Steven Gerrard's Trial...

[Guest RafaIsRafa]

 

Ant was just stating that there is a shitload of people on here who want to brush this under the carpet because he is Steven Gerrard. He wasnt trying to provoke you or anyone.

 

 

And the same people probably wouldnt if it was suspected he'd lobbed a paving slab at someones head. I still dont see any point here at all, the comparison is absolutely laughable.

[Bogman]

To be fair to Stevie, the blame lies solely at Rafa's door.

 

Can't believe no-ones pointed that out yet.

 

Shoddy.

[Whelan]

And the same people probably wouldnt if it was suspected he'd lobbed a paving slab at someones head. I still dont see any point here at all, the comparison is absolutely laughable.

 

Then say that!

 

I agree with you, I don't think they deserve comparison either.

[redrosetints]

The whole 'This sort of stuff happens week in week out' is a bit of a cop out IMO. If he did wrong he deserves to be punished, no matter what.

 

Spot on Ant. You can't go round punching people just cos they wont let you change the music, especially when its over Phil Collins.

 

From what ive seen (grainy CCTV footage on the news last night), its not clear who threw what first. But if Gerrard did hit the guy, he should take a punishment, some community service or a fine.

 

Anyone who says he shouldn't or that he should get off lightly cos he's SG or the victim is s manc really needs to take a look at what they think is acceptable in society.

[Guest RafaIsRafa]

Then say that!

 

 

I already had. Now fuck off and stalk someone else you weird twat.

[Nomad]

And the same people probably wouldnt if it was suspected he'd lobbed a paving slab at someones head. I still dont see any point here at all, the comparison is absolutely laughable.

 

I just think there was some cross-wire thats all mate

[Whelan]

I already had. Now fuck off and stalk someone else you weird twat.

 

haha, okay. Will do.

[Bogman]

From the Beeb

 

The man allegedly attacked by England midfielder Steven Gerrard in a Merseyside bar has told a jury he faced a "barrage" of punches.

 

Marcus McGee, 34, told Liverpool Crown Court he was attacked after he refused to give Mr Gerrard control of a CD player in the Lounge Inn, Southport.

 

Mr McGee, who was initially struck by Mr Gerrard's friend John Doran, said he thought the footballer hit him first.

 

Mr Gerrard, of Formby, Merseyside denies affray.

 

Mr McGee lost a crown on a front tooth in the attack in the early hours of 29 December last year, the court heard.

 

Mr Gerrard, who was in the club with friends to celebrate Liverpool's 5-1 win over Newcastle Utd, is shown on CCTV walking away before he returns several minutes later.

 

Stereo control

 

He said: "I remember a barrage of punches coming in at my face but I didn't know who has done what.

 

"Having watched the CCTV it was obvious Steven Gerrard hits me a couple of times, maybe three times, but I couldn't honestly say on the night.

 

"I didn't know who did what."

 

Mr McGee said he was asked by the manager to be in charge of the music.

 

Watching the CCTV footage along with the jury, Mr McGee said he had thrown no punches and was in a "nondescript" mood.

 

 

Mr Gerrard was celebrating Liverpool's 5-1 win over Newcastle

Being led through his evidence by prosecuting barrister David Turner QC, Mr McGee said Mr Gerrard had tried to grab a card from his hand which controlled the stereo.

 

He said: "Mr Gerrard came to me from my left hand side and requested he wanted control of the music.

 

"It was something to the effect of 'Here you are, lad, give me that'."

 

He said he recognised Mr Gerrard, but did not give the card to him.

 

"It wasn't my permission to be giving it out to somebody else, it was my job so I didn't hand it over.

 

"He made a move to try to grab the card to take it away and I remember it slipped on the floor at one stage.

 

"He then walked away, that was the end of it."

 

Doran, 29, of Woodlands Road, Ian Gerrard Smith, 19, of Hilary Avenue and Paul McGrattan, 31, of Linden Drive, all Huyton, admit affray.

 

Accrington Stanley footballers Robert Grant, 19, of Enstone Avenue, Litherland, and Ian Dunbavin, 28, of Guildford Road, Southport, have also admitted affray.

 

John McGrattan, 34, of Rimmer Avenue, Huyton, has admitted threatening behaviour after denying affray.

 

The trial continues.

