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Stewart Downing

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I've never rated him. We've got enough average players in our squad without adding Downing to it. I'd rather us see us buy Charlie Adam on the cheap, who would offer more to us than Downing.

 

The only player we should be buying from Villa is Ashley Young.

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Youngs no.1 choice for many.

 

or Albrighton who is 21 great prospect and could be got for around 10m. Fits FSG model to a tee.

 

I cant help thinking that j cole will be used as a bargaining tool, a villa would be a good fit for him.

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Youngs no.1 choice for many.

 

or Albrighton who is 21 great prospect and could be got for around 10m. Fits FSG model to a tee.

 

I cant help thinking that j cole will be used as a bargaining tool, a villa would be a good fit for him.

 

Think he'd prefer a townhouse though :smile:

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People need to stop making up fees. No one has a clue how much he is going to cost, or how the deal will be structured. It's pointless talking about which other players we could get for the money because, a) we might not actually be able to get them, and b) we don't know that the fee is.

 

It's a transfer speculation thread - what else do you expect people to do? If we're banned from pulling figures out of our arses in these discussions they'd struggle to get 2 pages.

 

On which note... Downing is one of their stars; is English; has played for England; has two and a bit years left on his contract; Villa aren't exactly skint (i.e. not desperate to sell); they paid £12m for him. With that lot in mind you can quite easily see them looking for £15m-£20m.

 

From our point of view, Downing will be 27 at the start of the season and seeking fat wages/lengthy contract. Surely this goes against the model we're told FSG aspire to?

 

I hope his comments yesterday were just meant to spur Villa into action on the managerial and transfer fronts, because if it was a "come and get me, lads" plea there's no way he's worth the kind of fee they will be demanding. Arsenal have supposedly got money to burn, let them buy him.

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It's a transfer speculation thread - what else do you expect people to do? If we're banned from pulling figures out of our arses in these discussions they'd struggle to get 2 pages.

 

On which note... Downing is one of their stars; is English; has played for England; has two and a bit years left on his contract; Villa aren't exactly skint (i.e. not desperate to sell); they paid £12m for him. With that lot in mind you can quite easily see them looking for £15m-£20m.

 

From our point of view, Downing will be 27 at the start of the season and seeking fat wages/lengthy contract. Surely this goes against the model we're told FSG aspire to?

 

I hope his comments yesterday were just meant to spur Villa into action on the managerial and transfer fronts, because if it was a "come and get me, lads" plea there's no way he's worth the kind of fee they will be demanding. Arsenal have supposedly got money to burn, let them buy him.

 

He's not seeking 'fat wages', he'd take a pay cut to come here.

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I am the least ITK person there could be, but Downing's cousin runs a team in Middlesbrough who my son plays for now and again. She knows both me and my son support Liverpool and sent me the following text last night "Think Stuie is on is way to the pool, put your money on it" Don't shoot the messenger I just thought that I would pass it on.

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Downing (and Young) would suit a team with Carroll in it as they usually cross high into the box. Mata, Hazard and Nzogbia are more modern wide players in that they usually play the ball to feet in the box. One of each would be great.

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These transfer thread always go the same way, they're kind of quaint in a sense. They usually start with a player being mooted, reaction is often negative if they're British and the money involved is stupid (a la Crouch and more recently Carroll), then as pages drift by and it looks like we're going to get the player whether we like it or not, we almost start talking ourselves around to the idea.

 

A 'no way' becomes 'he's not that bad' until eventually he's a signing of potential huge significance and maybe, just maybe, all this time we just weren't aware of just how boss he really was. At this point we usually slag of Rashid or Red Nick for not wanting said player and decide that this is becuase they're somehow shallow and that their understanding of the game only extends to Pannini stickers.

 

What tends to happen then is that said player - who we always knew was overpriced and limited - turns out to be overpriced and limited. It's usually exposed in a big match and we're left feeling blue. We've come full circle, it's time for a cull, no more half measures, we all hate football, and all the while we lament the fact the mancs have just spent £6m on a 17-year-old Guatemalan shitbag who's tearing up more wings than that monster from the William Shatner episode of The Twilight Zone.

 

We quite simply need to start aiming higher. We need either top class players for top dollar, or exciting prospects. Lads who can 'do a job' can not have a place in our football vocabulary anymore or, quite simply, we don't deserve to even be called top four.

