Evra accuses Suarez of racism

[rEddie]

It is disgusting hypocrisy, looking at the shit Luis is getting.

 

Suarez seems to have admitted referring to Evra's colour during discussion. He could have said 'negro' or 'negrito' or any manner of things, and meant them without any pejorative intent whatsoever -- it wouldn't matter. Unfortunately, he's playing in a country in which if someone asked you: 'who's John?' and you answered: 'oh, you know, the tall, black guy' someone would be clipping you round the ear for acknowledging that you see colours.

 

That's basically the attitude of the British press, and if I put on my armchair psychology hat, I would say that the hysteria over racism comes from guilt rather than moralism. At the same time as accepting that migration is an essential part of moving our country forward, it is also emblematic of the decline of our empire, and their can doubtless have been some collective reluctance to share our land with people from other countries and continents. I would say that that is probably, in some ways, natural -- but it ought to be acknowledged and tempered with reason, rather than being repressed.

 

People are often the most outwardly violent towards the worst qualities that exist within themselves. It makes a lot of sense that an endemically racist country is so desperate to string up racists.

 

The great irony of the judgement is that it is more racist than the crime. It totally ignores the defendants culture, upbringing, and personal history. It is stringing him up as a racist in spite of his being from a culture in which the idea of racism probably connotes something completely different. Does the verdict show any understanding of cultural or linguistic nuances? No. Does it show any tolerance for those differences? No. So where is the morality in that?

 

If the FA were to actually take a leading role in this, the right thing to do would have been to say: 'look, we accept what you meant. Over here, we have a different set of expectations and a different attitude towards language. Please don't do it again.' I think it would have been their prerogative to do that, if there was evidence for him using language that they found unacceptable.

 

With the verdict having been delivered so sensationally, Suarez is going to carry this tag throughout his time here. It will be sung about at games, he'll get shit for it in the street, he'll be forever attracting snide digs from commentators and journalists... he'll be hounded out, basically, unless this is overturned. And I think, to be fair, that nobody in their right mind could blame him if he decided to leave that behind. I wouldn't wish the contradictory bile of the faux-moral fuckwits of England on anybody.

 

It is particularly vexing, though, seeing that punishment delivered on somebody who is alone in a foreign country and who has not had time to learn the language or understand accused of using a non-pejorative term spoken in a foreign language. Oh, brave England.

 

Thank god we are crucifying him to save the morality of our country.

 

Graham Taylor said that 'it's wholly acceptable in parts of the Middle East to cut the hands off of thieves - but we wouldn't tolerate it here.' If you look closely enough, Gordon, the only thing missing is the knife.

 

THIS is why I still have faith in this forum. One of best thought out and articulated posts I have read in a long while. Well done Sir.

[dirk grout]

I have just learned that John Mackie, who admitted to the racist abuse of Carl Asaba, was handed a 3 game ban by the FA. A 3 game ban. This is a fucking outrage.

[Abs]

I know alot of you guys are angry right now and its understandable. But the statement Liverpool released was absolute joke. It really sounded like a mad man rant and I would expect alot more from a classy club like liverpool, even if they disagreed with the verdict and was going to appeal.

[TheDrowningMan]

I have just learned that John Mackie, who admitted to the racist abuse of Carl Asaba, was handed a 3 game ban by the FA. A 3 game ban. This is a fucking outrage.

 

Banned for three with five suspended.

[Guest LFD]

I know alot of you guys are angry right now and its understandable. But the statement Liverpool released was absolute joke. It really sounded like a mad man rant and I would expect alot more from a classy club like liverpool, even if they disagreed with the verdict and was going to appeal.

 

I know what you are saying.

 

They could have put out a simple, brief and more professioanl statement, saying they will review the report from the FA and then decide how to proceed.

 

But I think they knew that they had to do more in this instance. The FA are a joke and they needed to make a few facts clear - such as saying publically that Evra and the FA mentioned in their statements that Suarez is not a racist. Not to mention other things, which they clearly strongly feel haven't been mentioned or noted publically.

 

Sometimes you have to make some information public to put pressure and increase the scrutiny on the FA to make the right decision in the appeal process, especially when it is of such importance as branding someone as a racist.

 

Usually I'd agree, the club should make more closed, professional statements. But not in this instance, when some facts and information had to be made known and some pressure and scrutiny on the FA was essential.

[stevienando]

I know alot of you guys are angry right now and its understandable. But the statement Liverpool released was absolute joke. It really sounded like a mad man rant and I would expect alot more from a classy club like liverpool, even if they disagreed with the verdict and was going to appeal.

 

Fuck you, fuck off.

[Dr Arthur De Sabre]

Spot on there Razor, time and again I've tried to make the point the argument of racism is built on hollow ground, what indeed we as a people/community/society and the FA should be fighting for is an end to all discrimination.

