Cameron: "Cuts will change our way of life"

[Stu Monty]

I'm not, though, am I? I really am just expressing an opinion.

 

That is absolutely pathetic. I should be able to identify as a Lib Dem without people treating me like shit for it.

 

Would you treat me like shit if you spoke to me in a bar? At the match? Just because you disagree with me on... whatever it is you disagree with me about?

 

I probably wouldn't but I can understand why other people would, I'd almost certainly walk away from you though, in disgust. Like I say, you might disagree but a lot of people think that a line has been crossed in how much shit the majority are going to take from the wealthy in this country. They have reached the point where they are mad as hell and they aren't going to take it anymore. It's no good saying "Well I know it's a bit off that the disabled and mentally ill are going to be getting royally fucked, and the NHS will be getting further shoved into fewer hands and you'll all be losing your jobs, and your houses, but don't you dare strike or we'll change the law to smite you because our chief cuts advisor Philip Green says it's a great idea..." etc, without people becomeing violently angry. Whether you agree that all the above is happening or not is irrelevant, lots of people do and they are going to lash out at people they see at trying to facilitate a further land-grab of this country's wealth.

 

The people who have a massive majority of the power, wealth and opportunity in this country are making moves to take even more, and they are doing it completely brazenly. That is the sort of thing that will make you treat someone who is a member of the organisation doing those things a target for hatred.

 

What's happening is a fucking disgrace so why wouldn't people become massively angry at you, someone who stood as a councilor for the some of the cunts that are doing this? There's no reason. People are angry and they are angry at you. This isn't an issue of who should play in such and such a position for LFC where you can agree to disagree and shake hands, it's about people's communities being sold off so that the very wealthy don't have to pay their share. It's as good a reason as any to get absolutely furious about. You popping in and poking the tigers with sticks is going to get you shit. Sorry but it's going to happen.

[Section_31]

Changed their mind about sentencing policy now, changed their mind about the NHS bollocks, and been told be economists to get fucked with their economy bullshit (except the IMF, which has ruined more countries than Galactus).

 

They're really not very good, at anything.

 

Nice to see they're still banging the free market knows best drum though, as Southern Cross care homes stand on the verge of going bust leaving thousands of elderly and disabled people in the lurch, bosses made plenty of money though - naturally. High profits for a select few and thousands left to suffer because of high-risk business practices, where have we seen that before?

 

Scottish Power putting energy prices up too, even though it made £1.5bn profit last year.

 

The fact people still can't see how obscene it is that the private sector has been allowed to carve up the state, reduce value for the consumer (or even place them in danger) while still creaming a profit is a disgrace. What's worse, the process is actually speeding up, just like the way the banks are back to their old routine. We're on a fast track to absolute disaster.

[torahboy]

I'm not, though, am I? I really am just expressing an opinion.

 

 

 

 

That is absolutely pathetic. I should be able to identify as a Lib Dem without people treating me like shit for it.

 

Would you treat me like shit if you spoke to me in a bar? At the match? Just because you disagree with me on... whatever it is you disagree with me about?

 

 

 

 

Jokes are funny. Being threatened by an anonymous racist shithouse on the Internet isn't funny. PaddyBerger15 got banned for less, that is an absolute fact. I have never done anything to "torahboy" but he is congenitally incapable of having a civilised conversation.

 

Fuck yes he means it, absolutely he does. Why wouldn't he? I do. He is a piece of worthless shitscum who hates me for no reason. A gutless coward who regularly attacks me for who I am and what I am from behind a veil of anonymity.

 

Check your messages, kid. That should clarify the 'anonymity' issue that you seem to have your pussy caught on.

 

I don't actually know who you are, and don't give a fuck about who you are. What you are is something that I find almost impossible to describe, but I do enjoy winding you up. You react like a clockwork mouse: turn the key and you react in the most predictable manner, then you stop. Until you get wound up again.

 

Stamp your foot and hurl your valiant abuse, would-be councillor, but you can't escape your own vindictive nature - you've got that for life. Your poor shithouse.

[Cardie]

 

Gutless little shithouse hiding behind an anonymous name and telling other members they should be killed.

 

Rashid, WATB and PB15 were banned for less.

 

Would you have preferred he did it via a neg instead like you do?

 

Gotta love how you play the victim yet inbetween are quite happy to neg me for a joke on the world war thread with the comment 'kill yourself'.

Edited June 8, 2011 by Cardie

[Stu Monty]

Changed their mind about sentencing policy now, changed their mind about the NHS bollocks, and been told be economists to get fucked with their economy bullshit (except the IMF, which has ruined more countries than Galactus).

 

They're really not very good, at anything.

