Kicking off in Northern Ireland again?

[rondeco]

News is reporting that soldiers opened gate to get pizza from delivery guys. A barrage of shots rang out hitting the 2 soldiers and 2 delivery guys. Then the gunmen approached the guys on the ground and shot again. One of the pizza guys is not expected to survive and is polish.

[Carradona]

Cheers for that, Dec. Don't really get to hear the "real" events over here.

[rondeco]

Two British soldiers shot dead in Antrim

Sunday, 8 March 2009 13:39

Two British soldiers were shot dead and four other people seriously injured during an attack on a British Army base in Antrim town last night.

 

Nobody has claimed responsibility for the killings, but the attack at the Massereene Barracks is being linked to dissident republicans.

 

The attack began shortly before 10pm as pizzas from a local business were being delivered.

 

AdvertisementDuring two long bursts of gunfire, the two soldiers in their 20s received fatal wounds and four people, including two civilians, were seriously injured.

 

The PSNI has confirmed that two of the men injured were the employees of a pizza delivery company.

 

The other two injured men were British soldiers at the base.

 

 

The perpetrators made off as a fleet of ambulances rushed to the scene.

 

Chief Superintendent Derek Williamson said: 'I have no doubt in my mind this was an attempt at mass murder.

 

'Last night two very young men lost their lives in a very callous and a very ruthless attack by terrorists who have no thought and had no thought last night for anyone who was in the vicinity.

 

'It's clear from what we know at this stage that the terrorists not only wanted to kill soldiers who were there last night, but also tried to kill those two pizza delivery men.

 

'The gunmen, having fired an initial volley of shots, moved forward when people were on the ground and fired additional shots at those people on the ground.'

 

 

Police are understood to be examining a car found abandoned in the nearby town of Randalstown. Officers are trying to establish whether the vehicle was used in the shooting.

 

Massereene Barracks is the Northern Ireland headquarters of the British Army's engineering division.

 

Since the Good Friday Agreement, the number of soldiers there has been reduced and the base is due to be closed next year.

 

Suspicion will fall on dissident republican groups. They carried out gun attacks on police officers in Derry and Dungannon last year and they have repeatedly said they want to kill PSNI members.

 

It is 12 years since Lance Bombadier Stephen Restorick was shot in the back while manning a British Army patrol in Beesbrook, Co Armagh.

 

Until last night, he was the last British soldier killed in Northern Ireland.

 

 

Political condemnation

 

The killings were widely condemned on both sides of the border and in Britain.

 

British Prime Minister Gordon Brown (below) insisted that the killings would not derail the peace process.

 

'I can assure you that we will bring these people to justice,' Mr Brown vowed in his first comments on the shootings.

 

'No murderer will be able to derail a peace process that has the support of the vast majority of the people of Northern Ireland and we will step up our efforts to make the peace process one that lasts and endures.'

 

 

The Taoiseach Brian Cowen said violence had been utterly rejected by the people of this island and a tiny evil group could not undermine the will of the people to live in peace together.

 

Mr Cowen had a phone conversation this morning with Mr Brown during which he conveyed his sympathy.

 

 

The Northern Secretary Shaun Woodward described the shooting as an 'act of criminal barbarism'.

 

Northern Ireland's First Minister Peter Robinson and Deputy First Minister Martin McGuinness were due to travel tomorrow to the US but have postponed their visit.

 

The DUP leader said the shootings were a 'terrible reminder of the events of the past'.

 

Sinn Féin President Gerry Adams (below) said: 'Last night's attack was an attack on the peace process. It was wrong and counter-productive.

 

'Those responsible have no support, no strategy to achieve a United Ireland. Their intention is to bring British soldiers back onto the streets. They want to destroy the progress of recent times and to plunge Ireland back into conflict.'

 

 

Speaking at the scene, the local MP William McCrea of the DUP expressed support for the Chief Constable Hugh Orde in tackling the heightened threat from dissident republicans.

