Our midfield

[HBenn]

You cannot help but wonder whether the injuries have got to do with the Schlumberger promotion and Moxon going. It was a bit weird that he went by mutual consent and there were no quotes from Klopp, especially after he probably saved Elliott's career. Albeit I am not sure how all the roles interact and whether Moxon would be that involved in the injury prevention aspects.

Maybe, they have just done things differently this season or the fact that usually, after they kill them in Austria for a week/two they can gradually build their level up instead of this time round where they have had to build it up more quickly.

Either way, do wonder if the club are starting to have worries about virtually all their midfielders and whether that will drive them to push harder for one of their targets.

If they are only planning to bring in say Bellingham and he clearly is not available I imagine we will grin and bear it but if they are planning to bring in another as well or they were planning on waiting for the price of a target to lower next summer then maybe they will pay a bit more to get him now.

 

Jurgen made the point in the sky interview that contract length impacts price. Maybe before the injury worries they were happy to wait a season and get player x for a certain price. Maybe now they may think they maybe not be able to rely on any of the players and so they will pay the extra to get in player x now. For example, if the player they like is Barella, his cost may have been seen as prohibitive as he has ages left on his contract, maybe they will push harder now though.

 

All that said, my gut says that while there has been a slight softening from Jürgen in tone we will just grin and bear it until next summer now.

[VladimirIlyich]

7 hours ago, HBenn said:

You cannot help but wonder whether the injuries have got to do with the Schlumberger promotion and Moxon going. It was a bit weird that he went by mutual consent and there were no quotes from Klopp, especially after he probably saved Elliott's career. Albeit I am not sure how all the roles interact and whether Moxon would be that involved in the injury prevention aspects.

Maybe, they have just done things differently this season or the fact that usually, after they kill them in Austria for a week/two they can gradually build their level up instead of this time round where they have had to build it up more quickly.

Either way, do wonder if the club are starting to have worries about virtually all their midfielders and whether that will drive them to push harder for one of their targets.

If they are only planning to bring in say Bellingham and he clearly is not available I imagine we will grin and bear it but if they are planning to bring in another as well or they were planning on waiting for the price of a target to lower next summer then maybe they will pay a bit more to get him now.

 

Jurgen made the point in the sky interview that contract length impacts price. Maybe before the injury worries they were happy to wait a season and get player x for a certain price. Maybe now they may think they maybe not be able to rely on any of the players and so they will pay the extra to get in player x now. For example, if the player they like is Barella, his cost may have been seen as prohibitive as he has ages left on his contract, maybe they will push harder now though.

 

All that said, my gut says that while there has been a slight softening from Jürgen in tone we will just grin and bear it until next summer now.

Every window or season that City/PSG/Chelses/Newcastle(insert next club financed by criminal and murdering regimes) 'cheat' their way through the transfer market Liverpool fall further behind in the task of trying to run a business close to some kind of moral or ethical code (don't laugh...much) and the efforts needed to compete for trophies are even more monumental. Personally I have no answer to this other than either 'The PL and FIFA do their job safeguarding the game' not going to happen when individual clubs are richer more powerful than their ruling bodies or LFC sell to an owner or owners who are morally reprehensible. The latter is more likely than the former and I wont even bother then and even if the former occurred it would be far too late to make anything from the wreckage.

[Daisy]

You can put your mortgage on that nunes being the fucking nuts. 

[Barrington Womble]

8 hours ago, Jose Jones said:

Yeah lots of sniffing our own farts after keeping a few of the sick notes available for most of last season.  Might have gone a bit too early in praising the new fitness / medical team.

Well with the doctor going recently, it makes you wonder what the fuck is going on. I assumed that was a reaction to how kelleher and Jota were dealt with after their injuries with their international team, but maybe it's deeper than all that. Is he supposed to help all the players through the summer and they've just not come back recovered or in the right shape? There's more than one person in that medical setup, so it might be jumping to conclusions pinning it on him, but the coincidence is clearly there and we need to find a way through it fast. We have a lot of players with questionable injury records and they're all looking wobbly at this point. 