[redrosetints]

Iv never know a court to ask how do you plead

 

Guilty/Not Guilty or Self defence

 

If hes pleading self defence then that in itself is an admittence of guilt as he is saying he has hit him in self defence which is an offence wether self defence or not.

 

So surly he would be told to plead guilty and take a lesser offence.

 

If this is the case and he is found guilty (you can be found guilty even if self defence) of affray which is

 

The Public Order Act 1986 s.3 states:

 

'A person is guilty of affray if he uses or threatens unlawful violence towards another and the person's conduct is such as would cause a person of reasonable firmness present at the scene to fear for his personal safety.

Where two or more persons use or threaten the unlawful violence, it is the conduct of them taken together that must be considered for the purpose of subsection (1)

For the purposes of this section a threat can not be made by the use of words alone.

No person of reasonable firmness need actually be, or be likely to be, present at the scene.

Affray may be committed in private as well as in public places'

 

then surly the sentence would be lesser if he pleaded guilty

 

i read it as Gerrard was pleading not guilty as he was defending himself. Self defense is not the plea, but the mitigation.

[Nomad]

i read it as Gerrard was pleading not guilty as he was defending himself. Self defense is not the plea, but the mitigation.

 

Yes i know . that post was in relation to somebody who had earlia stated he was pleading self-defense i was stating that you cannot plead just self defence.

 

and i just added the affray part so people knew what it was all about

[redrosetints]

And even then it looks like it could be someone else.

 

They've got fuck all on him. Wait till his defence gets going.

 

Looks like two people, someone sticks an elbox/forearm on McGee, then someone else throws two or three punches. but its not clear who is who.

[redrosetints]

Yes i know . that post was in relation to somebody who had earlia stated he was pleading self-defense i was stating that you cannot plead just self defence.

 

and i just added the affray part so people knew what it was all about

 

Ah, ok, thought you werent sure.

[WaltonRed]

Looking forward to the defence, they'll take this manc gimp the cleaners.

 

As for saying people are blinded because he's our captain, i'm not, its unclear who did what and if he wasnt a football player it wouldnt of gone this far. end of.

[aws]

Looks like two people, someone sticks an elbox/forearm on McGee, then someone else throws two or three punches. but its not clear who is who.

 

Gerrard's admitted punching him so it must have been him throwing the uppercuts. The only other blow is the elbow so it's funny that all of his mates have pleaded guilty to the affray charge.

 

What a waste of time and resources though. It's just a simple assault "sexed-up" to affray because gerrard is involved. The problem for gerrard is that affray is so wide-ranging he could be found guilty . Even then he'll only end up with a fine and 50 hours teaching kids to play football.

Edited July 22, 2009 by aws

[RedinSweden]

Affray? Steven Gerrard? My arse. He fears nothing.

[Major Tom]

I am interested to hear Gerrard's side of this. If him and 5 of his pals laid into one bloke over what music was being played as is being touted by the prosecution, well that is just fucking lame and they deserve what's coming their way.

[OmarVizquel]

If him and 5 of his pals laid into one bloke over what music was being played as is being touted by the prosecution, well that is just fucking lame and they deserve what's coming their way.

 

That's the sad part of the whole thing. That, and the whole Phil Collins angle....

 

Stupid, stupid shit.

[kelster]

I'd be surprised if that footage is admissable for the trial now it's been leaked all over the place. Can see this gettign thrown out.

 

I'd be very surprised if prior showing of a video were now cause for getting a trial stopped. Imagine how that would impede police if they were asking for witnesses in another case but couldn't show the vid. Crimewatch would be finished.

 

I think you've thought this one up in your head or have been watching far too much US court TV.

[Funkasy]

it must be a top 3 worst reason to attack someone

[Maldini]

It's interesting to compare the reaction of fans to this case, to that of the case of Michael Shields.

 

It just seems there is alot more faith in Steven being aquitted/innocent despite CCTV evidence showing he twatted him. Than what there is with an innocent Liverpool fan who was convicted in a botch trial abroad.

 

There is more valid evidence in 'potentially' convicting Gerrard than what there is convicting Michael..

 

People using the excuse 'This happens week in week out' it may do so, but it still needs to be punished, no matter who you are.

 

I'm not saying Gerrard is innocent or guility, thats not for me to decide, but it doesn't look good for him.

