New HBO Series: Game of Thrones

[Anubis]

I’ll have to give it another watching in optimal

conditions.

 

This made me chuckle, and is worth a read.

 

https://www.wired.com/story/game-of-thrones-winterfell-battle-tactical-analysis/

[Pidge]

1 hour ago, Anubis said:

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.theverge.com/platform/amp/tldr/2019/4/30/18524679/game-of-thrones-battle-of-winterfell-too-dark-fabian-wagner-response-cinematographer

 

"After all, Wagner says the show was directed and shot like a cinematic experience that could be viewed in a movie theatre"

 

Yeah, well it's not.  Pretentious twat.  It's a TV show for home viewing, you should have some knowledge of how it'll be viewed to inform how you light it.  I have my TV set up, probably far from perfectly, to suit my average viewing and am not going to fuck around with settings every time I want to watch something on the basis that I somehow know how the content has been shot before I've fucking watched it...

 

Blaming the showrunners doesn't wash either, he's the one paid to have the technical knowledge to inform and guide those directions.  Maybe they aren't receptive to such feedback, or don't have the time to consider screentests, in which case he would have a point.  But it's not one he'd ever make if he wants to work again.

 

He did have to battle one element, noir styles usually benefit from sharp contrasts to help identify edges where much of the screen is in darkness.  The snowstorm really affected his capability there as the background lighting had a much more subtle feeling that they obviously wanted to retain.  It was there in places, Jon and the blue flames, Arya and the wights in the library, even the crypts (although needed a few more third man/M shadows to get full film-nerd points).  But the external just came across as muddy and indistinct on first watch. 

 

I can only assume budget concerns meant we didn't see more close detail to contrast with the big, muddy wide shots.

[Bjornebye]

Fuck sake anyone else accidentally subscribe to Cosmo? 

[Sugar Ape]

3 hours ago, RedKnight said:

 

It has but that's the folly of having a mute enemy. We have no idea what the motivations are, where they've been, where their power comes from, why they make that swirling symbol, how they forged a deal with Craster for his sons and what they intended to do if they won.

 

Lots of questions, zero answers and it's why an over-powered villain who doesn't speak can very often be a narrative cul-de-sac.

I know the show is different from the books, but in the books you have point of view characters and some characters, like Robb Stark for example, who are not POV and are only seen through the eyes of others which is why you just see the outcome of the battle of the whispering wood rather than witnessing it happen.

 

For me the NK is like a non POV character for the show. He’s mainly seen through the eyes of others and it’s intentional to keep his motivations secret. It just adds to the ‘otherness’ of him only knowing whatever cryptic bits Bran has thrown out. 

 

I’d say it’s similar to Sauron in LOTR. You don’t need to know much about him beyond he wants to wipe everyone out and he wants his fucking ring back. Sometimes less is more and all that. 

 

2 hours ago, Spy Bee said:

A couple of things here... they reckon the darkness was due to the compression HBO used, and judging by some hi-def clips I have seen posted online, that looks to be entirely valid.

 

In terms of the battle, the Whitewalkers were almost too powerful. The fight could never be expanded over an extended period, because they would swarm all over you. The idea of the living retreating was never feasible. It was either kill or be killed, there and then. This was suggested often when they talked about it being all over by dawn etc.

Yeah I agree, Jon was even going on about it in a previous episode talking about fighting enemies that don’t tire and need rest or feel pain etc..

 

You can’t really retreat with them at your back.

 

1 hour ago, aws said:

Watching in a darkroom with the brightness up a bit makes a massive difference and everything is visible except the bits they don't want you to see like the wights swarming over people and the dragon fights which are pretty much unfilmable.

 

So we now know that the song of ice and fire consists of two story arcs rather than one and we've more or less seen the conclusion of the first although I expect there might be a bit of clearing up to do.  Arya is azor ahai and the endless training sequences make sense as does the way Jaqen was happy to see her leave once she'd proven herself. 

 

Arya wasn’t born amongst fire and salt or whatever the prophecy said was she? If Arya is pregnant and has a kid however...

[Remmie]

Was a bit shithouse to sacrifice the Dothraki and then Unsullied first seeing as they could have stayed safe in Essos but came to fight for the throne. 

[aws]

2 hours ago, Anubis said:

I’ll have to give it another watching in optimal

conditions.

 

This made me chuckle, and is worth a read.

 

https://www.wired.com/story/game-of-thrones-winterfell-battle-tactical-analysis/

Should have loaded those ballistas with the millions of dragon glass chippings Gendry must have swept out of his smithy.  Would have gone through the wights like a medieval Gatling gun. 

[Gooch]

The more I've thought about it the worse I think it is. Proper brain dead, mindless, shite from start to finish. The ending can't come soon enough.