[Jose Jones]

4 minutes ago, Barrington Womble said:

Well with the doctor going recently, it makes you wonder what the fuck is going on. I assumed that was a reaction to how kelleher and Jota were dealt with after their injuries with their international team, but maybe it's deeper than all that. Is he supposed to help all the players through the summer and they've just not come back recovered or in the right shape? There's more than one person in that medical setup, so it might be jumping to conclusions pinning it on him, but the coincidence is clearly there and we need to find a way through it fast. We have a lot of players with questionable injury records and they're all looking wobbly at this point. 

Didn’t realise the doctor had left recently. Not normally a good sign when the manager falls out with the medical staff.

[Barrington Womble]

1 minute ago, Jose Jones said:

Didn’t realise the doctor had left recently. Not normally a good sign when the manager falls out with the medical staff.

As mentioned in a previous post, klopp didn't give him a farewell either. 

 

https://www-liverpoolfc-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.liverpoolfc.com/news/dr-jim-moxon-leave-role-liverpool-fc?amp=1&amp_gsa=1&amp_js_v=a9&usqp=mq331AQKKAFQArABIIACAw%3D%3D#amp_tf=From %1%24s&aoh=16606403563584&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.liverpoolfc.com%2Fnews%2Fdr-jim-moxon-leave-role-liverpool-fc

[No2]

If 9 is the optimal midfield quantity then 3 youngsters, 5 peak and 1 Milner is the perfect set up. Numbers aren't the problem, it's the players.

 

It's probably decided already that we proceed with what we have but for next year I'd look to replace Thiago, Ox and Keita. Thiago has too important a role to be absent as often as he is, no point pretending we have him when more often than not we don't.

 

Fab

Hendo 

Elliott 

Carvalho 

Jones 

Milner 

 

That's the starting point for next season, add 2 to that plus a player that can play midfield or upfront. We may not even need 3 replacements, 2 probably does it if they're build of wet of toilet paper.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Carra_is_legend]

13 minutes ago, No2 said:

 

Fab

Hendo 

Elliott 

Carvalho 

Jones 

Milner 

 

That's the starting point for next season, add 2 to that plus a player that can play midfield or upfront. We may not even need 3 replacements, 2 probably does it if they're build of wet of toilet paper.

If Jones cannot cut it this season then he needs to go next summer. Hopefully 2 out of Jones, Elliott and Carvalho will turn out to be good/consistent which will be a huge success.

 

Need to cut ties with Milner too. 

[m0e]

12 hours ago, HBenn said:

You cannot help but wonder whether the injuries have got to do with the Schlumberger promotion and Moxon going. It was a bit weird that he went by mutual consent and there were no quotes from Klopp, especially after he probably saved Elliott's career. Albeit I am not sure how all the roles interact and whether Moxon would be that involved in the injury prevention aspects.

Maybe, they have just done things differently this season or the fact that usually, after they kill them in Austria for a week/two they can gradually build their level up instead of this time round where they have had to build it up more quickly.

Either way, do wonder if the club are starting to have worries about virtually all their midfielders and whether that will drive them to push harder for one of their targets.

If they are only planning to bring in say Bellingham and he clearly is not available I imagine we will grin and bear it but if they are planning to bring in another as well or they were planning on waiting for the price of a target to lower next summer then maybe they will pay a bit more to get him now.

 

Jurgen made the point in the sky interview that contract length impacts price. Maybe before the injury worries they were happy to wait a season and get player x for a certain price. Maybe now they may think they maybe not be able to rely on any of the players and so they will pay the extra to get in player x now. For example, if the player they like is Barella, his cost may have been seen as prohibitive as he has ages left on his contract, maybe they will push harder now though.

 

All that said, my gut says that while there has been a slight softening from Jürgen in tone we will just grin and bear it until next summer now.

Do you work for thr Athletic?

[Jairzinho]

Thiago is our best midfielder, getting rid of him would be ridiculous from the position we're in.

 

Keita and Chamberlain are shit and always injured. They need to be sold/released/hidden in a cupboard.

