Alcoholism.

[Mook]

I've no idea why anyone would want to go out on a night out & drink juice, unless you're driving. I've done it once & lasted about 90 minutes, it was fucking awful.

 

My drinking is bad these days, when the kids aren't around at the weekend, I'm going on 3 or 4 day benders, getting up in the morning half pished & going straight to the boozer. it's doesn't feel self distructive either as I always have such a good laugh when I'm out but it's proper binge stuff & takes me about four days to recover fully.

[YorkshireRed]

7 hours ago, Mook said:

I've no idea why anyone would want to go out on a night out & drink juice, unless you're driving. I've done it once & lasted about 90 minutes, it was fucking awful.

 

My drinking is bad these days, when the kids aren't around at the weekend, I'm going on 3 or 4 day benders, getting up in the morning half pished & going straight to the boozer. it's doesn't feel self distructive either as I always have such a good laugh when I'm out but it's proper binge stuff & takes me about four days to recover fully.

I was this for the best part of thirty years. In my case this also included maybe fifteen years on the gear. These days I only drink on a Saturday, still a good swill mind. I’m also a few days short of eleven months clear of cocaine.
 

By some miracle I have, so far, escaped the ‘worst case’ scenarios these lifestyle choices can bring (who knows what long term damage has been done). Others who have been on the same path as me down the years have not been so lucky. 
 

Of course, there’s loads of factors as to why one person ends up in one place, whilst someone else ends up in a completely different one. We are all playing the odds. Not sure there are any long term winners though, just varying degrees of loss. 
 

Go steady. 

[deiseach]

In the annals of 'things will get worse before they get better', yesterday was a day when I had another harsh insight into what that means. I had done everything right in terms of making the enviornment benign, and had the pleasure of a shared experience between me, her and our son that was on my terms rather than theirs, a close defeat in the board game Pandemic. Even within that though I should have heard alarm bells as she left the room a couple of times for 'reasons' and she expressed sympathy with our son's disappointment at what I was planning to cook - she'd never turned her nose up at a cottage pie before, what was this about? The kumbaya moment seemingly stretched through the three of us watching Ironman 3, but it was punctuated by more darts out of the room and by the time she snapped at her dad asking about the status of the watch battery he had asked for, I realised she was three sheets to the wind. And what was different for me this time was the realisation that I had to play along with her fiction that she was nothing of the sort. I don't mind admitting...actually, I mind admitting but have nowhere else to admit it, which in itself is a tale*, that I fell apart. What probably triggered my last post on this subject was the evening she stared me down when I told her she had been mainlining the G&Ts all day. She not only denied it, she wanted me ask her mother to confirm that all the cans were accounted for. Looking to make common cause with that evil junkie should have made me crack, but somehow I kept my cool and 'apologised' for being 'wrong'. She even admitted the following day that she had lied, which taken in isolation is positive because it shows she is aware of the effect the drink has on her, but the awareness only lasts so long - nuair a bhíonn an deoch istigh bíonn an chiall amuigh / when the drink is in, the sense is out - and the prospect yesterday evening of several hours of nerve-shredding tension tipped me over the edge. I cried like a baby in front of them both and the contempt that roiled on her face as the Compulsion overcame her natural empathy to tell her this was me being a hysterical fanny because it absolutely positively can't be because I was justifed in being nervous over her drinking only served to make more, well, hysterical. When it finally subsided, all I could think to do in the face of her attempting to be sweetly reasonable was say nothing. Not give her the silent treatment so much as respond to every inquiry with the observation that I wished to say nothing because nothing I said worked, No, it's worse than that. Everything I do is making things worse. Confront the Compulsion, it lashes out. Facilitate it by pretending everything is hunky-dory, it validates it and the toxicity infiltrates everything, We have an appointment in L4 this afternoon where alcohol is everywhere. Either the Compulsion wins and the cycle of dread starts again, or it loses and I endure a litany of bitterness that things can't be the way they were two decades ago. I'm sick with fear, and it's only going to get worse before it gets better.