 

You talk some amount of shit kid, you really do. Keep your fucking mouth shut will you, because all you're doing by spouting this shit is turning this into a "if you support Gerrard, you don't support Shields" tardfest and that REALLY isn't what either case needs.

[Maldini]

I am interested to hear Gerrard's side of this. If him and 5 of his pals laid into one bloke over what music was being played as is being touted by the prosecution, well that is just fucking lame and they deserve what's coming their way.

 

The story doing the rounds at the time on YNWA (can't remember who posted it, but it was someone believable) was that the DJ had been acting the bollocks all night, singing songs about Gerrard (baby's not yours, stuff about his wife etc) and Gerrard had taken it all in his stride. Later in the night Gerrard went over and asked for a song which the DJ wouldn't play so Gerrard tried to go behind the bar and stick it on himself, at this stage the DJ got up in his face and one of Gerrard's mates from behind misjudged the situation, thought the DJ was gonna hit Gerrard and steamed in, from there a scuffle broke out.

 

That seems to be backed up by CCTV footage, well the stuff after Gerrard approaching anyway. I dunno if the defence would want any of the DJs cockish actions brought up anyway as it would give Gerrard a motive for kicking off which wouldn't really help their case.

[Lucky Pierre]

It just seems there is alot more faith in Steven being aquitted/innocent despite CCTV evidence showing he twatted him. Than what there is with an innocent Liverpool fan who was convicted in a botch trial abroad.

Where? That could be you for all I can see of it.

[navbasi]

The story doing the rounds at the time on YNWA (can't remember who posted it, but it was someone believable) was that the DJ had been acting the bollocks all night, singing songs about Gerrard (baby's not yours, stuff about his wife etc) and Gerrard had taken it all in his stride. Later in the night Gerrard went over and asked for a song which the DJ wouldn't play so Gerrard tried to go behind the bar and stick it on himself, at this stage the DJ got up in his face and one of Gerrard's mates from behind misjudged the situation, thought the DJ was gonna hit Gerrard and steamed in, from there a scuffle broke out.

 

That seems to be backed up by CCTV footage, well the stuff after Gerrard approaching anyway. I dunno if the defence would want any of the DJs cockish actions brought up anyway as it would give Gerrard a motive for kicking off which wouldn't really help their case.

 

If anything wouldn't that come under severe provocation and not help Steven's case?

[Antynwa]

You talk some amount of shit kid, you really do. Keep your fucking mouth shut will you, because all you're doing by spouting this shit is turning this into a "if you support Gerrard, you don't support Shields" tardfest and that REALLY isn't what either case needs.

 

All I'm trying to say is that the support of Gerrard v the support of Sheilds seems some what inconsistent considering the evidence in both cases and the obvious relevance to Liverpool Football Club.

 

On one hand you've got fans wanting the Gerrard issue to be swept under the carpet regardless of guilt or not, and on the other you've got the same fans showing, little or no concern for Michael's plight, and even going as far as to condoning Jack Straw's decision despite the Merseyside Police saying he should be pardoned.

 

I just think it's a bit 'Off' that the majority on here should be supporting a captain 'un-reservedly' but questioning the validity of their own fans innocence in a flawed trial in a foreign country.

 

It's all abit too inconsistent for me, and I'm not comparing the incidents because they are totally different, I am comparing the levels of support v the evidence at hand.

 

This isn't about Stevie v Michael, this is about finding a level playing field. If Gerrard gets found guilty, we'll find people on here supporting Gerrard, but not giving two shiny shites about Michael's plight and I believe that is wrong.

[Major Tom]

The story doing the rounds at the time on YNWA (can't remember who posted it, but it was someone believable) was that the DJ had been acting the bollocks all night, singing songs about Gerrard (baby's not yours, stuff about his wife etc) and Gerrard had taken it all in his stride. Later in the night Gerrard went over and asked for a song which the DJ wouldn't play so Gerrard tried to go behind the bar and stick it on himself, at this stage the DJ got up in his face and one of Gerrard's mates from behind misjudged the situation, thought the DJ was gonna hit Gerrard and steamed in, from there a scuffle broke out.

 

Cheers for the info.

 

None of what you have said there lends itself to a defence basing itself on a self-defence as a mitigating circumstance though.

 

That said, Gerrard's people must think he has a reasonable chance of walking away from this.