Murdoch's Scum Credentials All In Order I See

[Strontium]

Miliband is walking all over Cameron here.

 

 

Well, Ed has an advantage over Dave: he still has his spin doctor from News International...

[Skidfingers McGonical]

Well, Ed has an advantage over Dave: he still has his spin doctor from News International...

 

Who be that then?

[Strontium]

Ed Miliband's head of communications, Tom Baldwin, used to work for the Times, and has a few skeletons of his own in the closet.

[Skidfingers McGonical]

Ed Miliband's head of communications, Tom Baldwin, used to work for the Times, and has a few skeletons of his own in the closet.

 

Haven't they all though.

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

Ed Miliband's head of communications, Tom Baldwin, used to work for the Times, and has a few skeletons of his own in the closet.

 

Has he been arrested in connection with the hacking of phones owned by terrorism and murder victims? Actually, the comparison being made between the two, as the Tories seem to be trying to do, is indicative of the hole they've got themselves into.

 

Ashcroft, who is the Tory party's largest donator and a tax-avoiding shit bag, made allegations that Baldwin paid somebody to look into his bank accounts when the Times were investigating potentially illegal donations (Ashcroft was shifting money from Belize to the Tory party) and also details of major tax evasion, but he seems to have never offered a shred of evidence. After all, it would be totally unlike the Conservatives, or any political party, to try to deflect their own idiocy by pointing the finger elsewhere, wouldn't it?

 

I'm not a huge fan of Baldwin, nor many Blairite supporters; but even if it was true, and I'm not convinced it is, then investigating the relationship between the uber-rich and the potential governing party is a wholly different thing from hacking the phone messages of murdered kids and 9/11 victims in order to pay a few quid.

 

Unless you're talking about some other skeletons that I don't know about, in which case, please share?

[stringvest]

I said I doubted whether it would be needed, but yes, I do if that was the only choice.

 

I don't think it would be the only choice. Which is a scary thought in itself, as the (even) less scrupulous parties are out there, readying themselves to help to fill a vacuum.

[PestiRed]

Tom Baldwin's boss was Michael Gove at the time so Gove would have approved the pay-off/expenses if Baldwin had used a private detective.

 

 

Ed Miliband ends the Baldwin controversy | Westminster blog | Jim Pickard and Kiran Stacey share their views on the UK’s political scene for the Financial Times – FT.com

[Guest Numero Veinticinco]

I don't think it would be the only choice. Which is a scary thought in itself, as the (even) less scrupulous parties are out there, readying themselves to help to fill a vacuum.

 

It all depends on the maths at the time. I'd wager Labour would win a majority if an election was called. If not, the split would be much kinder to Labour than it was last time around.

[Cardie]

Ed Miliband's head of communications, Tom Baldwin, used to work for the Times, and has a few skeletons of his own in the closet.

 

The yeah but what about labour defence.

 

Good job you rarely use that.

[Carradona]

I can't even look at Nick Clegg's face any more without laughing at him. Fucking embarrassment.

[stringvest]

It all depends on the maths at the time. I'd wager Labour would win a majority if an election was called. If not, the split would be much kinder to Labour than it was last time around.

 

Hmmm. I am far from convinced Labour would win an overall majority right now. Milliband has yet to convince. Disaffection with the Lib Dems won't be enough on its own, and Cameron has not offended enough of his newly won support yet - give it 12 months or so, and the picture might be different.

[torahboy]

I couldn't give a shit about the Labour Party or Tom Baldwin - they're not in government and may not be for some considerable time. My concern is the corruption, lies and deceit that are at the heart of this administration.

 

Cameron, with his kind offer to 'apologise wholeheartedly' if Coulson is convicted of any criminal activity, has failed to answer so many questions today that the debates have become farcical. His memory is as bad as fucking Rupert's, and his refusal to name the company who he employed to 'vet' Coulson suggests that there will be many more questions for him to dodge in the future.

 

Two words kept forming in my mind while listening to Cameron today, the same two words that Blair's justification for the Iraq invasion provoked - "Fucking liar!". Despite his twenty something meetings with NI or BSkyB connections he never once discussed Murdoch's takeover plans for the broadcasting company? Not once? This is one farce that will turn into a tragedy for this corrupt cunt.

[ChrisM]

Have the police secretly signalled the current investigations are going nowhere? | Westminster blog | Jim Pickard and Kiran Stacey share their views on the UK’s political scene for the Financial Times – FT.com

 

Everyone loves a good conspiracy theory. This one comes from Craig Murray, the outspoken former ambassador to Uzbekistan, who asks, “What’s in a name?”

 

Quite a lot, it would seem, as far as the Metropolitan Police is concerned.

 

The Met’s investigations into hacking and payments by journalists to police are called, respectively, Operations Weeting and Elveden. But why?

 

Apparently Elveden is famous among people in Norfolk as a bottleneck on the A11 at which drivers can get stuck for hours. According to Murray, “Elveden means no progress.” What’s more, the name of the village at the end of that bottleneck is – you’ve guessed it – Weeting.