 

Minister for Foreign Affairs Micheál Martin said the attack will not be allowed to undermine power-sharing and peace in Northern Ireland.

 

'I condemn absolutely this murderous attack,' he said.

 

He added: 'The targets of this attack are the Irish people, north and south.

 

'This is an attempt to undermine the remarkable progress of recent years.

 

'The perpetrators of this assault have no mandate. They will not be allowed to succeed. They must be brought to justice.'

 

President Mary McAleese has expressed her shock and dismay at last night's attack.

 

The President condemned the violence in the strongest terms and said that her thoughts and prayers were with the families of those who had been killed and with the injured.

 

Minister for Justice Dermot Ahern has confirmed that the Garda Commissioner Fachtna Murphy has been in touch with the PSNI Chief Constable.

 

They are due to meet in the coming days along with senior officials on both sides.

 

Opposition leaders have also condemned and offered their condolences to the families of those killed and injured.

 

Fine Gael's Enda Kenny and Labour's Eamon Gilmore called for the public to co-operate with the PSNI and gardaí to bring those responsible to justice.

[Carradona]

Any idea where the two soldiers killed were from?

[Gods back]

Pure evil scum.

 

I still cant believe that happened last night,but i suppose when you have convicted terrorists on the assembly,and running the country,then what did we expect.

[Section_31]

Pure evil scum.

 

I still cant believe that happened last night,but i suppose when you have convicted terrorists on the assembly,and running the country,then what did we expect.

 

You're obviously closer to all that than most on here living in NI, but I'd be personally hesitant to tar them all with the same brush.

 

The peace has been maintained for a good long while and there must have been a lot of work going on behind the scenes to keep it that way.

 

The problem with any violent organisations, is that they're going to be comprised of some who think they're genuinely fighting for something, and others who - to quote Michael Cain in The Dark Knight 'just like to see the world burn."

 

There are probably many men on both sides who'd be beating and killing people whether the troubles existed or not. I saw a programme on that Johnny Adair fellow a while back and that's how he struck me, as someone who'd have been a bouncer come gangster in another life anyway, no matter what the environment he was brought up in.

 

In fact wasn't there supposedly former provos caught up in that massive bank heist a few years back? Just goes to show that many of them are just criminally minded violent individuals who hide behind an ideal as an excuse to hurt people and get their own way.

 

That's not going to change, the only way they can be beaten is if people don't fall for their shit and they're pursued as criminals.

[JohnnyH]

Pure evil scum.

 

I still cant believe that happened last night,but i suppose when you have convicted terrorists on the assembly,and running the country,then what did we expect.

 

That's got absolutely nothing to do with it. Having horrible filth like McGuinness and Paisley in Government was the only way the whole thing could move forward.

 

This has nothign to do with who is in the assembly.

[Carradona]

Pure evil scum.

 

I still cant believe that happened last night,but i suppose when you have convicted terrorists on the assembly,and running the country,then what did we expect.

 

I can only guess who you are referring to there (but I'm pretty sure I know who you are talking about as it isn't that difficult!). I think that comment is bullshit and that trouble is always close regardless of who is on the assembly.

[Carradona]

JohnnyH beat me to it.

[reder]

The fallout from this is going to be very interesting. Blair and Ahern are no longer in position to come in and smooth things over. I personally doubt that Brown or Cowen have the skills required to pull through if it starts falling apart. Cowen has an economy is crisis to deal with firstly.

 

Worrying times ahead. Hope to God, that the bad old times dont return to NI. The region to my eyes, living down south but never visiting, was making great steps forward. Tourism was really starting to rocket and droves of people down south were venturing up north to shop as the prices are so much lower. Also, more members of the non-republican communities were coming "down south" to shop in the like of Brown Thomas etc.

[smokinsteve]

fucking scum of the earth..

 

99% of us in norn iron want these scum bags to rot in hell...

 

 

They dont deserve to live the cunts...

