Media Led Witch Hunt

[Jose M]

Your opinion is irrelevant.

 

If that was true, clueless superfan simpletons like you wouldn't constantly respond to my every thought now would they?

[Liverpool lad]

Does Rafa have many friends in the media? I mean compared to other managers.

 

Just wondering, because as much as he deserves criticism at times, I do feel that some of the debates have been made to look increasingly simple by the media.

[Tom R]

some of you clowns would let Rafa piss in your wife's mouth and then buy the fucker a drink.

[The 5th Benitel]

So it was my imagination that when we got to Athens Rafa wasn't congratulated for a fantastic achievement, he was abused for not winning the league? Ok.

 

It was my imagination that the media led by Jamie Redknapp didn't have a crusade against the manager for playing Gerrard on the Right? Ok.

 

It was my imagination that Rafa wasn't ridiculed for signing Peter Crouch? Ok.

 

It was my imagination that Momo Sissoko was labeled the worst Liverpool player ever, just after we signed him? Ok.

 

It was my imagination that Rafa was criticised for spending £18m on Mascherano, but sir Alex was immune from criticism for signing three inferior players for the same price? Ok.

 

The media didn't single out Liverpool rotation, or zonal marking? Ok.

 

I must have been living in a parallel universe were all of this took place. As for the victim mentality quote, a disgusting, sly little dig more suited to the Spectator than a Liverpool forum.

 

Oh and I don't think anyone here has blamed the media for our performances, just their agenda driven inaccuracies when it comes to writing about the club and in particular the manager.

 

 

Seen as we've proved that it isn't cos he's foreign, can anyone tell me why the press hate us and Rafa? It cant be the north/south thing cos last time i checked Manchester was jsut down the road?

 

And can people really not see you're remembering these things cos it's the team you support? I'm sure loads of teams have signed players who everyone said was shit, you just dont remember them cos they didn't play for us.

 

They pick on things like zonal marking and rotation cos we were losing games as a result of it. Remember the days when you'd be on your way to the ground and you wouldn't be able to predict more than 5 or 6 players who'd be in the team? For at least one season that got ridiculous and, when we were getting beat by shit teams, people are obviously going to point to that.

 

Like i said Baconface got shit when Chelsea walked to the title but he doesn't get as much os of what he's achieved in the past. Simple.

 

And from what i remember after Athens Rafa was getting hailed as a genius in Europe but someone who looked like he was struggling to get to grips with the league. I thought the same thing at the time cos that's exacly what it looked like whenever we played.

[Jose M]

They ignore anything positive said about him to fuel their self pity and inferiority complex. If he's only here to be liked by the media then he's in the wrong profession.

[ferryman]

FFS. The reporter bitch on CNN in Hong Kong (!) laughed out loud as she talked about Liverpool´s CL exit. Just a minute ago.

[Redshadow]

As Matt Busby our one-time captain said MUCH later in life when he was President of Manchester United and advising a young, badly struggling manager at Manchester United who incidentally was in a FAR worse mess than the one we're in at the moment and on the brink of being sacked as well a long time ago; ''If you don't like what the newspapers are writing about you, why bother reading them?'' .

 

Although nowadays it can be amended to ''If you don't like what the television/newspapers/Internet/phone-ins have written/said about you, why bother listening to/reading them'' It Still stands true today as probably the wisest advice I've ever read anywhere with regard to football. Ignore the media - ALL of them, they live on publicity which means people listening to/responding to them - If they don't get that, they die out/change subject to something that Does get a response. Simple as and maybe the world would be a better place if they did.

 

Incidentally the manager Busby gave the advice to? A young Alec Ferguson and the year? 1990 - We all know how badly United did then (and in 2005/2006 when they went out of the CL and Europe bottom of their group before Christmas without even the UEFA Cup to console them). They held onto Ferguson in Both cases (especially the 1990 one) and look where he's taken them since. With this his only Really Bad season out of the 6 he's been here (so far anyway) whose to say that Rafa' won't recover from this and Really hit the heights If we hold onto him? We won't know unless we keep hold of him and Don't sack him though will we?

 

My advice now is the same as Busby all those years ago - Ignore the press - They stick the boot in now while they can as they know Rafa's not a bad manager and they Hate him (for taking a post at a big club that a British manager might otherwise try for And for not indulging them) and fear him (for what he might do at Anfield with REAL backing) - Let them hate and fear him. So long as we ignore them, it matters not what they say, they know that, and hate it.............................

