Tory Country

[Duncan Clench]

Okay so now we are getting to the crux of it.  I think I've answered the SNP point but I will just do it again anyway.  The SNP vote is irrelevant.  They are a party left of labour.  If labour had won all the seats in Scotland that the SNP won the tory majority would still be the same because the SNP are more against the tories than Labour are.  The tories would still have the same number of seats

 

You are also suggesting there are some potential labour voters who voted UKIP, a party to the right of the tories who have solely been created and based their campaign on one issue which is to take the UK out of the EU, because Labour ruled out a coalition with the SNP to get the tories out.  Do you not realise how ridiculous this is?  There are plenty of people who voted UKIP who would have voted labour, conservative etc but if you think they chose to vote for UKIP because Labour ruled out a coalition with the SNP you are more stupid than I thought  They did so because they hate immigrants, are racist or are thick as fuck.  They aren't voting UKIP because Labour refused to go into coalition with the SNP.  Anyone clever enough to worry about something like that south of the border wouldn't be stupid enough to then vote for a party more right of the tories.

 

This is all ignoring the fact UKIP and the greens only got 2 seats and their votes weren't enough to have significantly lowered votes on labours or the conservatives side to lose the marginals.  Labour lost the marginals because more people voted tory in them.  It's a simple as that.

 

It's a laughably stupid point to make.

 

This is the exact quote

 

"I strongly feel that if Ed Miliband hadn't completely dismissed the idea of coalition with the SNP then they'd be in power right now."

 

And it's fucking thick as pigshit.

 

Mate I'm bored of explaining the same point to you over and over again while being called all sorts. Sort yourself out.

 

Yes, I'm suggesting that some Labour voters (not supporters) might vote UKIP. You don't know why people vote the way they do, and we've touched on the fact, in this very thread (that you appear reluctant to read, preferring to take snippets at which you can spout bilious crap) that there are more than a few people who vote based on such wealth of information as what a person looks like. Just as easily, they could vote for the Tories. And they did. Why you think it so mind-blowing that Labour could turn UKIP I don't know... especially when a whole load went Tory.

 

http://diamondgeezer.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/majority-2015.html?m=1 This article shows how close some of the marginal were (and goes on to suggest that 901 votes could have changed the outcome which I wouldn't take too much notice of unless that's the bit you decide to focus on and then rant about). Lots of people went from Labour to Tory (and to UKIP and Green), I think if Milliband had not dismissed the notion of a coalition then he would have kept more of those voters, and it's clear that it doesn't take many to make a big difference in the marginals. 

 

If someone could change their vote based on the looks of a leader, then why couldn't they change based on the fact that Miliband would rather let the Tories in than entertain a coalition?

[Jairzinho]

Loads of UKIP voters are ex Labour. UKIP pretend to represent the working class, Labour can't even be bothered to pretend any more.

[bouncebrigade]

Speak english Boy

 

He said with a straight face.

[Oh Buoy]

More than 12,000 people have signed a petition demanding the north of England break away from the “London-centric south” and join a new Scotland.

 

The petition says the northern English cities “feel far greater affinity with their Scottish counterparts such as Glasgow and Edinburgh than with the ideologies of the London-centric south” and demands secession from the UK.

 

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/the-northerner/2015/may/14/thousands-sign-petition-calling-for-north-of-england-to-be-part-of-scotland?CMP=fb_gu

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Silly billies

[Bjornebye]

I reckon I could take Nigel Farage's head clean off with a decent dig.

[Oh Buoy]

I reckon I could take Nigel Farage's head clean off with a decent dig.

 

 

Nah.

 

 

[Section_31]

Loads of UKIP voters are ex Labour. UKIP pretend to represent the working class, Labour can't even be bothered to pretend any more.

 

It's a weird one. 

 

I think that's true to an extent, but it was a symptom of something bigger. 

 

The immigration debate was something felt strongly about in large parts of the country but Labour ignored those concerns out of the fact they were aloof, they were run by a Westminster elite and their attitude to such concerns was to call people bigots like Gordon Brown did. 

 

I genuinely don't think the likes of Cameron and Osborne are in the slightest bit bothered about Immigration either, they just have to pretend to be in order to placate their back benchers. 

 

I think working class people felt Labour, and especially its leadership, were simply from a different world to them now, that Labour isn't a grassroots movements of 'workers' and union men and activists, but merely some kind of quasi-liberal career path for people who couldn't quite bring to call themselves Tories. 

 

I genuinely don't even  think these things are conscious, people just instinctievely know Labour don't give a fuck. 

[The Guest]

Loads of UKIP voters are ex Labour. UKIP pretend to represent the working class, Labour can't even be bothered to pretend any more.

 

I'm not arguing that.

 

I'm saying it's absolutely fucking laughable to think that there are enough people in England that would be pissed off with Labour for ruling out a coalition with SNP and subsequently vote for UKIP because of that reason that would effect whether labour would be in power or not.

 

That's not even taking into account how many English people would then have voted away from Labour because they refused to rule it out.

[Jairzinho]

It's a weird one. 

