players we've got who's capable of playing in between the lines and capable of that cute little slide pass through. The lad showed at the back end of last season as well that he can finish. God knows we could do with a few bringing their shooting boots to games at the minute!

[lamai]

On current form I'd have Adam downing and kuyt out of the side, put Gerrard further forward and have Lucas alongside Spearing or Henderson. With Carrol up top and Bellamy and Suarez buzzing around him. What baffles me the most is the dissapearance of the high tempo pressing game we played towards the end of last season.

at

 

yep i'd go for that

[stringvest]

Had Maxi taken the pens, he would've been our leading scorer last year. And he didn't start too many games. And when he did he was on the wing.

[Bernard Diomede]

Good post, Dan.

 

Wouldn't mind seeing Maxi being given a crack of the whip in the coming weeks, personally. Maybe not as a week in, week out starter, but I do think he's been criminally underused this season. Probably one of the few players we've got who's capable of playing in between the lines and capable of that cute little slide pass through. The lad showed at the back end of last season as well that he can finish. God knows we could do with a few bringing their shooting boots to games at the minute!

 

Said the same to Ally today mate, for me Kuyt shouldn't be starting in games at home to the likes of norwich. We need someone with more intelligent movement and touch for home games against weaker oposition. i didnt even think Kuyt worked very hard today, and the time he was away down the left flank and didnt play Carroll in was terrible. I like Dirk, but there are certain games he should be played in and for me today wasnt one of them.

[Faustus]

I'll be honest, I really do like Adam. I think he's fantastic on the ball and his vision for a pass is outstanding. That crossfield ball today for Bellamy in the first half was outstanding.

 

I do agree though that you're asking him to do a lot in a two man centre mid. His positional sense and defensive skills leave a lot to be desired and while I wouldn't say that 4-4-2 has died a death like some have, you have to have two jack of all trade type players in the engine room if you want to pull it off.

 

I think we found the right system against the Mancs last week with a player sitting deep to create space for Adam to pick his passes and to allow a player to regularly break into the box from midfield (as Henderson did so effectively that day).

 

I personally thought Adam had his best game in a red shirt against United and I don't think it was any coincidence that it was because we had the extra bodies in there.

[Bernard Diomede]

As a side note i was well impressed with that Houllihan today, thought he took up some quality positions and was always wanting the ball. Looked like a very intelligent player.

[Mitch]

Kenny has bough badly. That's the bottom line. He was given substantial backing but bought mediocre journemynen for excessive prices. We have 2-3 world class players, the rest are mediore cannon fodder. Why bury your head in the sand. Ot's plain for all to see Caroll,Downing ,Adam, Henderson to a lesser extent are mediocre players. We haven't improved at all. We'll be lucky to finish top 6 imo

[Bernard Diomede]

I'll be honest, I really do like Adam. I think he's fantastic on the ball and his vision for a pass is outstanding. That crossfield ball today for Bellamy in the first half was outstanding.

 

I do agree though that you're asking him to do a lot in a two man centre mid. His positional sense and defensive skills leave a lot to be desired and while I wouldn't say that 4-4-2 has died a death like some have, you have to have two jack of all trade type players in the engine room if you want to pull it off.

 

I think we found the right system against the Mancs last week with a player sitting deep to create space for Adam to pick his passes and to allow a player to regularly break into the box from midfield (as Henderson did so effectively that day).

 

I personally thought Adam had his best game in a red shirt against United and I don't think it was any coincidence that it was because we had the extra bodies in there.

 

Adam did well last week I'll agree with that, but for me his qualities on the ball are not quite good enough to accommodate playing him there. He does ping the odd brilliant pass out wide but at times he looks for the hollywood ball when he should keep it simple. I just dont think he's a good enough player to be changing a formation for or building a team around.

 

And the amount of times he went down like a sack of spuds today was doing my head in! He could be a valuable squad player but I dont see him as a long term first choice option.