 

*I was later given the opportunity to talk to someone about it as she phoned the Campaign Against Living Miserably (CALM) on my behalf. I'm the one with the problem, see? 

[YorkshireRed]

1 hour ago, deiseach said:

In the annals of 'things will get worse before they get better', yesterday was a day when I had another harsh insight into what that means. I had done everything right in terms of making the enviornment benign, and had the pleasure of a shared experience between me, her and our son that was on my terms rather than theirs, a close defeat in the board game Pandemic. Even within that though I should have heard alarm bells as she left the room a couple of times for 'reasons' and she expressed sympathy with our son's disappointment at what I was planning to cook - she'd never turned her nose up at a cottage pie before, what was this about? The kumbaya moment seemingly stretched through the three of us watching Ironman 3, but it was punctuated by more darts out of the room and by the time she snapped at her dad asking about the status of the watch battery he had asked for, I realised she was three sheets to the wind. And what was different for me this time was the realisation that I had to play along with her fiction that she was nothing of the sort. I don't mind admitting...actually, I mind admitting but have nowhere else to admit it, which in itself is a tale*, that I fell apart. What probably triggered my last post on this subject was the evening she stared me down when I told her she had been mainlining the G&Ts all day. She not only denied it, she wanted me ask her mother to confirm that all the cans were accounted for. Looking to make common cause with that evil junkie should have made me crack, but somehow I kept my cool and 'apologised' for being 'wrong'. She even admitted the following day that she had lied, which taken in isolation is positive because it shows she is aware of the effect the drink has on her, but the awareness only lasts so long - nuair a bhíonn an deoch istigh bíonn an chiall amuigh / when the drink is in, the sense is out - and the prospect yesterday evening of several hours of nerve-shredding tension tipped me over the edge. I cried like a baby in front of them both and the contempt that roiled on her face as the Compulsion overcame her natural empathy to tell her this was me being a hysterical fanny because it absolutely positively can't be because I was justifed in being nervous over her drinking only served to make more, well, hysterical. When it finally subsided, all I could think to do in the face of her attempting to be sweetly reasonable was say nothing. Not give her the silent treatment so much as respond to every inquiry with the observation that I wished to say nothing because nothing I said worked, No, it's worse than that. Everything I do is making things worse. Confront the Compulsion, it lashes out. Facilitate it by pretending everything is hunky-dory, it validates it and the toxicity infiltrates everything, We have an appointment in L4 this afternoon where alcohol is everywhere. Either the Compulsion wins and the cycle of dread starts again, or it loses and I endure a litany of bitterness that things can't be the way they were two decades ago. I'm sick with fear, and it's only going to get worse before it gets better.

 

*I was later given the opportunity to talk to someone about it as she phoned the Campaign Against Living Miserably (CALM) on my behalf. I'm the one with the problem, see? 

I really feel for you mate. Thanks for sharing your story. I hope it helps in a small way.

[Engineman Hicks]

2 hours ago, deiseach said:

