Alberto Aquilani

[Unrighteous]

Had he not demanded a move to Madrid, then he'd still be here, wouldn't he?

 

And yes, I know exactly where this is heading, but fuck it, you started it

 

We all know the situation surrounding his move. So, instead of getting back into it, I'll just say that it's wrong to put down 'his demand' as the sole vehicle of the move.

[Tom R]

How on earth can anyone say that injuries have not played a part this season.

 

Last season Torres and Gerrard were injured but when we went on our run at the end did they feature heavily.

 

Another note is if it was just Gerrard and Torres that were injured then so be it but like its been put the midfield influence of Alonso is not playing and Aquilani who will fill the void is yet to start a game.

 

Add to the that the injuries of Riera, Agger, Aurelio and more recently Johnson have all made an impact.

 

Another point which is important is the fact that players such as Carragher and especially Kuyt all raised their games last season but this season the two players mentioned are way below par, especially Kuyt.

 

Its alright having a couple of players injured but when more then half the team is out then the majority of clubs will struggle to cope.

 

Nobody is saying uinjuries haven't played a part.

 

All I'm saying is that if our squad wasn't so fucking SHITE then they wouldn't have played half the part that they have.

 

And how do you explain getting beat by inferior teams who also have a lot of their key players missing?

 

Something far bigger than injuries is wrong with our team right now.

Open your eyes.

[Guest Ulysses Everett McGill]

We all know the situation surrounding his move. So, instead of getting back into it, I'll just say that it's wrong to put down 'his demand' as the sole vehicle of the move.

 

I'd say the fact he handed in a transfer request having been agitating for months for a move made his intentions pretty clear.

 

He has admitted himself he decided he wanted a move early into last season

 

The above is fact, everything else is conjecture, speculation and gossip, unless of course you have evidence to the contrary

 

The fact he is not here is down to Xabi, no one else

 

And again, just re-iterate, I never brought him into this

[Unrighteous]

I'd say the fact he handed in a transfer request having been agitating for months for a move made his intentions pretty clear.

 

He has admitted himself he decided he wanted a move early into last season

 

The above is fact, everything else is conjecture, speculation and gossip, unless of course you have evidence to the contrary

 

The fact he is not here is down to Xabi, no one else

 

And again, just re-iterate, I never brought him into this

 

Gareth Barry wouldn't have missed that header, Xabi!

 

 

(Myself, and a lot of other people would disagree... and to not turn this into a xabi thread, let's move on)

[Brownie]

How on earth can anyone say that injuries have not played a part this season.

 

Last season Torres and Gerrard were injured but when we went on our run at the end did they feature heavily.

 

Another note is if it was just Gerrard and Torres that were injured then so be it but like its been put the midfield influence of Alonso is not playing and Aquilani who will fill the void is yet to start a game.

 

Add to the that the injuries of Riera, Agger, Aurelio and more recently Johnson have all made an impact.

 

Another point which is important is the fact that players such as Carragher and especially Kuyt all raised their games last season but this season the two players mentioned are way below par, especially Kuyt.

 

Its alright having a couple of players injured but when more then half the team is out then the majority of clubs will struggle to cope.

 

Who has said that?

 

I presume you're talking about me seeing as I mentioned injuries. I actually said that, 'I think we're in danger of simply blaming everything on injuries this season.'

 

And I do.

 

Of course injuries have played a part, but they also played a part last season as well and we managed to win lots of games regardless.

 

There are lots of different reasons as to why we are struggling to win games this season but it's not all down to injuries, which is what i've seen plenty of people claim.

[Brownie]

If we hadn't tried to replace Alonso with Barry in the summer of 2008, then he would still be here, in my opinion.

[Guest Ulysses Everett McGill]

Gareth Barry wouldn't have missed that header, Xabi!

 

 

(Myself, and a lot of other people would disagree... and to not turn this into a xabi thread, let's move on)

 

As I said, provide me with something that isn't gossip or innuendo and I'll be more than willing to change my mind.

