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AngryOfTuebrook

Summer 2022 Transfer Thread

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Hopefully we can keep the band together for (at least) another year. Losing Mane would be a blow, but he's actually the most expendable of the original three, as we've already got his like for like replacement in Diaz, and a good understudy in Jota. We haven't got a player to fully replace Salah, and none of the other forwards can replace what Firmino gives us either.

 

Just to be clear, Sadio's been great for us (and especially himself), but those thinking Salah's dwindling numbers are all down to Salah's own loss of form are sticking their head in the sand. For me, our best lineup still features Bobby,  unless his latest injury woes are recurring. I'd like to keep both Sadio and Diaz for a while longer (Jota is by far our weakest option, even if his versatility is a great asset), but it won't be a disaster if he goes.

 

I'm not nerdy enough to give the whole statistical breakdown of who's scoring most alongside who, but my eyes tell me that Salah is much more involved in and around the box when Bobby's there next to him.

 

I really hope to see us starting with Salah, Bobby and Mane in Paris, with Diaz coming on for the last 30 causing mayhem down Carvajal's right

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21 minutes ago, MegadriveMan said:

Darwin Nunez is a good goalscorer, but the rest of his game leaves a lot to be desired.

Maybe it's one for the amnesty thread but I do sometimes miss watching players who do nothing else other than putting the ball in the back of net with frightening regularity.

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1 minute ago, manwiththestick said:

Maybe it's one for the amnesty thread but I do sometimes miss watching players who do nothing else other than putting the ball in the back of net with frightening regularity.

The problem with that for us is we're a dominant football team. There are like 3 or 4 teams in the world that have more possession than us, we can't have passengers in buildup play, players who don't run or press, forwards who aren't great technically, etc... 

 

It's not like when we were a top 4-6 team in England, or when we had pragmatic managers that didn't want to take risks and throw men forward. When you have that type of team, have less of the ball, and the chances are more scarce, you probably do just want a scorer that is as good as it gets at finishing a minimum of chances. 

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As much as I hate him but Sons clinical finishing. Is he two footed. Salahs only real weakness is hes so one footed. We can say we need someone clinical but who is it. All our strikers get tonnes of goals yet bizarrely their finishing is strange. Score difficult chances but pea roll, scuff or spoon wide loads. I think it might just be because of how we play city cut the ball back from the byline someone is in the middle and basic shot... goal. Ours always seems like it was a goal written by agatha Christie you don't know how it's going to unfold.

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I have only seen Darwin Nunez in full in the two games we played against them, and he seemed to work like a Trojan, so not sure why he is being dismissed as too static and lazy for our system.

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We create so many chances that any decent finisher with a bit of pace will score 20+. We would just need to be satisfied that he will work hard and do what he's told. 

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27 minutes ago, sir roger said:

I have only seen Darwin Nunez in full in the two games we played against them, and he seemed to work like a Trojan, so not sure why he is being dismissed as too static and lazy for our system.

I don't think the concern is laziness or that he's too static.

 

The concern is whether his build up play is good enough considering the amount of work our central strikers put in to create both chances and space for the wide attackers who are essentially our goal scorers.

 

For example:

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/4d77b365/Darwin-Nunez

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/178ae8f8/Diogo-Jota

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/4c370d81/Roberto-Firmino

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/c691bfe2/Sadio-Mane

 

He plays in one of the top sides in Portugal where most weekends they are the dominant team yet he's in the bottom 5% for assists, 9% for expected assists, 17% for passing, 1% for pass completion, 39% for progressive passes etc.

 

If Klopp's planning a tactical switch with the central striker becoming more of a goal scoring focus then Nunez would be a good option.

 

It would be an expensive option though if you're not fully committed to the switch especially when you already have someone like Jota already at the club.

 

 

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13 minutes ago, TD_LFC said:

I don't think the concern is laziness or that he's too static.

 

The concern is whether his build up play is good enough considering the amount of work our central strikers put in to create both chances and space for the wide attackers who are essentially our goal scorers.

 

For example:

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/4d77b365/Darwin-Nunez

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/178ae8f8/Diogo-Jota

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/4c370d81/Roberto-Firmino

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/c691bfe2/Sadio-Mane

 

He plays in one of the top sides in Portugal where most weekends they are the dominant team yet he's in the bottom 5% for assists, 9% for expected assists, 17% for passing, 1% for pass completion, 39% for progressive passes etc.

 

If Klopp's planning a tactical switch with the central striker becoming more of a goal scoring focus then Nunez would be a good option.

 

It would be an expensive option though if you're not fully committed to the switch especially when you already have someone like Jota already at the club.

 

 

This is a real good post with some well thought through points.