In the annals of 'things will get worse before they get better', yesterday was a day when I had another harsh insight into what that means. I had done everything right in terms of making the enviornment benign, and had the pleasure of a shared experience between me, her and our son that was on my terms rather than theirs, a close defeat in the board game Pandemic. Even within that though I should have heard alarm bells as she left the room a couple of times for 'reasons' and she expressed sympathy with our son's disappointment at what I was planning to cook - she'd never turned her nose up at a cottage pie before, what was this about? The kumbaya moment seemingly stretched through the three of us watching Ironman 3, but it was punctuated by more darts out of the room and by the time she snapped at her dad asking about the status of the watch battery he had asked for, I realised she was three sheets to the wind. And what was different for me this time was the realisation that I had to play along with her fiction that she was nothing of the sort. I don't mind admitting...actually, I mind admitting but have nowhere else to admit it, which in itself is a tale*, that I fell apart. What probably triggered my last post on this subject was the evening she stared me down when I told her she had been mainlining the G&Ts all day. She not only denied it, she wanted me ask her mother to confirm that all the cans were accounted for. Looking to make common cause with that evil junkie should have made me crack, but somehow I kept my cool and 'apologised' for being 'wrong'. She even admitted the following day that she had lied, which taken in isolation is positive because it shows she is aware of the effect the drink has on her, but the awareness only lasts so long - nuair a bhíonn an deoch istigh bíonn an chiall amuigh / when the drink is in, the sense is out - and the prospect yesterday evening of several hours of nerve-shredding tension tipped me over the edge. I cried like a baby in front of them both and the contempt that roiled on her face as the Compulsion overcame her natural empathy to tell her this was me being a hysterical fanny because it absolutely positively can't be because I was justifed in being nervous over her drinking only served to make more, well, hysterical. When it finally subsided, all I could think to do in the face of her attempting to be sweetly reasonable was say nothing. Not give her the silent treatment so much as respond to every inquiry with the observation that I wished to say nothing because nothing I said worked, No, it's worse than that. Everything I do is making things worse. Confront the Compulsion, it lashes out. Facilitate it by pretending everything is hunky-dory, it validates it and the toxicity infiltrates everything, We have an appointment in L4 this afternoon where alcohol is everywhere. Either the Compulsion wins and the cycle of dread starts again, or it loses and I endure a litany of bitterness that things can't be the way they were two decades ago. I'm sick with fear, and it's only going to get worse before it gets better.

 

*I was later given the opportunity to talk to someone about it as she phoned the Campaign Against Living Miserably (CALM) on my behalf. I'm the one with the problem, see? 

I feel for you mate. This is a horrible situation. Is there anywhere you and your son can go to even temporarily? 
 

[deiseach]

33 minutes ago, YorkshireRed said:

I really feel for you mate. Thanks for sharing your story. I hope it helps in a small way.

 

Thanks, it does help a little. This really is the only place I can think of in which to share.  The only people who know about the alcoholism are in Ireland so I'd only be burdening them without any corresponding lightening of my load. Even them (my family and my best friend) knowing is a potential problem because she thinks they don't know and that them knowing would mean they would judge her which - yep, you've guessed it - would drink her to drink. The idea that my siblings wouldn't know is ludicrous, we're all quite close in that Bart-and-Lisa fashion, but it's part of the fiction I have to sustain. As it happens, the fiction was exposed pretty much instantly this morning. The junkie mother-in-law has taken to obsessing over cat food, deciding one of the cats will only eat one type and would starve rather than eat dry food. I had another of those meltdowns through the week as the vile ghoul harrassed me over this and it happened again this morning. I made a point of not going near my wife about it but she leaps out of bed to 'defend' me. which in turn led me to asking her not to 'defend' me, which in turn led to letting rip about the events of the night before, which in turn triggered The Compulsion as I was blamed for her drinking. Not all of it, of course, that would be silly, but an indeterminate amount that was enough to absolve her of blame. It should be noted, for the purposes of full disclosure, that I did drive her to drink frequently in recent times. She decided in 2019 that moving back to England and in with her parents would be a win-win for everyone. I did not agree on soooo many levels, not least of which was the preposterousness of someone who was conscious of her own drinking problems moving in with an absolute fiend for the booze. Pretty much every misgiving I had about what we now term 'The Move' has been proven to be well-founded, and I spent the best part of three years telling her in no uncertain terms the folly of her choice. Not to put too fine a point on it, I was an emotional abuser, shrieking at her 3-4 times a week for all manner of atrocities that could be linked to The Move. Things got so bad that we went to a couples counsellor, who was brilliant. A few sessions with her showed me that I had been a horror to live with and it was entirely my responsibility. Money quotes: "you think you can be as angry as you like because you're not going to hit her" and "you wouldn't behave like that in Tesco". Armed with those simple mantras, I have dialled back the rage to the point that whole months can go by where I don't lose my temper. Now, I don't expect anything in return for this. She is entitled not to be frightened and I will endeavour to carry on in that spirit. But - you knew there had to be a 'but' - if my anger was contributing to her drinking, why has her drinking increased as my explosions have declined? Treating my upset at being exposed to her mother's selfishness and at her being a loose cannon on deck like she was last night as somehow my fault is completely fucked up. As I said in my previous post, not only does nothing I do work: everything I do makes things worse. She's pottering around now as I type this and I know she will want to talk about it, which means I have to come up with some form of words to take the blame or we'll be right back here tonight. So, after all of that which I wasn't planning to type when I sat down, I'd say that sharing does help. What the solution is to the source of the problem, I have none beyond just keeping on trucking until she reaches rock bottom - whenever that may be.