[moof]

1 hour ago, Gooch said:

The more I've thought about it the worse I think it is. Proper brain dead, mindless, shite from start to finish. The ending can't come soon enough.

Here’s an idea; don’t watch it 

[General Dryness]

9 hours ago, Captain Turdseye said:

 

It’s up on Spotify as a single. Had it on myself earlier. 

 

 

Excellent score for the whole episode. This one has a bit of a feel of Lux Aeterna to it.

[Reckoner]

13 hours ago, VERBAL DIARRHEA said:

Jon Snow is coming off a bit Harry Kane. It was my kill!

He was actually shouting “let’s go!!!!” to the dragon

[Gooch]

10 hours ago, moof said:

Here’s an idea; don’t watch it 

Really? With 3 episodes left? Having watched since it first started? Nah.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

12 hours ago, Gooch said:

The more I've thought about it the worse I think it is. Proper brain dead, mindless, shite from start to finish. The ending can't come soon enough.

Talking out of your arse. Which is appropriate given your user name.

[Numero Veinticinco]

14 hours ago, Gooch said:

The more I've thought about it the worse I think it is. Proper brain dead, mindless, shite from start to finish. The ending can't come soon enough.

Utter fucking bullshit. Are you sure you put any thought into it at all, because you’ve not shown it in this mindless declaration. 

[3 Stacks]

Have to agree that it was mindless. Doesn't mean it didn't make for good tv or that the suspense or the visuals weren't there, but the implications this episode had in terms of the greater story and what the show-runners have been doing were shite. It was basically like: We don't know what to do with the fantasy aspect and these white zombies but Dany is currently too strong for Cersei so let's bring her up north so they can get rid of these zombies and at the same time make this a more realistic fight for the actual threat to come.

 

That's the overall impression it leaves you with because the WW storyline was incredibly shallow to begin with and they clearly just decided, fuck it, don't want to deal with it anymore. Or they're saving an in-depth backstory for the prequels, but that's no good right now, is it.

 

You have to judge the overall story when the season and the whole thing is over, but right now, that episode and the conclusion to it were weak.

[Bjornebye]

59 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

Have to agree that it was mindless. Doesn't mean it didn't make for good tv or that the suspense or the visuals weren't there, but the implications this episode had in terms of the greater story and what the show-runners have been doing were shite. It was basically like: We don't know what to do with the fantasy aspect and these white zombies but Dany is currently too strong for Cersei so let's bring her up north so they can get rid of these zombies and at the same time make this a more realistic fight for the actual threat to come.

 

That's the overall impression it leaves you with because the WW storyline was incredibly shallow to begin with and they clearly just decided, fuck it, don't want to deal with it anymore. Or they're saving an in-depth backstory for the prequels, but that's no good right now, is it.

 

You have to judge the overall story when the season and the whole thing is over, but right now, that episode and the conclusion to it were weak.

An army risen from the dead attacking a castle guarded by 2 dragons and a battalion of men without dicks? Fuck all mindless about that in my book. 

[Numero Veinticinco]

 

[KMD7]

16 minutes ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

 

Brilliant

[Gooch]

The episode had all the tropes of a standard Hollywood flick, nothing wrong with these in other films/TV etc given the right context, but this is a show that built its reputation on subverting those tropes, not embracing them.

 

I wouldn't mind so much if it was actually done well, but it was painfully dumb and the show has, for the last few seasons, been constantly hamstrung by being in awe of the fandom it's created, sacrificing any interesting storytelling for cheap Hollywood moments to satisfy these morons.

 

Maybe they'll pull something out of the hat and wrap this up well, but give how things have played out so far, they don't seem remotely capable of it. They will probably fall back on some lazy, anti-climatic finale and everyone goes home 'happy'.

 

[polymerpunkah]

It's still living on the good will the first three books earned with me. 

 

He lost his way in books 4 and 5, so all I wanted from the makers of the TV show was that they do justice to the first three books, then extract a passable story out of the rest and deliver it in as entertaining a manner as possible.

 

It's done that.

 

But I'm still disappointed with the books. After those first three I thought I'd found another classic set to add to the "reread" list. No such luck. I doubt he'll ever finish them, and if they are finished, they'll be short novelizations of the television show.

 

 

 

 

[General Dryness]

1 hour ago, Numero Veinticinco said:

 

Big fan of Swede Mason here. He's definitely got a gift with sampling and whatnot. This was a season 7 promo he did for Sky. 

[Sugar Ape]

3 hours ago, 3 Stacks said:

Have to agree that it was mindless. Doesn't mean it didn't make for good tv or that the suspense or the visuals weren't there, but the implications this episode had in terms of the greater story and what the show-runners have been doing were shite. It was basically like: We don't know what to do with the fantasy aspect and these white zombies but Dany is currently too strong for Cersei so let's bring her up north so they can get rid of these zombies and at the same time make this a more realistic fight for the actual threat to come.