 

That's a very good post that is. I've pondered on the group-think that is endemic on places like this. I think at its heart is a very noble defence mechanism designed to protect the group (club) from harm. A player can go from fucking terrible before we were going to sign him, to 'give him a fucking chance' 'don't judge him' once he's pulled on a Liverpool shirt etc. In reality, everyone makes judgements constantly and everyone constantly updates their judgements based on the evidence they know. But this is suppressed to give people the benefit of the doubt, including the manager and players. All very noble.

 

Unfortunately some individuals who struggle to get these norms of behaviour have to play the role of sacrificial lambs - your Red Nicks and Rashids. When a player is stinking the place out, someone has to put their head above the parapet and say: "he's not great, is he?" Getting the timing right is a form of social knowledge and depends on your position within the group. Anyway, enough of the amateur sociology.

 

If Kenny spends £20M on Downing, then that's £55M we would have spent on two players that if you'd ask people to value last year, you would have been lucky to get £15M for. Carroll's signing was reckless, don't pile a whole other layer of madness on top of it.

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That's a very good post that is. I've pondered on the group-think that is endemic on places like this. I think at its heart is a very noble defence mechanism designed to protect the group (club) from harm. A player can go from fucking terrible before we were going to sign him, to 'give him a fucking chance' 'don't judge him' once he's pulled on a Liverpool shirt etc. In reality, everyone makes judgements constantly and everyone constantly updates their judgements based on the evidence they know. But this is suppressed to give people the benefit of the doubt, including the manager and players. All very noble.

 

Unfortunately some individuals who struggle to get these norms of behaviour have to play the role of sacrificial lambs - your Red Nicks and Rashids. When a player is stinking the place out, someone has to put their head above the parapet and say: "he's not great, is he?" Getting the timing right is a form of social knowledge and depends on your position within the group. Anyway, enough of the amateur sociology.

 

If Kenny spends £20M on Downing, then that's £55M we would have spent on two players that if you'd ask people to value last year, you would have been lucky to get £15M for. Carroll's signing was reckless, don't pile a whole other layer of madness on top of it.

 

When we signed Carroll, I said that I think it was perhaps 15-20m too much. At least Carroll is young and has the attributes to be incredibly effective. He cost loads, and is an overhyped English young payer, but Downing has long since passed that stage. 20m is much 'madder money' than Carroll, I'd say.

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When we signed Carroll, I said that I think it was perhaps 15-20m too much. At least Carroll is young and has the attributes to be incredibly effective. He cost loads, and is an overhyped English young payer, but Downing has long since passed that stage. 20m is much 'madder money' than Carroll, I'd say.

 

It depends really. We've got no track record for Carroll so the range of potential outcomes is far wider. He could go on to be top class (worth his £35M). He could go on to be absolutely shite and a liability (minus net worth when you consider his wages). Therefore he has a large variance in his outcomes: -5m< Carroll <35M. His expected value will be somewhere in the middle of that. But Carroll will never exceed his transfer fee - therefore I question whether we will actually get any value-added from him. It is more than likely that he will give us less than what we paid for him.

 

Downing for £15M will never be worth more than his transfer fee but he will always be worth around £5M - £10M even after a few years. A market for his 'talents' will exist even when he's 30+ because you know exactly what he will give you. Therefore it makes more sense than Carroll's signing but not something that I would recommend.

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I've never rated him. We've got enough average players in our squad without adding Downing to it. I'd rather us see us buy Charlie Adam on the cheap, who would offer more to us than Downing.

 

The only player we should be buying from Villa is Ashley Young.

 

Outta interest, why do you rate Young at a higher level than Downing?

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Young is faster. We need pace, badly.

We also need a direct winger like him. Someone who takes on players and looks for the shot or a pass. I don't think we need old fashioned wingers like Downing to sit wide and lob balls into the box, I mean, for fuck's sake, Newcastle don't have any winger like that, Gutierrez is hardly good at crossing is he? And that's just one dimensional play and about the only thing Downing can really do at a very good level.

 

No, Carroll got a lot of service from Enrique going forward and Barton drifting wide a bit to deliver a ball into the box, something Gerrard does a lot and very well too. There's no reason we can't do the same especially as I think Enrique is long done & dusted.

 

We bought Carroll for £35m, buying more limited players like Downing just to tailor the team to his needs is ridiculous. He'll simply have to start playing better on the deck, which I'm confident he will, and his aerial abilities will still come in very handy via the fullbacks and more importantly, set pieces.