[Remmie]

Mate, your words absolutely scream unhappy relationship. You need to make a big change, I know that's easier than said but neither of you are happy, let alone the kid. 

[deiseach]

33 minutes ago, Engineman Hicks said:

I feel for you mate. This is a horrible situation. Is there anywhere you and your son can go to even temporarily? 
 

 

No. I mean, the only people I know over here are her relations. And I don't think it would solve anything. The ridiculous thing is that she needs my help to get over this. One of the reasons I have expressed confidence that she will overcome it in the end is the time she phoned LCAS to ask for help way back in 2020. I had given up drinking, almost by accident. We had been apart for four months during lockdown as I stayed in Ireland to sell the house and when we got back together we had a few very pleasant sessions. It was all good, but after one we were both knackered from the hangover and resolved to take two weeks off the ale together. My two weeks became two months etc. Hers didn't even last two nights. She felt me giving it up completely didn't help her, that it would be better if we dialed it back in tandem. She said as much to the LCAS woman who told her expicitly that this was nonsense. Having someone teetotal in the house is much better than having a moderate drinker about. And the thing is - she told me about this conversation. It would have been very easy to forget to mention it or have it never come up, thus allowing her to cling to the idea that not 'doing it together' was a problem. It took courage to admit to that, and I was (and still am) genuinely grateful. So moving out won't help. That would mean leaving her alone with the booze fiend, which won't end well.

[YorkshireRed]

11 minutes ago, deiseach said:

 

Thanks, it does help a little. This really is the only place I can think of in which to share.  The only people who know about the alcoholism are in Ireland so I'd only be burdening them without any corresponding lightening of my load. Even them (my family and my best friend) knowing is a potential problem because she thinks they don't know and that them knowing would mean they would judge her which - yep, you've guessed it - would drink her to drink. The idea that my siblings wouldn't know is ludicrous, we're all quite close in that Bart-and-Lisa fashion, but it's part of the fiction I have to sustain. As it happens, the fiction was exposed pretty much instantly this morning. The junkie mother-in-law has taken to obsessing over cat food, deciding one of the cats will only eat one type and would starve rather than eat dry food. I had another of those meltdowns through the week as the vile ghoul harrassed me over this and it happened again this morning. I made a point of not going near my wife about it but she leaps out of bed to 'defend' me. which in turn led me to asking her not to 'defend' me, which in turn led to letting rip about the events of the night before, which in turn triggered The Compulsion as I was blamed for her drinking. Not all of it, of course, that would be silly, but an indeterminate amount that was enough to absolve her of blame. It should be noted, for the purposes of full disclosure, that I did drive her to drink frequently in recent times. She decided in 2019 that moving back to England and in with her parents would be a win-win for everyone. I did not agree on soooo many levels, not least of which was the preposterousness of someone who was conscious of her own drinking problems moving in with an absolute fiend for the booze. Pretty much every misgiving I had about what we now term 'The Move' has been proven to be well-founded, and I spent the best part of three years telling her in no uncertain terms the folly of her choice. Not to put too fine a point on it, I was an emotional abuser, shrieking at her 3-4 times a week for all manner of atrocities that could be linked to The Move. Things got so bad that we went to a couples counsellor, who was brilliant. A few sessions with her showed me that I had been a horror to live with and it was entirely my responsibility. Money quotes: "you think you can be as angry as you like because you're not going to hit her" and "you wouldn't behave like that in Tesco". Armed with those simple mantras, I have dialled back the rage to the point that whole months can go by where I don't lose my temper. Now, I don't expect anything in return for this. She is entitled not to be frightened and I will endeavour to carry on in that spirit. But - you knew there had to be a 'but' - if my anger was contributing to her drinking, why has her drinking increased as my explosions have declined? Treating my upset at being exposed to her mother's selfishness and at her being a loose cannon on deck like she was last night as somehow my fault is completely fucked up. As I said in my previous post, not only does nothing I do work: everything I do makes things worse. She's pottering around now as I type this and I know she will want to talk about it, which means I have to come up with some form of words to take the blame or we'll be right back here tonight. So, after all of that which I wasn't planning to type when I sat down, I'd say that sharing does help. What the solution is to the source of the problem, I have none beyond just keeping on trucking until she reaches rock bottom - whenever that may be.