 

That's the overall impression it leaves you with because the WW storyline was incredibly shallow to begin with and they clearly just decided, fuck it, don't want to deal with it anymore. Or they're saving an in-depth backstory for the prequels, but that's no good right now, is it.

 

You have to judge the overall story when the season and the whole thing is over, but right now, that episode and the conclusion to it were weak.

 

Mate, there are only three episodes left. If they don’t deal with it now then when? They obviously need 2-3 episodes to wrap up the main storyline of the iron throne and every other payoff we’ve been waiting for like The Hound V The Mountain. 

 

Either the strand with the Night King or the Strand with Cersei had to wrap up around now to leave time to deal with the other.

[Remmie]

I think whatever they'd done in this final season would be subject to criticism. There are so many characters that everyone has favourites and some will get less screen time and/or killed off without a satisfying ending. It's also trying to maintain the incredibly high standards from previous seasons and wrapping up multiple story arcs of characters that lead very different lives suddenly thrust together. 

 

For all those wanting a bigger wight wanker battle there will be plenty like me who are delighted that that story has been snuffed the fuck out, not before time. Just think, the real moaning hasn't even started, as it will reach a crescendo on the finale: too predictable or too many favourites killed or whatever. 

 

Bring it on. 

[Pidge]

1 hour ago, Sugar Ape said:

 

Mate, there are only three episodes left. If they don’t deal with it now then when? They obviously need 2-3 episodes to wrap up the main storyline of the iron throne and every other payoff we’ve been waiting for like The Hound V The Mountain. 

 

Either the strand with the Night King or the Strand with Cersei had to wrap up around now to leave time to deal with the other.

Why are they mutually exclusive?  There were plenty of options to bring things to a head together (the classic A/B story structure), they could have flattened Winterfell and then have a frantic rush to get South. The Golden Company are, I assume, in the field tasked with winning the South for the Lannisters. The refugees stuck between two hosts, the golden company could then have come face to face with an enemy that doesn't care who's paying them and may have broken them...

 

I'm following a thread there in the worst I-grew-up-reading-Tolkien-and-Pratchett way possible...  Point is, there's plenty of options (and there still are), I don't buy this whole one show is finished to allow the other one to now conclude.  They were the same show.  As I said to NV a while back, the opening scene of the books and the show is about the White Walkers.  "Winter is coming".

 

Winter has been and gone, it was a bit mild and inclement but we had a day off when they closed the roads...

 

edit: to clarify I'm still fine with what they're doing, they can do what they want.  I'm still going to enjoy what they serve up.  It's just that the idea that are separate stories that needed to be boxed up separately doesn't work for me.

[Sugar Ape]

27 minutes ago, Pidge said:

Why are they mutually exclusive?  There were plenty of options to bring things to a head together (the classic A/B story structure), they could have flattened Winterfell and then have a frantic rush to get South. The Golden Company are, I assume, in the field tasked with winning the South for the Lannisters. The refugees stuck between two hosts, the golden company could then have come face to face with an enemy that doesn't care who's paying them and may have broken them...

 

I'm following a thread there in the worst I-grew-up-reading-Tolkien-and-Pratchett way possible...  Point is, there's plenty of options (and there still are), I don't buy this whole one show is finished to allow the other one to now conclude.  They were the same show.  As I said to NV a while back, the opening scene of the books and the show is about the White Walkers.  "Winter is coming".

 

Winter has been and gone, it was a bit mild and inclement but we had a day off when they closed the roads...

 

edit: to clarify I'm still fine with what they're doing, they can do what they want.  I'm still going to enjoy what they serve up.  It's just that the idea that are separate stories that needed to be boxed up separately doesn't work for me.

It works for me. I’ve always viewed then as separate stories

 

How are you meant to retreat from an enemy that is faster than you and doesn’t need to sleep, rest, eat or drink? As soon as they made their stand at Winterfell, which was always going to happen once they breached the wall, then that was where the White walker story ended for me unless they killed literally everyone at Winterfell and the last battle is between the Golden company and the White walkers which really would have been bad writing.

 

The only way to resolve all  the things still left hanging; Cleganebowl, Arya and Cersei, Tormund or Jamie tapping Brienne, Bronn presumably trying to take out Tyrion and the final battle for the throne was to deal with the Night King beforehand imo. There was almost a feature length battle with him to end his storyline, I’m bemused how people can feel short changed by that to be honest.

 

Anyway, last three episodes I’m expecting;

Next episode: Deal with aftermath of Winterfell and all to prepare for battle. 

Second to last: War!

Last episode: Sort our the final little bits and see who ascends the throne.

[Sugar Ape]