[zigackly]

Give it a rest about fucking Alonso and Barry for fucks sake.

[Carra_is_legend]

As I said, provide me with something that isn't gossip or innuendo and I'll be more than willing to change my mind.

 

Likewise, can you provide something to back your statement:

 

"The fact he is not here is down to Xabi, no one else"

 

I don't think you can. Because it is not black and white. We wanted to sell him the previous summer, Xabi had that in his mind, raised his game and helped his team professionally and left when the club of his choice came calling. If Madrid didn't decide to re-elect Perez and spend over £200m, I don't think he would have left - to Man City for example. Similarly, if Madrid never came in for him and if only Arsenal came in with a £12m offer, he wouldn't have been sold by the club.

 

In the end, he got his move and we got the price. But the club started the issue and he forced it when he had the chance. We can keep talking about it for the next 10 years but it will only bore us all to death.

[Whelan]

If we hadn't tried to replace Alonso with Barry in the summer of 2008, then he would still be here, in my opinion.

 

In my opinion (only mine by the way) if Alonso had played as he did last year for the previous two, we wouldn't have tried to replace him with anybody last season.

 

It is not as black and white as people say it is, none of this current situation is.

[JohnnyH]

If we hadn't tried to replace Alonso with Barry in the summer of 2008, then he would still be here, in my opinion.

 

But if we hadn't of tried to replace him, would we still have the Xabi of the 2005-2006 season? Which if that is the case, then we'd be looking to get rid anyway?

 

It took Rafa trying to replace him for Xabi to realise he was in danger of ending up at a lesser team, as none of the likes of Real came in for him (Why would that be? Must be because he played so well) so Xabi upped his game, so he could get his dream move.

 

I'd look on it a different way. If we didn't try and sell Xabi in the summer of 2008, then we would not have had the title challenge we had last season as we would have had Xabi of old, and just pottered about way off challenging for the title. Without the kick up the arse, we'd have sold Xabi this summer with only the likes of Juve coming in for him again.

[Whelan]

Give it a rest about fucking Alonso and Barry for fucks sake.

 

So what you are saying is that Rafa was fucking Alonso and Barry?, no wonder Xabi got pissed off!

[WhiskeyJar]

Its all just theories and gossip. We dont really know what happend so no good will come out this debate.

 

Just more frustration and aggro. If the team was winning and on top of the league we would be singing a different tune right now.

[Guest Ulysses Everett McGill]

Likewise, can you provide something to back your statement:

 

"The fact he is not here is down to Xabi, no one else"

 

I don't think you can. Because it is not black and white. We wanted to sell him the previous summer, Xabi had that in his mind, raised his game and helped his team professionally and left when the club of his choice came calling. If Madrid didn't decide to re-elect Perez and spend over £200m, I don't think he would have left - to Man City for example. Similarly, if Madrid never came in for him and if only Arsenal came in with a £12m offer, he wouldn't have been sold by the club.

 

In the end, he got his move and we got the price. But the club started the issue and he forced it when he had the chance. We can keep talking about it for the next 10 years but it will only bore us all to death.

 

Did he, or did he not hand in a transfer request?

 

Did Benitez, numerous times over the course of last season, state that he wanted the player to stay?

"'I accept it as a professional but that moment probably changed my mind and I thought maybe from that moment it was maybe time for a change.'"

[Red Phoenix]

So do people think Rafa wouldn't risk Aquilani for the derby? If so, when? Blackburn? Or the match after?

 

I won't be surprised if he just starts with him on sunday. Puts out his best possible side, hopes they're all ok (he'll bring Aquilani off after 60 mins anyway won't he?) and that finally the injury madness is coming to a close.

 

Arse had this crazy stuff last year and look how they finished off, there's no way I'm worrying if we get over the injuries.

[Carra_is_legend]

Did he, or did he not hand in a transfer request?

 

Yes he did. But he also said that "he won't force the issue" before he did. Did we force him to force it? So that we don't pay the loyalty bonus? Most likely.

