Howard Webb

[SpeedyG]

Fuck the sponsors, if they want their logo displayed that badly, they can pay the players to have it tattooed on their chests. Some of the whores who play the game these days would do it too.

 

Yeah, fuck 'em and their money that bought Torres.

[Randy Marsh]

Yeah, fuck 'em and their money that bought Torres.

[dave u]

Yeah, fuck 'em and their money that bought Torres.

 

Erm, I wasn't actually being serious.

[SpeedyG]

Erm, I wasn't actually being serious.

 

Sorry then, sometimes it's hard to tell.

[Royal Family]

Between them, Webb (with 6), Bennett and Riley have refereed over a third of United's premiership games this season. There are 18 referees on the premierhsip list by the way.

[bigal]

As betfair offered 6.4 about United at half time I'd love to know if Webb has an account with them. Just so he could check his horses of course, I wouldn't imply anything else

[Catch22]

The PL is institutionally corrupt.

 

There are far more people who have a passing interest/support in the PL than there are people who are actually really into football like the vast majority of us on this forum.

 

The PL needs their custom but they are PL fans not "football fans" per se

(For an analogy look at most countries during major tournaments where success leads to mass short-term "water-cooler" type interest & women in bars ask if Joe & Ashley Cole are siblings)

 

To keep these people interested football is presented as a soap opera.

So there are pantomine villiams & heroes (the ridiculous Rafa/Fat Sam/GinSoak episode, Jose the charlatan etc) & players are glamourous "celebrities".

That is why even in the broadsheets there is almost no tactical analysis as people are not that interested in football.

 

People like to watch their team win.

That is why the bigger clubs (& we normally benefit) get all the decisions.

 

The Mancs are the most popular club in the land so they need to win in order to get highest viewing figures & interest.

 

However sometimes they need to favour another club.

Had we not won at the Toliet the PL would have been mathmatically over now & on a very sunny day how many people would have bothered to watch the Mancs vs Spurs?

That game was comparable to Pakistan/Bangladesh in the 1999 crcket world cup in the amount professional investors had on the result.

 

It is barely more valid as a legitimate sporting contest than WWF.

[JMARKH]

He deserves Anders Frisk treatment.

[Mr T]

The PL is institutionally corrupt.

 

There are far more people who have a passing interest/support in the PL than there are people who are actually really into football like the vast majority of us on this forum.

 

The PL needs their custom but they are PL fans not "football fans" per se

(For an analogy look at most countries during major tournaments where success leads to mass short-term "water-cooler" type interest & women in bars ask if Joe & Ashley Cole are siblings)

 

To keep these people interested football is presented as a soap opera.

So there are pantomine villiams & heroes (the ridiculous Rafa/Fat Sam/GinSoak episode, Jose the charlatan etc) & players are glamourous "celebrities".

That is why even in the broadsheets there is almost no tactical analysis as people are not that interested in football.

 

People like to watch their team win.

That is why the bigger clubs (& we normally benefit) get all the decisions.

 

The Mancs are the most popular club in the land so they need to win in order to get highest viewing figures & interest.

 

However sometimes they need to favour another club.

Had we not won at the Toliet the PL would have been mathmatically over now & on a very sunny day how many people would have bothered to watch the Mancs vs Spurs?

That game was comparable to Pakistan/Bangladesh in the 1999 crcket world cup in the amount professional investors had on the result.

 

It is barely more valid as a legitimate sporting contest than WWF.

 

I agree that the game is institutionally biased towards the top teams, but not because of some Machiavellian betting conspiracy. The referees simply want to get high profile games and they don't want to rock the boat when they are in the spot light the most - reffing one of the top 4. But the Mancs have more power because Ferguson has developed the excellent skill of selecting referees for particular games. Moreover, the grip he has over the media, and his pallyness with other British managers creates a terrible anti-competitive culture in this country. Most teams are beaten before they turn up.

 

The only breaker of this monopoly has been Wenger and Mourinho. I think you do Mourinho a disservice, his flamboyance and confidence created a similar culture around Chelsea that Ferguson had spent years developing around the Mancs. Intimidating opposing managers so they can't stop praising the man, intimidating and wooing the press so most teams are beaten before they kick a ball. On top of that he intimidated referees that crossed him - Frisk. It worked, but after a while his more in your face style faced diminishing returns.