[old skool tom]

5+ years of average football and its a witch hunt? come on people ffs

 

tbh its a polital/people thing more than a football thing.i love this city and club but were to fuckin paranoid.the sooner this city and its club stop pulling up the draw bridge evey time someone has a pop at us the sooner we can see things with more perspective.

 

one good league campaign (2nd) in 6 seasons and overly cautios robotic football (bar 3 months last season) is far from witch hunting

[Whelan]

5+ years of average football and its a witch hunt? come on people ffs

 

tbh its a polital/people thing more than a football thing.i love this city and club but were to fuckin paranoid.the sooner this city and its club stop pulling up the draw bridge evey time someone has a pop at us the sooner we can see things with more perspective.

 

one good league campaign (2nd) in 6 seasons and overly cautios robotic football (bar 3 months last season) is far from witch hunting

 

Cretin

[Liverpool lad]

As much as Rafa might have similarities with Ferguson all those years ago, or even he might share some traits that Houllier had in his final seasons here, there is no fucking blueprint that Benitez follows for fucks sake.

[Dicko]

Seen as we've proved that it isn't cos he's foreign, can anyone tell me why the press hate us and Rafa? It cant be the north/south thing cos last time i checked Manchester was jsut down the road?

 

And can people really not see you're remembering these things cos it's the team you support? I'm sure loads of teams have signed players who everyone said was shit, you just dont remember them cos they didn't play for us.

 

They pick on things like zonal marking and rotation cos we were losing games as a result of it. Remember the days when you'd be on your way to the ground and you wouldn't be able to predict more than 5 or 6 players who'd be in the team? For at least one season that got ridiculous and, when we were getting beat by shit teams, people are obviously going to point to that.

 

Like i said Baconface got shit when Chelsea walked to the title but he doesn't get as much os of what he's achieved in the past. Simple.

 

And from what i remember after Athens Rafa was getting hailed as a genius in Europe but someone who looked like he was struggling to get to grips with the league. I thought the same thing at the time cos that's exacly what it looked like whenever we played.

 

No he was criticised for using Europe at the league's expense, something Ronnie Whelan has just accused him of.

 

The part in bold is what interests me though, you'd have a point if it was just Liverpool supporters, but it's not is it. Rafa is called "Rafa the Rotator" or the "tinkerman", our zonal marking is questioned by fans of other clubs as well which if it was just this season then ok but it hasn't been has it.

 

Rafa is accused by other supporters of not taking the domestic cup competitions seriously, despite winning one and getting to the final of the other.

 

Like I say it's not just a Liverpool fan remembering, ask any football fan to describe Benitez and I bet they'd come out with the same cliched drivel that the media have said about him.

[The 5th Benitel]

No he was criticised for using Europe at the league's expense, something Ronnie Whelan has just accused him of.

 

The part in bold is what interests me though, you'd have a point if it was just Liverpool supporters, but it's not is it. Rafa is called "Rafa the Rotator" or the "tinkerman", our zonal marking is questioned by fans of other clubs as well which if it was just this season then ok but it hasn't been has it.

 

Rafa is accused by other supporters of not taking the domestic cup competitions seriously, despite winning one and getting to the final of the other.

 

Like I say it's not just a Liverpool fan remembering, ask any football fan to describe Benitez and I bet they'd come out with the same cliched drivel that the media have said about him.

 

But people would say 'i didn't see it' about Wenger, 'wally with the brolly' about McClaren, 'tinkerman' about Raneri. The press come up with stupid shit like that and always have done. Remember 'The Turnip'?

 

The thing with us is we seem to make the same mistakes over and over again which is why people remember it so vividly. Look at zonal marking this season, it's not the odd game that costs us a couple of points. It's 12 goals in 13 games that have cost God knows how many. Same with the rotation, you must remember when you'd have no idea what team we were putting out? Well, around that time we were constantly dropping points while the other top teams were winning. That's why people remember it. Baconface did make shit transfers last summer, but they won the league so it would look stupid to critise him for it.

 

As for the domestic competitions, if we'd beaten Burnley it wouldn't have mattered, but we did, so he got slated. To be honest, i'd feel more sympathy for him if he wasn't getting £4m a year to be in that position. He's in one of the highest profile club jobs in football and if you consistantly lose you'll get critisied. End of.

