Quantcast
We're missing Height & Strength - Page 2 - FF - Football Forum - The Liverpool Way Jump to content
cestrianred

We're missing Height & Strength

Recommended Posts

We're missing footballers who know what to do with the ball.

 

Correct. More quality on the ball, better ball retention, more options, less reason for the speculative 60 yard punt, better chance of a successful final ball, more goals.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Well, all that, plus the fact he might not want to come, but we need that type of player. If I could get any English centre half in the window, it'd be him. We need a big grock who wins 95% of his headers. That Greek mess we've signed wins his fair share of headers but is too unreliable in all the other areas. We need someone who will say "MINE!" and deal with it.

 

Agger tries his best and is quite tall, but we all know his strengths are on the floor, Carragher is the best second ball defender I've seen play for Liverpool and I am concerned about Skrtel at the moment. We need an absolute monster at the back, someone who we can depend on to clear the lines and become our main header of the football. We don't have someone like that at the moment and it's killing us.

 

It is killing us I wholeheartedly agree with you AP.

 

Shawcross was going on about his kids or something saying 'if they are happy and settled then so am I' so I think prising him away would be difficult as I said. His contract probably has clauses lets face it so who knows.

 

Upson as I've said would be a shout, I love Mertesacker as I've said and Hanglaand would be good too.

 

I think Wheater would be a good signing as well.

 

Its clear to me the partnership of Skrtel and agger which we all thought would be class wont work, they need to have someone next to them other than each other.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Shankly and Paisley wouldn't have put up with shirkers..... ever.

 

That's very true, but neither would they put up with players who regularly demonstrate a lack of technique. We have both in our team at present.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Lorik Cana cost Sunderland £2m LESS than we paid for Lucas Leiva.

 

Either you are capable of buying players suited for the Premiership, or you are not. After 5 years, you don't really have the excuse of claiming you don't know what is needed.

 

On a similar (if racially stereotypical point about physicality) theme, why do we have so few black players, esp of African origin or descent?

 

African Cup of Nations. It's a kick in the balls, and we're lucky to not have to deal with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You don't necessarily have to be 6ft5 to be dominant in the air - Skrtle is proof of that.

Some players are naturals at attacking the ball in the air, look at shorter centre halfs such as Cannavaro.

 

I agree we are currently screaming out for a quality CB at the momment. Ideally we would get one in January plus a decent back player for Torres. But we all know we are skint. I thought the greek did well in the air against city, probably his best game for us.

But hes seriously lacking against tricky forward players and would cost us goals if played on a regular basis.

 

Skrtle's a funny one really , it initially looked as if Rafa had grabbed a Bargin at around 6m. He played like a CB who cost double that last season, but hes gone all alehouse this season. Not sure if it's lack of form / confidence or did he overperform last year. The jury's still out on him. He's deffo third choice now. Carra Agger is the way forward this season if agger can stay fit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think we're missing the player (Aquilani hopefully.) who can deliver the killer pass. Yossi is so, so damn close at being able to do that, but his passes seems to just fall short. (I clearly remember this happening twice on saturday.) If he practised those types of passes more and got better at it he could be phenomenal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yesterday's game (as last years against City) just showed up one of our main problems-a lack of height and strength in the ranks.

 

Masch and Lucas must be 5'8" at best on a good day, and playing against De Jong, Barry (Kompany last season) were out muscled in the middle. We seriously need a 6ft+ defensive midfielder in the near future (Alberto is about 6' 1" but he's offensive not defensive).

The same lack of height causes problems at set pieces (the up side of Agger's injury yesterday was getting the Greek on for defending set pieces, although I'd have him in the centre for corners rather than Skrtel, whose pathetic effort on Adebayor's goal proved).

With Insua, Benny,Aurellio and others under 6ft, added to not the tallest centre halfs (other than the Greek) we're seriously small & lightweight.

Now before it's pointed out I know that Xabi & Iniesta get by fine being small, but when you're packing that creativity in your team the problems are for the other side.

We lack height, muscle and don't have enough creativity to negate this.

We need bigger more powerful players in future purchases (or loans as is more likely).

 

 

He is a midget. Wikipedia says 5.8 and a half, but that seems generous to me. (And who puts "and a half" – Adrian Mole?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

we're missing players who have the desire and heart to perform and regain possession on the ground or the air when we don't have the ball. we need to be more aggressive all over the pitch or else our season will continue as the last 10 matches.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You don't necessarily have to be 6ft5 to be dominant in the air - Skrtle is proof of that.

Some players are naturals at attacking the ball in the air, look at shorter centre halfs such as Cannavaro.

 

Proof of what? He isn't even approaching dominant in the air.

 

I agree that it's not always height, a big part of it is about technique. Lucas, for example, isn't the tallest but wins 95% of his headers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yesterday's game (as last years against City) just showed up one of our main problems-a lack of height and strength in the ranks.

 

Masch and Lucas must be 5'8" at best on a good day, and playing against De Jong, Barry (Kompany last season) were out muscled in the middle. We seriously need a 6ft+ defensive midfielder in the near future (Alberto is about 6' 1" but he's offensive not defensive).

The same lack of height causes problems at set pieces (the up side of Agger's injury yesterday was getting the Greek on for defending set pieces, although I'd have him in the centre for corners rather than Skrtel, whose pathetic effort on Adebayor's goal proved).

With Insua, Benny,Aurellio and others under 6ft, added to not the tallest centre halfs (other than the Greek) we're seriously small & lightweight.

Now before it's pointed out I know that Xabi & Iniesta get by fine being small, but when you're packing that creativity in your team the problems are for the other side.