 

I think that's true to an extent, but it was a symptom of something bigger. 

 

The immigration debate was something felt strongly about in large parts of the country but Labour ignored those concerns out of the fact they were aloof, they were run by a Westminster elite and their attitude to such concerns was to call people bigots like Gordon Brown did. 

 

I genuinely don't think the likes of Cameron and Osborne are in the slightest bit bothered about Immigration either, they just have to pretend to be in order to placate their back benchers. 

 

I think working class people felt Labour, and especially its leadership, were simply from a different world to them now, that Labour isn't a grassroots movements of 'workers' and union men and activists, but merely some kind of quasi-liberal career path for people who couldn't quite bring to call themselves Tories. 

 

I genuinely don't even  think these things are conscious, people just instinctievely know Labour don't give a fuck. 

 

I agree. Was talking to a lad about two days before the election. He's from quite a poor part of Newcastle, his family have voted Labour for 50+ years, etc. He voted UKIP (despite some half arsed efforts from myself to change his mind) because he likes some of the rhetoric of UKIP, he even knows loads of it will be bollocks (he's a reasonably smart lad), he just wants something different. He detests the current Labour Party, as you say from a different world. I honestly think he'd be almost as likely to vote Green as UKIP. He no longer believes a word the three other parties say (and would never have voted Tory anyway).

 

The Labour Party is finished, I reckon. They won't get in on Tory lite, people will just vote Tory. And they haven't got the inclination to revert back to any of their founding principles as they know short term it won't work. We need a new party, I like the Greens but if it's to be them they at least have to change the name. Syriza, Podemos...Greens. Nah. 

 

Greenesma.

[Section_31]

I agree. Was talking to a lad about two days before the election. He's from quite a poor part of Newcastle, his family have voted Labour for 50+ years, etc. He voted UKIP (despite some half arsed efforts from myself to change his mind) because he likes some of the rhetoric of UKIP, he even knows loads of it will be bollocks (he's a reasonably smart lad), he just wants something different. He detests the current Labour Party, as you say from a different world. I honestly think he'd be almost as likely to vote Green as UKIP. He no longer believes a word the three other parties say (and would never have voted Tory anyway).

 

The Labour Party is finished, I reckon. They won't get in on Tory lite, people will just vote Tory. And they haven't got the inclination to revert back to any of their founding principles as they know short term it won't work. We need a new party, I like the Greens but if it's to be them they at least have to change the name. Syriza, Podemos...Greens. Nah. 

 

Greenesma.

 

I think you're right unfortunately. 

 

Umuna is the last straw for me, seems like a Grade A tory cunt, and they're all sticking the knife into Ed Miliband now. Milburn today calling the last five years a 'grotesque experiment'. An experiement in what? Left of centre politics? For the Labour party for fuck's sake?

 

I wanted to get involved in politics in some way, it does genuinely feel like a 'fight' now, like I've been occupied by people who don't care whether me and mine live or die, and I'm not prepared to just sit back and eat that, I toyed with Labour membership but not after the last week. 

 

If Labour seriously thinks a shift to the right is the answer then its top brass is even more retarded and out of touch than I imagined, the party is fucked good and proper. 

[Jairzinho]

I think you're right unfortunately. 

 

Umuna is the last straw for me, seems like a Grade A tory cunt, and they're all sticking the knife into Ed Miliband now. Milburn today calling the last five years a 'grotesque experiment'. An experiement in what? Left of centre politics? For the Labour party for fuck's sake?

 

I wanted to get involved in politics in some way, it does genuinely feel like a 'fight' now, like I've been occupied by people who don't care whether me and mine live or die, and I'm not prepared to just sit back and eat that, I toyed with Labour membership but not after the last week. 

 

If Labour seriously thinks a shift to the right is the answer then its top brass is even more retarded and out of touch than I imagined, the party is fucked good and proper. 

 

Yeah, Umuna seems like a 100 carrot cunt.

 

I'd considered standing for the Greens but a combination of living in an area to the right of Nick Griffin, it being highly unlikely Caroline or Natalie would be okay with how much of a cunt I'd be on the campaign, and having little intention of still living in the UK in five years, meant I didn't bother. I've met a few Green candidates (although ironically not the one in my constituency) and they look like, well, Green candidates. They need some cunts. I know it'll piss off the full blow super lentils that support the party, but if they ever want to really be a sizeable party they'll have to do away the image that they care more about the plight of Greyhounds than the economy.

 

I think it very much has got to the point where Labour have to be ditched though. Start a movement now, even with the acceptance that you'll not win the next election (especially as I don't think Labour will anyway, even drifting further off to the right). Although we've become quite a ring wing country, our situation isn't completely unique. Other countries have had a couple of shit parties that don't represent the many with the same "You have to vote for this slightly less appalling one or else you get the other" shit, and the people have just decided enough is enough. Other countries also have Cunt media. Get it binned.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Why is Umunna a grade A Tory cunt?

[Jairzinho]

Bugger, posted the article in the wrong thread. Well, sort of the right thread, but the...whatever.