[sir roger]

I agree that the game is institutionally biased towards the top teams, but not because of some Machiavellian betting conspiracy. The referees simply want to get high profile games and they don't want to rock the boat when they are in the spot light the most - reffing one of the top 4. But the Mancs have more power because Ferguson has developed the excellent skill of selecting referees for particular games. Moreover, the grip he has over the media, and his pallyness with other British managers creates a terrible anti-competitive culture in this country. Most teams are beaten before they turn up.

 

The only breaker of this monopoly has been Wenger and Mourinho. I think you do Mourinho a disservice, his flamboyance and confidence created a similar culture around Chelsea that Ferguson had spent years developing around the Mancs. Intimidating opposing managers so they can't stop praising the man, intimidating and wooing the press so most teams are beaten before they kick a ball. On top of that he intimidated referees that crossed him - Frisk. It worked, but after a while his more in your face style faced diminishing returns.

 

I remember David Elleray upsetting Ferguson over something and not getting a Manc game for over 18 months. I only remember it because Oliver Holt made a big fuss about it at the time.

[ratcatcher]

I remember David Elleray upsetting Ferguson over something and not getting a Manc game for over 18 months. I only remember it because Oliver Holt made a big fuss about it at the time.

 

Yes but didnt elleray ingraciate himself to ginsoak by giving them 2 dubious pens in the cup final against the chavs? elleray then had the cheek to say not giving them would have been cheating.

[RoboRiise]

Saw the penalty decision again on MOTD2 tonight and I'd just like to say AIDS.

[WaltonRed]

Biggest club and most supported?

 

Ahem

[The 5th Benitel]

The PL is institutionally corrupt.

 

There are far more people who have a passing interest/support in the PL than there are people who are actually really into football like the vast majority of us on this forum.

 

The PL needs their custom but they are PL fans not "football fans" per se

(For an analogy look at most countries during major tournaments where success leads to mass short-term "water-cooler" type interest & women in bars ask if Joe & Ashley Cole are siblings)

 

To keep these people interested football is presented as a soap opera.

So there are pantomine villiams & heroes (the ridiculous Rafa/Fat Sam/GinSoak episode, Jose the charlatan etc) & players are glamourous "celebrities".

That is why even in the broadsheets there is almost no tactical analysis as people are not that interested in football.

 

People like to watch their team win.

That is why the bigger clubs (& we normally benefit) get all the decisions.

 

The Mancs are the most popular club in the land so they need to win in order to get highest viewing figures & interest.

 

However sometimes they need to favour another club.

Had we not won at the Toliet the PL would have been mathmatically over now & on a very sunny day how many people would have bothered to watch the Mancs vs Spurs?

That game was comparable to Pakistan/Bangladesh in the 1999 crcket world cup in the amount professional investors had on the result.

 

It is barely more valid as a legitimate sporting contest than WWF.

 

 

I'm not having this. The biggest threat to the popularity of the Premier League is if it becomes a Formula 1 style procession with the mancs cantering to the title each year. The one way they can stop this happening is to make it genuinely competitive. My Dad was only saying the other day that when Liverpool were winning titles and cups every year fans of the other teams would always say that the refs used to give us everything. In fact, i remember as a kid in one of the panini sticker books there were cartoon type stickers representing each ground in div 1 and the one for Anfield was a load of fingers pointing at the penalty spot.

 

As for the soap opera, that's purely down to two reasons.

 

1. The tabloids still need to fill pages in the 2-3 days inbetween the actual matches. And...

 

2. The general public are fucking thick and lap that shit up. Football is just another branch of 'celebrity' so the tabloid created 'fall out' between Rafa and Taggart is basically the same as the one between Jordan and that thick cockney slag who was always getting her tits out. The fact is it sells so they're not gonna stop doing it. Lets face it, you say the people that post on here are the real footy fans but i bet every comment we made about the mancs and vice versa has been disected on here.

 

There's more than enough tactical anaylsis out there with Andy Gray and whatever other tit he gets to scribble over replays of goals. The fact is, just like the tabloid bollocks, a lot of it is just opinion. In fact, if anyone does do somekind of tactical analysis they are inevitably dismissed as talking bollocks on here. Usually cos the they disagree with the poster who is invarilably someone with absoultely no working knowledge of tactics at the top level of football bar taking Rotherham to a European Cup final on Championship Manager.