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14 minutes ago, TD_LFC said:

I don't think the concern is laziness or that he's too static.

 

The concern is whether his build up play is good enough considering the amount of work our central strikers put in to create both chances and space for the wide attackers who are essentially our goal scorers.

 

For example:

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/4d77b365/Darwin-Nunez

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/178ae8f8/Diogo-Jota

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/4c370d81/Roberto-Firmino

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/c691bfe2/Sadio-Mane

 

He plays in one of the top sides in Portugal where most weekends they are the dominant team yet he's in the bottom 5% for assists, 9% for expected assists, 17% for passing, 1% for pass completion, 39% for progressive passes etc.

 

If Klopp's planning a tactical switch with the central striker becoming more of a goal scoring focus then Nunez would be a good option.

 

It would be an expensive option though if you're not fully committed to the switch especially when you already have someone like Jota already at the club.

 

 

You put work into that answer. I'm not used to that. Now Halaand and Mbappe are over has football produced any other forwards these last few years or apart from them two is everybody dogshit.

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14 minutes ago, TD_LFC said:

I don't think the concern is laziness or that he's too static.

 

The concern is whether his build up play is good enough considering the amount of work our central strikers put in to create both chances and space for the wide attackers who are essentially our goal scorers.

 

For example:

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/4d77b365/Darwin-Nunez

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/178ae8f8/Diogo-Jota

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/4c370d81/Roberto-Firmino

 

https://fbref.com/en/players/c691bfe2/Sadio-Mane

 

He plays in one of the top sides in Portugal where most weekends they are the dominant team yet he's in the bottom 5% for assists, 9% for expected assists, 17% for passing, 1% for pass completion, 39% for progressive passes etc.

 

If Klopp's planning a tactical switch with the central striker becoming more of a goal scoring focus then Nunez would be a good option.

 

It would be an expensive option though if you're not fully committed to the switch especially when you already have someone like Jota already at the club.

 

 

TBF you should include he has been involved in 30 golas in 28 games - leads the league in scoring and puts it in the net every 76 minutes.

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4 minutes ago, Bobby Hundreds said:

You put work into that answer. I'm not used to that. Now Halaand and Mbappe are over has football produced any other forwards these last few years or apart from them two is everybody dogshit.

A bit of hype around Nkunku, who plays across the front line but I haven’t seen enough of his.

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1 minute ago, TheHowieLama said:

TBF you should include he has been involved in 30 golas in 28 games - leads the league in scoring and puts it in the net every 76 minutes.

If the subject of doubt was his goal scoring I would have, I don't think anyone was questioning his output as a goal scorer though.

 

The problem is you can be a brilliant player but you can also be the wrong player for a team and system and just because you do something really well it doesn't always translate.

 

It's entirely possible that Nunez's lack of build up play is the product of Benfica's system and it's been unfairly curtailed by the way they play, I don't know enough about Benfica to give an opinion on that, but at the price involved any club that wants to use him as anything but a pure goal scorer would have to be very sure that it's a system rather than player issue.

 

Luckily the club have some pretty good people to make that assessment so if we did sign him then we're probably safe.

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23 minutes ago, Bobby Hundreds said:

You put work into that answer. I'm not used to that. Now Halaand and Mbappe are over has football produced any other forwards these last few years or apart from them two is everybody dogshit.

Just to be clear I'm not saying he's dog shit, he's very very good and any team that signs him and plays to his strengths will have an excellent player (fingers crossed if he goes to Utd and they try and turn him into a winger).

 

Lots of good attackers around, it just always helps to sign one that fits your style of play.

 

I like Moussa Diaby and Nkunku for wider options I think Nkunku is slight more polished but Diaby is unpredictable and I'd like to see what Klopp would do with him if he could focus his ability.

 

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I’ve seen PSV’s Ibrahim Sangare being mentioned. Anyone know enough about him to venture an opinion.

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1 hour ago, aws said:

We create so many chances that any decent finisher with a bit of pace will score 20+. We would just need to be satisfied that he will work hard and do what he's told. 

Both 3stacks and TD_LFC have answered this really, but do you really believe that? It's the same logic that has got 90 million pound Lukaku surplus at first Utd and then Chelsea. I honestly believe City will take a step backwards with Haaland as their focal point too. He's completely unsuited to how Pep normally sets up his team, and I'm frankly a bit shocked that they've spent a small nation GDP to bring him. He's obviously so physically dominant that he's bound to score a few goals for them, but I can easily imagine the team scoring less with him there than someone like Jesus and Sterling, poorer players though they may be. The Haaland signing smacks of being profile-raising and sportswashing rather than a well-thought and considered approach by Pep. Not that they're alien to throwing good money after bad.