If it helps, keep on sharing. As much, or as little, as you’d like.

 

It good to read that you’ve had some help as well. The bit about you screaming at the wife really hit home. I’ve been there and live with the shame daily. Like you, there are reasons but they are not excuses. Working on yourself will help you to be better equipped to help your wife, so don’t be afraid to take all the help you can.

 

There may come a point when you will need to step away. I know you aren’t there yet but it might not hurt to have an exit strategy that isn’t a reaction to whatever ends up causing the breaking point. 
 

I remember how bad it was to watch my brother destroy himself. It must be far worse for you to have to live with this, essentially 24/7. 
 

If there’s anything you think any of us could do to help, just ask. We, in our own small way, are with you. 
 

 

[deiseach]

5 minutes ago, Remmie said:

Mate, your words absolutely scream unhappy relationship. You need to make a big change, I know that's easier than said but neither of you are happy, let alone the kid. 

 

I appreciate your concern, and I understand where you are coming from. And yes, there is misery in our situation. But I firmly believe there is nothing wrong with us that her giving up the drink wouldn't solve. I mentioned the emotional abuse to demonstrate that people can change for the better, even in the screwed-up environment that we are undoubtedly in. I love her, I really do. Our son was away with the in-laws last weekend and we went into Bold Street and had an alcohol-free bite to eat and it was just an absolute delight. She has a habit of gushing about eating out, something I once found irritating as it was true of a five-star restauarant or Spoonies, but someone on here noting that their partner always complained about what they didn't get made me realise what an endearing trait it was. I said in my post last week that she views perfect as the enemy of the good, that she can't give up drink until she is content in everything else in her life. I need to get her to the point that she realises that she won't be content until she gives up the drink. I'm not giving up on those Bold Street moments. Life would be horribly grey without them.

[deiseach]

31 minutes ago, YorkshireRed said:

If it helps, keep on sharing. As much, or as little, as you’d like.

 

It good to read that you’ve had some help as well. The bit about you screaming at the wife really hit home. I’ve been there and live with the shame daily. Like you, there are reasons but they are not excuses. Working on yourself will help you to be better equipped to help your wife, so don’t be afraid to take all the help you can.

 

There may come a point when you will need to step away. I know you aren’t there yet but it might not hurt to have an exit strategy that isn’t a reaction to whatever ends up causing the breaking point. 
 

I remember how bad it was to watch my brother destroy himself. It must be far worse for you to have to live with this, essentially 24/7. 
 

If there’s anything you think any of us could do to help, just ask. We, in our own small way, are with you. 
 

 

 

I can't emphasise enough how brilliant the counsellor was. I was sceptical about the utility of it, seeing it as an extravagant way of venting, but was willing to give it a shot. We had a joint session where she asked us seemingly bland questions that barely touched on the issue while making notes that looked more like doodling to me. In the next joint session, which was over Zoom, she revealed her doodlings which was a bubble chart showing the makeup of our lives. The bit that hit me like a hammer was one with the words: TELL [WIFE]. I would have a bad moment with The Junkie and would immediately sally forth to 'tell [wife]', i.e.rant and rave about it. Everything else flowed from that.  If I could learn to not do it, how much easier would life be? But how could I do this? Weren't the feelings of rage inevitable? I was convinced I'd have to go on medication, but as she pointed out to me in the next two solo sessions:

• you think that because you are not going to hit her that you can be as angry as you like. She can't know for sure that you are not going to hit her, and even if she did the sight of a man seven inches taller than her losing his shit is terrifying
• you wouldn't behave like that in Tesco. Why can't you behave like that at home? You don't need pharmaceuticals
• she has said sorry for The Move (which she has). What more do you want from her? (Answer that was left unsaid: I want her to feel my pain)

It's not too strong that say that she changed me, made me a better man. My family can see it, and when I explained all of this to my dad, the most stoic of Stoics, he was very impressed: "jeez, I thought these people were useless!", he grinned at me. And here's the rub this morning: if I can change, why can't she? That's a pat way of looking at alcoholism. I sincerely accept that there are all manner of reasons she can't quit in the same way I quit it and the rage monster. But just because the answers are more complex doesn't meant the question isn't useful. Until she accepts that the change has to come from her, things are going to get worse.

[Barrington Womble]

38 minutes ago, deiseach said:

 

I can't emphasise enough how brilliant the counsellor was. I was sceptical about the utility of it, seeing it as an extravagant way of venting, but was willing to give it a shot. We had a joint session where she asked us seemingly bland questions that barely touched on the issue while making notes that looked more like doodling to me. In the next joint session, which was over Zoom, she revealed her doodlings which was a bubble chart showing the makeup of our lives. The bit that hit me like a hammer was one with the words: TELL [WIFE]. I would have a bad moment with The Junkie and would immediately sally forth to 'tell [wife]', i.e.rant and rave about it. Everything else flowed from that.  If I could learn to not do it, how much easier would life be? But how could I do this? Weren't the feelings of rage inevitable? I was convinced I'd have to go on medication, but as she pointed out to me in the next two solo sessions:

• you think that because you are not going to hit her that you can be as angry as you like. She can't know for sure that you are not going to hit her, and even if she did the sight of a man seven inches taller than her losing his shit is terrifying
• you wouldn't behave like that in Tesco. Why can't you behave like that at home? You don't need pharmaceuticals
• she has said sorry for The Move (which she has). What more do you want from her? (Answer that was left unsaid: I want her to feel my pain)

It's not too strong that say that she changed me, made me a better man. My family can see it, and when I explained all of this to my dad, the most stoic of Stoics, he was very impressed: "jeez, I thought these people were useless!", he grinned at me. And here's the rub this morning: if I can change, why can't she? That's a pat way of looking at alcoholism. I sincerely accept that there are all manner of reasons she can't quit in the same way I quit it and the rage monster. But just because the answers are more complex doesn't meant the question isn't useful. Until she accepts that the change has to come from her, things are going to get worse.

 

How did the councilor say you should deal with the anger? I understand the point of view they think you shouldn't express is in front of your wife as it could be frightening to her, but if something makes you angry, you need to find a way to get that out surely? Just bottling it up can't be a good thing either and likely will increase resentment and tension from your side?

[deiseach]

5 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

 

How did the councilor say you should deal with the anger? I understand the point of view they think you shouldn't express is in front of your wife as it could be frightening to her, but if something makes you angry, you need to find a way to get that out surely? Just bottling it up can't be a good thing either and likely will increase resentment and tension from your side?

 

She did advocate for getting out of the house and howling at the moon, but I haven't even found that necessary. Just telling myself that 'tell [wife]' is not going to fix anything is enough to dissipate the rage. It doesn't always work, so I still lose my temper on occasion, but I'm not carrying around Vesuvius in my psyche that needs to be 'let out'. The meltdowns I've referred to are not anger. They're sadness. What that tells me about my mental health...I don't know. We'll find out in due course.

[Barrington Womble]

8 minutes ago, deiseach said:

 

She did advocate for getting out of the house and howling at the moon, but I haven't even found that necessary. Just telling myself that 'tell [wife]' is not going to fix anything is enough to dissipate the rage. It doesn't always work, so I still lose my temper on occasion, but I'm not carrying around Vesuvius in my psyche that needs to be 'let out'. The meltdowns I've referred to are not anger. They're sadness. What that tells me about my mental health...I don't know. We'll find out in due course.

 

Good luck for you being able to take care of your own mental health through this. It's good you have found a way to deal with it and can recognise it before you blow. I'm not sure I have that level of self awareness when I lose my shit. 