[Gods back]

Cunts are cunts. Always have been, always will be. Bullying cunts will always be bullying cunts, if you let them be bullying cunts.

 

Doesn't matter where you live, or when you live.

 

Some of them show their strength by breaking the back of an innocent baby.

 

Some of them rape their own daughters as a sign of their power.

 

Some of them blackmail their own staff.

 

Some of them exploit people who they know can't go to the police.

 

Some of them drive their wives to suicide.

 

Some of them get into positions of power in government.

 

Some of them get into positions of power in their local community.

 

But they all want the same. They all shout "Look at me!" They all want people to fear them. They all want nothing but the chance to get their own erection from someone else's pain.

 

Nobody who cares even a little tiny bit for others in their lives can look at today's events and justify them. They can't even look at today's events and say they understand, even if they disapprove.

 

It's the act of barbarians, the act of murderers and the act of cowards, whatever their so-called "cause".

 

The "cause" they have is bollocks, because they don't want anything other than to cause suffering and pain for others.

 

Anyone who gives even a millimetre of understanding to people capable of being a part of this, now, after so much work went into peace, when so many have let bygones be bygones, is as bad as those doing it.

 

Whether or not the so-called "cause" of these Viagra-seeking cunts contains anything you sympathise with or support, the fact is their true "cause" is really that desire to get something for themselves out of the pain of somebody else.

 

They also want to see everyone turn on each other. People who've let the past stay there, remembered and respected but not to be brought into the present, are now being tempted to retaliate, to pack people unconnected with these events into the same box.

 

But no matter what you wanted for Ireland would you ever want to see your son, daughter, brother, sister, mother, father, gran, grandad or that fit bird from down the supermarket killed in the name of that dream?

 

There has been so much shit done in the name of Ireland, for or against its unity, for or against its links to Britain, and none of it in recent times really done for anything other than making some bullying cunt feel something go round his veins making him feel special.

 

The British part of me feels ashamed when I think about the crimes against the Irish carried out in the name of the British, the small Irish part of me feels ashamed when I think about what has been done in Britain in the name of the "Irish". And all of me feels angry and disgusted that the real British and Irish people would never want any of this to happen.

 

But the bullying cunts always find a way of getting support, and dragging the good, normal people into their little fantasies.

 

The bullies had their day, it passed, and I hope that nobody gives them even a glimmer of hope they can have it back again.

 

 

 

Excellent post RR.

 

Though nobody will convince me that the provos werent involved with that last night.To an extent i agree with Johnny H,we werent going anywhere without including those murdering bastards in our government,but what sort of a government will that ever be.SF know everything thats happening,Mcguinness more or less admitted the other day that something was going to happen.

 

Johnny,please dont tar paisley with the same brush as Mcguinness.I dont have much time for Paisley,but he cant be tarred with the terrorist brush,unlike Mcguinness.

[JohnnyH]

Excellent post RR.

 

Though nobody will convince me that the provos werent involved with that last night.To an extent i agree with Johnny H,we werent going anywhere without including those murdering bastards in our government,but what sort of a government will that ever be.SF know everything thats happening,Mcguinness more or less admitted the other day that something was going to happen.

 

Johnny,please dont tar paisley with the same brush as Mcguinness.I dont have much time for Paisley,but he cant be tarred with the terrorist brush,unlike Mcguinness.

 

Paisley almost single handedly started the troubles in Northern Ireland when he insisted the RUC attack the Divis flats to remove an Irish flag. Not only is Paisley tarred with the same brush, but for me, he is the worst murdering scum ths Island has EVER seen. He is worse then McGuinness and Adams put together. He is worse then Stone and Gusty Spence. No one comes near to the terror and murder he has lead. He is pure scum.