 

It's the same reason why I'm still banging the Firmino drum even if a lot of our supporters have given up on him. If he has 2-3 bad touches in the first minutes people are going completely ballistic, as he hasn't got the goals to his name to absolve him of the blame (compare that to the crap performances Jota put in while on a scoring streak...). Bobby's movement and touches and overall play makes us tick though, and in a completely different way to our other options. It's the same with City, even if their "oil" is more often in the form of Silva (first David, now Bernardo) and De Bruyne. Without Jesus, Sterling, Mahrez and Foden chasing and winning the ball back for them though, the engine sputters. 

 

As good as Sadio's been in the CF role for us, he doesn't really do the things Bobby does when we're nearing the box. He's gotten a lot better at finding space between the lines when the opposition aren't balanced, but us attacking a side with 10 men behind the ball without Bobby in our middle is a bit painful to watch (especially if Thiago isn't playing).

 

Haven't really gotten to the point, have I? What I mean is that playing for a top side entails so much more than playing as a counter-attacking striker for a mid-table side. It's why teams like Leicester (Vardy) and Utd (Rashford) have been able to have so much (relatively) success against us. Lump a ball over the top, run after it and lash it in. Problem is if you adopt that kind of playing style (or buy that type of player), you can't really expect to dominate football teams (and the league) like us and to an even larger extent City do. Our forwards aren't particularly good finishers (the odd streak aside), but they are all fantastic chance creators, with Jota possibly being the odd man out. It makes us extremly entertaining, but also somewhat frustrating to watch at times. Will I take our dominant displays with erratic finishing over watching Fowler (he's top 3 in my Liverpool all-time favourites) and Owen miscontrolling numerous passes every game for them to later score clinical goals at odd times in those matches? Damn right I will. For all of the glorious moments those two (and other players) gave us, this is by far the best team we've had. Chance creation, pressing, patterns of play. It's all on a completely different level to what we've seen before. But yeah, stick Jamie Vardy or Darwin Nunez up top and we'd break all sorts of records...

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15 minutes ago, lebron said:

Both 3stacks and TD_LFC have answered this really, but do you really believe that? It's the same logic that has got 90 million pound Lukaku surplus at first Utd and then Chelsea. I honestly believe City will take a step backwards with Haaland as their focal point too. He's completely unsuited to how Pep normally sets up his team, and I'm frankly a bit shocked that they've spent a small nation GDP to bring him. He's obviously so physically dominant that he's bound to score a few goals for them, but I can easily imagine the team scoring less with him there than someone like Jesus and Sterling, poorer players though they may be. The Haaland signing smacks of being profile-raising and sportswashing rather than a well-thought and considered approach by Pep. Not that they're alien to throwing good money after bad.

 

It's the same reason why I'm still banging the Firmino drum even if a lot of our supporters have given up on him. If he has 2-3 bad touches in the first minutes people are going completely ballistic, as he hasn't got the goals to his name to absolve him of the blame (compare that to the crap performances Jota put in while on a scoring streak...). Bobby's movement and touches and overall play makes us tick though, and in a completely different way to our other options. It's the same with City, even if their "oil" is more often in the form of Silva (first David, now Bernardo) and De Bruyne. Without Jesus, Sterling, Mahrez and Foden chasing and winning the ball back for them though, the engine sputters. 

 

As good as Sadio's been in the CF role for us, he doesn't really do the things Bobby does when we're nearing the box. He's gotten a lot better at finding space between the lines when the opposition aren't balanced, but us attacking a side with 10 men behind the ball without Bobby in our middle is a bit painful to watch (especially if Thiago isn't playing).

 

 

I agree with your overall point 100%, I do think though that Haaland might just be good and prolific enough that he might transcend the need to fit City's style completely. He's a pretty special player, I think it remains to be seen. 

 

I also think Mane has done a phenomenal job at providing some of the technique and nuance we require from centre forward, to keep our play fluid. Jota to me does a bad job at this pretty much all the time and that's his main problem, although obviously he has other qualities, notably his play in the penalty area.

 

But yeah, it's hard to believe you'd see the best teams of the decade, with technical strikers like Suarez, Benzema, City's teams who have all technical forwards or play a midfielder up front, Messi playing false 9, forwards who are wizards all over the pitch, and then our best teams with Firmino up front, and then conclude we just need someone up top who is quick and who finishes chances. You need way more than that.  

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61b0f0d3844294291b0b9bfb1ca34e42.gif

 

Seriously though it's Real Madrid tactics 101, charm the player so he declares he wants to join then when you have the player convinced talk the transfer fee down with the selling club believing the player has made up his mind.

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