[Faustus]

As a side note i was well impressed with that Houllihan today, thought he took up some quality positions and was always wanting the ball. Looked like a very intelligent player.

 

We said the same thing coming back as well. To be fair, a few of their lads impressed me today. I caught that Johnson lad a few times when he was at Leeds and I liked the look of him then. Thought that that Morison fella up top was quite industrious, even if didn't really threaten, and Holt caused quite a few problems with his physicality, although, to be fair to him, he looked to have more to his game than just being some Sunday League bruiser.

 

On Houlihan though, the frustrating thing with having two men in the centre and Adam's pretty woeful positional sense is that the opposition always seem to have a free man in there. Today it was Houlihan and a few weeks back it was O'Hara for Wolves. Both had half decent games against us because of it and we saw against Spurs how quality players will exploit this better. I know we went down to ten men about 20 mins in that day, but we just didn't look like we'd be able to get near Modric all afternoon before then.

[Bernard Diomede]

We said the same thing coming back as well. To be fair, a few of their lads impressed me today. I caught that Johnson lad a few times when he was at Leeds and I liked the look of him then. Thought that that Morison fella up top was quite industrious, even if didn't really threaten, and Holt caused quite a few problems with his physicality, although, to be fair to him, he looked to have more to his game than just being some Sunday League bruiser.

 

On Houlihan though, the frustrating thing with having two men in the centre and Adam's pretty woeful positional sense is that the opposition always seem to have a free man in there. Today it was Houlihan and a few weeks back it was O'Hara for Wolves. Both had half decent games against us because of it and we saw against Spurs how quality players will exploit this better. I know we went down to ten men about 20 mins in that day, but we just didn't look like we'd be able to get near Modric all afternoon before then.

 

Yeh, the amount of times Adam let him run off him was pretty scary. The midfield looked very one dimensional and flat today, if one of our players would have took up some of the positions Houllihan would have we would have created a lot more problems for them.

[Manny]

We aren't clinical enough to make up for our shortcomings at the back. We aren't quite solid enough to make up for our profligacy up front. One of those areas has to improve.

 

We're over 10 games in and we've only been outplayed in 1 game. But we're yet to put together 2 really strong performances. It's been a strange old season.

 

We need to string together a few wins. I was hoping we'd start such a sequence today but it wasn't to be. There's a lot of room for improvement, but I'm not going to start calling for heads after a draw with that many chances. I don't want many more repeats of it, though, because I struggle to recall many more frustrating games than that.

[Redder Lurtz]

The mongy cuntery on here today is spectacular in its monginess.

[Funkasy]

We created enough chances to win 5 games, so i cant see what kenny really did wrong, just the players fucked up infront of goal.

[Iceman]

There are some very good posts on here (amongst some pretty bad mongery), I'll add my tuppence worth, for what it's worth.

 

We didn't play too badly today but we definitely need real quality on the right and also someone who can consistently put away all the chances that Suarez creates. Mad Luis is certainly no hitman that's for sure but he is one hell of a schemer.

 

Defense wise, I agree with many on here and say get Carra on the bench pronto, and lets see what Coates can do. He needs to see some action and we need to see what he brings to our team play. He won the player of the tournament at Copa so we know he's capable. Get him on. His long passing is excellent and a speedster like Bellamy could do nicely with that kind of service.

 

Also if Coates isn't ready it needs to be confirmed before January so we can buy another center back to add to the striker and the right side.

 

I agree that we need to keep Henderson central, his performance against the Mancs justifies that. Gerrard off Suarez works for me too.

 

Any way you look at this, FSG are going to have to spend some more money, and they may even ask Kenny to have a look at more culling of the squad to offset this. It may even mean taking a hit on Carroll(!) if we want that Hazard quality on the right and and the predatory finishing we really need to finish Suarez's Salvador Dali like football creations.

 

It's frustrating and tantalizing at the same time and games like today's are a perfect example of that. We're not that far off having a great team but for whatever reason, what we have now is not the finished article.