According to the club Suarez is himself "mixed race", this just doen't add up into any kind of moral or ethical way of thinking, if we accuse suarez of discrimating against evra de to the colour of his skin - which does not really appear to be what has happened but is fundamentally what he is being done for, then evra's performed exactly the same by referring to Suarez as South American. For what it's worth I don't think either player has been openly discimintaory, but I believe the cackhanded way that the British handle discrimination and bigotry - as alluded to in Razor's post, has meant that a situation such as this was always going to arise as british society comes to terms with the fallacy of the concept of racism.

 

If we are all one race, racism cannot exist, instead we just have bullies and bigot's, the same bullies and bigots who are no doubt labelled sexist or homophobic, or any of the other labels we commonly attribute to people who are essentially just dickheads, beahving like dickheads, or people with a very poor grasp of humanity due to their lifetime of indoctrination - ie pensioners.

[moof]

I know alot of you guys are angry right now and its understandable. But the statement Liverpool released was absolute joke. It really sounded like a mad man rant and I would expect alot more from a classy club like liverpool, even if they disagreed with the verdict and was going to appeal.

 

Abs, what's your opinion on Suarez and this hearing/verdict/case.

 

Do you think he's a cheat and a racist? Please be totally honest, i'd like an opinion from an outsider.

[TheResonator]

I know alot of you guys are angry right now and its understandable. But the statement Liverpool released was absolute joke. It really sounded like a mad man rant and I would expect alot more from a classy club like liverpool, even if they disagreed with the verdict and was going to appeal.

 

Loads of people are saying this. You know what, though? It's nobody's problem with the statement itself; it's just the people in power saying 'play by our rules.' They would love nothing more than a deferential 'oh err umm we will be appealing the charge' type statement because it is in keeping with the systems of procedure that they preside over. That gets you nowhere. I would rather we were an object of hatred than one of those who walks meekly towards the hangman's gallows. You and the rest of them can go fuck yourselves.

[stevienando]

Abs, what's your opinion on Suarez and this hearing/verdict/case.

 

Do you think he's a cheat and a racist? Please be totally honest, i'd like an opinion from an outsider.

 

So do I, but Abs is not an outsider, he's a deluded prick on crack.

[rEddie]

I know alot of you guys are angry right now and its understandable. But the statement Liverpool released was absolute joke. It really sounded like a mad man rant and I would expect alot more from a classy club like liverpool, even if they disagreed with the verdict and was going to appeal.

 

Sorry Abs. It sounded like a response that was based on an initial, objective assessment of the verdict, a review of the facts that are at all parties' disposal and a conclusion whereby LFC clearly feels the outcome was wrong.

 

A controlled assessment had to ensue, in order to follow with such an impassioned, as opposed to emotive, response. Time will tell, but to respond in such a fashion, there has to be first an objective and calculated assessment of the situation that confronts the club.

 

Also, LFC as an institution would not put its reputation on the line for one player, without an informed and reasoned basis to contest what appears to be an unjust outcome. IMO.

[moof]

So do I, but Abs is not an outsider, he's a deluded prick on crack.

 

Haha hard to argue with that but he's the closest thing to an outsider we've got!

[SCOUSE TAPAS]

Anybody know roughly how long about before the reasons behind the outcome of this will take.

 

I would of thought they would release it fairly soon after the charge.

[Jairzinho]

I know alot of you guys are angry right now and its understandable. But the statement Liverpool released was absolute joke. It really sounded like a mad man rant and I would expect alot more from a classy club like liverpool, even if they disagreed with the verdict and was going to appeal.

 

[Abs]

Abs, what's your opinion on Suarez and this hearing/verdict/case.

 

Do you think he's a cheat and a racist? Please be totally honest, i'd like an opinion from an outsider.

 

As far as cheat goes, he does go down easy at times. but plenty of players do.

 

I dont think he is racist. Lets be honest, in the heat of the moment, we can all say some bad things. One bad word does not make a person racist.

 

I believe they were trying to wind each other up, and from my understanding negrito is a slang word that can be used in a positive and negative light. Since these two guys dont know each other, I doubt it was used in a positve way.

 

The problem Suarez has is that if he admitted using the word negrito. The FA will say ignorance of different culture is not an excuse. And as they want to make a stand against racism. I really think they will not budge.

 

Terry will get similar ban as well. I just dont think its in Liverpools interest to have a full blown war with the FA and that statement will just anger people.

[Mathewbet1]

Suarez Hattrick - nailed on - get on it.

[moof]

As far as cheat goes, he does go down easy at times. but plenty of players do.

 

I dont think he is racist. Lets be honest, in the heat of the moment, we can all say some bad things. One bad word does not make a person racist.

 

I believe they were trying to wind each other up, and from my understanding negrito is a slang word that can be used in a positive and negative light. Since these two guys dont know each other, I doubt it was used in a positve way.

 

The problem Suarez has is that if he admitted using the word negrito. The FA will say ignorance of different culture is not an excuse. And as they want to make a stand against racism. I really think they will not budge.

 

Terry will get similar ban as well. I just dont think its in Liverpools interest to have a full blown war with the FA and that statement will just anger people.

 

Cheers.

[piscinin]

I just dont think its in Liverpools interest to have a full blown war with the FA and that statement will just anger people.