 

The top teams do tend to get the decisions and it's been that way long before Sky got involved and provided so much coverage that people who had never been a gmae in their lives became football experts. It's shit and it's working agasint us now but i just dont believe the secret space lizard free mason society are deciding the resluts of all the matches. It just doesn't stand up to any real scrutiny.

[Catch22]

I'm not having this. The biggest threat to the popularity of the Premier League is if it becomes a Formula 1 style procession with the mancs cantering to the title each year. The one way they can stop this happening is to make it genuinely competitive. My Dad was only saying the other day that when Liverpool were winning titles and cups every year fans of the other teams would always say that the refs used to give us everything. In fact, i remember as a kid in one of the panini sticker books there were cartoon type stickers representing each ground in div 1 and the one for Anfield was a load of fingers pointing at the penalty spot.

 

As for the soap opera, that's purely down to two reasons.

 

1. The tabloids still need to fill pages in the 2-3 days inbetween the actual matches. And...

 

2. The general public are fucking thick and lap that shit up. Football is just another branch of 'celebrity' so the tabloid created 'fall out' between Rafa and Taggart is basically the same as the one between Jordan and that thick cockney slag who was always getting her tits out. The fact is it sells so they're not gonna stop doing it. Lets face it, you say the people that post on here are the real footy fans but i bet every comment we made about the mancs and vice versa has been disected on here.

 

There's more than enough tactical anaylsis out there with Andy Gray and whatever other tit he gets to scribble over replays of goals. The fact is, just like the tabloid bollocks, a lot of it is just opinion. In fact, if anyone does do somekind of tactical analysis they are inevitably dismissed as talking bollocks on here. Usually cos the they disagree with the poster who is invarilably someone with absoultely no working knowledge of tactics at the top level of football bar taking Rotherham to a European Cup final on Championship Manager.

 

The top teams do tend to get the decisions and it's been that way long before Sky got involved and provided so much coverage that people who had never been a gmae in their lives became football experts. It's shit and it's working agasint us now but i just dont believe the secret space lizard free mason society are deciding the resluts of all the matches. It just doesn't stand up to any real scrutiny.

 

 

Good reply.

 

However i would say that so far lack of competitiveness is no bar to popularity.

 

& That is again down to the fact that there are far more "PL fans" than actual football fans.

 

Look at the race for the big 4.

It is now patently obvious that barring a substantial change in the financial positions (either an implosion at a top club or a Roman-style injection elsewhere) it is impossible to break into that grouping.

Yet another team will start the season well, usually thru benefiting thru a great deal of luck.

Sky hype them up (Keyes & Redknapp agreed that AV were top 4 challengers whilst Dion Dublin ludicrously said they could win the League) & people actually believe it when in reality I have more chance of shagging Paz Vega after bumping into her in my local tonight than of the top 4 cartel being broken.

The challenge then pathetically fades away but the cycle will be repeated next year & so on.

 

Articles appear in the FT or the Racing Post about the correlation between salaries & final position (the FT had it as high 0.92 recently which is even higher than i think) yet that is never covered in the broadsheets as they are completely reliant on PL PR for their celebrity/newsconference based stories.

 

I would also say that the fact that Andy Gray who is thick as shit & says exactly what his employers want him to in order to hype the games is actually doing "tactical analysis" shows indicates that their is no intelligent analysis out there.

 

The corruptness comes in many forms:

West Ham cheated: now this may have been a genuine mistake & the punishment for that is debateable but they were questioned about it & deliberately lied in order to kepp on playing an ineligible player.

Under no interpretaion should Sheffield United been relegated.

Unless of course you consider which is the bigger club, which has more fans paying more money, which is in the capital & which is in a Northern provinical town, which provided 3 players in '66, etc.

Look at the work permit rules: The Mancs have never lost one of these & the logic being "Well GinSoak says he's good enough for the Mancs: therefore he must be an addition to the PL". Now usually that is true but it would also apply to other top 4 teams yet they have lost these & also makes a mockery of a level playing field.

 

The reffing is bent because the refs are not picked randomly.

No money changes hands but refs want big games

This is exactly the same method that Italy used to cheat.

 

Most European football leagus have had corruption exposed.

It is Daily Mail jingoistic nonsense ("our coppers are the best in the world" type bollocks) to assume that the PL is not corrupt.