 

We basically have Thiago and Fabinho who are really good and should start the vast majority of games they are fit for (even if in the case of the former that isn't as many games as we'd like). Henderson is a very good squad player, but shouldn't be starting regularly. Milner isn't really good enough to be starting any games in the league or European cup.

 

We probably can't accomodate all of Jones, Carvalho, and Elliott at the same time. I have a feeling Jones will probably end up being the odd one out and get moved on.

 

As boring as it is, we still need the Wijnaldum type midfielder. Energetic, tactically astute, rarely injured, gives a 7/7.5 out of 10 performance every week. 

[HBenn]

1 hour ago, m0e said:

Do you work for thr Athletic?

No, Twitter.

[3 Stacks]

1 hour ago, Jairzinho said:

Thiago is our best midfielder, getting rid of him would be ridiculous from the position we're in.

 

Keita and Chamberlain are shit and always injured. They need to be sold/released/hidden in a cupboard.

 

We basically have Thiago and Fabinho who are really good and should start the vast majority of games they are fit for (even if in the case of the former that isn't as many games as we'd like). Henderson is a very good squad player, but shouldn't be starting regularly. Milner isn't really good enough to be starting any games in the league or European cup.

 

We probably can't accomodate all of Jones, Carvalho, and Elliott at the same time. I have a feeling Jones will probably end up being the odd one out and get moved on.

 

As boring as it is, we still need the Wijnaldum type midfielder. Energetic, tactically astute, rarely injured, gives a 7/7.5 out of 10 performance every week. 

Thiago and Fabinho playing together basically ensures wins. When either aren't there, it's bad. Having about 2 kids after that is also fine. Henderson and Milner do a job, but I'm not sure why we need both. One of them to play an auxiliary or versatile role is enough. The rest are not good enough.

 

[Guest]

I haven't watched a single minute of the new Premier League season so far and I haven't missed it at all. Can't wait until the new season starts.

[Jairzinho]

Just now, 3 Stacks said:

Thiago and Fabinho playing together basically ensures wins. When either aren't there, it's bad. Having about 2 kids after that is also fine. Henderson and Milner do a job, but I'm not sure why we need both. One of them to play an auxiliary or versatile role is enough. The rest are not good enough. 

Yeah, Jones is an odd one. There is some talent there but he's clearly never going to be someone Klopp trusts to play central midfield. If that's the case he, along with Keita, Chamberlain, and Milner, can go. I'd actually feel more comfortable about our midfield options if we signed one top quality central midfielder (doesn't need to be Bellingham) and binned the four mentioned previously. 

[No2]

1 hour ago, Jairzinho said:

Thiago is our best midfielder, getting rid of him would be ridiculous from the position we're in.

 

Keita and Chamberlain are shit and always injured. They need to be sold/released/hidden in a cupboard.

 

We basically have Thiago and Fabinho who are really good and should start the vast majority of games they are fit for (even if in the case of the former that isn't as many games as we'd like). Henderson is a very good squad player, but shouldn't be starting regularly. Milner isn't really good enough to be starting any games in the league or European cup.

 

We probably can't accomodate all of Jones, Carvalho, and Elliott at the same time. I have a feeling Jones will probably end up being the odd one out and get moved on.

 

As boring as it is, we still need the Wijnaldum type midfielder. Energetic, tactically astute, rarely injured, gives a 7/7.5 out of 10 performance every week. 

Squads can accommodate players that are unreliable, Matip being available for 15 games a season is fine, same with Origi or even Henderson as he starts to creak but when one of the most important players in the starting XI can't be relied upon then he needs to be replaced. If the budget is there to use him like a Daniel Sturridge then fine, keep him but most likely it's not. Go and get someone who is doesn't have a history of breaking.

 

Tielemans appears pretty durable and is free next year, a fit Tielemans is better than a broken Thiago, add Bellingham to the mix to replace Ox and overall we're stronger. No issue with keeping or replacing Keita, if we can accept he's our 6th choice and no longer our great new hope then he's perfect, probably the best 6th choice midfielder in the world.