 

Think that's exactly the point. We've bent over to the FA for too long. We want manure style treatment. We see how they mange to get that and we're going to play by the same rules for a change. The FA are cowards and will always side with whoever would give them the most grief.

 

This sure looks like a turning point. Hopefully, this is the point at which the club finally gets it. "We're a big club, treat us like one; or we will fuck you up". It's long overdue. We've tried to be lillywhite for far too long and it's suited everyone but us. If you want to win, you have to get your hands dirty. Kenny gets that.

 

The fact that the club was willing to throw Evra under the bus is a good sign of a long overdue realization that if you want to win, you can't take prisoners.

[Abs]

Think that's exactly the point. We've bent over to the FA for too long. We want manure style treatment. We see how they mange to get that and we're going to play by the same rules for a change. The FA are cowards and will always side with whoever would give them the most grief.

 

This sure looks like a turning point. Hopefully, this is the point at which the club finally gets it. "We're a big club, treat us like one; or we will fuck you up". It's long overdue. We've tried to be lillywhite for far too long and it's suited everyone but us. If you want to win, you have to get your hands dirty. Kenny gets that.

 

The fact that the club was willing to throw Evra under the bus is a good sign of a long overdue realization that if you want to win, you can't take prisoners.

But since Suarez admitted, Liverpool has no legs to stand on. The FA will just say ignorance is not an excuse. How can you think the FA will bend over and ruin the little credibility they have left in a subject they have criticised fifa and uefa for. The last thing they want to do now is be accused of taking racism lightly

 

I honestly think Liverpool should just take the ban, have suarez apologies if he caused any offence and say that was never his intentions and just move on. This case can really damage your clubs name and read any forum and you will see how little support Liverpool have in this subject

[TheDrowningMan]

It's remarkable how Arsenal's defining characteristic has filtered down through to their fans.

[Abs]

It's remarkable how Arsenal's defining characteristic has filtered down through to their fans.

 

What do you mean? We are known as a classy club:whistle:

[SCOUSE TAPAS]

But since Suarez admitted, Liverpool has no legs to stand on. The FA will just say ignorance is not an excuse. How can you think the FA will bend over and ruin the little credibility they have left in a subject they have criticised fifa and uefa for. The last thing they want to do now is be accused of taking racism lightly

 

I honestly think Liverpool should just take the ban, have suarez apologies if he caused any offence and say that was never his intentions and just move on. This case can really damage your clubs name and read any forum and you will see how little support Liverpool have in this subject

 

Your stupidity is astounding.

 

The problem we are saying is to do with how they reached there conclusion on the matter.

 

They reached the conclusion by asking the accuser and complaint maker if he thought the word was used in a racist way towards him.

 

Now a ten year old child can tell you how stupid and wrong that is for so many reasons,but somebody like you cant.

 

Says it all you need to know about your IQ dont you think?

[piscinin]

But since Suarez admitted, Liverpool has no legs to stand on. The FA will just say ignorance is not an excuse. How can you think the FA will bend over and ruin the little credibility they have left in a subject they have criticised fifa and uefa for. The last thing they want to do now is be accused of taking racism lightly

 

I honestly think Liverpool should just take the ban, have suarez apologies if he caused any offence and say that was never his intentions and just move on. This case can really damage your clubs name and read any forum and you will see how little support Liverpool have in this subject

 

It's got less to do with right and wrong and more to do with laying down a marker so they know that bollocks like the mascherano sending off will result in as much shit for them as it does us.

[chauncey]

I know alot of you guys are angry right now and its understandable. But the statement Liverpool released was absolute joke. It really sounded like a mad man rant and I would expect alot more from a classy club like liverpool, even if they disagreed with the verdict and was going to appeal.

 

I agree that the official statement is... clumsily worded; I'm pleased (as pleased as one can be in this situation) that we're refusing to be seen letting the FA ride roughshod over the player and club. Our people have had enough time to put a statement out and I think they've chosen this response as it will encourage the fanbase to close ranks and apply pressure to the relevant authorities/media outlets.

 

Ordinarily Abs I wouldn't give a shiny shite what 'neutrals' like you think but in this case the media could stoke such feeling that his career at Liverpool is a truncated one. It's that serious.

 

Why - not unlike other teams' best players - couldn't he have just been a rapist instead?

[Kevin D]

Loads of people are saying this. You know what, though? It's nobody's problem with the statement itself; it's just the people in power saying 'play by our rules.' They would love nothing more than a deferential 'oh err umm we will be appealing the charge' type statement because it is in keeping with the systems of procedure that they preside over. That gets you nowhere. I would rather we were an object of hatred than one of those who walks meekly towards the hangman's gallows. You and the rest of them can go fuck yourselves.

 

They've just slandered our star player, and by extension Kenny Dalglish and this football club, which has backed him to the hilt, as racists. That cannot go unanswered. Anybody with a connection and understanding of the tradition and prestige of this club is rightly livid by this slur and, at this time, couldn't give a fuck about tact.