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Will you vote for Alternative Vote?  

54 members have voted

  1. 1. Will you vote for Alternative Vote?

    • Yes
      29
    • No
      25


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After the fucking grief I've been getting for the last 11 months, I can't believe the number of people here who are going to vote WITH the Tories in the referendum and against Labour, Lib Dems, Greens, SNP, Plaid and UKIP. You cheeky hypocritical fuckers!

 

dont every make out you never start the insults again you cheeky hypocritical fucker.

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And I'm sure the next Tory government will be happy to give it to them, really happy :whatever:

 

Best chance we've had of giving the bastards a kicking for decades and you're going to give them what they want.

A kicking?

 

The chance of moving from one unrepresentative, undemocratic majoritarian system to an arguably, marginally less awful majoritarian system is what you call a kicking?

 

"Smithers, dispose of the body and send a corsage to the widow."

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And I'm sure the next Tory government will be happy to give it to them, really happy :whatever:

 

Best chance we've had of giving the bastards a kicking for decades and you're going to give them what they want.

 

Careful now Stronts, those 'bastards' are your coalition masters.

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There was no personal insult in my post. There was in yours though.

 

I think you are splitting hairs a bit, making a comment plural doesnt make it less personnal it just means your insulting more than one person. On reflection however I owe a sort of apology, so here it is, Sorry SD, on the subject of voting reform you have never been hypocritical or a fucker.

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And I'm sure the next Tory government will be happy to give it to them, really happy :whatever:

 

Best chance we've had of giving the bastards a kicking for decades and you're going to give them what they want.

 

You want to give them a kicking while you help them in government? You are a fucking beaut.

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Guest Numero Veinticinco
After the fucking grief I've been getting for the last 11 months, I can't believe the number of people here who are going to vote WITH the Tories in the referendum and against Labour, Lib Dems, Greens, SNP, Plaid and UKIP. You cheeky hypocritical fuckers!

 

I think that's harsh (I know I'm not included in that, as I'll be begrudgingly voting yes, but still...). It doesn't make them a hypocrite to simple vote against something they don't agree with, just because most Conservatives disagree with it.

 

The reason you're getting grief is because of some of the views you've been sharing and the suspicion that you're displaying those beliefs simply because your party has followed the Conservatives down the rabbit hole.

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AV would have resulted in a LD win pre-election.

 

 

No it wouldn't. They reckoned it would have added about 30 seats to our tally, although crucially, it would have made the possibility of coalition with Labour a mathematical possibility.

 

A kicking?

 

The chance of moving from one unrepresentative, undemocratic majoritarian system to an arguably, marginally less awful majoritarian system is what you call a kicking?

 

 

The Tories are screwed if we get AV. They know as well as everyone else does that Labour voters are more likely to put Lib Dems second, and vice versa. Most people in this country are centre/centre-left/left. I mentioned a figure of 30 seats above, two thirds of those would have been Tory seats. Why do you think Ed M is going all in for this? He's not an idiot.

 

You want to give them a kicking while you help them in government? You are a fucking beaut.

 

 

Sorry to shatter your illusions, we might be in government with them but it doesn't mean we're best mates or anything.

 

I think that's harsh (I know I'm not included in that, as I'll be begrudgingly voting yes, but still...). It doesn't make them a hypocrite to simple vote against something they don't agree with, just because most Conservatives disagree with it.

 

The reason you're getting grief is because of some of the views you've been sharing and the suspicion that you're displaying those beliefs simply because your party has followed the Conservatives down the rabbit hole.

 

 

People need to take the blinkers off, once they realise the Lib Dems aren't Tory-lite then they might begin to get it. Clegg has gambled the house on getting AV, he knows that electoral reform is more important in the long term than any short term hit we take in the polls for going along with unpopular decisions.

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Guest Numero Veinticinco

 

People need to take the blinkers off, once they realise the Lib Dems aren't Tory-lite then they might begin to get it. Clegg has gambled the house on getting AV, he knows that electoral reform is more important in the long term than any short term hit we take in the polls for going along with unpopular decisions.

 

I don't think it's a case of being blinkered. The Lib Dems, as you've said quite often, have a broadly different set of opinions amongst their membership. You've got your left-wing, sandal wearing social liberals, then you've got your orange-book tory-lite (at least from an economic sense). You've said on here that you agree with practically everything that the coalition is doing. You've defended them to the hilt. This coalition most certainly is tory-lite.