[the walsh]

im from dublin and the way i see it there both the same as each other but two wrongs dont make a right at the end of the day enough innocent people have lost there lives we don need to go down this road again dont let these scum undo all the good work thats has been done on both sides lets hope it doesnt start again.for everybody,

[Liverpool lad]

Could anybody recommend a book on this all? One that tries to remain objective

[russ1979]

Cool, do we get an extra bonus 7 counties if the island is united? :thumbup:

 

Joking aside, I don't see why people are overly surprised that this may all start up again. The Republicans have been fighting for a re-united Ireland for 100s of years, and despite all that's been said and done, there is still British control of the North. While that continues with no sign of a step towards Britain handing back the 6 counties, then the provos are always likely to start up a campaign again. The provos will always point to fact that the gun got them the 26 counties, so they will revert to type in an effort to get the final 6.

 

Also, given that there was never any real pressure on the loyalists to hand over their guns, despite the republicans show of good faith in putting theirs beyond use, it is no surprise that they may now feel that it was all just done to silence the Nationalist side while leaving the unionists running the show up there.

 

I really fail to see how the British Government thought that the IRA would just accept the continued British occupation and, for all intents and purposes, just give up on their original goals and surrender.

 

One thing that will be different though is the support for the IRA. In the 80s there was real support North and South of the border for what the IRA were trying to achieve and British military causalities were excused as the results of war. Now however, people will not accept this and I expect to se a huge public backlash from these deaths. Hopefully enough of a backlash to maybe stop this all starting again.

 

One thing is for certain, there will always be a threat of this kicking off while the Island of Ireland remains in partition. But then of course, if the Island was re-united then the loyalists would be blowing the shite out of everything. So, in truth, it'll never really end.

 

they obviously kept a couple behind for emergencys. The pressure was never on the loyalists to hand over their weapons because they are not the problem

[russ1979]

Paisley almost single handedly started the troubles in Northern Ireland when he insisted the RUC attack the Divis flats to remove an Irish flag. Not only is Paisley tarred with the same brush, but for me, he is the worst murdering scum ths Island has EVER seen. He is worse then McGuinness and Adams put together. He is worse then Stone and Gusty Spence. No one comes near to the terror and murder he has lead. He is pure scum.

 

don,t make me laugh martin mcgunness head of the IRA and gerry adams

who no doubt only got so high up in the organization by killing and torturing people are better people than ian paisley. you are off your head . ian paisley,s a politician those 2 are terrorists

[paddyberger15]

Could anybody recommend a book on this all? One that tries to remain objective

 

The Troubles by Tim Pat Coogan is a good place to start mate. In fact anything by Tim Pat Coogan is a good read.

[JohnnyH]

they obviously kept a couple behind for emergencys. The pressure was never on the loyalists to hand over their weapons because they are not the problem

 

Jesus.

[Stu Monty]

don,t make me laugh martin mcgunness head of the IRA and gerry adams

who no doubt only got so high up in the organization by killing and torturing people are better people than ian paisley. you are off your head . ian paisley,s a politician those 2 are terrorists

 

Mate, I don't really have much knowledge on Paisley or the Sinn Fein guys but the idea that a politician isn't comparable to a terrorist is some seriously flawed logic. Just because you're not pulling the trigger yourself doesn't absolve you of any blame.

[JRD7]

Could anybody recommend a book on this all? One that tries to remain objective

 

Sam Harris - End of Faith

Christopher Hitchens - God is not great (and how religion poisons everything)

[JBarnes]

Policeman shot dead tonight. Fuck sake.

[philyhamann]

I have never ever quite got the troubles, and don't think I ever will.

[NIred1]

Policeman shot dead tonight. Fuck sake.

 

Not dead mate, thank fuck.

 

Officer injured in town shooting

 

A police officer has been taken to hospital following a shooting incident in Craigavon, County Armagh, police have said.

 

He has been taken to Craigavon Area Hospital, but there are no details about their condition.

 

It is understood that the attack happened in the Lismore area.

 

[JBarnes]

Not dead mate, thank fuck.

 

I've been told by a member of the PSNI that he is but he may well be wrong. Well I hope he is anyway.