 

Of course, it might just be a coincidence, just as it might be a coincidence that Andy Hayman was chief constable in Norfolk before moving to the Met.

 

*This post was corrected to indicate that Andy Hayman, not John Yates, was previously chief constable at Norfolk Police.

[Strontium]

Has he been arrested in connection with the hacking of phones owned by terrorism and murder victims?

 

 

Not to my knowledge, but then again, nothing has been proven against Coulson either (yet).

 

Ashcroft, who is the Tory party's largest donator and a tax-avoiding shit bag, made allegations that Baldwin paid somebody to look into his bank accounts ... but he seems to have never offered a shred of evidence.

 

 

Ashcroft claims he went to the police, but their investigation was somewhat superficial.

 

Given what we now know about the Met's unholy links to News International, I don't think that's beyond the realms of possibility.

 

However, interesting to note that since Ashcroft made the allegations 6 years ago, they've not been challenged by either Baldwin, or the guy he allegedly paid to obtain Ashcroft's confidential information.

 

I'm not a huge fan of Baldwin, nor many Blairite supporters; but even if it was true, and I'm not convinced it is, then investigating the relationship between the uber-rich and the potential governing party is a wholly different thing from hacking the phone messages of murdered kids and 9/11 victims in order to pay a few quid.

 

 

No, I don't like this attempt at justification. The NOTW journalists managed to justify the hacking to themselves too. It's illegal, end of.

 

Unless you're talking about some other skeletons that I don't know about, in which case, please share?

 

 

More of the same really. The Times bribed a DEA worker in the US to leak classified information, and Baldwin was linked to that too.

 

I think Ed M is playing with fire and he could easily get burnt. If any of these allegations about Baldwin turn out to be true, he's going to look like an idiot - and a hypocrite.

[Strontium]

The yeah but what about labour defence.

 

Good job you rarely use that.

 

 

Grow up. I'm not defending anybody. I'm explaining how I think Miliband is playing a risky game by taking Cameron to task over Coulson.

 

So far as I'm concerned it's a plague upon both their houses. Unlike the other two, my party has emerged relatively unscathed from the hacking scandal as, indeed, it did from the expenses scandal. One might even suggest that a pattern is emerging...

[PestiRed]

See above. Ashcroft has gone quiet on the Baldwin thing since it was pointed out that Michael Gove was Baldwin's boss at the Times, would have approved any expenses relating to private detectives & in 1999 wrote a long defence of Baldwin against Ashcroft's allegations.

You can't get Baldwin without also getting a senior Tory minister

[Strontium]

Two birds with one stone. Even better.

[lifetime fan]

Grow up. I'm not defending anybody. I'm explaining how I think Miliband is playing a risky game by taking Cameron to task over Coulson.

 

So far as I'm concerned it's a plague upon both their houses. Unlike the other two, my party has emerged relatively unscathed from the hacking scandal as, indeed, it did from the expenses scandal. One might even suggest that a pattern is emerging...

 

How many cabinet ministers were caught fiddling expenses to the point they had to reseign?

[PestiRed]

Your leader doesn't really seem to agree

 

Should have got Simon Hughes in when you had the chance

[Cardie]

 

One might even suggest that a pattern is emerging...

Yep, you steadfastly refuse to accept any wrongdoing by your party and are happy to shift blame to others.

 

Definitely a pattern.

[Strontium]

How many cabinet ministers were caught fiddling expenses to the point they had to reseign?

 

 

I understand "fiddling" to involve criminal behaviour, generally claiming more money than you're entitled to, as opposed to less. So the answer is zero.

[lifetime fan]

I understand "fiddling" to involve criminal behaviour, generally claiming more money than you're entitled to, as opposed to less. So the answer is zero.

 

You understand wrong, and you know it.

 

An answer New Labour would have been proud of.

 

You do yourself no credit on this. Your party 'rightly' gets some credit over this. I say some as Murdoch would never want any association with them as they are no use to him.

 

However, again, blindly trying to defend the indefensible and saying that nasty Labour government weren't perfect makes you look daft and further destroys your credibility.

[PestiRed]

That is a very "political" explanation of what David Laws got up to

[Anubis]

Louise Bagshawe should learn that it shows the measure of a person when they are able to admit that they said something wrong, and apologise for it. It takes some going to make Piers Morgan look like the better person, but she has managed it.

 

One thing I will say, however, is that I think a lot of people have misjudged her questioning of Brooks. At first it looked sycophantic, but it encouraged Brooks to bang on about how hacking was endemic in Fleet Street, thereby setting her up for the final question - namely that if it was so endemic, surely Brooks could not be unaware her own journalists were doing it.

 

As for Dave, trying to bury the story merely makes him look like he's on the run. Long may it continue, because I think there is much more to come out yet. As for Osborne - it speaks volumes that, even though Cameron is struggling, he's hiding behind Cameron's coat tails.

[zigackly]

Nice to see the thread descend into my party's better than yours. Lets face it, they're all on the take, or would be if they were in power. Allegedly.