If we win the UEFA and finish 4th...

[Jose Jones]

Would you give Rafa another season?

Nevermind that we’re playing like shit and might not achieve either. Completely hypothetically, would you keep or sack the manager if we qualify for the Champions League and finish with a trophy?

[Liverpool lad]

The problem is that I am not entirely confident in giving him another transfer window to wheel and deal in, his hands are tied and he isn't exactly shit hot when he buys players.

[hobbit]

Rafa needs to sign another contract, we need to keep him.

[PaulMcC]

I'd probably keep him for more season regardless.

 

Depends on the rest of the season, obviously.

[FortressAnfield]

No. At the end of last season, it was obvious we had problems if Gerrard and Torres were injured, yet we approached the season without any attempt having been made to rectify the problem. Result is we're still shafted when they're both out. He knew there was a problem, and that problem is still there - and exactly the same - after two transfer windows.

 

No. He spent £20m on Aquilani, who was injured for three months, and is rarely picked now even when fit. Given our financial situation, his wasting of that money alone is a sackable offence.

 

I'm not interested now in any mitigating circumstances eg the owners - in a commercial organisation (which, sadly, we are), he should be sacked for those two things.

 

Don't forget - this season has been a massive step backward, even if we win the Europa 'League' and finish 4th.

[Jose Jones]

The problem is that I am not entirely confident in giving him another transfer window to wheel and deal in, his hands are tied and he isn't exactly shit hot when he buys players.

 

Well, yeah, that was what sort of got me thinking.

I’ve lost a lot of faith in the Rafaman, and I think he’s made too many mistakes in the last few transfer windows, however thinking that if we did manage to win the UEFA cup (we should be the best team left in it) and finish 4th in the league, it might make me reconsider...

 

Also quite a few people who have been ready to get rid of Rafa stated that lack of a trophy has been one of the reasons (“three years without a trophy, not good enough”, etc.) I was wondering if a trophy would change their minds.

[RobbieOR]

If we do both of them yes. If he gets the top four maybe. Anything less, definatly not.

[Original202]

If he stayed we'd just be asking the same question in 12 months.

 

I don't actually think our league position and run in the cup is the most important thing in terms of him keeping his job, aside from the money issue. I want to see his approach to games change and I want to stop banging my ahead against the wall when seeing his team selections and the predictability if it all.

[Original202]

Well, yeah, that was what sort of got me thinking.

I’ve lost a lot of faith in the Rafaman, and I think he’s made too many mistakes in the last few transfer windows, however thinking that if we did manage to win the UEFA cup (we should be the best team left in it) and finish 4th in the league, it might make me reconsider...

 

Also quite a few people who have been ready to get rid of Rafa stated that lack of a trophy has been one of the reasons (“three years without a trophy, not good enough”, etc.) I was wondering if a trophy would change their minds.

 

It is a trophy, but the only way we could win it would be by failing in a competition we usually do pretty well in.

 

It'd be better than nothing, but it wouldn't mean as much as winning a domestic cup and certainly can't compare with the champions league.

[Jose Jones]

It is a trophy, but the only way we could win it would be by failing in a competition we usually do pretty well in.

 

It'd be better than nothing, but it wouldn't mean as much as winning a domestic cup and certainly can't compare with the champions league.

 

No, but then are you forgetting his history of good Champions League performances, just after this season?

If you had a manager who’s European record with us was 1 win, 1 final, 1 semi, 1 quarter in the Champions League plus a win in the UEFA cup, that’d be pretty decent no?

 

For the record I would rank the trophies in terms of importance for me:

League

Champions League

FA Cup

UEFA

Carling

 

I find it hard to make an argument either way. I think this season has been one of the most disappointing in years. You can’t expect to win everything every season, and you’ve got to expect that losing to a lower league team in the FA cup, not getting through the group stages of the CL or failing to challenge for the league might happen occasionally. But all three in the same season? That really is unacceptably piss poor.

 

Still, if we did win a trophy, and managed to qualify for the Champions League next season, well at least it would be something, and as I said, I’m pretty sure I saw a few people at the start of this season saying they’d prefer to win a trophy and come fourth than get to a couple of semis and challenge for the league but not win anything.

[G Richards]

No. At the end of last season, it was obvious we had problems if Gerrard and Torres were injured, yet we approached the season without any attempt having been made to rectify the problem. Result is we're still shafted when they're both out. He knew there was a problem, and that problem is still there - and exactly the same - after two transfer windows.

 

No. He spent £20m on Aquilani, who was injured for three months, and is rarely picked now even when fit. Given our financial situation, his wasting of that money alone is a sackable offence.

 

I'm not interested now in any mitigating circumstances eg the owners - in a commercial organisation (which, sadly, we are), he should be sacked for those two things.

Don't forget - this season has been a massive step backward, even if we win the Europa 'League' and finish 4th.

 

 

I respectfully disagree with your viewpoint here.

 

When he spent the money on Johnson and Aquilani he knew he needed a striker. He was trying to sign one. He believed he had the funds to do so, and there were strong rumours early in the summer that we might be in for Tevez or possibly someone of that sort of calibre.

 

Without digging out the quotes Rafa even said there would be more signings to come. Unfortunately something changed along the way and his money was clearly taken away from him and we didn't get the striker we sorely needed.

 

I think Glen Johnson was a good signing. He was overpriced, but then, Chelsea were sniffing around again and he had just had a great season at Portsmouth. With Arbeloa going back to Spain it was a good move in the market, even if we did pay a little over the odds. It got the deal done early on in the window and was nice and decisive.