[No2]

Heartbreaking reading that. You have a great way with words and real clear picture of the situation. From what I'm reading the solution is obvious, get the people you love away from the junkie. No problems can be solved in that environment. Maybe suggest you and the wife work together to get the mother clean. The environment the child is growing up in sounds horrendous.

[Harry's Lad]

33 minutes ago, deiseach said:

 

She did advocate for getting out of the house and howling at the moon, but I haven't even found that necessary. Just telling myself that 'tell [wife]' is not going to fix anything is enough to dissipate the rage. It doesn't always work, so I still lose my temper on occasion, but I'm not carrying around Vesuvius in my psyche that needs to be 'let out'. The meltdowns I've referred to are not anger. They're sadness. What that tells me about my mental health...I don't know. We'll find out in due course.

Hat's off to you mate.

I hope you both find a way out of this as quickly and as painlessly as possible.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Alcohol is poison and it made me just that for many years and my current problem was almost totally due to it. Heavily drinking a few days a week was enough, you don’t need it everyday. My admiration and love to all of you.

[VERBAL DIARRHEA]

Said this before Deisach but your avatar looks like a cousin of mine.

[A Red]

1 hour ago, deiseach said:

 

She did advocate for getting out of the house and howling at the moon, but I haven't even found that necessary. Just telling myself that 'tell [wife]' is not going to fix anything is enough to dissipate the rage. It doesn't always work, so I still lose my temper on occasion, but I'm not carrying around Vesuvius in my psyche that needs to be 'let out'. The meltdowns I've referred to are not anger. They're sadness. What that tells me about my mental health...I don't know. We'll find out in due course.

The problem with living with an addict, let alone 2, is that you're in a knife fight armed only with common sense, love and caring. You won't win.

 

The true victim is your child, if only there was a way you could get her/him out of that situation.

 

I think you should try to weigh up the chances of her really wanting and trying to get better, which has to include getting away from her mother. If deep down you don't think she can do it you need to start planning your escape.

[redinblack]

7 hours ago, deiseach said:

 

She did advocate for getting out of the house and howling at the moon, but I haven't even found that necessary. Just telling myself that 'tell [wife]' is not going to fix anything is enough to dissipate the rage. It doesn't always work, so I still lose my temper on occasion, but I'm not carrying around Vesuvius in my psyche that needs to be 'let out'. The meltdowns I've referred to are not anger. They're sadness. What that tells me about my mental health...I don't know. We'll find out in due course.

I'm undecided about the approach of your counsellor ( and it's fuck all to do with me anyway), but the feelings I had with the drinkers I dealt with, and the addict I still deal with, were of utter helplessness. Nothing I did worked, absolutely nothing. It was all within them, and as you say my reactions either facilitated their drinking, or drove them to it. I could not win, ever. I either okayed their behaviour, or i made them do it. Which isn't true at all. Regardless of what I did, they were drinking, they just made the narrative fit opening the pop. And my rage was when I was at the end of my rope.

 

I cant tell you what to do because I failed in dealing with this, but I send you good wishes.

 

 

[redinblack]

9 hours ago, deiseach said:

 

She felt me giving it up completely didn't help her, that it would be better if we dialed it back in tandem. She said as much to the LCAS woman who told her expicitly that this was nonsense. 

Right on. A drinker can't have a problem if you are drinking with them. It's a cop out and it's good she was told that

[deiseach]

Thank you to everyone for you expressions of support and advice, which is all good. I might take a few days to let them marinate and tailor some responses, I feel they all deserve serious laptop based replies rather than flippant phone ones. And speaking of flippant, I feel I was that in my reply yesterday to @Barrington Womble:

 

19 hours ago, Barrington Womble said:

How did the councilor say you should deal with the anger? I understand the point of view they think you shouldn't express is in front of your wife as it could be frightening to her, but if something makes you angry, you need to find a way to get that out surely? Just bottling it up can't be a good thing either and likely will increase resentment and tension from your side?