 

Quite why Clegg has gambled the short and medium term - people won't forget this for a long while - for something he thinks is a 'miserable compromise' is well beyond me.

 

Can you still see this coalition lasting a full term?

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Guest Numero Veinticinco

And, if you don't mind my saying so, you seem to have mentally stepped out of the corner you backed yourself into.

 

 

(That's a compliment, just incase you think it isn't).

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Any Lib-Dems deluding themselves that AV is going to strike a blow against the Tories remind me of the "Fuck the Matrix" thread. The difference is, the posters there were being intentionally pathetic for comic effect.

http://www.liverpoolway.co.uk/forum/gf-general-forum/99576-fuck-matrix.html

 

Whichever voting system you use becomes completely irrelevant if the party you vote for are so thoroughly dishonest and morally bankrupt that they actually do the opposite of the stuff they promised to do before the election.

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  • 2 weeks later...
No it wouldn't. They reckoned it would have added about 30 seats to our tally, although crucially, it would have made the possibility of coalition with Labour a mathematical possibility.

 

You really don't get it do you? I think you must be either blind or deluded. I and most people would rather Labour be in coalition with the BNP. The Lib Dems have shown themselves up to be a bunch of complicit liars and twats. And anyone who thinks it is all down to Clegg just needs to check the voting record of the vast majority of Lib Dems.

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I'll very reluctantly be voting yes.

 

I think, reluctantly, so will I. It's not perfect but it is fairer than what we have. And I don't see it as rewarding Lib Dems because if we get AV, their candidate will be ranked last on my voting card.

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I dont understand it well enough to vote for AV and also I understand that its not gonna make much of a difference to anything really.

 

Is it true only 3 other countries in the world use the AV voting system at the moment?

 

BTW,from now on I would always vote Green as my second choice behind Labour in the future IF AV is brought in.

 

I would have voted LibDem in the past until they became the Tory B team.

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Is it true only 3 other countries in the world use the AV voting system at the moment?

 

 

 

Fiji, Australia and Papeau New Guinea. Fiji are apparently getting shut of it and a latest poll had the Aussies wanting out. As you can see it's wonderfully popular.

 

I'll be voting No to AV. If I have to rank them rather than pick just one winner then it would go Labour, Lib Dems and Tories (which is what it'd boil down to after the lesser parties are knocked out in the 'round robin' style vote). I'd feel ill having to even rank Cameron. The way I see it the Lib Dems would more often than not come second in every poll as Labour supporters would place Tories last and vice versa, giving the Lib Dems more seats and more say in matters. Strangely enough isn't it Clegg who's pining for this and made it part of the deal that saw him climb into bed with Dave? Even the Tories are against the AV behind the scenes.

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Guest Numero Veinticinco
You really don't get it do you? I think you must be either blind or deluded. I and most people would rather Labour be in coalition with the BNP. The Lib Dems have shown themselves up to be a bunch of complicit liars and twats. And anyone who thinks it is all down to Clegg just needs to check the voting record of the vast majority of Lib Dems.

 

He said that it would have made it possible. I, and most others on the left, would have much rather seen a coalition between Labour and the Liberal Democrats than what we've got now. Judging by how much they bend, it would have been much better than what we've got now, or the alternative or a minority Conservative government.

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I dont understand it well enough to vote for AV and also I understand that its not gonna make much of a difference to anything really.

 

BTW,from now on I would always vote Green as my second choice behind Labour in the future IF AV is brought in.

 

Ok, I need to ask what is probably a stupid question as I simply do not understand this AV business, so my apologies for being dim, but here goes...

 

In the AV system you rank your preferences.

 

Do you only rank those parties who have a candidate in your constituency?

 

So for example if I wanted to vote for party X as my second\third choice etc but they dont have a candidate in my area I cant vote for them?

 

In my constituency we historically only have the 3 main parties to pick from. Its a complete Labour stronghold, Im not sure why the other 2 send out a candidate, they have no chance!

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Ok, I need to ask what is probably a stupid question as I simply do not understand this AV business, so my apologies for being dim, but here goes...

 

In the AV system you rank your preferences.

 

Do you only rank those parties who have a candidate in your constituency?

 

So for example if I wanted to vote for party X as my second\third choice etc but they dont have a candidate in my area I cant vote for them?

 

In my constituency we historically only have the 3 main parties to pick from. Its a complete Labour stronghold, Im not sure why the other 2 send out a candidate, they have no chance!

Yes.

In a constituency where the there is an incumbent of any party who routinely picks up 50%+ of the votes then AV makes no difference at all.

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