 

Nice to see they're still banging the free market knows best drum though, as Southern Cross care homes stand on the verge of going bust leaving thousands of elderly and disabled people in the lurch, bosses made plenty of money though - naturally. High profits for a select few and thousands left to suffer because of high-risk business practices, where have we seen that before?

 

Scottish Power putting energy prices up too, even though it made £1.5bn profit last year.

 

The fact people still can't see how obscene it is that the private sector has been allowed to carve up the state, reduce value for the consumer (or even place them in danger) while still creaming a profit is a disgrace. What's worse, the process is actually speeding up, just like the way the banks are back to their old routine. We're on a fast track to absolute disaster.

 

But lets not get angry. Let's just calmly walk straight to our fate.

[Strontium]

I probably wouldn't but I can understand why other people would, I'd almost certainly walk away from you though, in disgust.

 

 

Disgust about what? Disgust because I don't share the hyperbolic view that the country is being dismantled?

 

It's no good saying "Well I know it's a bit off that the disabled and mentally ill are going to be getting royally fucked, and the NHS will be getting further shoved into fewer hands and you'll all be losing your jobs, and your houses, but don't you dare strike or we'll change the law to smite you because our chief cuts advisor Philip Green says it's a great idea..." etc, without people becomeing violently angry. Whether you agree that all the above is happening or not is irrelevant, lots of people do and they are going to lash out at people they see at trying to facilitate a further land-grab of this country's wealth.

 

 

I don't think it's irrelevant at all, people need to calm the fuck down. The sky is not falling in. The NHS is not being privatised. The poor are not being ground up for fertiliser.

 

The people who have a massive majority of the power, wealth and opportunity in this country are making moves to take even more, and they are doing it completely brazenly. That is the sort of thing that will make you treat someone who is a member of the organisation doing those things a target for hatred.

 

 

I reject the idea that my party is doing those things or allowing those things to happen. I believe time will bear that out.

 

What's happening is a fucking disgrace so why wouldn't people become massively angry at you, someone who stood as a councilor for the some of the cunts that are doing this? There's no reason. People are angry and they are angry at you. This isn't an issue of who should play in such and such a position for LFC where you can agree to disagree and shake hands, it's about people's communities being sold off so that the very wealthy don't have to pay their share. It's as good a reason as any to get absolutely furious about. You popping in and poking the tigers with sticks is going to get you shit. Sorry but it's going to happen.

 

 

Don't get furious with me, get furious with the people who bankrupted the country in the first place. That would be my advice. Those are the people I'm angry at. All that money pissed away with nothing to show for it.

[Strontium]

Changed their mind about sentencing policy now, changed their mind about the NHS bollocks, and been told be economists to get fucked with their economy bullshit (except the IMF, which has ruined more countries than Galactus).

 

 

Don't you think governments should change their mind when they're wrong, then?

 

And it's not so much changed their mind on the NHS, but been forced to by a junior coalition partner which has drawn a line in the sand.

 

Scottish Power putting energy prices up too, even though it made £1.5bn profit last year.

 

 

Isn't this a problem with energy supply and demand more than greedy shareholders?

 

Would you have preferred he did it via a neg instead like you do?

 

Gotta love how you play the victim yet inbetween are quite happy to neg me for a joke on the world war thread with the comment 'kill yourself'.

 

 

Jokes are funny. You are not. You are malicious and full of hatred.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Don't get furious with me, get furious with the people who bankrupted the country in the first place. That would be my advice. Those are the people I'm angry at. All that money pissed away with nothing to show for it.

 

Who are you talking about exactly?

[Strontium]

Labour and the banks, aka See No Evil and Speak No Evil.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Okay. Do I get in a pedantic debate about us not being bankrupted, and certainly not by Labour, or shall I just dredge up the last time I did it?

[lifetime fan]

Don't get furious with me, get furious with the people who bankrupted the country in the first place. That would be my advice. Those are the people I'm angry at. All that money pissed away with nothing to show for it.

 

I'm sure there was plenty of champange, coke and whores purchased by bankers so not exactly 'nothing to show for it'.

[Strontium]

Okay. Do I get in a pedantic debate about us not being bankrupted, and certainly not by Labour, or shall I just dredge up the last time I did it?

 

 

We disagree on the financial state of the country, and the cause of it, so it seems pointless.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Add you being blind to reason and we're in agreement that it's pointless.

[Strontium]

Uk deficit of £170bn and you accuse me of being blind to reason?

 

Whatever. Deficits don't run up themselves.

[Kevin D]

Not the GF's finest hour, here, but if Torahboy and SD are scrapping, I wouldn't mind a stream.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Uk deficit of £170bn and you accuse me of being blind to reason?

 

Erm, yes. The existence of a deficit and debt, which is growing as a result of the coalition government, has nothing to do with what caused it.