 

19 hours ago, deiseach said:

She did advocate for getting out of the house and howling at the moon, but I haven't even found that necessary. Just telling myself that 'tell [wife]' is not going to fix anything is enough to dissipate the rage. It doesn't always work, so I still lose my temper on occasion, but I'm not carrying around Vesuvius in my psyche that needs to be 'let out'. The meltdowns I've referred to are not anger. They're sadness. What that tells me about my mental health...I don't know. We'll find out in due course.

 

Dwelling on it during a break in proceedings in L4 yesterday and talking to my wife about it, I think I should be more worried about my state of mind. Three times in the last week, and twice in one 12-hour period, I have been curled up in the foetal position after a bout of 'howling at the moon'. It's good to talk, and it's good to see other people's take on the situation, many of whom seem to have gone through something similar and lived to tell the tale. It doesn't change the fact that I can't take any more positive steps to change the dynamic for her. The sea was mostly calm last night, which was good (I'm conscious I'm overusing that word) but the storm clouds were ever-present after a day where £30 was spent in L4 but the person sitting beside her who asked for a Fanta was to blame. Most expensive Fanta ever! I'm thinking of talking to work about my mental health. They're aware of the precarious nature of my domestic situation with The Junkie and her father, who requires a lot of care after his stroke. They don't know about the alcoholism though. Perhaps the union can sort me out with respect to counselling. I don't know the answer, and I'm nervous about going public, even in a formal workplace setting, with her alcoholism and how the Compulsion will react. I need to do something different though. You know what they say about doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result...

[Barrington Womble]

3 hours ago, deiseach said:

Thank you to everyone for you expressions of support and advice, which is all good. I might take a few days to let them marinate and tailor some responses, I feel they all deserve serious laptop based replies rather than flippant phone ones. And speaking of flippant, I feel I was that in my reply yesterday to @Barrington Womble:

 

 

 

Dwelling on it during a break in proceedings in L4 yesterday and talking to my wife about it, I think I should be more worried about my state of mind. Three times in the last week, and twice in one 12-hour period, I have been curled up in the foetal position after a bout of 'howling at the moon'. It's good to talk, and it's good to see other people's take on the situation, many of whom seem to have gone through something similar and lived to tell the tale. It doesn't change the fact that I can't take any more positive steps to change the dynamic for her. The sea was mostly calm last night, which was good (I'm conscious I'm overusing that word) but the storm clouds were ever-present after a day where £30 was spent in L4 but the person sitting beside her who asked for a Fanta was to blame. Most expensive Fanta ever! I'm thinking of talking to work about my mental health. They're aware of the precarious nature of my domestic situation with The Junkie and her father, who requires a lot of care after his stroke. They don't know about the alcoholism though. Perhaps the union can sort me out with respect to counselling. I don't know the answer, and I'm nervous about going public, even in a formal workplace setting, with her alcoholism and how the Compulsion will react. I need to do something different though. You know what they say about doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result...

 

it sounds all consuming. I am glad you are looking to find a councillor. it's not like you have a situation which can just resolve itself - say like a couple going for couples therapy, you try a bunch of sessions and if it doesn't work, you just split up. this is something that clearly you want to get to a conclusion, but you're only part of that story. so somewhere in there you need to find a way not just to help your own state of mind in the moment, but it is something that is sustainable. 

 

i know from when i was ill, talking is a great help. i didn't expect it to be, i was offered therapy and counselling, and I rejected it, as I didn't think I needed it. then surprisingly, i found talking with other patients, i said stuff with them that i couldn't with my family and i couldn't believe what a relief it was to share and know people were experiencing the same type of things. i used to look at those group therapy things you see on TV for AA or whatever and think "what a load of shit, how does that help". but it really does (although i was sat on a ward rather than in a circle in a community centre like every tv show!). 

 

and as for the speaking flippantly, i think you need to do what works for you in that moment. it seems to me your brain lets you deal with stuff as and when you are ready to think about stuff, because you are consumed by this problem you face. so the first thing you say can be a bit of a placeholder, then stuff runs around in your head and you can question things you maybe didn't think you needed to think about. for me it seems quite a healthy approach to things.