 

Downing will easily cost close to £20m. Hell, looking at Milner, probably even more.

Paying that for him is fucking madness and make no mistake, we'll have to pay that. Villa may have sold all their best players in recent years but they're not a selling club, they don't want or need the money and they'd prefer to keep Downing so they'll make sure that if a player pushes for a move they'll make you pay through the nose.

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I don't think anyone will make the point that he's a bad player mate.

The two questions are -

A. Is he a £20m player, cause that's what he's going to cost.

B. Is he really what we need right now to justify that price.

 

If we get him I'll be pretty damn disappointed given what his price will be. I hope he's a fallback option in case we don't get Mata.

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I don't think anyone will make the point that he's a bad player mate.

The two questions are -

A. Is he a £20m player, cause that's what he's going to cost.

B. Is he really what we need right now to justify that price.

 

If we get him I'll be pretty damn disappointed given what his price will be. I hope he's a fallback option in case we don't get Mata.

 

Why does it have to be one or the other? We obviously need at least 2 attacking players why not buy 2 that can add different things to the team.

 

Also how do you know how much he'd cost?

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Why does it have to be one or the other? We obviously need at least 2 attacking players why not buy 2 that can add different things to the team.

 

Also how do you know how much he'd cost?

 

If we're going to get 2 wingers I'd still prefer Downing not to be one of them, again, mainly because of the price. I just can't see Downing coming as the lesser of two wingers, if you will, not for the money we'll have to pay for him.

 

I don't know exactly how much he'd cost, I do know that people who think we'll get him for even £15m are dreaming.

This is a player Villa bought for a whopping £12m only 2 years ago and their current player of the season and yet somehow many people seem to think they're going to sell him at a loss or for about the same price they got him for.

 

Downing has 2 years left on his contract, he's their best player since Young is all but gone, and they're not a selling club, they prefer to keep their players so if we want him and he pushes for a move, they'll make us pay through the nose.

£20m+ easily, Lerner is no chump.

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I don't know exactly how much he'd cost, I do know that people who think we'll get him for even £15m are dreaming.

This is a player Villa bought for a whopping £12m only 2 years ago and their current player of the season and yet somehow many people seem to think they're going to sell him at a loss or for about the same price they got him for.

 

Downing has 2 years left on his contract, he's their best player since Young is all but gone, and they're not a selling club, they prefer to keep their players so if we want him and he pushes for a move, they'll make us pay through the nose.

£20m+ easily, Lerner is no chump.

 

Exactly. The only possibility of Villa selling for less than £12m is if he doesn't sign a new contract, and even then you're looking at the 2012 transfer windows before getting him 'on the cheap'.

 

It's my opinion that if between now and August he's pictured stood next to Kenny in a red shirt, we'll have been had and Villa will be moaning all the way to the bank. Unless Ged and Gary Mac are offering mates' rates...

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I could handle £12-13m for him. 15 million would be my absolute tolerance level.

 

Some people are incredibly harsh. He was Villa's player of the year for a reason.

 

Chiefly they had a shite season

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I'd get Young, too. But he wouldn't give us balance playing him on the left.

 

Downing's a good player. Good winger. Can beat a man and he's got a boss left foot.

 

Young's a good player, too, don't get me wrong. But I don't like the way he gets to the byline on the left and cuts back to put a cross in. He'll get found out by a full back who's worth his salt.

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]When we signed Carroll' date=' I said that I think it was perhaps 15-20m too much[/b']. At least Carroll is young and has the attributes to be incredibly effective. He cost loads, and is an overhyped English young payer, but Downing has long since passed that stage. 20m is much 'madder money' than Carroll, I'd say.

 

Ha! Carroll was NEVER EVER IN A MILLION YEARS going to move for less than 20m

 

That's just talking thick.

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Downing is exactly what Carroll needs, a player that hugs the touchline and can get himself a yard to whip a great cross in. Downing also gets in the box and has a decent shot on him.

 

Now we need a player in centre midfield who can move the ball quickly and switch play to either flank. Someone like Charlie Adam.

 

I know it's fashionable to go for a load of individually brilliant players who can pass and move the ball in between the lines like Arsenal and Barcelona but we've got a hulking centre forward who can't run in behind the defences so we need to make sure we get the right player for him to thrive off. He could get 15 - 20 goals a season with the right delivery and Suarez will get that through his individual brilliance, he doesn't need to be supplied in the same way.

 

I like the look of our front two if we can get Downing in

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