[magicrat]

People believed the economy had turned a corner above all else . Like most other elections its the party that tells the best story on the economy which wins.  

[Bobby Hundreds]

Its whichever side the media supports. Namely Rupert Murdoch.

[Dougie Do'ins]

Don't hang around do they.

 

George Osborne calls emergency July budget to reveal next wave of austerity

George Osborne will reveal how the government plans to cut £12bn from Britain’s welfare bill when he announces a fresh wave of austerity measures in his second budget in less than four months on 8 July. The chancellor said he wanted to make a start delivering on the commitments made in the Conservative party manifesto and pledged that his package would be a budget for “working people”.

Announcing his decision in an article in the Sun, Osborne said he would provide details of how the government plans to eliminate the UK’s budget deficit – forecast to be £75bn this year – and run a surplus by the end of the parliament. “On the 8th of July I am going to take the unusual step of having a second budget of the year – because I don’t want to wait to turn the promises we made in the election into a reality … And I can tell you it will be a budget for working people.”

Treasury sources said the budget would address Britain’s poor productivity record, which has held back growth in living standards, and would also announce plans to create 3m new apprenticeships. However, the centrepiece of the package will be a fresh bout of austerity, with Osborne keen to get unpopular measures out of the way early in the parliament, in readiness for pre-election tax cuts once the public finances have improved.

Provided the economy performs in line with forecasts made by the independent Office for Budget Responsibility, borrowing will be reduced to £41bn in 2016-17 and £14.5bn in 2017-18. By 2018-19, the plan is for the UK to be running a budget surplus of £4bn.

The Conservatives have provided details of how they will find around £1.5bn of savings from the UK’s social security budget and came under pressure from the Institute for Fiscal Studies during the election campaign to explain how they would find the remaining £10.5bn. The IFS said the scale of the overall savings - 10% of the part of the welfare bill not spent on pensioners - would involve the Conservatives looking at child benefit, child tax credit and disability allowances. According to the Treasury, the budget would announce reforms of welfare that would protect the most vulnerable while making sure the system is fair to taxpayers.

Osborne will say in the budget that the Conservatives intend to adopt a fair and balanced approach to deficit reduction, and that the package will include ringfencing spending on the NHS while cutting £13bn from other Whitehall departments. The budget will also include a fresh crackdown on tax avoidance designed to raise £5bn.

The timing of the budget in early July will allow the Office for Budget Responsibility to produce new forecasts for the economy and the public finances while giving time for a finance bill to be passed before parliament rises for its summer recess.

With Labour holding a leadership contest following the resignation of Ed Miliband, Osborne will seek to portray his package as a one-nation budget, with measures to build the so-called northern powerhouse and ensure that prosperity is not confined to London and the south-east.

The timing comes at a bad time for Labour, which has no shadow chancellor since the defeat of Ed Balls in the election. Harriet Harman, the caretaker leader, will have the task of responding to Osborne’s speech, while Chris Leslie temporarily heads Labour’s economic team.

As in the last parliament, Osborne will use the “one nation” theme of the budget to set the terms of the economic debate for the next five years while Labour is preoccupied by its own internal debates.

[Anubis]

[Jairzinho]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0y_K9a8XUQ

 

Beakesma.

[Ginny]

The welfare cuts are a funny one. I know loads of lads who are my age (33) and able bodied and have been on 'job seekers' for fuckin years. To the point that they annoy the shit out of me. My old drummer in my band was on the dole for years and must owe us all £100's in recording costs, practice room time and taxis and pints etc... I was working full time and was living in a shared house - he was on the dole and had his own one bed flat paid for. He's the first one on Facebook tearing into the Tories but I hope people like him get found out cos it's a fucking joke. Just for the record I voted labour but I think labour are viewed as a party that harbours the layabouts.

 

Obviously people need welfare and I am more than happy to pay higher tax to support that. I've even got a job promotion this month which takes me into a higher tax bracket. I don't care - always happy to support people in need but I hope the net closes on these lazy cunts.

[Jairzinho]

What would you like to see happen to him?

 

Kick him out of the flat and take away his £70 JSA?

[Mook]

It's part of being a drummer to be a useless cunt at life. It's to do with the polyrhythmic 5th dimension.

[Bobby Hundreds]

We just need to pray that whoever we owe all this debt too doesn't demand it all back right away. Essentially it's going to be two years doing the nastiest shit they can get away with, then brainwashing and giveaways and everything wil be rosy, then they get in again and repeat. 10 years there will be no state assets/services just an elected board that barks at the peasants used to keep control for the corporate overlords. Fuck it think I'm going to buy some chips and curry and butter some bread.

[Anny Road]

Who do we borrow this money from? Bet it's the Jewish isn't it.

[lifetime fan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0y_K9a8XUQ

 

Beakesma.

1 minute in.

 

Fucking cheeky twat trying to claim they did anything about Winterbourne View.

 

They did absolutely fuck all to improve the situation and actually colluded with the lib dems to make sure there wasn't any meaningful change.

 

Lying prick. Doesn't stop him using his own disabled child though does it. Despicable cunt.