[Heinze]

Promising performance. Should have been 2 or 3 up in the first 20.

 

Frustrating but I have faith.

[cmuller]

Awful subs from Kenny. It's becoming a worry that he doesn't seem to know how to change a game through making subs. Yesterday he just ruined any flow we had in the second half with his changes. As bad as Downing was, if you're bringing on Carroll you have to leave the probable supply line on the pitch.

 

His obssession with 442 is also beginning to annoy. We don't have the midfield (especially in the centre) to play this way so why persevere?

 

It doesn't feel right having a go at Kenny but there's some pretty simple stuff that he's not sorting out on the pitch at the moment.

 

Norwich were terrible. I hadn't seen anything of them this year and was expecting something more consiering their league position. As it was, they were there for the taking. It's just we have a set of strikers who need far more chances than should be necessary at this level. After all the money we've spent I don't think it's unreasonable to expect us to be further along the road to challenging for the top spots than we are.

[Guest LFD]

On current form I'd have Adam downing and kuyt out of the side, put Gerrard further forward and have Lucas alongside Spearing or Henderson. With Carrol up top and Bellamy and Suarez buzzing around him. What baffles me the most is the dissapearance of the high tempo pressing game we played towards the end of last season.

 

Kuyt has been playing far better than Carroll.

[robbiegod]

very frustrating, overall we played well yes no argument but thats another game (along with Stoke, Sunderland, man u, plus Wolves, Brighton and Bolton where we got away with it) that we are just not taking chances that we create.. it costing us now, if it had been one game you can say we were unlucky and bemoan missed chances but not in so many games, thats too many points dropped and it cant continue, we need an out and out finisher to play up with luis, he creates so many chances, he is a scorer of great goals but not a great goalscorer.. but at the same time he isnt immune from critism as there were a couple of occassions when players were better placed and he went alone, and at least one where he squared it when it wasnt actually on.. his decision making needs to improve.

 

There are issues with the midfiled too, Im affraid Charlie adam wont ever be good enough to start in central midfield for us, a good squad player but thats it for me.. the times we have been over run (especially second halfs ) in midfield this season is frightening.. its too important a position in the game, you win and lose games in central midfield and we arnt strong enough in there for me. Rm needs investment as well, Dirk (especially in a 442) cant play there, henderson looks better central and stevies days of playing there are gone..

 

the back four is too deep, when charlie lost the ball in midfield for there goal yesterday the gap that the norwich player had to run in to before he was put under pressure was daft.. we need to play a bit higher up

 

its not all negative dont get me wrong, we played well and on another day could have had 4 but how many times have we said that this season alone

[Evil_Ways]

Kenny has bough badly. That's the bottom line. He was given substantial backing but bought mediocre journemynen for excessive prices. We have 2-3 world class players, the rest are mediore cannon fodder. Why bury your head in the sand. Ot's plain for all to see Caroll,Downing ,Adam, Henderson to a lesser extent are mediocre players. We haven't improved at all. We'll be lucky to finish top 6 imo

 

I agree we have overspent on them, or at least several of them, without a doubt. But mediocre journeymen is abit much. Especially considering how we've been the better team in 8 out of 9 games this season, and the thing that's kept us from winning is bad finnishing and not that these players have gone into hiding.

 

Personally i thought we'd do worse before the season started, in an attacking sense, our ability at controlling games and creating chances i mean. I think chance wise we have created as much or more than the likes of Utd, City and Chelsea but our lack of top quality in the final third of the pitch maybe is reflecting on our goals tally. Where City and Utd have the widespread quality to put the fucking ball into the back of the net.

[billypilgrimnz]

The frustrating thing for me is that the commentators harped on about how well Norwich played away against the Mancs and Chelsea, how they took the game to them and had a go. Result? Two losses.

 

As per usual, same team comes to us and we look shocked that someone is putting up a fight after we score an early goal and hey presto, scratchy draw. We really, really, really have a mentally fragile team at the moment.