 

Moreover the exsposure of the corrpution leads to at least some short term clearing up (see Italy)

 

The only major league which hasn't had that process is Spain: again there, the major clubs get all the significant decisions although at least the regional politics somehat keeps it in check asthe roughly 50/50 federal/central split translates into Barca/RM.

 

The corruption is not done for gambling returns for the players (Unlike ODI cricket) as the players' rewards are high enough for it not to matter.

The professional gambling market is however paid to find things like this out & act accordingly which it did when we played the Mancs & also explians why the best coverage is in the Racing Post & Kuper in the FT.

 

Until the vast majority of supporters accept how bent the PL really is, it will continue to be so.

 

You are right that it will stop why it is costing the PL money.

The vast disbelief at the Manc's penalty is a start but it will be forgotten when they parade their trophy just as the '07 penalty they got on a weekend the Chavs didnt at this time of the year or that the '08 PFA award should have gone to Stev Bennett.

[OmarVizquel]

Nothing's fixed. He's just a bad ref who caved under the pressure of the Old Toilet. Simple.

[dirty_sanchez]

This is a stupid question, but why don't the FA make it so that the referees get to ref for each team the same amount of times each season? That way, the issue of whether a ref is impartial or not becomes less of an issue because they only get to influence that team's result on say two occasions.

[SpeedyG]

I'm not having this. ..................

 

There's more than enough tactical anaylsis out there with Andy Gray and whatever other tit he gets to scribble over replays of goals. The fact is, just like the tabloid bollocks, a lot of it is just opinion. In fact, if anyone does do somekind of tactical analysis they are inevitably dismissed as talking bollocks on here. Usually cos the they disagree with the poster who is invarilably someone with absoultely no working knowledge of tactics at the top level of football bar taking Rotherham to a European Cup final on Championship Manager.

 

hahahahahahaha tactical analysis????? That's not tactical analysis, that's just the noise he makes when his diaper is full.

[Stu Monty]

Carrick gets there first, that's why on first viewing it looks like a pen.

 

Slating a ref for something you need five replays to confirm is retarded. It was a wrong call, it happens, generally he's a decent ref.

 

Missing that two-footed, knee high lunge from Palacios was a much worse decision.

[Brownie]

Carrick gets there first, that's why on first viewing it looks like a pen.

 

Slating a ref for something you need five replays to confirm is retarded. It was a wrong call, it happens, generally he's a decent ref.

 

Missing that two-footed, knee high lunge from Palacios was a much worse decision.

 

Are you mad?! You needed five replays to notice that the goalkeeper won the ball?

 

You should be a ref then Stu; it was clear as day to anyone what had happened.

[Ponz]

Carrick gets there first, that's why on first viewing it looks like a pen.

 

Slating a ref for something you need five replays to confirm is retarded. It was a wrong call, it happens, generally he's a decent ref.

 

Utter rubbish. I immediately shouted "good save" after viewing the incident in real time. The ball clearly skewed off at a 90 degree angle towards the corner flag. Only a complete retard would infer that Carrick touched it first.

[PaulMcC]

He's on a career break from serving as a sergeant in South Yorkshire Police.

 

After the grief his force have been given about Hillsborough he's tried to get his own back on us this week with his decisions.

[Acid]

Utter rubbish. I immediately shouted "good save" after viewing the incident in real time. The ball clearly skewed off at a 90 degree angle towards the corner flag. Only a complete retard would infer that Carrick touched it first.

 

Carrick did touch it first. Then Gomez knocked it away.

[Stu Monty]

Are you mad?! You needed five replays to notice that the goalkeeper won the ball?

 

You should be a ref then Stu; it was clear as day to anyone what had happened.

 

No chance, Ian. It wasn't clear as day at all, it was a close decision and the fact that Carrick clearly gets there first makes it diffcult to be sure if the keeper got the ball.

 

Either way; I don't see anyone mentioning that Spurs should have been down to ten men after about five minutes when they're banging on about bias? If people disagree about then penalty and think it's a bad decision then fair enough, they happen. To talk about bias when he's let Palacious stay on the pitch after a kunk-fu kick is just silly.

 

rGjBzD-hKOs

 

Shocking.

[Liverpool lad]

That tackle was shocking, should have went for that. Had he caught him, it is a career ender