[Jairzinho]

5 minutes ago, No2 said:

 

Tielemans appears pretty durable and is free next year, a fit Tielemans is better than a broken Thiago, add Bellingham to the mix to replace Ox and overall we're stronger. No issue with keeping or replacing Keita, if we can accept he's our 6th choice and no longer our great new hope then he's perfect, probably the best 6th choice midfielder in the world.

Having Keita as 6th choice is both an unbelievably shit use of resources and blocks the path of young players who may eventually be good enough. He needed binning two years ago.

 

And I just can't even begin to comprehend looking at our current midfield options and wanting to get rid of Thiago. He could play 10 games a season and it would be worth it when you look at the rest of our midfielders.

 

I also think the idea we're going to replace Chamberlain with Bellingham to be...well...optimistic.

[Carvalho Diablo]

3 out and 3 in for me. If they can't stay fit then get rid. If they can't run a 100 meters quicker than a nana pushing a tartan shopping trolley then get rid.

 

Milner - gone

Keita - gone

Jonesy - gone

Thiago - love him but gone

Fabinho - you're on notice lad

Hendo - keep as a squad player

Ox - who?

 

Slim pickings.

[3 Stacks]

The bottom line is that the midfield is redundant. You can't have both Thiago and Keita as they're both too injury prone. So obviously, you keep Thiago, who is far superior. Ox is past his sell by date and Henderson and Milner, though they play different positions, they're too similar in ability level. We just have to cut the cord on some of these and make room.

 

 

[Carra_is_legend]

 

4 minutes ago, Carvalho Diablo said:

3 out and 3 in for me. If they can't stay fit then get rid. If they can't run a 100 meters quicker than a nana pushing a tartan shopping trolley then get rid.

 

Milner - gone

Keita - gone

Jonesy - gone

Thiago - love him but gone

Fabinho - you're on notice lad

Hendo - keep as a squad player

Ox - who?

 

Slim pickings.

It would be crazy to let Thiago go, he is quality. Injury prone but quality. 

 

We should sign quality replacements for Milner, Keita, Jones & Ox (even if 4 out, 2 in) which will help us manage Thiago. 

[Carvalho Diablo]

4 minutes ago, Carra_is_legend said:

 

It would be crazy to let Thiago go, he is quality. Injury prone but quality. 

 

We should sign quality replacements for Milner, Keita, Jones & Ox (even if 4 out, 2 in) which will help us manage Thiago. 

Thiago is quality, top quality, and he's out best midfielder, but if he can't stay fit then I'd sell him and get what we can for him.

[stringvest]

Madness to suggest offloading Thiago.  Him and Fabinho in the team guarantee wins.  Any of the others can go - personally I'd keep Keita and Milner to get us through to the next transfer window, offer Henderson an ambassador role, and ditch Jones and O-C.

[Carra_is_legend]

20 minutes ago, Carvalho Diablo said:

Thiago is quality, top quality, and he's out best midfielder, but if he can't stay fit then I'd sell him and get what we can for him.

Nah. Buy a couple of quality midfielders and manage Thiago's time. He played 25 PL games last season....with better management due to availability of quality players we should get more out of Thiago in next 2 years.

[Section_31]

"The Schlumberger promotion" sounds like a Paul Greengrass film.

[stringvest]

Just now, Section_31 said:

"The Schlumberger promotion" sounds like a Paul Greengrass film.

Either that, or something involving you being lubed up with a doctor's finger up your hoop

[VladimirIlyich]

37 minutes ago, 3 Stacks said:

The bottom line is that the midfield is redundant. You can't have both Thiago and Keita as they're both too injury prone. So obviously, you keep Thiago, who is far superior. Ox is past his sell by date and Henderson and Milner, though they play different positions, they're too similar in ability level. We just have to cut the cord on some of these and make room.

 

 

While you make a fair point about unreliable players being candidates for being 'gone' gone to who,and when? Who will buy them and when will they be bought? How does it help to sell players who we wont replace either?