 

Did Benitez, numerous times over the course of last season, state that he wanted the player to stay?

 

This is what Rafa said about Keane. On 27th Jan 2009. A few days before he actually left us. As I said, not black and white.

 

From Times Online January 27, 2009

Rafael Benitez: Robbie Keane is not for saleTimes Online

 

Rafael Benitez has played down suggestions that Robbie Keane could be sold in the transfer window but the Liverpool manager did not categorically rule out a transfer for the Irish forward.

 

Keane's future at the club has looked increasingly uncertain in recent weeks. He featured in only six of Liverpool’s past 12 matches and, to the astonishment of some at the club, was left out of the 18-man squad for the FA Cup tie at home to Everton on Sunday, with David Ngog, who has never started a Premier League match, preferred among the substitutes.

 

Yesterday, Keane was offered a potential return to Tottenham Hotspur, the club who sold him for £20.3 million summer, when Harry Redknapp, their manager, indicated in interest in signing him, either in this transfer window or at the end of the season.

 

However, Benitez insisted that he needed Keane in his squad as Liverpool push for the Premier League title and that he would return to the squad for the game against Wigan Athletic on Wednesday. “Everyone is now important for us,” Benitez said. “We have a lot of games to play in the coming weeks, in the league, FA Cup and Europe. We will need everyone."

 

The Spaniard appeared to suggest, however, that he considers Keane primarily as a back-up member of his squad. “People may not always play but two weeks later we may have an injury and then we need them,” Benitez said. “Everyone, including Robbie, is training well. He has experience and hopefully he will be an important player for us.

 

“When Fernando Torres was injured, Robbie was working hard and doing well. If he can continue to do this we will not have any doubts over his quality."

 

Given the recurring hamstring problems that have dogged Torres this season, Liverpool would be taking a gamble if they were to sell Keane without buying a replacement. “A lot of clubs have been asking about some players, to buy or loan,” Benitez said. “But we do not want to lose players now if we cannot replace those players later. We need all of them for the race for the title.

 

“People are talking too much about Keane. It was just one decision about one player, he wasn’t in the squad. He had a day off on Sunday like the rest of the players who were not involved in the game. He trained on Monday, he trained today and he will be in the squad at Wigan. If he can score goals then I will be happy."

 

Benitez argued that Manchester United could regularly leave out high-profile players without generating being subject to the kind of scrutiny that the Keane situation has had. “If you want to be in a top side then you must have the mentality to accept that some players will play and some will not," he said. “Robbie is a good player, we knew that when we signed him. Maybe he is not playing at his best level, but he wants to fight for his position."

 

Redknapp has already re-signed two former Tottenham players this month, with the return of Jermain Defoe from Portsmouth followed by that of Pascal Chimbonda from Sunderland yesterday.

 

He indicated that Keane would be a target if Liverpool are willing to cut their losses on the forward. "I wouldn’t sit here and say I wouldn’t like to have Robbie Keane at my club because I would be a liar if I did,” he said. “But he belongs to Liverpool, so it is not an option, unfortunately. As a player and a person, I have a lot of time for Robbie Keane. I think he’s fantastic.”

[WhiskeyJar]

I have learned long ago that Rafa doesnt do what he actually says. He might give his opinion but when it comes down to it he would go back on his word he said a few days ago if he views it as the right thing to do.

 

We got a big game tonight and people would rather talk about Alonso.

[Guest Ulysses Everett McGill]

Yes he did. But he also said that "he won't force the issue" before he did. Did we force him to force it? So that we don't pay the loyalty bonus? Most likely.

 

 

 

This is what Rafa said about Keane. On 27th Jan 2009. A few days before he actually left us. As I said, not black and white.

 

 

Fair comment, but even disregarding what Rafa said, we have two undeniable facts

 

Xabi decided he wanted a move early last season, he said so himself, unless he is telling porkies

 

He handed in a transfer request

 

Whether or not it was down to our interest in Barry, Rafa Benitez, global warming or the situation in Afghanistan is inconsequential, because ultimately he didn't have to leave, but he chose to.