[old skool tom]

Cretin

 

hahahaha

 

every time yous use your favourite word cretin i piss myself laughing! hahaha

 

argue your point instead of you playground stuff

 

whats next "ya mar"?

 

haha

[Redshadow]

One good league campaign; Old skool Tom you idiot - TWICE he's broken the record for points earned in a league campaign WITHOUT winning the title (82 points in 2006 and 86 last season). TWICE in 2006 he's gone on 10-11 plus match winning streaks (one of which we went 9 games in without even conceding a goal). He's won us a European cup and been to another final, won us an FA Cup. Created probably the deadliest strike partnership in our clubs history AND done it all with one hand tied behind his back by Moores and Parry AND a blindfold added by Hicks & Gillette - IF he'd done all that during the 90's on the back of our past dominance he'd be hailed for rebuilding the Liverpool machine and bringing about our continued dominance AFTER 1990 - Instead due to the 10 year hiatus of success we had in the 90's he's accused of NOT doing enough?

 

And all this against 2 teams that spend the equivalent per year of what some small countries use on their GDP? Pathetic. I tell you what, not only has he done more than enough but he's slated here. I'll state this also, IF he was at say Villa, City, Everton, Spurs or even Arsenal - He'd be hailed as a genius instead of questioned in comparism to such managerial luminaries as David Bloody Moyes or Harry Fcuking Redknapp whom he is in managerial terms to what the likes of Mozart in musical terms is to the Spice girls - not in the same galaxy; But no, it's Liverpool with our 'special' history and fans and the hatred borne for us by Her Majesty's Good English press and so he is slated from top to bottom. As I said before - Pathetic.

 

He's made us the best club in England outside the Top Two over the past 5 seasons and that's ALL he can do without FAR more resources - UNTIL he gets those we CAN'T go any further - You and I and all the other LFC fans will just have to lump it won't we? We CAN'T blame Rafa' for the lack of resources - I thnik we should look West across the Atlantic for the REAL cause of problems there don't you? And until said cause is removed? The problems Will continue.........................

 

NB Liverpool Lad you TOTALLY failed to get the point of my post rather spectacularly didn't you? I WASN'T talking about the similarity of Rafa' with Fergie all those years ago (although they certainly exist and then some); The point of my post was Busby's advice to Fergie which is that when things are going bad; Basically Fcuk the press and ignore them as all they'll do is criticise, have a go and try to drive out managers when things go wrong - They're like sharks who scent blood in such cases and the best way to combat them is to ignore them no? After all publicity IS their air and without/with a public who ignore them they have NO air and without air they'll die...................

[torahboy]

When you have cockroaches like Jamie Redknapp talking about the fans being 'manipulated' by Benitez, without Mr Potential having to justify his claim, then you know we have criticism for criticism's sake. Twatknapp's belief about Rafa's Machiavellian hold over the fans can be well disproved merely by looking at this site over the past few weeks.

 

Not only was the moronic twat attacking Benitez he was also, quite accidentally, exposing his own attitude towards supporters. Harry's boy shows his disrespect by believing that the fans cannot form an opinion of their own: everything that we believe can only be formed by those 'within' the game. How arrogant can these media fucks become? How fucking pig ignorant can they be? Well, they could all be like Jamie fucking Redknapp.

[Whelan]

hahahaha

 

every time yous use your favourite word cretin i piss myself laughing! hahaha

 

argue your point instead of you playground stuff

 

whats next "ya mar"?

 

haha

 

Sorry, I do apologise.

 

Illiterate cretin.

[Redshadow]

Torahboy I THINK Redknapp was doing more than that (Harry that is - Jamie doesn't have 2 brain cells to rub together); I think he was trying to drive a wedge between Rafa' and the fans by making our fans feel like Rafa's manipulating us and thus trying to get them all resentful, bitter and angry and more likely to turn on Rafa';

 

Doing that would make us angrier and less forgiving when things go wrong in home games and make it more likely for us to have things go wrong in Home games as the team nearly ALWAYS perform badly when the crowd turn on them - Everyone knows a team's main hope of doing well is in home games/it is their main source of points; Harry knows this, saw the difficulties we're having at home at present and basically tried to sabotage any recovery by getting our fans REALLY angry at the manager for manipulating them. At least that's what it looked like as other than that, I can see no reason for him to comment on our fans and manager's relationship. It was a pathetic attempt at sabotage by Redknapp.