We lack height, muscle and don't have enough creativity to negate this.

We need bigger more powerful players in future purchases (or loans as is more likely).

 

Lucas 5'8"? He is no Crouch, but he isn't 5'8".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Skrtle got to the ball first and should have dealt with it, its an aspect of his game which grates me, he doesnt go and win the ball enough, instead he tries to let it run out of play, or he concentrates too much on the man, giving needless fouls away.

 

Go and win the fucking ball Martin

 

Exactly - I nearly had a fuckin aneurysm screaming at him to take tevez out. He's decision making was just disgraceful on Sat. And he looks like his granny would out muscle him at the minute.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

MICAH RICHARDS is the answer.superb in the air ,fast and strong as fuck!

 

i know he's been ropey recently but for £5m he'd well be worth the gamble!he'd defo nuckle down for us because he knows if he fails at another big club he'll never get a chance to be a great player again.

 

if rafa can gamble on a 20m crock from italy why not a 5m player who just needs to mature in the head a little?

 

then again,whats the point in buying players to mark space and not men?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
then again,whats the point in buying players to mark space and not men?

 

You could ask the same of Bob Paisley, since it was his Liverpool teams that were the first to pioneer the use of zonal marking for set pieces. The main point is for the team to keep a useful shape whilst defending set pieces so that when you come out with the ball you can swiftly transition to an organised counter-attack.

 

The problem we have is not that the system we are trying to use is inappropriate so much as that we don't come out with the ball because our shite implementation of the system means that more often than not it's in the back of our net. And when we do come out with it, it ends up being lost by Kuyt about 60% of the time.

 

Given that we're not seemingly able to defend effectively and are not reaping the main benefits of the system, you could argue that its continuing use is something we should consider carefully.

 

However, switching the system to fully man marking at this time is by no means an instant fix. The time you would use drilling the team to defend in a completely different system might be more effectively spent drillling them to get this one right. They evidently don't have a fucking clue what they are supposed to be doing or how to do it half the time, and changing the system might make that worse before it gets better.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You could ask the same of Bob Paisley, since it was his Liverpool teams that were the first to pioneer the use of zonal marking for set pieces. The main point is for the team to keep a useful shape whilst defending set pieces so that when you come out with the ball you can swiftly transition to an organised counter-attack.

 

The problem we have is not that the system we are trying to use is inappropriate so much as that we don't come out with the ball because our shite implementation of the system means that more often than not it's in the back of our net. And when we do come out with it, it ends up being lost by Kuyt about 60% of the time.

 

Given that we're not seemingly able to defend effectively and are not reaping the main benefits of the system, you could argue that its continuing use is something we should consider carefully.

 

However, switching the system to fully man marking at this time is by no means an instant fix. The time you would use drilling the team to defend in a completely different system might be more effectively spent drillling them to get this one right. They evidently don't have a fucking clue what they are supposed to be doing or how to do it half the time, and changing the system might make that worse before it gets better.

 

 

i prefer a combo myself.a few players in a zone but our 4/5 best headers/markers against there best headers/finishers.its not rocket science to know that a player whos got a free run will out jump/power someone who is being hasled.

 

in paisleys day every game wasnt on tv and there wasnt 10 cameras at every match so it was much harder to exploit a teams 'ZM' or 'MM' or even basic tactics.its a completely different era! how many times was football on the tv in them days?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am willing to wager every team uses zonal marking. In a team that uses man to man marking, they will have their best header of a ball in a pre-determined zone, around the penalty spot usually.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
i prefer a combo myself.a few players in a zone but our 4/5 best headers/markers against there best headers/finishers.its not rocket science to know that a player whos got a free run will out jump/power someone who is being hasled.

 

in paisleys day every game wasnt on tv and there wasnt 10 cameras at every match so it was much harder to exploit a teams 'ZM' or 'MM' or even basic tactics.its a completely different era! how many times was football on the tv in them days?

 

I suggest you take another look at Adebayor's goal. We did exactly that but a clever run by Ireland took Gerrard away.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I am willing to wager every team uses zonal marking. In a team that uses man to man marking, they will have their best header of a ball in a pre-determined zone, around the penalty spot usually.

 

To a certain degree I think you are right, the problem isn't zonal it is being static when zonal marking, you have a space to mark but you still have to defend it and not stand fucking still as the ball lands on an opposition player standing one yard either side of you!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
To a certain degree I think you are right, the problem isn't zonal it is being static when zonal marking, you have a space to mark but you still have to defend it and not stand fucking still as the ball lands on an opposition player standing one yard either side of you!

 

I agree entirely. We don't have anyone who attacks a ball aggressively and to attack a ball aggressively you need to move!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
We miss a dominant first ball centre half. Someone who will stick their head in where nobody else wants to, someone to rely on to clear the lines. Without messing Sami about he'd still be here, but the fact is that he's gone and I reckon we need to go and sign Shawcross, but the Yanks won't be able to afford it.

 

Could'nt agree more with you. The only one that puts his body on the line is Carrra, need somebody else thats not afraid to get hurt.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
To a certain degree I think you are right, the problem isn't zonal it is being static when zonal marking, you have a space to mark but you still have to defend it and not stand fucking still as the ball lands on an opposition player standing one yard either side of you!

 

Yeah, a key part of it is to attack the ball when it comes into your zone.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'd just like to say De Jong is an outstanding DM.

 

Would be perfect to replace the Chief when Barca come callin.However this would only happen if Hughes gets the bullet and the replacing manager d'ont fancy him.........

With our budget its gotta be Wheater as he got the potential to be the new Sami IMO

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×