 

As an aside, given the choice, I'd still rather have him here and not had the club attempt to find a replacement, as he is probably the best player in the world in his position.

[Whelan]

We got a big game tonight and people would rather talk about Alonso.

 

Look on the brightside, the longer we carry on with the 'Alonso was pushed' arguments the longer we have to wait until we get the inevitable 'Alonso is better than Aquiliani' arguments!

 

I reckon by mid December they will be in full flow.

[stevienando]

I actually don't think Xabi is the best in his position, I think he tries to force the long balls too much, and when they don't come off it's fucking annoying. But when they come off, they're the sex. Sometimes he has to be more patient in his build-up and stop immediately looking for the "hollywood passes". Also he tends to always play the ball wide, never through the center. Which is kind of useless when our wingers can't cross the ball. If you compare Xabi and Fabregas' passing I'm sure you will find that Fabregas plays through balls down the middle much more, which invariably leads to more goals.

[Carra_is_legend]

Fair comment, but even disregarding what Rafa said, we have two undeniable facts

 

Xabi decided he wanted a move early last season, he said so himself, unless he is telling porkies

 

He handed in a transfer request

 

Whether or not it was down to our interest in Barry, Rafa Benitez, global warming or the situation in Afghanistan is inconsequential, because ultimately he didn't have to leave, but he chose to.

 

As an aside, given the choice, I'd still rather have him here and not had the club attempt to find a replacement, as he is probably the best player in the world in his position.

 

Aye. No one is an angel - Xabi wasn't one and Rafa Benitez certainly wasn't one.

 

As I said, the club started it and he ended it. He joined the club he wanted to join and we got the price we wanted. Whether the club or Rafa could have handled it any better or not has been done to death already.

 

As someone said above, we only have a big game tonight.

[WhiskeyJar]

Look on the brightside, the longer we carry on with the 'Alonso was pushed' arguments the longer we have to wait until we get the inevitable 'Alonso is better than Aquiliani' arguments!

 

I reckon by mid December they will be in full flow.

 

Thats a horrid way of looking at things.

 

I wont lose hope. Never will.

 

The team should keep on fighting until the last fucking whistle. If this our last Champions League game of the season, perhaps even next season if we dont finish 4th, then I would like us to show some guile and honour and go out with a big massive bang.

[zigackly]

If this our last Champions League game of the season.

 

It's not.

[silverlining]

Thats a horrid way of looking at things.

 

I wont lose hope. Never will.

 

The team should keep on fighting until the last fucking whistle. If this our last Champions League game of the season, perhaps even next season if we dont finish 4th, then I would like us to show some guile and honour and go out with a big massive bang.

 

Yes! Show some guile(?)! And honour! And go out with a massive bang!

[coop]

Nobody is saying uinjuries haven't played a part.

 

All I'm saying is that if our squad wasn't so fucking SHITE then they wouldn't have played half the part that they have.

 

And how do you explain getting beat by inferior teams who also have a lot of their key players missing?

 

Something far bigger than injuries is wrong with our team right now.

Open your eyes.

 

I think its a culmination of things Tom.

 

The injuries have played a major part but morale at the club is shite.

 

You had Torres, Gerrard and i think Carragher (cant be sure on that one) all stating that they were looking forward to adding to the team with quality.

 

You even had Rafa talking about the possibility of breaking the transfer record for the club.

 

Next thing there is fuck all to spend other then what Alonso and Arbeloa fetched.

 

I don't buy into this shite from Purslow regards we have spent the same amount as normal.

 

This will have had an effect on morale as we never made the next step by signing another quality forward in the Silva mould.

 

People who i have spoke to that stayed in the same hotel as the players in pre-season say that the atmosphere was like a funeral, everyone down.

 

You right Tom there is many things wrong at the club but i suggest you open your eyes if you think Rafa is a major one.