[old skool tom]

Sorry, I do apologise.

 

Illiterate cretin.

 

at least this illiterate cretins head isnt up rafa's arse so much that i can see clearly.

 

your not a scouser our you fella? cretin? HAHAHAHAH

[Catch22]

But people would say 'i didn't see it' about Wenger, 'wally with the brolly' about McClaren, 'tinkerman' about Raneri. The press come up with stupid shit like that and always have done. Remember 'The Turnip'?

 

The thing with us is we seem to make the same mistakes over and over again which is why people remember it so vividly. Look at zonal marking this season, it's not the odd game that costs us a couple of points. It's 12 goals in 13 games that have cost God knows how many. Same with the rotation, you must remember when you'd have no idea what team we were putting out? Well, around that time we were constantly dropping points while the other top teams were winning. That's why people remember it. Baconface did make shit transfers last summer, but they won the league so it would look stupid to critise him for it.

 

As for the domestic competitions, if we'd beaten Burnley it wouldn't have mattered, but we did, so he got slated. To be honest, i'd feel more sympathy for him if he wasn't getting £4m a year to be in that position. He's in one of the highest profile club jobs in football and if you consistantly lose you'll get critisied. End of.

 

"Baconface did make shit transfers last summer, but they won the league so it would look stupid to critise him for it."

Isn't that the key point about any analysis though: the resources at the Mancs,Chavs & now City are so much greater than to judge the manager on the basis of simply how many games they win doesn't make anysense at all.

 

Some managers get deservedly credited with achievements based on resources (ie/ Moyes); other don't.

 

Most absurd is the treatment of 'Arry.

 

His transfer dealings have directly led to the bankruptcy of his last 3 clubs, yet he is bizarrely portrayed in the media as being good in the market which is akin to saying Fred Goodwin was a great bank CEO.

 

Years ago similar arse-lickin' articles used to appear about El Tel after he had bought some journo bubbly in his tacky club.

He was regularly portrayed as a genius on almost no concrete evidence whatsoever.

 

Football reporting in this country outside of the Racing Post & Kuper's Saturday FT article is incredibly simplistic & full of shit.

 

It doesn't really happen in other sports & it doesn't happen in other countrys (ie/ Italy has serious tactical analysis; the US mainstream press covered the maths behind Belichick's recent decision to go for it on 4th down in great detail)

[Dicko]

But people would say 'i didn't see it' about Wenger, 'wally with the brolly' about McClaren, 'tinkerman' about Raneri. The press come up with stupid shit like that and always have done. Remember 'The Turnip'?

 

The thing with us is we seem to make the same mistakes over and over again which is why people remember it so vividly. Look at zonal marking this season, it's not the odd game that costs us a couple of points. It's 12 goals in 13 games that have cost God knows how many. Same with the rotation, you must remember when you'd have no idea what team we were putting out? Well, around that time we were constantly dropping points while the other top teams were winning. That's why people remember it. Baconface did make shit transfers last summer, but they won the league so it would look stupid to critise him for it.

 

As for the domestic competitions, if we'd beaten Burnley it wouldn't have mattered, but we did, so he got slated. To be honest, i'd feel more sympathy for him if he wasn't getting £4m a year to be in that position. He's in one of the highest profile club jobs in football and if you consistantly lose you'll get critisied. End of.

 

I agree that right now it's hard to defend anyone at the club from the owners & manager down to the players, the way the season's gone and I'm not attempting to do so. The debacle of the group stage is all of our own making, Lyon away aside.

 

I also take your point about the media with other managers, but even with what you said, we all know in his first few years Wenger would deny seeing anything, because we'd see him denying it ourselves with aftermatch interviews on Sky or BBC. McClaren getting slaughtered then is probably the same for Rafa now, more so really given the talent he had at his disposal.

What happened to Taylor was a disgrace. A fundamentally decent man who was out of his depth, destroyed by people who didn't have one tenth of his knowledge of the game.

 

But what I'm trying to get accross is that unlike them (Taylor aside) the media have crucified Rafa in the past for things that were totally uncalled for.

 

The point you make about the Burnley game is a prime example, he's still tarred with that brush now. Yet a year later he won it in the finest cup final since 1953, beating Utd & Chelsea on the way and scoring seven against Birmingham. What more could have the man done to try and correct a mistake?