 

He also signed Aquilani, which seemed a sensible move given Xabi was off back to Spain too. As a player Aquilani has the jury out on him. I can't judge him after seeing so little of him. I've seen a couple of glimpses that make me think there is something there, but I've also seen a lot of anonymity. I think his injury was worse than we were first led to believe. He may or may not prove to be a player for the Prem, but I think he is owed next season to see if he can make his mark.

[G Richards]

If Rafa finishes fourth he should stay on in the job.

 

He has regressed in comparison to last season, but then, we have only been spending what we generate through sales so that is to be expected, especially when you consider the strides other teams have been making to try to crack that top four.

 

It is only a matter of time before we slip out of the top four with these owners. Stu Monty has said that before and he is spot on.

 

If we are to stay there long term, we need new owners (good owners!) If they come in then I could well understand it if the new regime would want their own manager.

[rage]

for those who'll give him another season what should the minimum be then?

 

and for those who'd give him another season i bet most of these would regardless if rafa finished outside the top 4.

[Jose Jones]

I think most people are the same Rage old son.

You decide based on whether you trust the manager to do well next season. No-one puts in “minimum requirements” and hard and fast rules like “If we don’t win the league within 4 years change the manager”. Those just get used to try and win arguments. Everyone makes their own judgement based on a lot of things.

[JohnnyH]

Without a change of owners, we shouldn't consider it. A new manager coming in with no ability to bring in his own players, would be bad in my opinion.

 

if we change the owners to more competent ones and we finish out of the top 4 and don't win a cup, then we may very well have to sack him if a good candidate is available.

[Catch22]

If we finish 4th in the PL we will have overachived versus what we spend.

 

Now, that may be because City fucked it up so badly, which reduces the credit that should go to out staff.

 

But in purely bald terms it is better than we can expect given how little we spend compared to the top 4 spenders in the PL.

 

The PL isn't our only competition though. Indeed it is far less important for any major European side than the CL.

Our performance in that was terrible this year.

However it has been very good over 5 years.

 

The UEFA cup is easily the 3rd most important thing we can win: it is far behind the top2 but it is far ahead of any domestic cups.

It will be excellent to win it with many great European nights & continental trips along the way.

 

Finally there is the question of our style of play which has been crap this season.

 

I fully understand people wanting a change on those grounds as what the Arse hierarchy decided has a lot of merit: the PL is so pre-detemined that you might as well enjoy it rather than try to win it; what is interesting is they made that decision whilst spending a great deal more than us every year.

 

I have a lot of sympathy for people who want a change for entertainment reasons, but people are deluding themselves about the underlying determinant of PL position & our rankiong within that, if they are at all disappointed with a final outcome of 4th

[Red Hot]

If we do win the cup and finish in the top 4, how can the board sack him? Rafa has gambled on Masch and Lucas in centre midfield to galvinise a young partnership. Sometimes one has to take a step backwards to move forward. Both Masch and Lucas are stating to look sharper before the goal, Masch last night scoring a cracker, Lucas forcing a top save.

I am sure Rafa will live or die, pending how both Masch and Lucas progress till the end of the season in LFCs engine room. If we make the top 4, I would give Rafa another season, to turn the situation to his advantage.

[cmuller]

So much has gone wrong this year outside of Rafa's control that he should get another year. Even if we don't win anything and finish worse than fourth.

 

Rafa does need to 'prove' himself a bit this coming summer on how he improves the squad however.

[Josef Svejk]

I doubt we'll win the Europa Cup, but if we do, I think a lot of minds will change. I'm not sure they should, however.

[Fowlers God]

for those who'll give him another season what should the minimum be then?

 

and for those who'd give him another season i bet most of these would regardless if rafa finished outside the top 4.

 

No, champions league football is the minimum requirement here. Anything less and its a bigger failure than what this seasons already been.

 

And to whoever said Rafa needs ANOTHER contact -your talking bollocks. This contract he is on is the reason why if the owners ever did want to get rid it would cost us the transfer kitty for the next season. IF we win the Uefa and get champions league football next season then by all means keep going Rafa, but only under his current terms and conditions.

[RedBrian84]

Yes.

 

But his approach to games- particularly at home- needs to change. We need to really utilise the attacking players we have in aggressive, positive formations. There is definitely scope to play Gerrard, Torres, Babel, Benayoun and Kuyt all in the same side. Abandon the two holding midfielders at home for fuck's sake Rafa. We need to take games to teams and give them a good hiding.

[ZonkoVille77]

I'd give him another year. So many things have been beyond his control this season. Injuries have played a major part in how bad we've been as it's prevented us getting any sort of consistency in the side. I don't actually think he needs to do very much in the transfer window except buy a decent striker. If everyone else manages to stay fit then I think we have a squad capable of making a decent challenge.

 

Need to start playing a bit of ball though, it's painful to watch.

[Lucky Pierre]

If the yanks are still here, there's no point getting rid. If they go in the summer, I would probably give him another year regardless. Get some of his own players in, see whether the football improves.

[Bob]

I still stick with the outlook of "who would come thats better?".

 

Right now, i dont think anyone with a proven track record would come in and be able to do anything with the restrictions we have. In other circumstances I would want rid now, but i cant see past the issues.

 

Personally, I would get rid if he fails to get 4th, as keeping him after that gives out the wrong message to our players, to potential signings and to opposition teams etc, but I would do it reluctantly with the expectation that a replacement was a big gamble.

 

I sometimes wonder whether it might be the right time to give an unproven but potentially talented manager a go at the job, someone who's done good things elsewhere and has a relatively high stock, such as coyle a few months ago for instance. Maybe get Mark Hughes back into a job as i rate him very highly, but its a gamble, and can we afford to gamble in our position?

 

4th is way more imporatant in my eyes than the Uefa cup, but winning a trophy would be a lovely end to a shite season, and i would treat it as such.

[Tom R]

26 idiots so far right there.