 

Whatever. Deficits don't run up themselves.

 

I'm perfectly aware of why there's a deficit and how it came about. I mean factually, not some parroted, second-hand Tory nonsense that has been regurgitated by the LDs.

[Strontium]

Depends if you count HM Treasury figures as "parroted, second-hand Tory nonsense that has been regurgitated by the LDs". To me, they seem somewhat official. And the official figures specifically exclude the cost of the bank bailout.

[lifetime fan]

Stronts I know you watched panorama as I got a surprise rep from you.

 

How after watching that can you justify or even attempt to defend cuts that have resulted in a near 70% reduction of inspections by the CQC into hospitals and care providers that look after the most vulnerable people in society...

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

You're incredibly dense at times.

[lifetime fan]

Care homes crisis points to dangers in the big societyThe Human Rights Act doesn't allow people to enforce their rights against private companies. This loophole needs closing

 

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Leon Glenister guardian.co.uk, Wednesday 8 June 2011 14.00 BST Article history

The government has not ruled out an independent inquiry into the abuse of adults with learning disabilities at the Winterbourne View care home. Photograph: Tim Ireland/PA

Care homes are facing troubled times, as government announces that it has not ruled out an independent inquiry into the abuse of adults with learning disabilities at the Winterbourne View care unit near Bristol. The BBC's Panorama documentary showed that the home, run by private contractor Castlebeck, breached residents' rights guaranteed under the European convention on human rights, in particular the prohibition on inhuman and degrading treatment and the right to private life.

 

Meanwhile, another private care home contractor, Southern Cross, has taken emergency measures to avoid financial collapse. These two private companies are an example of the growing privatisation of government services – a trend David Cameron has supported through his "big society" policy.

 

Given their importance to users, it is crucial that privately run services are answerable for their actions. It is worrying that service users may, in some cases, struggle to enforce their rights under the European convention, because the Human Rights Act, which incorporates the convention into domestic law, allows individuals to enforce convention rights directly against "public authorities", but not private companies.

 

A public authority is defined as an organisation "whose functions are of a public nature". Whether or not a contractor is carrying out public functions depends on its closeness to the local authority: in YL v Birmingham city council, coincidentally deciding the status of Southern Cross, Lord Mance was persuaded that the care home was a "private, profit-earning company", not a public authority. The government has since reversed this decision through legislation with respect to care homes, so the residents of Castlebeck and Southern Cross can now directly enforce their convention rights under the act. However, the narrow interpretation of a public authority still applies to other types of service. In such cases the service users, if unable to adapt an existing legal action, will have to spend time and money taking claims to the European court of human rights – and will fail unless they can show the government is at fault because it breached its positive obligation to secure convention rights when contracting out of its public functions.

 

With Cameron's plans to allow private companies to bid for almost every public service, including hospitals and schools, it is crucial that private contractors operating the sorts of services previously provided by local authorities are brought within the Human Rights Act. The bill of rights commission is currently meeting to discuss the protection of rights in Britain, and given the big society policy, privatisation is an issue that ought to be addressed.

 

Two options are preferable. The first is to legislate on the meaning of "public authority" to encompass big society private contractors. Lord Bingham, dissenting in YL, preferred a test based on the nature of the service rather than how closely it is associated with the local authority. The second is to require the government, when contracting out a service, to insert a term into the contract that the private body comply with the convention rights. As a named third party in the contract, individuals using a privately run public service will have direct recourse to the domestic courts if their convention rights are breached.

 

The recent care home crisis is a reminder of the importance of individuals' rights and dignity in the provision of public services. Privatisation is currently an open door whereby a service user's convention rights are not fully secure. This door needs to be shut by any new legislation the bill of rights commission proposes.

 

Care homes crisis points to dangers in the big society | Leon Glenister | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

[lifetime fan]

You're incredibly dense at times.

 

Cheers, you cunt. :whistle:

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Not you, you're sexual chocolate.

[Strontium]

Stronts I know you watched panorama as I got a surprise rep from you.

 

How after watching that can you justify or even attempt to defend cuts that have resulted in a near 70% reduction of inspections by the CQC into hospitals and care providers that look after the most vulnerable people in society...

 

 

I won't even try to justify it. It's entirely possible that reducing the number of inspections will lead to a reduction in standards. It's entirely possible that this is a cut which should not have been made. Not everything the government does is going to be a good thing. Not everything any government does is going to be good. Singling one cut out of many for criticism doesn't mean that the general philosophy behind balancing the budget is a bad one though.

[Sugar Ape]

Not you, you're sexual chocolate.

 

Nice quote for your ten thousandth post NV!

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

It doesn't mean that the rest of the cuts, many of which are equally bad or self-serving, either. Still, it can't be long before there's a u-turn there too.