[Jose M]

Surely given the respective wage bills in our group shouldn't we have automatically qualified?

[Whelan]

at least this illiterate cretins head isnt up rafa's arse so much that i can see clearly.

 

your not a scouser our you fella? cretin? HAHAHAHAH

 

Nope, I'm from Bognor Regis and proud of it. You illiterate scouse retard.

[The 5th Benitel]

"Baconface did make shit transfers last summer, but they won the league so it would look stupid to critise him for it."

Isn't that the key point about any analysis though: the resources at the Mancs,Chavs & now City are so much greater than to judge the manager on the basis of simply how many games they win doesn't make anysense at all.

 

Some managers get deservedly credited with achievements based on resources (ie/ Moyes); other don't.

 

Most absurd is the treatment of 'Arry.

 

His transfer dealings have directly led to the bankruptcy of his last 3 clubs, yet he is bizarrely portrayed in the media as being good in the market which is akin to saying Fred Goodwin was a great bank CEO.

 

Years ago similar arse-lickin' articles used to appear about El Tel after he had bought some journo bubbly in his tacky club.

He was regularly portrayed as a genius on almost no concrete evidence whatsoever.

 

Football reporting in this country outside of the Racing Post & Kuper's Saturday FT article is incredibly simplistic & full of shit.

 

It doesn't really happen in other sports & it doesn't happen in other countrys (ie/ Italy has serious tactical analysis; the US mainstream press covered the maths behind Belichick's recent decision to go for it on 4th down in great detail)

 

 

I cant comment on other countries cos i dont or really care about their reporting. I've very little time for football journalism as a whole cos i only really care about Liverpool and i think i see more than enough of them to form my own opinions. Yes, people from inside the game might be abel to give a different perspective, but, for the most part, it's just fat cockney's spouting opinions and i couldn't really give a shit what they think.

 

I see your point about Backonface but if any other managers have spent big and NOT won anything then they get the same treatment. That includes Scolari, Mourinho (no CL), Allerdyce (to an extent) and Hughes last sesaon, soon to be this. If you win it gives you immunity and i'm sure that's true of virtually every sport acriss the globe.

 

As for Redknapp, i think his media accessiblity and perceived likeablility plays a big part. I remember there was a similar thing for Peter Reid before they all just turned on him completely. I'm also sure the likeabillity is why Zola has avoided critism despite have a number of internationals in his team and they were all lining up to have a go at Phil Brown depsite them being in very similar places in the table.

 

It aint a conspiracy, it's just how it goes. It may not be 100% just and fair but they are very heavily compensated for that, and it certainly isn't based on their passports in the vast majority of newspapers.

[Jose M]

Nope, I'm from Bognor Regis and proud of it. You illiterate scouse retard.

 

Tut tut. Have you got any car stereo or hub cap jokes?

[Redshadow]

He'll make amends for it IF he's here next season - I have no doubts on THAT score whatsoever - If he goes out the FA Cup to the likes of Burnley one year and wins it the next. Finishes in 5th in our league one year and then rewrites our defensive records on the way to 82 points and a little later racks up 86 points with only TWO defeats all season then I'm damn sure he can rectify the little matter of crashing out in the CL group stages (his first such elimination with us in SIX years of CL compettiton don't forget - Fergie didn't even pass the Qualifiers in his first CL season in 1993/94 and went out in the group stages in his second in 1994/1995 as well as United crashing out bottom of their group without even the UEFA Cup as recently as 2006);

 

If Rafa' can do all of the above, then I'm damn sure he'll rectify said error in the CL and in style next season - I'd put money on us now sailing through the group next year with 5/6 straight wins AND getting to the final next season - If I know Rafa' we'll probably win it to. As to finishing in the Top 4? There's not even a question - Our FULL team (you should take notice of the word FULL if you're one of the Rafa' hating idiots who deliberately ignores the facts of a Somme like injury list amongst other things) so outclasses our so called challengers for that position in terms of experience, ability, scoring potential and class that's it not even funny; In fact, I'm very confident that WHEN our entire team and squad are back - We'll make the so called 'question' of whether we're going to finish in the Top 4 an academic one - I think the question then instead will be ''Can we get third or higher?'' Watch, it WILL happen - all of it , you'll see........................................